Recommended by Ricochet Members Created with Sketch. Trump’s Peace Plan

 

For the first time, an actual proposed map has been published by a player in the Israeli-Arab negotiations. It is truly fair to both sides. And it includes this wonderful gem:

“People of every faith should be permitted to pray on the Temple Mount/Haram al-Sharif, in a manner that is fully respectful to their religion, taking into account the times of each religion’s prayers and holidays, as well as other religious factors.”

This punchline is why the Palestinians would never accept this deal. Jews are currently not allowed to pray on the Temple Mount.

It is a very solid proposal. Israel could add a “stick,” if not accepted, Israel will annex the West Bank. The Palestinians would still reject it. And so Israel should annex anyway and be done with it.

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There are 142 comments.

  1. Arahant Member

    iWe: The Palestinians would still reject it.

    Yep. There will always be another demand.

    • #1
    • January 28, 2020, at 12:01 PM PST
    • 7 likes
  2. Hartmann von Aue Member

    Arahant (View Comment):

    iWe: The Palestinians would still reject it.

    Yep. There will always be another demand.

    If I recall, the Peace Plan back in the 90s under Rabin and Arafat with Clinton acting as bartender gave the Palestinians both more of Gaza and more of the West Bank territory than they had asked for. Result: Intifada II. 

    • #2
    • January 28, 2020, at 12:27 PM PST
    • 11 likes
  3. RushBabe49 Thatcher

    The stupidest thing the Israelis ever did was giving the Temple Mount to the Arabs. It is disgusting that the Jews cannot pray at their holiest site.

    • #3
    • January 28, 2020, at 12:46 PM PST
    • 18 likes
  4. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Israel should drive the Palestinians into the sea (or, alternatively, Jordan), and be done with it.

     

    • #4
    • January 28, 2020, at 12:53 PM PST
    • 13 likes
  5. Susan Quinn Contributor

    The Palestinians won’t agree to even discuss it, is my guess. But if they do, they will want to negotiate it indefinitely, ergo, no resolution.

    iWe: It is a very solid proposal. Israel could add a “stick” – if not accepted, Israel will annex the West Bank. The Palestinians would still reject it. And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

    Works for me!

    • #5
    • January 28, 2020, at 1:33 PM PST
    • 6 likes
  6. Clifford A. Brown Contributor

    All this in the middle of a rabidly partisan quest to nullify and criminalize his presidency. President Trump seems to thrive on opposition. 

    • #6
    • January 28, 2020, at 1:43 PM PST
    • 15 likes
  7. Stad Thatcher

    iWe: This punchline is why the Palestinians would never accept this deal.

    The “Palestinians” have never been about peace. They’ve always been most of the Arab world’s proxy to destroy Israel. Has any Arab country publically stated (and written into their foreign policy) that Israel has the right to exist?

    • #7
    • January 28, 2020, at 2:41 PM PST
    • 12 likes
  8. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… Member

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    The Palestinians won’t agree to even discuss it, is my guess. But if they do, they will want to negotiate it indefinitely, ergo, no resolution.

    iWe: It is a very solid proposal. Israel could add a “stick” – if not accepted, Israel will annex the West Bank. The Palestinians would still reject it. And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

    Works for me!

    Susan, good comment. I wonder if the purpose of this plan is to seek an actual agreement, or to make a reasonable proposal in order to politically isolate the Palestinians.

    I wonder how the Squad will react. It seems plausible that the President, and his advisers, are making a play that will drive the Democrats to embrace the Palestinians.

    I know that this is a bit cynical, but I actually don’t object to any of it. Politics is politics.

    • #8
    • January 28, 2020, at 3:09 PM PST
    • 12 likes
  9. ctlaw Coolidge

    Full map

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPY2upzX0Akk14R?format=jpg&name=large

    • #9
    • January 28, 2020, at 3:17 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  10. Unsk Member

    Nice Post. With Trump this is the opening round of negotiation designed I think to put the Palestinians in a box of their own making. 

