Defend a Maligned Movie

 

I don’t believe in “guilty pleasures” – why should I feel guilt because the critical groupthink scorned something I think has merit? It’s not as if those individual critics don’t pull the shades and watch something the rest of the priesthood demeans. (Unless Marty Scorcese gave it a nod in an interview, and then it’s time for a Fresh New Look.) I also don’t believe in watching bad movies to revel in their awfulness, unless there’s some meta-level payoff. (Plan Nine really is the apotheosis of true unintended hilarity.) I’m watching something right now that makes eyes roll if you try to make the case for its importance, but that’s not important right now. (No, I’m not watching Airplane!) I’ll hand it off to you: defend a movie dismissed by the gatekeepers.

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  1. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    American Abroad (View Comment):

    I don’t think it was maligned at the time, but Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom certainly would be maligned today as racist. The banquet scene where they slice open the snake and eat monkey brains was thrilling to me as a kid. Plus, he had that stereotypical Asian sidekick. I would watch that move again–and order some real Indian takeout to go with it!

    Disney+ has put content label warnings on “The Muppet Show.”

    This is the kind of crap you get when you raise two generations on participation trophies.

    • #151
  2. Stad Coolidge
    Stad
    @Stad

    American Abroad (View Comment):

    I don’t think it was maligned at the time, but Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom certainly would be maligned today as racist. The banquet scene where they slice open the snake and eat monkey brains was thrilling to me as a kid. Plus, he had that stereotypical Asian sidekick. I would watch that move again–and order some real Indian takeout to go with it!

    It’s the only Indiana Jones movie we haven’t rewatched . . .

    • #152
  3. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    James Lileks (View Comment):

    Now that you’ve chimed in – and thank you! – here’s the movie that prompted this thread, a strange, surreal, conceptually bizarre movie that for some reason just hits me right and makes me smile and love America.

    (whispers)

    (Cars)

    Yeah, I’ve never gotten the hate for that movie.  IMHO, it is one of the best of Pixars output.  Good story, likable characters, great animation.

    • #153
  4. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    American Abroad (View Comment):

    I don’t think it was maligned at the time, but Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom certainly would be maligned today as racist. The banquet scene where they slice open the snake and eat monkey brains was thrilling to me as a kid. Plus, he had that stereotypical Asian sidekick. I would watch that move again–and order some real Indian takeout to go with it!

    It was maligned at the time.

    I remember reading something shortly after Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade came out where Spielberg said he made the third Indiana Jones movie as an apology for the second.

    • #154
  5. Gazpacho Grande' Coolidge
    Gazpacho Grande'
    @ChrisCampion

    Vince Guerra (View Comment):

    We had a movie fight recently along those lines. https://ricochet.com/847526/ricochet-movie-fight-club-question-38/

    Personally I’ll defend Terminator Salvation against those critics who try to write it off. It’s even better now that Terminator: Dark Fate further soiled the franchise.

    That flick stands up more or less OK on re-watch.  Has some really odd and eerie visuals (courtesy of McG), echoing lots of childhood nightmares of Large Malevolent Things From The Sky ripping the roof off the house to “get” me.

    Still not great, but a fun watch.  Dark Fate was a crap festival.  And a really hideous naming.

    • #155
  6. Gazpacho Grande' Coolidge
    Gazpacho Grande'
    @ChrisCampion

    philo (View Comment):

    Not so much maligned as just ignored…I still think Hostiles (2017) is the best movie ever seen by only me and three other people:

    It is a hard movie. (As the credits rolled my wife turned to me and threatened to slap me when we got to the parking lot for taking her to it on “date night.”) The characters are hard. The subjects are hard. The interactions are hard. (It will drain you by the end.) But the backdrop for the journey is the American West at its most beautiful. (There is a 1-2 second clip of the group photo scene before the “parade” that is my favorite part of any movie ever.) Plus it has Christian Bale and Ben Foster in it. Great movie.

    Thanks for that – I think I had it on my watch list at one point and it fell off.  Back on.

    Talk about Christian Bale whiplash.  I’ll watch Hostiles then Terminator Salvation.  Throw in The Machinist and American Psycho and you’ll need a chiropractor.

    • #156
  7. Gazpacho Grande' Coolidge
    Gazpacho Grande'
    @ChrisCampion

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    I also like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen; I never really got the hate, the premise was good and the portrayals were entertaining.

    It’s sequel was much better, The League of Extraordinary Genitals.

