Contributor Post Created with Sketch. Recommended by Ricochet Members Created with Sketch. Spiritual But Not Religious

 

I’m tired of people describing their spiritual lives as “spiritual but not religious.” I have little respect for people who wear the spiritual label to show how enlightened they are, and how they have freed themselves from the archaic practices of religion.

I know there are many people who have had painful experiences with religion and thus have chosen this narrow journey of spirituality. Many people have had difficult, emotionally wounding experiences with organized religion. They have been betrayed by a spiritual leader or were taught as a child a fearful or hateful version of religions. They were expected to follow rituals they didn’t understand or resented. All in all, early experiences left them empty, without filling their hearts and souls. Even my own mother felt rejected; she had wanted to join a synagogue, but we had limited funds. She left hurt and embarrassed after visiting the synagogue, when they told her they couldn’t adjust the fees for her poor financial situation.

There are also many people who, for one reason or another, never felt connected to their religion. A plethora of people and entities could be blamed for this lack of fulfillment. In many cases, parents didn’t know how to communicate the depth and meaning of the religion; often they themselves had been poorly educated, so that the religious observation was a perplexing combination of ritual, holy days, and practices to which they couldn’t relate. The mix of observances just seemed to interfere with everyday life and didn’t seem to provide a meaningful purpose.

And yet there are many people who have felt that “something was missing” in their lives; it didn’t occur to them that their earlier experiences had to do not just with particular churches or synagogues, or with certain religious leaders, or even with their families, and that their generalizations about religion might be incomplete. Instead, they may have asked themselves why they should go back to something that had already failed them. And there are others who feel moved to “try something” outside of religion. I describe those efforts as “dabbling,” “trial efforts,” or “just spiritual,” or a mixture of all three.

“Dabbling” describes” trying out different practices they’ve heard of or read about. These efforts are often superficial, like trying on a new dress to see how it fits. When a woman dabbles in clothing styles, she often puts a value on whether the color suits her, whether the outfit complements her body type, or whether it’s a practical addition to her wardrobe. If she doesn’t like it, she can always return it. Unfortunately, that’s how some people explore religion: what looks good, which things “feel” right, which make the fewest demands. They move in and out of belief systems as if they are changing outfits. They may assume that they may find something that suits them, but underneath, they are too reticent, too wounded, or too disillusioned to take a risk to make a serious religious commitment. So they spend a lifetime dabbling and call it spiritual.

Trial efforts are made by people who aren’t quite satisfied with their lives but feel they are willing to try something else; this description described me at one time, although at the time, I didn’t see it as a trial effort. I had never deeply connected to Judaism and I liked Zen Buddhism, liked many of the teachings, appreciated meditation and even enjoyed most of the rituals. I felt that it deepened my spiritual life, especially since I felt it brought me closer to G-d. I didn’t go into Zen with that intention, since Zen is not a theistic practice, but it doesn’t forbid believing in G-d; ironically I felt G-d’s presence more deeply when I practiced Zen, and I know that meditation contributed to my experience.

But life was determined to move me away from Zen and in some ways, I sabotaged my own practice. Left bereft with no religious framework and no community, I questioned where to go next. Eventually, as many of you know, I returned to and embraced my original faith of Judaism.

Others who engage in “trial efforts” often try more than one faith. This decision is deeper than dabbling, but it often is fairly limited in the way it works upon the soul of an individual. That result could be due to the ambivalence of the practitioner, or due to a mismatch with a religion, or due to the person expecting the perfect practice and finding problems with it over time. When disillusionment sets in, a person can muddle along indefinitely, or move on to a new religion.

Finally, there are those who want to be “just spiritual.” They’ve had little exposure to formal religion, and what they’ve learned has been critical of religion. They’ve been told that people of faith just believe in a “big man in the sky,” and they perceive religion as primitive and restrictive.

People who want to be just spiritual often don’t even dabble They experience spirituality through a beautiful landscape, brilliant sunset or some other part of nature. They see no need for ritual, for a framework of values and beliefs to build on. They want to be free to be spiritual when the moment moves them.