    • #10
    • January 28, 2020, at 3:46 PM PST
    • 11 likes
  11. Susan Quinn Contributor

    Just out :

    Palestinian protesters chant angry slogans during a protest against the U.S. Mideast peace plan, in Gaza City, Monday, Jan. 28, 2020. U.S. President Donald Trump is set to unveil his administration’s much-anticipated Mideast peace plan in the latest U.S. venture to resolve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. (AP Photo/Khalil Hamra)

    RAMALLAH, West Bank (AP) — Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas said “a thousand no’s” to the Mideast peace plan announced Tuesday by President Donald Trump, which strongly favors Israel.

    The Palestinians remain committed to ending the Israeli occupation and establishing a state with its capital in east Jerusalem, Abbas said at a news conference in the West Bank city of Ramallah, where the Western-backed Palestinian Authority is headquartered.

    ‘After the nonsense that we heard today we say a thousand no’s to the Deal of The Century,’ he said.

    • #11
    • January 28, 2020, at 4:09 PM PST
    • 6 likes
  12. DonG (skeptic) Coolidge

    iWe:

    It is a very solid proposal. Israel could add a “stick” – if not accepted, Israel will annex the West Bank. The Palestinians would still reject it. And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

     

    It could be argued that the territory between the river and sea was fairly divided after WWII and the Palestinian people chose to go double or nothing in 1973. They lost war(s) and thus fairly get nothing.

    • #12
    • January 28, 2020, at 4:12 PM PST
    • 13 likes
  13. Valiuth Member
    Valiuth Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    DonG (skeptic) (View Comment):

    iWe:

    It is a very solid proposal. Israel could add a “stick” – if not accepted, Israel will annex the West Bank. The Palestinians would still reject it. And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

     

    It could be argued that the territory between the river and sea was fairly divided after WWII and the Palestinian people chose to go double or nothing in 1973. They lost war(s) and thus fairly get nothing.

    Didn’t the Jews lose wars to the Romans? I dont recall them thinking that out come was fair? In fact they whined about it for 2000 years until the Brits threw them a bone. 

    So if by some chance the Palastinians triple down and win a war then you’d honor that as legitimate? 

     

    • #13
    • January 28, 2020, at 4:25 PM PST
    • 1 like
  14. Valiuth Member
    Valiuth Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    iWe:

    And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

    So annex the whole thing? And then they do what with the 3 million people there? Make them citizens? So how I dont think that works. But if they don’t make them citizens then what? You keep them arround as a second class population? Isn’t that living down to the accusations from the BDS critics of Israel as an Apartheid state? 

    • #14
    • January 28, 2020, at 4:35 PM PST
    • 1 like
  15. Caryn Thatcher
    Caryn Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    They’re not going to annex. The plan is to apply sovereignty. There’s a difference. See here for a full explanation.

    • #15
    • January 28, 2020, at 4:55 PM PST
    • 1 like
  16. Sweezle Member

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    All this in the middle of a rabidly partisan quest to nullify and criminalize his presidency. President Trump seems to thrive on opposition.

    Trump is getting stronger and fighting harder with each blow. Amazing. 

    • #16
    • January 28, 2020, at 6:50 PM PST
    • 8 likes
  17. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    iWe:

    And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

    So annex the whole thing? And then they do what with the 3 million people there? Make them citizens? So how I dont think that works. But if they don’t make them citizens then what? You keep them arround as a second class population? Isn’t that living down to the accusations from the BDS critics of Israel as an Apartheid state?

    See my comment #4.

     

    • #17
    • January 28, 2020, at 7:29 PM PST
    • Like
  18. Hartmann von Aue Member

    I have to agree with those who think this is a long game play. Israel, backed by the U.S. offers the Palestinians even more than they were asking for, the Palestinians reject it in most undiplomatic terms, and then Israel proceeds with the plan unilaterally, acknowledging the new state and leaving the Palestinians to face the logical consequences of their intransigence. These consequences should include cutting off all utilities that originate inside the new borders of Israel according to the agreement. Some of the public utility needs are already met, but not all of them, and whether the leadership of the PA and Hamas decide to act like responsible national leaders or continue their bloodthirsty terror campaign will quickly become obvious to all but the most willfully blind.

