Where Do We Go from Here?

 

If one spends some time examining what has happened between the lead-up to the 2016 election and since then, as it regards Donald Trump, I think it is really difficult to pin any serious wrongdoing, much less actions involving criminal intent on him.

It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign, then turned immediately into almost totally biased opposition after that. He still won that election, although the Democrats flailed about in severe election denial. Most already existing mainstream media has been anti-Trump since his election in 2016. Trump has had significant support in alternative media sources.

Democrats, aided by anti-Trump turncoat Republicans, worked throughout Trump’s term to bring him down, mostly with false information and accusations of wrongdoing, nothing ever proven, including claims that Trump’s actions and statements about the 2020 election and during the January 6 protests and riot involved inciting insurrection. Let’s refer to these anti-Trump-Agenda types as Globalists.

There are others, who may actually support Trump’s agenda but don’t like how he conducts himself, they don’t like his personality, so they tend to turn to other Republicans who actually either support the Globalists or do little to oppose them. Trump’s clarion call is to Make America Great Again (MAGA). Globalists’ falsely label MAGA as fascist, a term that describes forms of national socialism. MAGA does promote America’s national sovereignty but certainly not socialism. Trump’s agenda for MAGA has a number of issues to be addressed; trade, border control, and military conflict, lead that list. But his four years in office reveal we are in a real fight for the freedoms Americans are guaranteed under the US Constitution against the Oligarchs pushing for one world government.

Meanwhile, we were learning so many dark things about Democrats in general, and even some Republicans, and our federal bureaucracy, but without generating any inquiry interests in the various departments and agencies of the government. A picture depicting a severe and almost total political divide between the Republicans (Trump-led) and the Democrats (Obama-led) emerged in the 2020 and 2022 elections.

The Globalist movement led by the World Economic Forum (WEF) benefits from a century of groundwork by the Socialists and Communists in America culminating in the last 40 years with the hollowing out of America’s traditional institutions. The MAGA agenda is arrayed in opposition to the Global Socialists (Globalists) and strives to restore the integrity of our emptied traditional institutions.  The weapons are money, political power, disinformation, and knowledge. I’m using knowledge here as complete and truthful information as opposed to propaganda and indoctrination.

There are plenty of issues, viewpoints, and characters that will be part of the coming period.

Pay attention and enjoy the ride.

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  1. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Bob Thompson: If one spends some time examining what has happened between the lead up to the 2016 election and since then, as it regards Donald Trump, I think it is really difficult to pin any serious wrongdoing, much less actions involving criminal intent on him.

    That’s pretty much central to the idea that he was more sinned-against than sinned or sinful.

    • #1
  2. DonG (CAGW is a Scam) Coolidge
    DonG (CAGW is a Scam)
    @DonG

    Bob Thompson: There are plenty of issues, viewpoints, and characters that will be part of the coming period.

    And this just here on Ricochet!

    • #2
  3. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: If one spends some time examining what has happened between the lead up to the 2016 election and since then, as it regards Donald Trump, I think it is really difficult to pin any serious wrongdoing, much less actions involving criminal intent on him.

    That’s pretty much central to the idea that he was more sinned-against than sinned or sinful.

    I do think Trump has a demeanor and behaviors, particular in response to criticism or other things he views as having negative effects on him, that make many people take an immediate dislike to him. But I also think that is part and parcel of the package that makes him effective as a man of action. I include myself now as someone who accepts the complete package because I consider most of those negative aspects as having little effect on his actions. This would describe many, maybe even most of his supporters. This is not a cult. There may be such a thing composed of some small numbers of people, I have no idea.

    At the other extreme in this fight are those working on an ideological objective that leads to a one word order or government. Those leading that group think they know how to get there and they think they have some vision of that end.  There are surely many fellow travelers and those joining for personal benefits, maybe the Biden’s are an example. Trump and his supporters have the potential to screw up their progression towards those goals. I think they had made enormous strides with hardly any resistance while most of us idled and Trump has the potential to change that. One reason to believe that is that we have never seen this kind of political turmoil inside the United States since before 1860. The current Republican Party is split like the Whigs did back then.

    Then there are also some big numbers in the middle of people whose support might shift as this conflict develops, people get more interested and acquire more knowledge, and learn why they should be involved.

    For those who are religious, there might be something there that can connect Trump’s emergence with their beliefs. 

    There will be something for everyone in this.

