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Hey, Hey, Ho, Ho, Western Civ is Going to Go!
My husband, my youngest daughter, and I had lunch with an old friend yesterday. He and I were known to have heated arguments back when we were more politically in-sync, which, I daresay, we both enjoyed immensely. While he still adheres to atheistic liberalism, I’ve converted both religiously and politically. Paradoxically, our conversations seem to be more measured and substantive, although I still win 99 percent of the disputes – just ask me.
In the course of our conversation, he cracked a joke about selecting swimwear and potentially looking good in a burkini. This led to a discussion of France’s somewhat feeble attempts to push back against the assertion of Muslim culture by banning the veil and, now, the controversial initiative to ban the burkini. Our friend asserted there are only two realistic approaches to take on the cultural tensions extant when Muslims move into western societies: 1) Try to retain the western values of pluralism and religious tolerance in an open society while “leaving the door open for compromises,” or 2) Expel the alien ideological element and combat it wherever it is found. I demurred.
There is a third option, which is the course we’re currently pursuing: the West can simply lie down and die.
Something I said really touched a nerve, because our friend became very animated and heatedly asked me, “You really believe, in a hundred years, the West will be overrun?” He was absolutely confident that what we’re witnessing in the way of cultural jihad (from Islamic supremacists on one side and leftists on the other) is not a trend and I’m dead wrong to believe Western Civilization is vulnerable.
That was before I informed him about Sharia courts given the authority to settle civil disputes in Great Britain and many municipalities in Canada (because the Jews and the Catholics already had them, so Muslims must have them too!), and the abrogation of the Anglo common-law tradition. Neither was he aware of the video taken (by a very brave youngster, I assume) in the madrassa in Great Britain where high school students recite the punishments for homosexuality (throw them off a high place, and then stone them) and apostasy (kill them). H/t: @pseudodionysius
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzEm4xuBhqg
Still, he insisted, I’m wrong to think the West is dying. Unfortunately, our time together was short and I had to leave, but I parted with this thought: In order to sustain a culture, the people must understand and love their heritage (Westerners are either ignorant or ashamed), must live by its values (we’re increasingly secular and relativistic), and even be willing to die for its principles. Most westerners are too soft to assert the superiority of our culture, with the exception being Christians and conservatives. <mic drop>
Now, how is any of this relevant to the 2016 Election (because every worthwhile discussion must be related to Trump vs Clinton)? The real contest is between Christianity and its two mortal enemies: Islam and leftism. They know it and most Christians (who are not also leftists) know it. NeverTrumpers? Not so much.
Why do I assert this? After mentally replaying my conversation with our friend and trying to discover the pattern that would explain the NeverTrump position, I noticed that the NeverTrumpers align almost identically with secular “conservatives” who are soft on social/cultural issues like abortion and SSM. On these subjects, they largely agree with the anti-Christian Left.
I don’t mean to suggest NeverTrumpers are themselves anti-Christian, only that their unfamiliarity with the Christian religious tradition may amke them unaware of the danger of their alliance with the Left to Christianity and, therefore, Western Civilization.
Published in GeneralLet nothing disturb you,
Let nothing frighten you,
All things are passing away:
God never changes.
Patience obtains all things
Whoever has God lacks nothing;
God alone suffices.
— St. Teresa of Avila
Okay. Mentioning Odoacer is a touch hyperbolic, isn’t it?
You aren’t being beaten by nothing.
Criticism of the Western tradition by Westerners is just an(other) expression of the Western tradition.
Which all Westerners have authentic ownership of. Not just conservatives.
I honestly think that Western heritage is broader than you imply.
Hillsdale is a perfectly valid expression of it, but so (sorry) are things like SJW and BLM.
You. Don’t. Own. It.
We all do.
It was in Rome too, when he was just a soldier/bureaucrat.
Indeed, self criticism is a central part of the Western tradition.
Well said. I would add that the gross overreach of the Progressive Left and the ineffectual response from the elected representatives of the GOP also shoulder responsibility for the rise of Trump. None of these people are accepting their role in this.
Voters were angry – seriously, deeply angry – at the last eight years. And nobody in the media or in DC has yet admitted they are even partly to blame.
There’s so much wrong with this election that if the blame was fairly distributed and dumped on those responsible, a good portion of the citizenry would be flattened. Trying to rise above the oh-so-yucky democratic process by sitting out the election isn’t an option if you want to remain blameless. Pilate tried that and history hasn’t been kind to him.
And if you value self-criticism in the Western tradition then you need to vote for the narcissist who never admits mistakes or we’ll lose everything!
And if you intend to preserve the Western tradition, you need to vote for the corrupt, decrepit, narcissistic harridan who will abandon American soldiers in the field to die and open the borders to barbarian invaders to ensure Democrat electoral victories in perpetuity.