* * * * *

It’s occurred to me that one of the greatest barriers to others embracing a religion is that it is often filled with paradoxes. How do those of us who are religious explain that the deepest experiences can come from the limits we set in our lives? How do we describe the freedom and satisfaction that comes from following a belief system that seems to restrict us and is even difficult? How do we show people that we grow through spiritual questioning and examination? How do we demonstrate that believing in and opening ourselves up to a divine being can be some of the most intimate and rewarding times of our lives?

* * * * *

The spiritual choices that people reject or embrace not only affect themselves, but affect their families, their communities, even this country. Unless they transcend their self-centered views, they will have restricted their own lives and their ability to influence this country in a wholesome, positive way. Everyone loses.

* * * * *

To understand these factors is more than an intellectual exercise; these are not ideas you can read about in a book to determine that they are true. Study is invaluable, but study without experience will rarely fulfill one’s spiritual hopes. But if one studies religion, asks oneself the toughest questions and requests divine guidance, practices with devotion, and an open heart, all things are possible.

Published in Religion & Philosophy
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There are 129 comments.

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  1. philo Member

    Susan Quinn: I have little respect for people who …. have freed themselves from the archaic practices of religion

    In my defense, I am a Methodist.

    [EDIT: link added]

    • #1
    • November 3, 2019, at 7:50 AM PST
    • 6 likes
  2. KentForrester Coolidge

    Susan, I always read and appreciate your “meditations” concerning religion and the spiritual life.

    But I never find myself among the kinds of religious experiences (or lack thereof) that you describe. (Susan, you’re a bit harsh sometimes on my “type.”)

    At the risk of redundancy (I’ve touched on these matters before), my parents were secular-minded, and so am I. Thus, I didn’t really have anything to rebel against.

    I have absolutely no need to believe in anything beyond this material world. And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    I‘ve experienced great sadness a couple of times, but those experiences have never moved me toward religious belief.

    I‘ve had a satisfying and happy life with my wife of 56 years. I don’t need anything more.

    I think I’m an empiricist or agnostic who tends toward atheism.

    Your Ricochet friend, Kent

    • #2
    • November 3, 2019, at 7:57 AM PST
    • 9 likes
  3. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    philo (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn: I have little respect for people who …. have freed themselves from the archaic practices of religion

    In my defense, I am a Methodist.

    [EDIT: link added]

    It is tragic to see how many communities have been infiltrated by politics, @philo. It is devastating to a community, especially when some think they know what the community should do. Where do you stand with your church at the moment? Would you mind sharing a bit?

    • #3
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:01 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  4. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    KentForrester (View Comment):

    Susan, I always read and appreciate your “meditations” concerning religion and the spiritual life.

    But I never find myself among the kinds of religious experiences (or lack thereof) that you describe. (Susan, you’re a bit harsh sometimes on my “type.”)

    At the risk of redundancy (I’ve touched on these matters before), my parents were secular-minded, and so am I. Thus, I didn’t really have anything to rebel against.

    I have absolutely no need to believe in anything beyond this material world. And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    I‘ve experienced great sadness a couple of times, but those experiences have never moved me toward religious belief.

    I‘be also had a satisfying and happy life with my wife of 56 years. I don’t need anything more.

    I think I’m an empiricist or agnostic who tends toward atheism.

    Your Ricochet friend, Kent

    Actually, I think you have led a very fine life, @kentforrester. You have a loving marriage, have shown us what a good person you are and a gifted writer. My argument is with those who think they’ve got the spiritual life all figured out, essentially making themselves a god. If you haven’t been moved to pursue spirit or religion, that’s fine. You offer many other gifts to the world and need not justify your position. And you are also respectful toward those of us who pursue religion; that means a lot!

    • #4
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:04 AM PST
    • 12 likes
  5. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    KentForrester (View Comment):

    Susan, I always read and appreciate your “meditations” concerning religion and the spiritual life.

    But I never find myself among the kinds of religious experiences (or lack thereof) that you describe. (Susan, you’re a bit harsh sometimes on my “type.”)

    At the risk of redundancy (I’ve touched on these matters before), my parents were secular-minded, and so am I. Thus, I didn’t really have anything to rebel against.