    • #157
  8. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    I was just thinking … the most Maligned movie that nobody has seen has to be “The Hunt”… Ive been looking for it, and cant find it anywhere… (even when sailing the high seas)

    It sparked such controversy that it had to be pulled from theatrical release – only to get caught by covid-1984 shutdowns…

    • #158
  9. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):

    I was just thinking … the most Maligned movie that nobody has seen has to be “The Hunt”… Ive been looking for it, and cant find it anywhere… (even when sailing the high seas)

    It sparked such controversy that it had to be pulled from theatrical release – only to get caught by covid-1984 shutdowns…

    If  you mean the 2020 title with Ike Barinholtz and Hilary Swank, apparently it’s come out on blu-ray and is also downloadable.

    • #159
  10. lowtech redneck Coolidge
    lowtech redneck
    @lowtech redneck

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    James Lileks (View Comment):

    Now that you’ve chimed in – and thank you! – here’s the movie that prompted this thread, a strange, surreal, conceptually bizarre movie that for some reason just hits me right and makes me smile and love America.

    (whispers)

    (Cars)

    Yeah, I’ve never gotten the hate for that movie. IMHO, it is one of the best of Pixars output. Good story, likable characters, great animation.

    Some of it was progressive hatred for celebrating small-town America, and some of it was because people were sick of their children watching it over and over again.

    • #160
  11. Basil Fawlty Member
    Basil Fawlty
    @BasilFawlty

    Gazpacho Grande' (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    I also like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen; I never really got the hate, the premise was good and the portrayals were entertaining.

    It’s sequel was much better, The League of Extraordinary Genitals.

    Leak.

    • #161
  12. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    Gazpacho Grande’ (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    I also like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen; I never really got the hate, the premise was good and the portrayals were entertaining.

    It’s sequel was much better, The League of Extraordinary Genitals.

    Leak.

    “Leakage” probably works better.

    • #162
  13. JosePluma Coolidge
    JosePluma
    @JosePluma

    James Lileks (View Comment):

    Now that you’ve chimed in – and thank you! – here’s the movie that prompted this thread, a strange, surreal, conceptually bizarre movie that for some reason just hits me right and makes me smile and love America.

    (whispers)

    (Cars)

    You know what?  I enjoyed Cars 2.

    • #163
  14. Basil Fawlty Member
    Basil Fawlty
    @BasilFawlty

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    Gazpacho Grande’ (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    I also like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen; I never really got the hate, the premise was good and the portrayals were entertaining.

    It’s sequel was much better, The League of Extraordinary Genitals.

    Leak.

    “Leakage” probably works better.

    Too many syllables.

    • #164
  15. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    Gazpacho Grande’ (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    I also like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen; I never really got the hate, the premise was good and the portrayals were entertaining.

    It’s sequel was much better, The League of Extraordinary Genitals.

    Leak.

    “Leakage” probably works better.

    Too many syllables.

    Just one more.  And it doesn’t seriously upset the rhythm of the title.

    • #165
  16. Pagodan Member
    Pagodan
    @MatthewBaylot

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Pagodan (View Comment):

    Which leads me to a second movie, that while much maligned, is actually a solid “Good” movie. “Star Trek: The Motion Picture”. My only real complaint is that some of that cool mid-century modern kitsch from the 60’s became earth toned 70’s cheesiness, with goofy jumpsuits (bleh). I remember being bored and hating it as a kid (I grew up on all things Star Trek), but I think the problem is back in the 80’s we were watching this on a small tube tv with crappy color and a worn out speaker for sound. No one is gonna like a movie like this on that set-up. As and adult I went back and watched it with a large screen HD tv, decent sound system and speakers, and it was a whole new movie.

    Great effects, great Star Trek wonder, and the TOS cast is always great.

    You didn’t see it in a proper theater? That seems to have been the first mistake.

    Unfortunately, I was busy being born the year it came out in theaters so it wasn’t really an option. 

    • #166
  17. Pagodan Member
    Pagodan
    @MatthewBaylot

    KirkianWanderer (View Comment):

    ctlaw (View Comment):

    JimGoneWild (View Comment):

    OK, it must said, Paint Your Wagon is an awesome movie and Clint Eastwood’s singing is pretty good too. It gets a lot of knocks because its a musical, with Lee Marvin and Clint, “Partner”. The plot is simple and solid. The marriage situation is hilarious. But I like the singing.