     

    • #3
  4. E. Kent Golding Member
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats  CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries ,  primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably  the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party).    I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry,  both of which crashed and burned early.    Trump was a long term Democrat  who successfully used the weakness of the  Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President,  I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party.    I am hesitant to bet again against  Trump as a sure loser,  I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    • #4
  5. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party). I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early. Trump was a long term Democrat who successfully used the weakness of the Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President, I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party. I am hesitant to bet again against Trump as a sure loser, I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    I don’t disagree with the collateral damage thesis but the perhaps unanticipated awakening from idleness of middle Americans might be enough to offset that.

    • #5
  6. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party). I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early. Trump was a long term Democrat who successfully used the weakness of the Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President, I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party. I am hesitant to bet again against Trump as a sure loser, I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    Naw, Trump didn’t cause the collateral damage, people like Bill Kristol and Jonah Goldberg did that.

    • #6
  7. E. Kent Golding Member
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    kedavis (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party). I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early. Trump was a long term Democrat who successfully used the weakness of the Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President, I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party. I am hesitant to bet again against Trump as a sure loser, I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    Naw, Trump didn’t cause the collateral damage, people like Bill Kristol and Jonah Goldberg did that.

    There has been enough collateral damage for there to be many contributors.

    • #7
  8. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party). I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early. Trump was a long term Democrat who successfully used the weakness of the Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President, I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party. I am hesitant to bet again against Trump as a sure loser, I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    Naw, Trump didn’t cause the collateral damage, people like Bill Kristol and Jonah Goldberg did that.

    There has been enough collateral damage for there to be many contributors.

    Then there are those who think the collateral damage is a good thing. So much was revealed during Trump’s Presidency about the half-century of destruction to many of our traditional institutions, what was/is behind that, and where those responsible are trying to take it. It is one thing for large numbers of voting Republicans (like me) to be idled by ignorance from lack of attention and quite another for the leaders of the Republican Party to suffer the same malady. The latter is unacceptable.

    • #8
  9. Barfly Member
    Barfly
    @Barfly

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    The media and democrats  CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries ,  primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably  the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party).

    They chose the form of their destructor. 

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry,  both of which crashed and burned early.

    I try to tell people, politics is constrained by what is possible. I was hoping for Cruz, but DJT was the best we could get – the lefties saw to that. 

    • #9
  10. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Barfly (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party).

    They chose the form of their destructor.

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early.

    I try to tell people, politics is constrained by what is possible. I was hoping for Cruz, but DJT was the best we could get – the lefties saw to that.

    And “best we could get” turned out to be better than many Republicans thought.  I doubt Cruz would have done as well as Trump as president, if he had even beaten Hillary which I doubt.

    • #10
  11. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Barfly (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party).

    They chose the form of their destructor.

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early.

    I try to tell people, politics is constrained by what is possible. I was hoping for Cruz, but DJT was the best we could get – the lefties saw to that.

    And “best we could get” turned out to be better than many Republicans thought. I doubt Cruz would have done as well as Trump as president, if he had even beaten Hillary which I doubt.

    When I went to precinct caucus in Utah in 2016 we voted to support Cruz, who I supported, for Republican nominee for President at the state convention. I remember Mike Lee was in our precinct group (don’t know who he supported at that time) and we ask him about Trump. He didn’t know much either way and he has been back and forth on Trump since then but mostly trending to supporting him.

    • #11
  12. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: If one spends some time examining what has happened between the lead up to the 2016 election and since then, as it regards Donald Trump, I think it is really difficult to pin any serious wrongdoing, much less actions involving criminal intent on him.

    That’s pretty much central to the idea that he was more sinned-against than sinned or sinful.

    And , you know, Trump would have an almost impossible task to do anything truly out of order and get away with it like other politicians do routinely because of the scrutiny and the intent to get him. 

    • #12
  13. Franco Member
    Franco
    @Franco

    What a great summary! Thank you for such a concise and dense encapsulation. 

    • #13
  14. CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill
    @CarolJoy

    You state: Democrats, aided by anti-Trump turncoat Republicans, worked throughout Trump’s term to bring him down, mostly with false information and accusations of wrongdoing, nothing ever proven, including claims that Trump’s actions and statements about the 2020 election and during the January 6 protests and riot involved inciting insurrection.

    I found it interesting that with Elon Musk re-instating Trump as of a few days ago, that  all his old tweets can now be read as well.