    I have absolutely no need to believe in anything beyond this material world. And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    I‘ve experienced great sadness a couple of times, but those experiences have never moved me toward religious belief.

    I‘ve had a satisfying and happy life with my wife of 56 years. I don’t need anything more.

    I think I’m an empiricist or agnostic who tends toward atheism.

    Your Ricochet friend, Kent

    Besides, you have a very cool dog!

    • #5
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:05 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  6. David Foster Member

    “spiritual but not religious”….this is a very common self-definition among people under about 45, especially women, it seems.

    Interestingly: in Goethe’s ‘Faust’, when Faust is attempting to seduce Gretchen but she demurs because she is concerned that he may not be a religious man, then he replies:

    “Fill your heart to overflowing,
    and when you feel profoundest bliss
    then call it what you will:
    Good fortune! Heart! Love! or God!
    I have no name for it!
    Feeling is all;
    the name is sound and smoke,
    beclouding Heaven’s glow.”

    Spiritual but not religious!

    And she replies: “That’s all well and good. The priest says the same thing in different words.”

    The seduction happens.

     

    • #6
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:21 AM PST
    • 10 likes
  7. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    David Foster (View Comment):

    “spiritual but not religious”….this is a very common self-definition among people under about 45, especially women, it seems.

    Interestingly: in Goethe’s ‘Faust’, when Faust is attempting to seduce Gretchen but she demurs because she is concerned that he may not be a religious man, then he replies:

    “Fill your heart to overflowing,
    and when you feel profoundest bliss
    then call it what you will:
    Good fortune! Heart! Love! or God!
    I have no name for it!
    Feeling is all;
    the name is sound and smoke,
    beclouding Heaven’s glow.”

    Spiritual but not religious!

    And she replies: “That’s all well and good. The priest says the same thing in different words.”

    The seduction happens.

     

    Fascinating point, @davidfoster, and expands on my points very well! Thank you!

    • #7
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:25 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  8. SpiritO'78 Member

    I’m most familiar with Evangelical Christianity so take my opinions from that filter. We’ve probably been unduly harsh with the ‘un-churched’ or non-religious types over the years. Things are better now I think. The American Church (evangelical) has been losing ground for a long time, both in numbers and ideas in culture. The future of growth (salvation) will be person to person and not corporate, massive church buildings. People don’t trust institutions anymore and that certainly includes going to a service.

    • #8
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:28 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  9. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    I feel compelled to clarify a few things at this point. First, I generally have no problem with atheists and agnostics, and I don’t think I was clear about this point on another post. My friends on Rico who are atheists or agnostics are loving, caring people, and I don’t care whether they are religious or not. I think people are entitled to believe whatever they wish, even if it’s silly, hateful, confused or loving. Where I differ with some people is not about what they think, but how they act. So if a person denigrates or ridicules religion, I have a problem with their actions. As I accept their right to believe whatever they wish, I expect them to act respectfully toward my beliefs. (I always say that you don’t have to respect my beliefs, but you should behave respectfully.)You are welcome to feel as you wish, but to publicly attack religions is not helpful. So in terms of this post, I am not saying that everyone should be religious; I am saying that if you wish to be deeply spiritual, IMHO, you should look into a religious practice. And of course, you have the right to ignore my suggestions!

    • #9
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:33 AM PST
    • 9 likes
  10. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    SpiritO'78 (View Comment):

    I’m most familiar with Evangelical Christianity so take my opinions from that filter. We’ve probably been unduly harsh with the ‘un-churched’ or non-religious types over the years. Things are better now I think. The American Church (evangelical) has been losing ground for a long time, both in numbers and ideas in culture. The future of growth (salvation) will be person to person and not corporate, massive church buildings. People don’t trust institutions anymore and that certainly includes going to a service.

    Excellent point, @spirito78. Things get dicey for me with some evangelicals when they see me as less than them (and express that through their words). There is a tension that can arise when they express their commitment or desire to convert me. I already know that is their mission, but I’m not interested. If we can both agree to put that idea aside, we’ll do great!

