All They Need Is a Name

 

Over the last few weeks, I’ve felt ill-at-ease about the shootings at Parkland in a way that went far beyond the deaths and desperation that has followed the episode. I finally put my finger on my perceptions. And it raised great concern for me. Let me summarize first what has been happening nationwide regarding the shootings, students, and protests.

Students are obviously in great emotional pain and are motivated to take action following the traumatic experience of the shootings. They have come together for a primary cause. They have made the National Rifle Association their primary focus/scapegoat, and secondarily the legislature. They are saying to everyone that you are either anti-gun or against their teens. Companies have boycotted the NRA. Those who didn’t support the calls for new legislation are the enemy. Hundreds of students and adults all over the country have organized protests. Millions of dollars have been donated to their cause, including GoFundMe sites, many of which are for the survivors and their families; included with the donors are Oprah Winfrey, George Clooney, and his wife.

Meantime, these young people have been receiving an education that is deeply influenced by Leftist doctrine, hating and demonizing those on the right, and demanding that students be listened to and cared for.

Now I’d like to shift gears and hope that you’ll bear with me. As I describe the following historical period, I’d like you to see if you can identify parallels and whether they stand up to scrutiny.

In Germany in the 1920s Hitler Youth groups were created. By 1933, membership increased to 100,000; by 1936, all other youth organizations were abolished. Although boys and girls were organized separately, both types of groups were highly disciplined. In 1938, Hitler made the following statement:

These boys and girls enter our organizations [at] ten years of age, and often for the first time get a little fresh air; after four years of the Young Folk they go on to the Hitler Youth, where we have them for another four years . . . And even if they are still not complete National Socialists, they go to Labor Service and are smoothed out there for another six, seven months . . . And whatever class consciousness or social status might still be left . . . the Wehrmacht [German armed forces] will take care of that.

The Third Reich looked to the schools to carry out further indoctrination:

Nazi scholars and educators glorified Nordic and other ‘Aryan’ races, while denigrating Jews and other so-called inferior peoples as parasitic ‘bastard races’ incapable of creating culture or civilization. After 1933, the Nazi regime purged the public school system of teachers deemed to be Jews or to be “politically unreliable.’ Most educators, however, remained in their posts and joined the National Socialist Teachers League. 97% of all public school teachers, some 300,000 persons, had joined the League by 1936. In fact, teachers joined the Nazi Party in greater numbers than any other profession.

Indoctrination included new textbooks that lauded the Nazi causes, anti-Semitism, and racism.

Group leaders played an important role, too:

Youth leaders used tightly controlled group activities and staged propaganda events such as mass rallies full of ritual and spectacle to create the illusion of one national community reaching across class and religious divisions that characterized Germany before 1933.

By 1939 the Hitler Youth became the largest youth organization in the world with over 7.3 million strong within its ranks. A new law was issued on March 25, 1939, conscripting any remaining holdouts into the organization amid warnings to parents that unless their children were enrolled they would be forcibly removed and placed in the custody of state run orphanages.

Now I realize that we are a long way from becoming a Germany; our culture does not embrace Prussian discipline, and our youth tend to choose peace, philosophically, instead of war. Yet I’m also observing a great deal of anger that may have as much to do with the times as it does with a school shooting. I see school teachers indoctrinating our young people across the country with Leftists ideas and ideology, as well as the accompanying demonizing of those who are “the enemy.” I see teenagers who are looking for a way to find “a home,” a place where they feel safe and included. I see millions of dollars pouring into their cause, and unidentified people or organizations appearing to guide their activities. The media is intimately engaged, and social media is being exploited to publicize their agendas.

It’s easy to point to other causes that eventually died out: Occupy Wall Street; anti-war protests (Vietnam and Iraq). But today’s activities have a uniform, vulnerable (teen) population with a centralized cause, possibly shadow supporters and millions of dollars. And I see no way to mollify the participants or focus the energy in a constructive way.

Is Germany a cautionary tale? Am I overreacting? What do you think?

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  1. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Manny (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    …fatherless homes…

    The GOP and the libertarians need to figure out how to pitch what the the fundamental structure of human capital development looks like. All we do now is try to stomp out sociological fires with government.

    Minnesota has tons of wealth and progressive power and it’s still notorious for a bad “achievement gap”. It’s the worst state in the nation for blacks in this sense. There is all kinds of theft and graft surrounding NGO “solutions”. People get thrown in jail. It’s crazy.