    I also find it interesting that the fourth from the final tweet he made in Jan 2021 was this :

    @realDonaldTrump·  “I am asking for everyone at the U.S. Capitol to remain peaceful. No violence! Remember, WE are the Party of Law & Order – respect the Law and our great men and women in Blue. Thank you!”

    • #14
  15. Unsk Member
    Unsk
    @Unsk

    Where do we go from here?

    I think a lot of the answer to that question depends on how Congress’s investigation s this coming year go and how  tough the pUbs can be On denying  the continuing budget resolutions and the extension of the debt limit to force change like defunding then FBI, Home land Security and perhaps the DOJ  to force laws to be passed that would all those rights that were taken away from us as well as the necessity to massively cut the deficit to reduce our debt payments and to avoid a looming economic collapse heading directly down the tracks right now.

    • #15
  16. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill (View Comment):

    You state: Democrats, aided by anti-Trump turncoat Republicans, worked throughout Trump’s term to bring him down, mostly with false information and accusations of wrongdoing, nothing ever proven, including claims that Trump’s actions and statements about the 2020 election and during the January 6 protests and riot involved inciting insurrection.

    I found it interesting that with Elon Musk re-instating Trump as of a few days ago, that all his old tweets can now be read as well.

    I also find it interesting that the fourth from the final tweet he made in Jan 2021 was this :

    @ realDonaldTrump· “I am asking for everyone at the U.S. Capitol to remain peaceful. No violence! Remember, WE are the Party of Law & Order – respect the Law and our great men and women in Blue. Thank you!”

    Thanks for putting that up. The safety and security of the Capitol itself is a direct responsibility of the Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi. President Trump had already offered any assistance the Speaker deemed necessary which was rejected. It is hard to imagine after that what Trump could or should do beyond exhorting that protesting crowd to remain peaceful.

    • #16
  17. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Our 2024 nominee must not be Trump.  It should be someone who supported Trump in 2016 and 2020 and broke with Trump only after Trump insisted that the “only” way he could have lost was due to cheating.  Chris Christie and Ron DeSantis come to mind.  We want Trump policies without Trump himself.

    • #17
  18. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    We want Trump policies without Trump himself.

    A statement worthy of the characters in Ayn Rand’s Atlas Shrugged who wanted Rearden’s money but wanted nothing to do with him. :)

    • #18
  19. Bishop Wash Member
    Bishop Wash
    @BishopWash

    Barfly (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party).

    They chose the form of their destructor.

    They seemed to do better this go around. Schumer’s PAC was the biggest spender in something like twelve Republican primaries and they all went on to lose in the general.

    • #19
  20. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens
    @BryanGStephens

    We go the way of Rome. 

     

    • #20
  21. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    kedavis (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party). I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early. Trump was a long term Democrat who successfully used the weakness of the Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President, I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party. I am hesitant to bet again against Trump as a sure loser, I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    Naw, Trump didn’t cause the collateral damage, people like Bill Kristol and Jonah Goldberg did that.

    You are collapsing distinctions again by lumping everyone who is not as pure MAGA as you as creating collateral damage.  There is a huge distinction between Goldberg and Kristol that you seem eager to ignore.

    • #21
  22. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    We go the way of Rome.

    Or we can have a Pro-Life, Pro-Gun, Lower Taxes, Less Regulation officials in Arizona and Georgia who win 55% of the vote, as did Kimberly Yee, Brian Kemp and Brad Raffensperger did.  You can have everything you want except one thing.  If you insist on people who dispute the Biden Election Victory in 2020, you lose, as the Arizona candidates for Senator, Governor, Secretary of State and Attorney General all did.

    You realize, if Trump hadn’t endorsed Republicans in the Arizona Primary who dispute the 2020 election, then we would have a Republican Senator, Governor, Secretary of State and Attorney General right now in Arizona.

    Henry Olsen had a great column in the Washington Post showing that nationally in competitive races, a Trump Endorsement in the primary cost 5% in the general election.  In Arizona, it cost 5.7%.  Pro-Life, NRA Rated “A” Kimberly Yee won 55.7% of the vote while the top 4 statewide Republicans all got less than 50% of the vote AND LOST.

    • #22
  23. Buckpasser Member
    Buckpasser
    @Buckpasser

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Our 2024 nominee must not be Trump. It should be someone who supported Trump in 2016 and 2020 and broke with Trump only after Trump insisted that the “only” way he could have lost was due to cheating. Chris Christie and Ron DeSantis come to mind. We want Trump policies without Trump himself.