    • #10
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:37 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  11. Jim McConnell Member

    A very perceptive and, I think, accurate description of the spiritual “trap” in which many find themselves. 

    @susanquinn, although you are Jewish and I’m an evangelical Christian, I think we would both agree with the seventeenth century Catholic theologian Blaise Pascal:

    “What else does this craving, and this helplessness, proclaim but that there was once in man a true happiness, of which all that now remains is the empty print and trace? This he tries in vain to fill with everything around him, seeking in things that are not there the help he cannot find in those that are, though none can help, since this infinite abyss can be filled only with an infinite and immutable object; in other words by God himself.”

    Thank you for the post!

     

     

    • #11
    • November 3, 2019, at 8:46 AM PST
    • 16 likes
  12. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    Jim McConnell (View Comment):

    A very perceptive and, I think, accurate description of the spiritual “trap” in which many find themselves.

    @susanquinn, although you are Jewish and I’m an evangelical Christian, I think we would both agree with the seventeenth century Catholic theologian Blaise Pascal:

    “What else does this craving, and this helplessness, proclaim but that there was once in man a true happiness, of which all that now remains is the empty print and trace? This he tries in vain to fill with everything around him, seeking in things that are not there the help he cannot find in those that are, though none can help, since this infinite abyss can be filled only with an infinite and immutable object; in other words by God himself.”

    Thank you for the post!

     

     

    I love the quotation, @jimmcconnell. And you are one evangelical among many whom I hold in deep regard. Thanks for the kind words, too.

    • #12
    • November 3, 2019, at 9:16 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  13. Henry Racette Contributor

    Susan, I’ve long shared your frustration with the “spiritual but not religious” label, but recently I’ve begun to reexamine it, and I think I’m revising my opinion. I think that essentially everyone is “spiritual,” in the sense that almost everyone feels the desire, the need, for something transcendent, for a purpose greater than that of meeting their quotidian exigencies. In the past, most people sought a religious community in which to fulfill that longing, a body of people sharing and reaffirming a common understanding of this transcendent purpose. As our culture grows more secular, other causes take on the same character of shared purpose: environmentalism, identity, collectivism, social justice, eugenics — various ersatz theologies that provide ideological structure and the support of a community.

    People want to belong to something, want to feel that they’re contributing to something larger and more enduring than their own lives. Some seek that in cosmology and mathematics, in adding bricks to the edifice of knowledge. Others devote themselves to parenting, though that’s a choice available to almost everyone and yet, apparently, insufficient in itself to reliably satisfy the call of the numinous.

    I’m not spiritual, but I like organized religion. I think participation in faith communities is good for us and good for our culture. I also think we under-appreciate the aspect of purpose such faith communities serve to reify, in that we too often focus on what the organization — the church, synagogue, temple — can do to serve the congregation, rather than on what it can call the congregation to do in service. People want to serve; I think most of us need to serve, to feel fulfilled.

     

    • #13
    • November 3, 2019, at 9:43 AM PST
    • 11 likes
  14. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    As our culture grows more secular, other causes take on the same character of shared purpose: environmentalism, identity, collectivism, social justice, eugenics — various ersatz theologies that provide ideological structure and the support of a community.

    Thanks for your thoughtful response, @henryracette. I will give more thought to your comment, but I don’t think we’ll agree. First, I don’t know that most people want to experience something greater than themselves; in fact, I’m not sure what that means. Also, I think they are terrified of what they think that means. What people want is to experience bliss; they want to feel good, feel happy. There’s nothing wrong with those desires, only they are limiting and superficial. As you point to the movement toward the secular, many of these folks are “looking for something,” but I believe most of them are looking for something great to which they can attach themselves–the topic you mention. I think there is a narcissism and a naivete that goes with those goals. They live within their utopian ideals. When a person is genuinely religious, I believe they can desire to meet the ideal, but in the real world. They know there are limitations to what they can do, rather than feeling justified to force the world to join their utopian cause.

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    People want to belong to something, want to feel that they’re contributing to something larger and more enduring than their own lives.

    In this regard, you may be right, but I don’t think most people are doing this from a selfless perspective. They are doing it to align with an ideal, but it’s to do something more enduring that they will be remembered for–rather than doing it for a greater cause. If there is no G-d, what is the greater cause?