    And, for trivia purposes, this is not the only movie Eastwood sings in. Can you name the other?

    Seems like he sings in several:

    I think he also sings somewhere on the score for Gran Torino.

    I’m pretty sure he composed and sang the title song. 

    • #167
  18. Pagodan Member
    Pagodan
    @MatthewBaylot

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    ToryWarWriter (View Comment):

    Vince Guerra (View Comment):

    Gary McVey (View Comment):
    I’m going to be a little pre-emptive here and defend a movie that the gatekeepers never loved and in eleven or so months will be maligned big time: Stanley Kubrick’s A Clockwork Orange.

    I disagree. It’s revered by the groupthink critic intelligencia as are all things Kubrick, erroneously in my opinion. They’ll never cook up their sacred cows.

    Speaking of Kubrick. 2010 is a much better movie than 2001. The first movie is banal trash, which makes you despise the Vienna Waltz by the end.

    With all due respect, my friend, I have to differ on that assessment. I have no strong feelings about 2010, but 2001 occupies a well-deserved place in science fiction cinematic history as the first truly great science fiction movie — Metropolis and The Day the Earth Stood Still notwithstanding.

    Forbidden Planet? 

    • #168
  19. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Pagodan (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    ToryWarWriter (View Comment):

    Vince Guerra (View Comment):

    Gary McVey (View Comment):
    I’m going to be a little pre-emptive here and defend a movie that the gatekeepers never loved and in eleven or so months will be maligned big time: Stanley Kubrick’s A Clockwork Orange.

    I disagree. It’s revered by the groupthink critic intelligencia as are all things Kubrick, erroneously in my opinion. They’ll never cook up their sacred cows.

    Speaking of Kubrick. 2010 is a much better movie than 2001. The first movie is banal trash, which makes you despise the Vienna Waltz by the end.

    With all due respect, my friend, I have to differ on that assessment. I have no strong feelings about 2010, but 2001 occupies a well-deserved place in science fiction cinematic history as the first truly great science fiction movie — Metropolis and The Day the Earth Stood Still notwithstanding.

    Forbidden Planet?

    That’s 1956.  When Worlds Collide came out in 1951.

    • #169
  20. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):

    I was just thinking … the most Maligned movie that nobody has seen has to be “The Hunt”… Ive been looking for it, and cant find it anywhere… (even when sailing the high seas)

    It sparked such controversy that it had to be pulled from theatrical release – only to get caught by covid-1984 shutdowns…

    If you’re still unable to find it, send me a private message or something and I can get it for you.

    • #170
  21. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    kedavis (View Comment):

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):

    I was just thinking … the most Maligned movie that nobody has seen has to be “The Hunt”… Ive been looking for it, and cant find it anywhere… (even when sailing the high seas)

    It sparked such controversy that it had to be pulled from theatrical release – only to get caught by covid-1984 shutdowns…

    If you’re still unable to find it, send me a private message or something and I can get it for you.

    Actually I found it, it was quietly added to Amazon Prime.

    • #171
  22. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    kedavis (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    Percival (View Comment):

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    Boney Cole (View Comment):

    Galaxy Quest. Really love the beginning at the convention. So real it hurts while I’m laughing. Can’t watch, can’t quit watching.

    No one maligns this movie. It’s a recognized classic.

    Agreed. Rotten has it at 90/79. When the critic and audience scores are so high – this is a recognized Gem.

    I think the only people a little upset with it, where Star Trek fans, because it does parody them quite heavily.

     

    Short-sighted Star Trek fans.

    When the self-destruct device is armed, the cast doesn’t know what to do – they were only pretending. The Thermians? They only built the thing. Who ya gonna call? The fans, who have been poring over floor plans and schematics while arguing the esoterica of the Protector since the series was on the air. They know how to access and disable it.

    A brilliant conceit and a big sloppy wet kiss for the people who really count.

    And at the end of the movie, the series was back on the air!

    And the wizard granted the Cowardly Redshirt a name. 

    • #172
  23. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Pagodan (View Comment):

    KirkianWanderer (View Comment):

    ctlaw (View Comment):

    JimGoneWild (View Comment):

    OK, it must said, Paint Your Wagon is an awesome movie and Clint Eastwood’s singing is pretty good too. It gets a lot of knocks because its a musical, with Lee Marvin and Clint, “Partner”. The plot is simple and solid. The marriage situation is hilarious. But I like the singing.

    And, for trivia purposes, this is not the only movie Eastwood sings in. Can you name the other?

