The Real Baltimore

 

Kim Klacik is a Republican running for Congress in Baltimore, and she has a few things to say. Warning: pearl clutchers should have pearls handy before watching this campaign ad:

While Nancy makes selfie-videos of her $30 a pint designer ice cream, Kim Klacik is shaking up her old home town. Sometimes the revolution that arises is not the one the elites were staging. A race worth following. Donate here.

As you were.

Published in Elections
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  1. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    The Scarecrow (View Comment):
    Is it a good thing that it seems like he didn’t get it?)

    Oh, he got it.

    • #151
  2. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher.  So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before.  But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher.  And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    • #152
  3. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    The Scarecrow (View Comment):

    Percival (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    Midnight, one more night without sleeping
    Watching till the morning comes creeping
    Green door, what’s that secret you’re keeping?

    Uhhh… Marilyn Chambers?

    Shakin’ Stevens.

    (Yo, @kedavis. Is it a good thing that it seems like he didn’t get it?)

    Not sure.  But I don’t know what/who “Shakin’ Stevens” is either.

    • #153
  4. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    They can learn to code? 

    • #154
  5. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    kedavis (View Comment):

    The Scarecrow (View Comment):

    Percival (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    Midnight, one more night without sleeping
    Watching till the morning comes creeping
    Green door, what’s that secret you’re keeping?

    Uhhh… Marilyn Chambers?

    Shakin’ Stevens.

    (Yo, @kedavis. Is it a good thing that it seems like he didn’t get it?)

    Not sure. But I don’t know what/who “Shakin’ Stevens” is either.

    • #155
  6. FloppyDisk90 Member
    FloppyDisk90
    @FloppyDisk90

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    Exactly, you can’t have the same number of employees for the numbers to improve.  That’s my point.

    • #156
  7. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    TBA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    They can learn to code?

    The no-longer-needed public school teacher can go to the charter school and teach those 50 kids, or fewer, and get paid more for it since the charter school is likely to have less administrative bloat.

    That’s kind of a “duh” isn’t it?  You expected the charter school to handle 50 more kids without hiring another teacher?  c’mon.  Are you voting for Biden, too?

    • #157
  8. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    Exactly, you can’t have the same number of employees for the numbers to improve. That’s my point.

    See my response to TBA.

    Who says you need the same number of employees for less work?  Unions, sure.  But nobody else I can think of.

    • #158
  9. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Percival (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    The Scarecrow (View Comment):

    Percival (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    Midnight, one more night without sleeping
    Watching till the morning comes creeping
    Green door, what’s that secret you’re keeping?

    Uhhh… Marilyn Chambers?

    Shakin’ Stevens.

    (Yo, @kedavis. Is it a good thing that it seems like he didn’t get it?)

    Not sure. But I don’t know what/who “Shakin’ Stevens” is either.

    Sorry, my expertise is porn, not… “popular?”… music.

    • #159
  10. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    kedavis (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    They can learn to code?

    The no-longer-needed public school teacher can go to the charter school and teach those 50 kids, or fewer, and get paid more for it since the charter school is likely to have less administrative bloat.

    That’s kind of a “duh” isn’t it? You expected the charter school to handle 50 more kids without hiring another teacher? c’mon. Are you voting for Biden, too?

    We need charter schools, in part, because teachers aren’t doing their jobs. Certainly in many cases it isn’t their fault. But in many cases it is. 

    • #160
  11. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    TBA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    They can learn to code?

    The no-longer-needed public school teacher can go to the charter school and teach those 50 kids, or fewer, and get paid more for it since the charter school is likely to have less administrative bloat.

    That’s kind of a “duh” isn’t it? You expected the charter school to handle 50 more kids without hiring another teacher? c’mon. Are you voting for Biden, too?

    We need charter schools, in part, because teachers aren’t doing their jobs. Certainly in many cases it isn’t their fault. But in many cases it is.

    Well sure, but those teachers aren’t owed a job teaching just because that may be what they want to do.  Or may be what they can get paid the most to NOT do, thanks to unions etc.

    (P.S.  My prediction is that they would suck at coding, too.)

    • #161
  12. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    kedavis (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    They can learn to code?

    The no-longer-needed public school teacher can go to the charter school and teach those 50 kids, or fewer, and get paid more for it since the charter school is likely to have less administrative bloat.