    • #18
    • January 28, 2020, at 10:32 PM PST
    • 6 likes
  19. Valiuth Member
    Valiuth Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    iWe:

    And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

    So annex the whole thing? And then they do what with the 3 million people there? Make them citizens? So how I dont think that works. But if they don’t make them citizens then what? You keep them arround as a second class population? Isn’t that living down to the accusations from the BDS critics of Israel as an Apartheid state?

    See my comment #4.

     

    So worse than Apartheid, a genocidal state? Now no better than its enemies?? Okay go with that I’m sure it will work out. 

    • #19
    • January 29, 2020, at 4:18 AM PST
    • Like
  20. Old Bathos Moderator

    The formulation is an effective foil against those Israel-bashers among the secular elite. True diversity, true respect for all religious traditions should be the position of the nominally liberal which calls for opening up the site to non-Muslims. I think the enlightened ones should be under constant pressure to deal with the fact that the language of tolerance and diversity is often at odds with Islamic belief and practice and with the goals of the Palestinian groups they tacitly or overtly support.

    Whatever sympathy I had for Palestinian Arabs dissipated after I saw celebrations of the 9/11 attack. When I read about a suicide bomber on a bus (who clearly saw that his victims would include children when he detonated) and that there was a ‘martyr card’ for this piece of filth for Palestinian children to collect so as to praise this behavior I realized that this is a hopelessly depraved culture. Ehud Barak gave them the best offer they would ever get and they chose perpetual grievance and violence instead.

    • #20
    • January 29, 2020, at 6:29 AM PST
    • 9 likes
  21. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    This is classic, mad-brilliant Donald Trump: expose the faithlessness of your “negotiating partner” — just as he’s exposed the Democrats’ and MSM’s bad faith as the “loyal opposition.”

    We’ve been gestating a similar problem here in the States for decades by “educating” and importing people who are ideologically opposed to the founding principles of our nation. It’s a set-up for violent conflict. The only non-violent resolution I can see is to remove the trip-wires. In Israel’s case, that means Arab Muslims who don’t want to live in an Israeli state should have their own Exodus to a state which conforms to their ideology, and they have plenty to choose from nearby. Buh-bye! Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.

    • #21
    • January 29, 2020, at 7:46 AM PST
    • 7 likes
  22. JamesSalerno Coolidge

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    Israel should drive the Palestinians into the sea (or, alternatively, Jordan), and be done with it.

     

    Jordan: “Turn around, we’re full!”

    • #22
    • January 29, 2020, at 7:59 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  23. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… Member

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    iWe:

    And so Israel should annex, and be done with it.

    So annex the whole thing? And then they do what with the 3 million people there? Make them citizens? So how I dont think that works. But if they don’t make them citizens then what? You keep them arround as a second class population? Isn’t that living down to the accusations from the BDS critics of Israel as an Apartheid state?

    See my comment #4.

     

    So worse than Apartheid, a genocidal state? Now no better than its enemies?? Okay go with that I’m sure it will work out.

    This illustrates the problem with the Left-wing view of things, which has been adopted by many on the right. I think that the conundrum is caused by several bad ideas. I consider these ideas to be quite naive.

    One bad idea seems to be that we must rule out any relocation of people. As incompatible groups of people are intermixed in many parts of the world, ruling out relocation means that this problem can never be solved. 

    Another bad idea is that a nation must give citizenship, and a voice in the government, to a group of residents who want to overthrow the state. Again, this is a recipe for endless conflict.

    The situation is difficult. Forced relocation is an unpleasant thing, even if it is carried out in a humane fashion. Historically, it has often not been carried out in a humane fashion, compounding the suffering. But the alternatives are also unpleasant, and at least relocation has a chance of solving the problem.