    Most of the people I’ve met who call themselves spiritual, too, have no moral set from which they operate. They may have absorbed a moral sense from living in a Jude0-Christian country, but I wonder if they are conscious of the importance of acting from that sense? Folks who call themselves spiritual are often nice people, but they are not deep, philosophically or religiously. They rarely impress me.

    I do agree with your comments about the value of religious community, even though I don’t attend one myself. But that’s my loss.

    • #14
    • November 3, 2019, at 9:58 AM PST
    • 5 likes
  15. David Foster Member

    What I find interesting is that few of the people who reject traditional American religions become atheists or agnostics of the scientific-materialist type. Most of them seem to adopt mystical beliefs ranging from magical crystals to homeopathy to astrology. 

     

    • #15
    • November 3, 2019, at 9:59 AM PST
    • 11 likes
  16. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    David Foster (View Comment):

    What I find interesting is that few of the people who reject traditional American religions become atheists or agnostics of the scientific-materialist type. Most of them seem to adopt mystical beliefs ranging from magical crystals to homeopathy to astrology.

     

    I’m not doubting your point, @davidfoster, but I would love to see data to support that. In other words, do they create their own version of G-d?

    • #16
    • November 3, 2019, at 10:02 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  17. David Foster Member

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):
    I’m not doubting your point, @davidfoster, but I would love to see data to support that. In other words, do they create their own version of G-d?

    No solid data, mainly anecdotal based on people I’ve known.

    They don’t create their own version of God, rather, they seem to be more inclined to a polytheistic worldview.

    • #17
    • November 3, 2019, at 10:28 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  18. Arahant Member

    KentForrester (View Comment):
    And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    That reminds me, Kent, why don’t you come by after you’re dead? We can have a laugh together.

    • #18
    • November 3, 2019, at 11:22 AM PST
    • 6 likes
  19. jonb60173 Member

    I’ve also sensed/felt this anti movement, yoga seems to be the main outlet of replacement. My sister has likened her yoga beliefs to my Godly ones – huh? not even worth arguing over, that’s what prayer is for. In the midst of all of this anti-God movement (didn’t Californians actually make posters “Keep God out of California”? Yikes! Why don’t you just curse yourselves) in reading the Bible this isn’t anything new and God’s seemingly got it covered. My belief is as believers we still need to stand our ground but we needn’t have any disparity, God’s been there and done that. One wonders; what craziness will there be 100 years from now?

    • #19
    • November 3, 2019, at 11:25 AM PST
    • 8 likes
  20. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    jonb60173 (View Comment):

    I’ve also sensed/felt this anti movement, yoga seems to be the main outlet of replacement. My sister has likened her yoga beliefs to my Godly ones – huh? not even worth arguing over, that’s what prayer is for. In the midst of all of this anti-God movement (didn’t Californians actually make posters “Keep God out of California”? Yikes! Why don’t you just curse yourselves) in reading the Bible this isn’t anything new and God’s seemingly got it covered. My belief is as believers we still need to stand our ground but we needn’t have any disparity, God’s been there and done that. One wonders; what craziness will there be 100 years from now?

    Great comment, @jonb60173. Yes, yoga comes out of the Hindu tradition, and some practice it as a religion, since it is one. At the same time, it’s a great physical practice–I don’t practice it regularly or religiously(!) but it keeps these 70-year old bones moving. I believe G-d is there for us; he expects us, however, to continue his creation and serve him. If we don’t speak up for religion in this world (which I believe is part of my mission), who will? Thanks for weighing in, and I’m glad your sister is engaged in her own way.

    • #20
    • November 3, 2019, at 11:41 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  21. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    By the way, some of you may not realize that even if you commented, you may not get notifications of other comments; if you’re not getting notifications in general, check your Settings and make sure the Notifications box is checked. (Somehow the system has unchecked a number of people.)

    • #21
    • November 3, 2019, at 11:43 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  22. Scott Wilmot Member

    I’ve always scratched my head when I hear someone say they are spiritual but not religious. I don’t even know what that means.