    That’s kind of a “duh” isn’t it? You expected the charter school to handle 50 more kids without hiring another teacher? c’mon. Are you voting for Biden, too?

    We need charter schools, in part, because teachers aren’t doing their jobs. Certainly in many cases it isn’t their fault. But in many cases it is.

    Well sure, but those teachers aren’t owed a job teaching just because that may be what they want to do. Or may be what they can get paid the most to NOT do, thanks to unions etc.

    (P.S. My prediction is that they would suck at coding, too.)

    Owed a job? Heavens no! Well, not in my book. Laws may differ. 

    • #162
  13. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    kedavis (View Comment):
    Not sure. But I don’t know what/who “Shakin’ Stevens” is either.

    The singer of “Green Door.”

    • #163
  14. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    Barfly (View Comment):

    The way AOS dresses is a clue. Her outfits are always trim and close-fitting, but what really catches my eye is the regular use of 4 cuff buttons. It is so obvious that she’s a little girl playing military dress-up, without the faintest bit of self awareness. “I’m a general! Now listen while I tell you what to do!” Ilhan Omar does the same thing.

    She is a general.  Have no doubt if she ordered her followers to kill you they would gleefully do so 

    • #164
  15. Giulietta Inactive
    Giulietta
    @giuliettachicago

    Man, I’d work on her campaign if she was in Chicago.

    I think the outfit is perfect. It just reinforces the necessary message that women are women and there’s no harm if they want to play up their femininity. (At least it’s not one of Elizabeth Warren’s cardigans…)

    • #165
  16. FloppyDisk90 Member
    FloppyDisk90
    @FloppyDisk90

    kedavis (View Comment):

    …..

    See my response to TBA.

    Who says you need the same number of employees for less work? Unions, sure. But nobody else I can think of.

    OK, that’s certainly a reasonable position to take, but getting back to my original point about charter school funding, I also think it’s reasonable to point out that, all else equal, moving kids out of traditional public schools and into charter schools will reduce funding for public schools.  You and I may agree that is the right thing to do but I can certainly understand how the unions would be against it.

    • #166
  17. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    …..

    See my response to TBA.

    Who says you need the same number of employees for less work? Unions, sure. But nobody else I can think of.

    OK, that’s certainly a reasonable position to take, but getting back to my original point about charter school funding, I also think it’s reasonable to point out that, all else equal, moving kids out of traditional public schools and into charter schools will reduce funding for public schools. You and I may agree that is the right thing to do but I can certainly understand how the unions would be against it.

    It seems like some kind of lefty thing to believe that reducing funding by 33% while reducing student load by 50%, for example, is “bad.”  That amounts to an x% INCREASE in per-student funding, which is what they always say they want. It’s like when they say a 33% increase when they wanted a 50% increase, is a “cut.”  Regular people don’t believe that kind of nonsense.

    • #167
  18. namlliT noD Member
    namlliT noD
    @DonTillman

    I can’t tell who’s arguing what side here, but…

    School systems constantly adjust to varying student populations.  They add teachers, they lay off teachers, they reassign teachers to different schools, or different school districts, they add portable classrooms, they remove them, etc.  I know several school buildings where I have lived that have been repurposed into community centers.

    Also (since the topic is Baltimore) know that Baltimore’s population has been declining significantly since 1950-something.

     

    • #168
  19. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    namlliT noD (View Comment):

    I can’t tell who’s arguing what side here, but…

    School systems constantly adjust to varying student populations. They add teachers, they lay off teachers, they reassign teachers to different schools, or different school districts, they add portable classrooms, they remove them, etc. I know several school buildings where I have lived that have been repurposed into community centers.

    Also (since the topic is Baltimore) know that Baltimore’s population has been declining significantly since 1950-something.

    There’s that too.  Although they tend to keep – or even add more – administrators even as they shed teachers.

    • #169
  20. Clifford A. Brown Member
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    Taras (View Comment):

    Inner city blacks may be the worst educated voting demographic in the US, and probably the most ill-informed.

    Large percentages still believe the Tawana Brawley hoax, and the Duke lacrosse team hoax, and the “hands up don’t shoot“ hoax, and the Trayvon Martin hoax.

    Corrupt “community leaders” who are sold out to the Democratic Party can routinely persuade them to vote against their own interests.

