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America’s most beloved podcasters return for another dose of politics, pop culture, and predictions. This week, in the effort to defend ObamaCare, if everyone is a RINO, who’s actually a Republican? Also, Breaking Bad’s almost over, should kids have smartphones, iOS7 mini reviews, and will there be a live GLoP in New York City next month? Tune in to find out.
The walrus was EJHill.
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Have not listened yet but EJ Hill, you continue to raise the bar.
Here is where I start the rumor that one of the GLoP boys is dead and that we’ve replaced him with a look alike. Currently in the process of running the podcast backward to find out…
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
The lesson was you need to win elections to remove Obamacare. ·9 minutes ago
Republicans lost an election in 2008 so:
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
The lesson was you need to win elections to remove Obamacare. ·9 minutes ago
Republicans lost an election in 2008 so:
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
There are future elections Billy. Provided we don’t blow them by turning America against us in futile government shutdowns.
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
The lesson was you need to win elections to remove Obamacare. ·9 minutes ago
Republicans lost an election in 2008 so:
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it. ·3 minutes ago
Possibly! You have to come to terms with the reality of the situation.
Barring a great change in heart over the next several elections, which have little bearing on this budget fight, except for the large downward potential for GOP prospects, Obamacare is here to stay.
Alternatively, if implementation goes badly enough, it could self destruct, but we will still be left with all the “popular” provisions, and left with more of a mess than when we began.
Gnash your teeth all you like, but gnashing while demanding your own party go through with a suicide pact is not going to get you your way.
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
The lesson was you need to win elections to remove Obamacare. ·9 minutes ago
Republicans lost an election in 2008 so:
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it. ·3 minutes ago
Possibly! You have to come to terms with the reality of the situation.
Barring a great change in heart over the next several elections, which have little bearing on this budget fight, except for the large downward potential for GOP prospects, Obamacare is here to stay.
Alternatively, if implementation goes badly enough, it could self destruct, but we will still be left with all the “popular” provisions, and left with more of a mess than when we began.
Gnash your teeth all you like, but gnashing while demanding your own party go through with a suicide pact is not going to get you your way. ·3 minutes ago
Yeah, we wouldn’t a repeat of the last of the last shut down, imagine being forced to hold on to both houses of Congress for a decade.
What a disaster!
A live NYC GLoP? Must clear schedule…travel imminent.
So what is hidden message with Ted Cruz in George’s place ?
If you play Come Together backwards, and listen carefully, you’ll hear it.
Defund me now ,defund me now.
If you play Revolution #9 backwards, and listen carefully, you’ll hear something sounding like “what difference does it make ? ”
Don’t pallbearers in Nepal sometimes carry french horns ? Aha !!
That’s got to be it . Mark Steyn is actually Billy Mumy. (and he looks great for 59 !)
Could only listen to 15 minutes of this silliness. A conservative from Texas? Myopic Neanderthal! A Tea Party supporter? Political ingénue! Voted for Ted Cruz? Destroyer of the GOP! And now, if you don’t live within the Leftist cultural confines? You must be a Sort-er!
I think Joe Scarborough would make an excellent addition to this fine crew.
People love to lecture Rob about his RINO-insecurity issues around here, and he takes it so well that I hate to pile on, but I’m just itching to make a point.
I know some very conservative and some very liberal people. The liberal ones mostly really like the Democrats. The conservative ones are pretty cool on the GOP, and some hate it with a passion.
Why is this? I think it’s because the two parties have pursued different strategies of late. Both on the left and right, there is a sizable group of people with its own established values and cultural energy. Democrats have decided to let their strongest horses do the pulling, which has resulted in a hard left party that is winning elections. Republicans keep their nexus of cultural energy in the rear, try to form a coalition of moderates, and lose.
I’m not necessarily saying that the GOP would win if they tried to follow the Democrats in this regard. Secular progressives (the liberal “horse”) have a level of cultural influence that social conservatives (the conservative “horse”) don’t.
But you have to understand how frustrating it is when the liberal party is succeeding in marshaling together their heavy hitters to win elections, while the conservative party is failing. America is more conservative than its present political leadership would suggest but the Republicans have not been successful at converting that conservative energy into electoral success.
Would “purity tests” enable them to do that? That I can’t tell you. But the alienation of a good part of its natural base is to my mind a huge problem that the GOP needs to address.
I also think in a very general way that confidence makes for winners. That sounds very trite and motivational speechy, but it’s still often true. Great civilizations and political movements tend to be ideologically charged and confident. Another way of summing up the GOP’s problems might be to say that far more than the Democrats, its political class is trying to represent a group of people whose values diverge pretty widely *from those of the political class generally*. So their people aren’t with them in the way the Democrats’ are, and it makes it hard to get traction.