    I’ve heard it mostly from those who reject the Catholic faith because they want to follow their own precepts rather than those of God.

    It seems like a lazy cop-out to me.

    • #22
    • November 3, 2019, at 12:25 PM PST
    • 11 likes
  23. I Shot The Serif Member

    What about the “It’s not a religion, it’s a relationship” people? They make it sound like you can’t have both. 

    Back in my online theological debate days, it seemed like a lot of Christians saw ‘religion’ as a bad word. They saw it as what the prophets preached against–rituals with nothing behind them. I think that’s unfortunate.

    • #23
    • November 3, 2019, at 1:13 PM PST
    • 5 likes
  24. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn Post author

    I Shot The Serif (View Comment):

    What about the “It’s not a religion, it’s a relationship” people? They make it sound like you can’t have both.

    Back in my online theological debate days, it seemed like a lot of Christians saw ‘religion’ as a bad word. They saw it as what the prophets preached against–rituals with nothing behind them. I think that’s unfortunate.

    @ishottheserif, maybe it’s because of our, ahem, age difference, but all of this is new to me. What does “It’s not a religion, it’s a relationship” mean? Relationship with whom? And Christians seeing religion as a bad word? Maybe they just didn’t want to be “judged” by people who actually believed in religion–or those who didn’t. Weird. Let’s see if anyone else wants to weigh in on experiences like yours.

    • #24
    • November 3, 2019, at 1:24 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  25. David Foster Member

    To correct my earlier comment, I think pantheistic would be more accurate than polytheistic for most of the people I’m talking about.

    • #25
    • November 3, 2019, at 1:28 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  26. KentForrester Coolidge

    Arahant (View Comment):

    KentForrester (View Comment):
    And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    That reminds me, Kent, why don’t you come by after you’re dead? We can have a laugh together.

    I will, Arahant. Can I count on you being there?

    • #26
    • November 3, 2019, at 1:41 PM PST
    • 4 likes
  27. Scott Wilmot Member

    I Shot The Serif (View Comment):

    What about the “It’s not a religion, it’s a relationship” people? They make it sound like you can’t have both.

    Back in my online theological debate days, it seemed like a lot of Christians saw ‘religion’ as a bad word. They saw it as what the prophets preached against–rituals with nothing behind them. I think that’s unfortunate.

    Sounds like “me and Jesus” Protestantism. It is the denial of the Church and the Sacraments; what one might call a Christian heresy.

    • #27
    • November 3, 2019, at 1:47 PM PST
    • 5 likes
  28. E. Kent Golding Member

    KentForrester (View Comment):

    Susan, I always read and appreciate your “meditations” concerning religion and the spiritual life.

    But I never find myself among the kinds of religious experiences (or lack thereof) that you describe. (Susan, you’re a bit harsh sometimes on my “type.”)

    At the risk of redundancy (I’ve touched on these matters before), my parents were secular-minded, and so am I. Thus, I didn’t really have anything to rebel against.

    I have absolutely no need to believe in anything beyond this material world. And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    I‘ve experienced great sadness a couple of times, but those experiences have never moved me toward religious belief.

    I‘ve had a satisfying and happy life with my wife of 56 years. I don’t need anything more.

    I think I’m an empiricist or agnostic who tends toward atheism.

    Your Ricochet friend, Kent

    God Bless you Kent. You could rebel against your parents by developing faith.

    • #28
    • November 3, 2019, at 1:47 PM PST
    • 4 likes
  29. Arahant Member

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):
    Yes, yoga comes out of the Hindu tradition

    From a Dane teaching calisthenics at a YMCA in India.

    • #29
    • November 3, 2019, at 2:16 PM PST
    • 4 likes
  30. Arahant Member

    KentForrester (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):

    KentForrester (View Comment):
    And death, I believe, will end all. And that doesn’t bother me a whit. It just seems like the way of the world.

    That reminds me, Kent, why don’t you come by after you’re dead? We can have a laugh together.

    I will, Arahant. Can I count on you being there?

    I’m here for the duration.

    • #30
    • November 3, 2019, at 2:18 PM PST
    • 3 likes
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