    I remember reading in the New York Times, years ago, about a proposal in Chicago to provide scholarships to several thousand poor black kids so they could go to good schools. The Democratic Party was able to mobilize and get the poor black welfare mothers whose children would have benefited from the program to oppose it.

    I think this is a perfect example of my point. The typical claim of Democrats is that scholarships, charter schools, education grants, etc…divert money away from public schools and would make an already bad situation worse. Given that most/all public schools are funded based on butts in seats, this is actually a fair point to make. Now you can argue, and I would agree with you, that the benefits outweigh the costs and that the inner city schools deserve to be defunded but that’s the crux of the debate. If you put yourselves in the shoes of those black welfare mothers I can certainly understand how a message of “those rascally Republicans are trying to defund your schools” would sell. It’s no different than when Trump goes to working class Pennsylvania and sells the idea that Democrats want to ship jobs to China and let illegal immigrants take over the ones that are left.

    Except that poor black mothers spend hours in school lotteries, see Waiting for Superman and are crushed when their children do not get one of the coveted slots in a quality school. 

    • #170
  21. Clifford A. Brown Member
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    Taras (View Comment):

    Inner city blacks may be the worst educated voting demographic in the US, and probably the most ill-informed.

    Large percentages still believe the Tawana Brawley hoax, and the Duke lacrosse team hoax, and the “hands up don’t shoot“ hoax, and the Trayvon Martin hoax.

    Corrupt “community leaders” who are sold out to the Democratic Party can routinely persuade them to vote against their own interests.

    I remember reading in the New York Times, years ago, about a proposal in Chicago to provide scholarships to several thousand poor black kids so they could go to good schools. The Democratic Party was able to mobilize and get the poor black welfare mothers whose children would have benefited from the program to oppose it.

    I think this is a perfect example of my point. The typical claim of Democrats is that scholarships, charter schools, education grants, etc…divert money away from public schools and would make an already bad situation worse. Given that most/all public schools are funded based on butts in seats, this is actually a fair point to make. Now you can argue, and I would agree with you, that the benefits outweigh the costs and that the inner city schools deserve to be defunded but that’s the crux of the debate. If you put yourselves in the shoes of those black welfare mothers I can certainly understand how a message of “those rascally Republicans are trying to defund your schools” would sell. It’s no different than when Trump goes to working class Pennsylvania and sells the idea that Democrats want to ship jobs to China and let illegal immigrants take over the ones that are left.

    Trump won by advocating for working class and poor Americans against both Democrats and Bush Republicans shipping jobs to China and letting illegal and legal immigrants crowd out jobs and depress wages. Hence the unrelenting opposition since his nomination by both Democrats and Bush Republicans.

    You have a fair point that (Bush) Republicans, to the extent they bother pitching education reform, do so in a way that is tone deaf and ineffective. You could also make the point about our senior generations, starting with groups like the Grey Panthers, vehemently opposing any change to senior benefit programs (Social Security, Medicare) because they fear any change will be for the worse for them. This is why Trump has loudly, unconditionally opposed any change to Social Security. 

    • #171
  22. Jules PA Inactive
    Jules PA
    @JulesPA

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    You have no idea what is required of teachers if you think one teacher should be responsible for 50 kids. 

    My reccommendation: Toss the super, toss the admin, hire 3 teachers and save money. Oh, and the job actually gets done. 😁

    • #172
  23. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Jules PA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    You have no idea what is required of teachers if you think one teacher should be responsible for 50 kids.

    My reccommendation: Toss the super, toss the admin, hire 3 teachers and save money. Oh, and the job actually gets done. 😁

    I didn’t create the hypothetical.  But if you assume 100 students and 2 teachers, that works out to 50 students per teacher.  I didn’t invent simple math, either.

    Put another way: your argument, to the extent you may have one, is with FloppyDisk90, not me.

    • #173
  24. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Jules PA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    You have no idea what is required of teachers if you think one teacher should be responsible for 50 kids.

    My reccommendation: Toss the super, toss the admin, hire 3 teachers and save money. Oh, and the job actually gets done. 😁

    If legislatures would make schools less subject to lawsuits, admin would make teachers less accountable for ‘lesson plan writing’, and parents made children more responsible for their failures I imagine things would improve. 

    Oh, and fire every other admin person. Honestly, it looks like a turn-of-the-other-century graft machine. 

    • #174
  25. Sisyphus Member
    Sisyphus
    @Sisyphus

    TBA (View Comment):
    Oh, and fire every other admin person. Honestly, it looks like a turn-of-the-other-century graft machine. 