    Seems like he sings in several:

    I think he also sings somewhere on the score for Gran Torino.

    I’m pretty sure he composed and sang the title song.

    Get Off My Lawn is a classic. 

    • #173
  24. American Abroad Thatcher
    American Abroad
    @AmericanAbroad

    Percival (View Comment):

    American Abroad (View Comment):

    I don’t think it was maligned at the time, but Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom certainly would be maligned today as racist. The banquet scene where they slice open the snake and eat monkey brains was thrilling to me as a kid. Plus, he had that stereotypical Asian sidekick. I would watch that move again–and order some real Indian takeout to go with it!

    Disney+ has put content label warnings on “The Muppet Show.”

    This is the kind of crap you get when you raise two generations on participation trophies.

    I am not sure what this implies about Temple of Doom, @percival.  Does this mean that Temple of Doom has a content warning or has been cancelled altogether?  Or perhaps Disney just notes which racists watch the movie and sends their names to Homeland Security for domestic terrorist activity.

    • #174
  25. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    American Abroad (View Comment):

    Percival (View Comment):

    American Abroad (View Comment):

    I don’t think it was maligned at the time, but Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom certainly would be maligned today as racist. The banquet scene where they slice open the snake and eat monkey brains was thrilling to me as a kid. Plus, he had that stereotypical Asian sidekick. I would watch that move again–and order some real Indian takeout to go with it!

    Disney+ has put content label warnings on “The Muppet Show.”

    This is the kind of crap you get when you raise two generations on participation trophies.

    I am not sure what this implies about Temple of Doom, @ percival. Does this mean that Temple of Doom has a content warning or has been cancelled altogether? Or perhaps Disney just notes which racists watch the movie and sends their names to Homeland Security for domestic terrorist activity.

    I used to try to fathom what they were thinking, but it gave me brain cramps. They are probably just banning everything BW (Before Woke).

    • #175
  26. KevinKrisher Inactive
    KevinKrisher
    @KevinKrisher

    James Hageman (View Comment):

    I like Big Trouble (not in Little China).

    It did have a memorable line, spoken by a teenage girl who was watching her parents fight: “I’m going upstairs where it’s not so stupid.”

    • #176
  27. WilliamDean Coolidge
    WilliamDean
    @WilliamDean

    KevinKrisher (View Comment):

    My wife insists that I point out the wonderfulness of 1984’s The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the Eighth Dimension.

    When one of the cast members was interviewed about it a few years ago, he said, “It’s been over twenty years since we made that movie, and we’re still not quite sure what it was about.”

    “Where are we going!?”
    “DIMENSION X!!!”
    “And when are we going to get there!?”
    “REAL SOON!!!”

    ‘That’s Big Boot-ay!”

    • #177
  28. WilliamDean Coolidge
    WilliamDean
    @WilliamDean

    KevinKrisher (View Comment):

    James Hageman (View Comment):

    I like Big Trouble (not in Little China).

    It did have a memorable line, spoken by a teenage girl who was watching her parents fight: “I’m going upstairs where it’s not so stupid.”

    It’s full of lines:

    “Hey, I’m a reasonable guy. But I’ve just experienced some very unreasonable things!”

    “It’s black blood of the earth.”
    “You mean oil?”
    “I mean BLACK BLOOD OF THE EARTH!”

    “Me!? Scared!? Huh.”

     

     

    • #178
  29. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    WilliamDean (View Comment):

    KevinKrisher (View Comment):

    My wife insists that I point out the wonderfulness of 1984’s The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the Eighth Dimension.

    When one of the cast members was interviewed about it a few years ago, he said, “It’s been over twenty years since we made that movie, and we’re still not quite sure what it was about.”

    “Where are we going!?”
    “DIMENSION X!!!”
    “And when are we going to get there!?”
    “REAL SOON!!!”

    ‘That’s Big Boot-ay!”

    “Remember: no matter where you go, there you are.”

    • #179
  30. Brian Clendinen Inactive
    Brian Clendinen
    @BrianClendinen

    Ok maybe, because I really like british humor but the orgional Aveagers that was based off the 60s TV series. I dont think people get that its a British satire of a James Bond movie l/spy movie that has a heavy doss of british wit. I mean the main villian is Shawn Connery for goodness sake.  Like when I herd the latter Aveagers  was comming out I was so stoked because I thought they were redoing that movie.  I did not know it was a lame superhero movie.

    • #180
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