    Chris Christie???

    • #23
  24. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Buckpasser (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Our 2024 nominee must not be Trump. It should be someone who supported Trump in 2016 and 2020 and broke with Trump only after Trump insisted that the “only” way he could have lost was due to cheating. Chris Christie and Ron DeSantis come to mind. We want Trump policies without Trump himself.

    Chris Christie???

    Doesn’t Chris Christie spend all day eating breakfast?  Seems like I heard a story about that once.

    • #24
  25. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Buckpasser (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Our 2024 nominee must not be Trump. It should be someone who supported Trump in 2016 and 2020 and broke with Trump only after Trump insisted that the “only” way he could have lost was due to cheating. Chris Christie and Ron DeSantis come to mind. We want Trump policies without Trump himself.

    Chris Christie???

    Doesn’t Chris Christie spend all day eating breakfast? Seems like I heard a story about that once.

    If you can have anyone you want except Trump (or DJTJ), who would you choose?  

    Anyone other than Trump (or an overt election disputer) would have an extra 5% margin in contested states.

    • #25
  26. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Buckpasser (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Our 2024 nominee must not be Trump. It should be someone who supported Trump in 2016 and 2020 and broke with Trump only after Trump insisted that the “only” way he could have lost was due to cheating. Chris Christie and Ron DeSantis come to mind. We want Trump policies without Trump himself.

    Chris Christie???

    Doesn’t Chris Christie spend all day eating breakfast? Seems like I heard a story about that once.

    He’s an unusually tall Hobbit?

    • #26
  27. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson: It is very interesting how the media helped Trump with publicity during the 2016 Republican primary campaign

    The media and democrats CREATED Trump in the 2016 Primaries , primarily because they thought he would be the easiest Republican nominee to have Hillary crush ( and probably the most enjoyable to crush , who would do the most collateral damage to the Republican party). I really really wanted Scott Walker or Rick Perry, both of which crashed and burned early. Trump was a long term Democrat who successfully used the weakness of the Republican party to become a Presidential nominee and later President.

    While Trump ( against my expectations ) both won and was a generally good President, I think the Democrats again want to set up Trump as a sure loser and someone who will do the most collateral damage to the Republican party. I am hesitant to bet again against Trump as a sure loser, I think the collateral damage thesis has been proven out.

    Naw, Trump didn’t cause the collateral damage, people like Bill Kristol and Jonah Goldberg did that.

    You are collapsing distinctions again by lumping everyone who is not as pure MAGA as you as creating collateral damage. There is a huge distinction between Goldberg and Kristol that you seem eager to ignore.

    Gary, what about all the distinctions between different allegations of election cheating in 2020?

    https://ricochet.com/1334554/two-years-later-how-to-think-about-election-cheating-in-2020/

    • #27
  28. E. Kent Golding Member
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    I think DeSantis, Youngkin, and Abbott( sp?)  could all win in 2024.   I think either Tim or Rick Scott could win in 2024.   I prefer DeSantis,  but would joyfully support  any of them.    There may be other strong, good choices that I am not aware of.  Hopefully the primaries will result in our strongest best candidate.

    • #28
  29. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    I think DeSantis, Youngkin, and Abbott( sp?) could all win in 2024. I think either Tim or Rick Scott could win in 2024. I prefer DeSantis, but would joyfully support any of them. There may be other strong, good choices that I am not aware of. Hopefully the primaries will result in our strongest best candidate.

    I totally agree.  I am fine with any of these five.  What I hope happens is that well before Iowa, most Republican candidates drop out, that Iowa narrows the field to three candidates, and New Hampshire narrows the field to two candidates.

    • #29
  30. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens
    @BryanGStephens

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    I think DeSantis, Youngkin, and Abbott( sp?) could all win in 2024. I think either Tim or Rick Scott could win in 2024. I prefer DeSantis, but would joyfully support any of them. There may be other strong, good choices that I am not aware of. Hopefully the primaries will result in our strongest best candidate.

    I totally agree. I am fine with any of these five. What I hope happens is that well before Iowa, most Republican candidates drop out, that Iowa narrows the field to three candidates, and New Hampshire narrows the field to two candidates.

    I will vote for whomever wins the nomination. 

     

    • #30
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