    Dissolve the US Department of Education and rescind the web of associated regulations, executive orders, and “dear colleague letters” to restore subsidiarity in education. Then let the cash strapped jurisdictions do the rest.

    • #175
  26. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    Jules PA (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But they don’t have to pay ALL of those teachers and ALL of those administrators etc, the same amounts, when they are dealing with FEWER STUDENTS. And if the school “loses” less per student that leaves than they get to start with, that means you could have smaller classes – a goal everyone seems to favor – with the teachers being paid MORE. Even if the only students left in the public schools were “special needs,” they would have MORE MONEY to deal with them than they get NOW! What kind of gyrations can the left invent for why that’s a bad thing?

    Simple example: say a school has 100 students, two teachers, one principle and one superintendent. Say the state gives the school $100 dollars per student. That’s $10000 total income. For simplicity’s sake, let’s assume that income is split equally between the teachers and administration and the only costs associated with running the school is paying teachers and administration so each person earns $2500. Along come a charter school and 50 students leave but the state continues to give the school $50 dollars for each of the missing students. So now income is $50 * 50 students + $100 * 50 students = $7500. But you still have four employees to pay so either you have to fire someone or everyone has to take a pay cut.

    But there are only 50 students left, and you don’t need TWO teachers for 50 students if you’re putting 50 students with a teacher. So with one teacher, one principle, and one superintendent, splitting $7500 they each get the same amount as before. But really you don’t need a principle AND a superintendent for ONE teacher. And if you scale it up more reasonably, the numbers get better, not worse.

    You have no idea what is required of teachers if you think one teacher should be responsible for 50 kids.

    My reccommendation: Toss the super, toss the admin, hire 3 teachers and save money. Oh, and the job actually gets done. 😁

    I think you guys do not understand current education.  It is not really about teaching / indoctrinating children.  That is just an excuse, a reason for existence.  It is more about mining administrative law for money for the school system.  That is why you need so many administrators, to comply, to work, to justify, to find all those little places to shake money out of the various government and their departments.  

    • #176
  27. Basil Fawlty Member
    Basil Fawlty
    @BasilFawlty

    Arahant (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):
    Not sure. But I don’t know what/who “Shakin’ Stevens” is either.

    The singer of “Green Door.”

    A singer. First time I heard the song it was the Jim Lowe version.

    • #177
  28. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):
    A singer. First time I heard the song it was the Jim Lowe version.

    True, and Lowe recorded it first.

    • #178
  29. Stina Inactive
    Stina
    @CM

    kedavis (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    …..

    See my response to TBA.

    Who says you need the same number of employees for less work? Unions, sure. But nobody else I can think of.

    OK, that’s certainly a reasonable position to take, but getting back to my original point about charter school funding, I also think it’s reasonable to point out that, all else equal, moving kids out of traditional public schools and into charter schools will reduce funding for public schools. You and I may agree that is the right thing to do but I can certainly understand how the unions would be against it.

    It seems like some kind of lefty thing to believe that reducing funding by 33% while reducing student load by 50%, for example, is “bad.” That amounts to an x% INCREASE in per-student funding, which is what they always say they want. It’s like when they say a 33% increase when they wanted a 50% increase, is a “cut.” Regular people don’t believe that kind of nonsense.

    It all comes down to unions believing they are owed a job and a certain pay. Where lower funding makes that untenable, to them the solution is NOT to fire anyone. If they thought firings were acceptable, we wouldn’t be in the position of having useless teachers fake-teaching students to (not) read.

    • #179
  30. Stina Inactive
    Stina
    @CM

    I’d like to point out… it seems the most dysfunctional attitudes on teaching and unions and public schooling is coming from administrators and higher degree holders. It seems there’s a decent enough mix among lower teachers to make it battle worthy that the school administrations and bureaucrats in education are improperly utilizing the money that is earmarked for the schools.

    When teachers complain of lack of funding, it’s less about needing taxes to go up, but for administrator pay to drop so more money goes into the classrooms.

    It doesn’t look like these younger teachers have as much union power as the older members with more advanced degrees have.

    In other words, there may be enough fracture there for some limited working together.

    The education administration and bureaucracy needs a haircut. With all the money we dump into schools, there is no reason why teachers should be paying out of pocket for school supplies.

    • #180
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