Rachel, I think you hit the nail on the head. The GOP has time and again let down conservatives. In fact, it is pretty clear a lot of them dislike conservatives. The fact is, people sent to run the government like government. That puts our side at a disadvantage.
Time and again, the GOP makes nice with the Dems and we conservatives get screwed. That is where the idea of ‘betrayal” comes in.
Further, we did it the establishment’s way with the Romney Campaign. That did not work.
Everyone keeps telling me we need to win elections. I do my part, I vote for the GOP. When, exactly, doe we win?
Jonah, Rob and John, thanks very much for another informative and insightful podcast. I did not detect the negative inferences to Senator Cruz identified in some of the comments. Although I do not agree with Cruz’ “Defund Obamacare” tactic, I do think highly of him.
Thanks for identifying the part that PACs like Club for Growth and Heritage Action along with talk radio hosts like Limbaugh, Levin, and Hannity have played in this. One is trying to increase contributions and the size of their mailing lists, and the other is trying to increase their ratings. Neither has earned the right to determine whether I am a “true” conservative or not.
Although it is disappointing to be put into the categories of “Surrender Caucus” and “Obamacare Supporter” by some on the right, what really worries me is the belief of some that additional “purity” is the road to success. I worked on both of Ronald Reagan’s campaigns for governor in California. We converted the unbelievers by articulating common sense solutions to the problems the state faced. Reagan built a movement by inclusion, not by expulsion. We need to do the same today.
I’m not going to throw around the accusations of RINO but the left doesn’t do this to their own. Disagree with Cruz’ tactics but you go way beyond that to calling him insane, reckless, idiotic and even questioning his motives. Good job guys. Whatever inspiring spirit generated by seeing Cruz fight no matter how hopeless has been totally eviscerated by the reaction on the right. Yes, the GOP needs to win back the senate. Yes they need to message better. Maybe they need to pick their fights more strategically but they also have a huge failing in fighting sprit and will to actually shrink government. It’s not the left but the right that has turned something that had messaging potential into a black eye.
you are testing the good will of your audience going after Ted Cruz
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it.
The lesson was you need to win elections to remove Obamacare. ·9 minutes ago
Republicans lost an election in 2008 so:
a) Obamacare is here to stay so get over it. ·3 minutes ago
Possibly! You have to come to terms with the reality of the situation.
Barring a great change in heart over the next several elections, which have little bearing on this budget fight, except for the large downward potential for GOP prospects, Obamacare is here to stay.
Yeah, we wouldn’t a repeat of the last of the last shut down, imagine being forced to hold on to both houses of Congress for a decade.
What a disaster! ·2 hours ago
That’s a pretty simplistic metric. Where were those seats picked up; where were seats lost? Who knows how many would have been picked up in the absence of the shutdown?
You didn’t detect negative inferences? You repeated several of them with the implication that those pushing the Defund/Delay are simply being selfishly opportunistic and disingenuous.
Did Reagan win over people by calling people in his own party preposterous, reckless and insane? I wasn’t old enough to be aware of politics at the time but it’s my understanding that Reagan was instead the recipient of such treatment by other Republicans who saw him as too radical.
I agree that inclusion would have been a better approach which is why this podcast which I normally love was such a disappointment. I don’t mind disagreement but there has been much more than disagreement with Cruz. Podhoretz’ hyperbolic rant was unwarranted and certainly wasn’t an effort at inclusion or reconciliation.
In the LA Times Jonah strikes a more modulated tone:
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/commentary/la-oe-goldberg-ted-cruz-obama-20130924,0,3816032.column
And hours later Rob Long struck a more reasonable tone:
http://ricochet.com/main-feed/Thoughts-on-Cruz
I’m really tired of the anti-Ted Cruz and anti-Tea Party crusade so many in the beltway and the isle of Manhattan seem to be on as of late.
I usually look forward to his podcast. Maybe I was in a bad mode after having listened to the WSJ segment with Dorothy Rabinowitz but this was much more depressing since my expectations were much higher.
Why can’t they disagree in a civil way? Like on Ricochet. Wait… that appears to be gone.
It is a bit ironic that on the one hand Cruz’ intentions, intelligence and principles are maligned but saying McConnel has betrayed conservatives is preposterous.
Man, after reading these comments I have deleted the podcast. It might be time to take a “Sajak sabbatical”, go off the Ricochet grid for 45 days or so.
The Republican Party always has some reason why nothing can be accomplished. If it wins House, Senate, and White House in 2016 we are going to be given 1001 reasons why Obamacare can’t be repealed, only palliated. For historic examples: we never got the Panama Canal back, the Department of Education still stands, and incandescent light bulbs are still legislated to extinction, Sandra Day O’Connor, John Roberts, Anthony Kennedy …
What vast swaths of the NY/DC/LA conservative commentariat, and safe-district elected officials seem to miss is that the anger out here in flyover country is incandescent.