The destruction of a tradition is part of the tradition itself??? No. Distortions, contortions and manipulations forcing a thing into a use not intended are not the essence of the thing. The germ of western civilization is Judeo-Christian, and one unique feature of that is the level of grace in coexistence with competing systems. Judeo Christian Western Civ does not exist to destroy others by force…and a by product of that feature is that throughout history it has been tainted by those other, often corrosive influences. But those influences are still foreign, still not of the same provenance.
I am NOT actually more comfortable with a Trump win. I am more abjectly terrified of a Clinton win because of all that is likely to go with it. If she carries the day, she is likely to carry more Senators and Representatives in with her. Regardless which awful choice for president wins, it is imperative that we do not have another feckless rubber stamping congress (like the one that passed Obamacare) guarding the gates. She would have the momentum of the last 8 years and a weakened opposition. He would have chaos. But at least chaos would slow or pause the current momentum.
It is a binary choice. Not a good one.
Well, we hope not. The pessimistic among us might wonder if some things really do contain the seeds of their own destruction. Not in a Marxian sense, but just in the sense that there doesn’t seem to be any rule of logic guaranteeing that it can’t happen with something somewhere.
See, what I said was a reiteration of the absurdity of the post. What you said doesn’t really make any sense.
I agree. The most amazing part of it to me is that despite the fact that we’re dealing with, not ounces, not pounds, but tons of unsavory qualities, many people have weighed the downsides and found not a smidgen of difference between them. Not a gram. One candidate has the entire Progressive movement on her side of the scale and yet they level out exactly! It’s uncanny. Exactly the same!
What are the odds?
Well, low, because we can’t measure exactly. But many who claim Trump is not clearly better than Hillary are pretty open about the fact that the comparison is not a point-to-point comparison (which no one can really make, because nobody knows that much), but largely overlapping, though differently shaped, distributions, which can rationally be weighted differently depending on risk preference.
Like someone might think that Hillary has a high peak and low variance at “bad”, see Trump’s peak at “bad” as lower, but his tail to the left of “bad” even fatter (“worse”), even if his tail to the right (“better”) is also fatter. Be risk-preferring enough, and you can weight it so the fat right tail dominates, but a different assessment of risk could make the fat left tail dominate.
The fact that it’s possible to arrange a weighting scheme that does not count as rational by risk-preference criteria doesn’t change the fact that risk preferences that meet the criteria of rationality can differ widely.
What about the Kennedy family’s lifestyles – a good Catholic family? The rampant adultery, drug and alcohol use and divorce did not stop them from generations of public service – they did a lot of good for the country and in the states they serve. Like someone said, we’re not voting for a pope – do you honestly think Hillary, given the long list of serious issues that have been presented and they keep coming, would be a better choice?
As someone who has participated in this thread for more than a day now, I want to complain about the title. The rhythm is not right. It really screws with me.
Keep in mind the election is a binary choice but politics is not.
For the love of all that is holy.
I don’t believe this for one second. The country class is in no hurry to surrender; however, the ruling class don’t give a shinola about God, family or country.
Let me sum up for you; – we’re better off with the ‘robber baron’ than the moral busybody;)
One would think that that is obvious, but apparently it is not.
Trajans definition- ‘Establishmentarian’….
A person who has allowed their emotional stake in the ‘Establishment’, to override their ability to critically think….or, in plainer language, get their head out of their third point of contact; ex; George Will…
nice try detracting from discussion Fred…..
This election has proven that people of all class, income, race, gender, age are fed up with what has happened over the last eight years – if you mean the ruling class in DC, you may be right.
“Abjectly terrified of a Clinton win…” That pretty well sums it up for me.
The unfortunate part of this equation is that the country class is not making the rules, the ruling class is. That will likely continue until the country class is willing to overthrow the ruling class. And that won’t happen until things are far worse than they are now, such as they are in France, where parts of the country are now effectively the Middle East.
I can see the attraction of that self-view – and surely it is in part correct – but you realize that this hasn’t been how the rest of the world has mostly experienced the West?
All living civilizations change – and there’s always a tension between change and preservation. It’s a healthy conflict, imho.
I do not find that to be a disqualifier for president. He may be lawyered up and brazen, and he has paid bribes and done deceitful deals.
But Hillary is more than lawyered up. Her lawyers are paid by bribes she takes. She is brazen, but that is covered up by the Leftist mass media. Her deals are more slimey, as in the Russian uranium deal.
And Hillary is the figurehead for a horde of Leftist flying monkeys who want to make Washington even more powerful at the expense of both citizens and states. They are the spiritual heirs of the French Revolutionairies, who sought to destroy all of the old institutions and whose most bitter hatred was directed at the churches.
Trump is not an ideologue, and he does not lead a large team but a small one.
Support Trump. Save western civilization.