    I’m going to cite Thomas Sowell here. There are no solutions, only trade-offs.

    My impression is that many people refuse to face difficult facts about this issue, and about many others. They seem more interested in displaying themselves like a moral peacock than in solving hard problems and making the messy choices demanded by the real world.

    Val, you have done this with your Apartheid reference.

    If I recall correctly, Locke addressed this, stating that the “magistrate” (his term for the governing authority) had a right to demand the loyalty of the people.

    • #23
    • January 29, 2020, at 8:11 AM PST
    • 9 likes
  24. iWe Reagan
    iWe Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Didn’t the Jews lose wars to the Romans? I dont recall them thinking that out come was fair?

    We fought, we lost, and it sucked. It put paid to our misunderstanding about our mission on this earth.

    But unfair? No.

    In fact they whined about it for 2000 years until the Brits threw them a bone.

    WHINED? We yearned to rebuild our Temple.

    And what is with the dog references? Is that how you see Jews?

     

     

    • #24
    • January 29, 2020, at 9:07 AM PST
    • 8 likes
  25. Arahant Member

    iWe (View Comment):
    And what is with the dog references? Is that how you see Jews?

    It is an old habit with some people and cultures, isn’t it?

    • #25
    • January 29, 2020, at 9:12 AM PST
    • 5 likes
  26. Manny Member

    Looks like a good deal for Israel. I can’t imagine the Palestinians going for it. I’d be shocked if it happened. But let’s hope.

    • #26
    • January 29, 2020, at 9:12 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  27. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Manny (View Comment):

    Looks like a good deal for Israel. I can’t imagine the Palestinians going for it. I’d be shocked if it happened. But let’s hope.

    I dunno, I look at the map linked by ctlaw and I think, “the whole thing is Israel. It’s way too generous to people who want to destroy Israel and exterminate Jews.” But, that’s the beautiful sleight of hand in the offer. The Palestinians will never accept it no matter how generous a “coexistence” plan is, which makes the “get out” alternative all the more reasonable.

    • #27
    • January 29, 2020, at 9:26 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  28. Manny Member

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Looks like a good deal for Israel. I can’t imagine the Palestinians going for it. I’d be shocked if it happened. But let’s hope.

    I dunno, I look at the map linked by ctlaw and I think, “the whole thing is Israel. It’s way too generous to people who want to destroy Israel and exterminate Jews.” But, that’s the beautiful sleight of hand in the offer. The Palestinians will never accept it no matter how generous a “coexistence” plan is, which makes the “get out” alternative all the more reasonable.

    I don’t know what Israel’s options are with the Palestinians. Can they push them out to the sea as someone above suggested? I don’t think so. I don’t think it’s in Israel’s interest to integrate the Palestinians into their society. It would be a huge voting block. A two state solution is the best option for both as far as i can see. It’s a question of what the terms of that two state solution are.

    • #28
    • January 29, 2020, at 9:48 AM PST
    • 1 like
  29. Arahant Member

    Manny (View Comment):
    Can they push them out to the sea as someone above suggested? I don’t think so.

    There is history behind that suggestion, which is probably at least semi-facetious in the current context. That was what the Arabs intended to do to the Palestinians (Jews). Of course, that was back when “Palestinian” meant a Jew living in British Mandate Palestine and the people we now call “Palestinians” were called Arabs.

    • #29
    • January 29, 2020, at 9:57 AM PST
    • 8 likes
  30. iWe Reagan
    iWe Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    Can they push them out to the sea as someone above suggested? I don’t think so.

    There is history behind that suggestion, which is probably at least semi-facetious in the current context. That was what the Arabs intended to do to the Palestinians (Jews). Of course, that was back when “Palestinian” meant a Jew living in British Mandate Palestine and the people we now call “Palestinians” were called Arabs.

    Actually, this is STILL what the Palestinians say they want to do to the Jews.

    • #30
    • January 29, 2020, at 10:05 AM PST
    • 9 likes