People are sick to death of “we’re holding hearings” and “I’m co-sponsoring a bill.” They see no sense of urgency from the officials they busted their butts and bank accounts to help elect so when someone comes along who actually steps up and fights they’re ready to sign on.
That’s a pretty simplistic metric. Where were those seats picked up; where were seats lost? Who knows how many would have been picked up in the absence of the shutdown? ·1 hour ago
Immediately after the shut down, in the ’96 election, the GOP lost two house seats, both of which were in Dem. leaning districts. This is after gaining the House in ’94 for the first time in 40 years. So after the disastrous shut down, the GOP held the House and Senate but lost the White House.
Then again, it was Clinton vs. Dole, with a strong economy, relative peace, and no other divisive issue on the table.
And with all that, Clinton couldn’t crack 50%.
Where exactly was the GOP disaster?
( I went and checked, the GOP gained two seats in the Senate that year)
If John is going to go the NYC meetup, maybe we should meet at Giggles in West Nyack, NY
1) Congress has funding authority and all Cruz is suggesting is for the GOP to use their House majority and filibuster numbers in the Senate to exercise that funding authority. It’s not complicated or confusing or a dead end, no matter how many times John says it is.
2) Cruz is not suggesting the GOP fillibuster the House bill, he’s suggesting they fillibuster the amendment that puts ACA funding back into the House bill.
3) If you follow John’s logic, GOP must accede to all Dem spending demands or be blamed for shutting down the government.
4) Cruz is appealing because for too long our side has felt like there is no opposition party. They say the right things, but they don’t oppose Obama/Reid in their actions.
5) “woe is me” about being called a RINO is unbecoming, like when Dems whine about being called socialists to deflect from the substance of the criticisms
6) “Every single person who lived in DC in 1995 knows the shutdown was a calamity…” I would suggest living in the DC bubble might cloud one’s judgement about what effect the shutdown had across the country politically.
GLoP – Because Jonah’s on it, I have to listen. Because JPod’s on it, I hate to listen. And, Rob’s just alright with me.
Except Jonah on Cruz is annoying…imagine that, even he isn’t perfect. Bummer.
Then again, it was Clinton vs. Dole, with a strong economy, relative peace, and no other divisive issue on the table.Immediately after the shut down, in the ’96 election, the GOP lost two house seats, both of which were in Dem. leaning districts. This is after gaining the House in ’94 for the first time in 40 years. So after thedisastrousshut down, the GOP held the House and Senate but lost the White House.
And with all that, Clinton couldn’t crack 50%.
Where exactly was the GOP disaster?
Good points, but the 50% metric, while valid, doesn’t take into account Perot. And we have to acknowledge that comparisons are not equivalent because freaking Obama was reelected with more than 50% of the vote. Unfortunately, we seem to be living in a much different world than the mid-90’s.
Look, I see myself as witnessing history. There’s nothing we can do to alter the outcome, as much as we like to feel we can. I’m interested in seeing how this all plays out. State your bet, but it does nothing to change what will happen. We’ll see who’s right.
Gentlemen (GLoPers): The problem I have with your analysis of the Ted Cruz Defund Obamacare gambit is the total lack of scorn directed at the GOP congressional leadership for abandoning the field to Ted Cruz, Mike Lee et al. What do I mean? Remember back 6-8 month ago when about 70 U.S. senators passed and sent legislation over to the House that included repeal of the medical device tax? At the time it was widely recommended by those craven talk radio entertainers you essentially dismissed in your podcast that the House GOP leadership ought to craft a stand-alone bill with the repeal and send it back to the Senate and the 70 yes votes waiting there for it. Hugh Hewitt had on his show a number of House committee chairs and leadership-types who instead described some kind of legislative gymnastics they’d rather pursue. These “leaders” said, in effect, “not now but trust us, we’ll get it done in the CR/budget/debt-ceiling battle in the fall.” Do we hear anything about repeal of the medical device tax? See Comment #30 for the rest of my rant.
As a Jonah Goldberg fan, it is beyond us to understand the shallow ridicule he heaps upon the one of a few Republicans who still retain the anatomical maleness they were born with.
Boehner and crew have not lead. They have no endgame or strategy of their own to counter Obama on anything let alone Obamacare. Ted Cruz’s gambit is half-baked but he fights. Lincoln picked Grant because “he fights!” The grassroots may be wrong on the specific tactical steps to pursue but we are not wrong on the goal. We deserve leaders who will formulate and articulate our cause. We will follow leaders who lead not ones who simply enjoy the title. True, Ted Cruz is an upstart who likely has no idea how difficult it is to accomplish what he wants to accomplish with Obamacare. But he fights. Why not Boehner, McConnell and our other “leaders”?