    That may be true, but what makes you think the Libertarians have a fight in this? The Libertarian mentality is partly to blame for the break down of the family.

    The Austrian school is very concerned about human capital development. IMO, the wider, more comprehensive way Austrians explain things makes more sense than just “property rights” and”non-aggression principle” stated over and over ad nauseam.

    So the Austrian School would agree to limits on divorce and support through legislation religious orientation of children in the public square and other family based legislation?

    They wouldn’t ever think of it in a piecemeal sense like that.

    The thing that I’ve never understood about Libertarianism is why would something that makes some sense as economic policy translate to the same efficacy in cultural matters? They are not analogous. Culture requires proactive exertion to prevent it from degenerating, especially in a multicultural world, and that proactive exertion comes from a learned tradition based on communal wisdom. That at its heart is what conservatism is.

    Which is why I made the distinction.

    OK, then I need to learn a little more about the Austrian School. Thanks.

    I think the last few Mises Weekends Podcast would appeal to your sensibilities quite a bit.

    Also, I love this.

    Yet capital is distinct from money, it is a largely irreversible, definite structure, composed of heterogeneous elements which can be (loosely) described as goods, knowledge, context, human beings, talents and experience. Money is “only” the simplifying aid that enables us to record the incredibly complex heterogeneous capital structure in a uniform manner. It serves as a basis for assessing the value of these diverse forms of capital.

    The fact that the generations currently living in our society are able to enjoy such a high standard of living is the result of decades or even centuries of both cultural and economic capital accumulation by our forebears.

    IMO, everything bad can be explained through Keynesianism and the Frankfurt school / cultural Marxism. You could do a lot worse.

    • #91
  2. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):
    There are many factors that have contributed to the Florida school shooting, along with other mass killings recently. The kids that were murdered, along with Las Vegas, churches, night clubs, and other public places were the result of several things that President Trump is trying to address.

    1. The abundance of rapid fire assault weapons in a civil society available to anyone, for sale at any gun show or on line, that have the capacity to kill many people in minutes.
    2. The broken mental health system where people are pushed through, medicated and left to their own devices, and family members are ignored due to HIPPA.
    3. The lack of cohesiveness in society – friends, neighbors, law enforcement, relatives taking responsibility to communicate and follow up.
    4. Violence in video games, movies, television and social media and exacerbating a separation from reality.
    5. The attacks on family values, faith, the lack of support for marriage and two parent households.

    It’s a combination of a modern, open, free society without boundaries and a moral compass.

    I take issue with your first point. There are already restrictions on who can buy guns and where. It isn’t the guns, it’s crazy people. Change involuntary commitment laws, and get rid of gun-free zones where the deranged know that they will have five to twenty minutes to commit mayhem unimpeded. If nothing else, there are way fewer crazies than guns, they are easier to find (their friends and families are begging for help in many cases), and there’s nothing in the Bill of Rights that protects their right to terrorize others.

    As for “the capacity to kill many people”, that’s the point. I need effective weapons to defend myself against gangs of criminals, whether they are ordinary criminals or a tyrannical government.

    Fatherlessness is the single most common factor in most mass murderers

    Again

    This also explains the massive problem we have with everyday violence in the black community.  The estimates are 70% of Black males grow up fatherless.  The White population is now at levels that Blacks reached in the 1980’s.  The  trends are not reassuring.

    • #92
  3. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    It was not unlike what the Nazis had been doing 20 years earlier.

    Or the cantonist system under the Tsars, or the Ottoman devshirme system

    It’s beginning to sound, @ontheleftcoast, that every totalitarian regime did it. If you were a ruler, it would only make sense.

    • #93
  4. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Kozak (View Comment):

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):
    There are many factors that have contributed to the Florida school shooting, along with other mass killings recently. The kids that were murdered, along with Las Vegas, churches, night clubs, and other public places were the result of several things that President Trump is trying to address.

    1. The abundance of rapid fire assault weapons in a civil society available to anyone, for sale at any gun show or on line, that have the capacity to kill many people in minutes.
    2. The broken mental health system where people are pushed through, medicated and left to their own devices, and family members are ignored due to HIPPA.
    3. The lack of cohesiveness in society – friends, neighbors, law enforcement, relatives taking responsibility to communicate and follow up.
    4. Violence in video games, movies, television and social media and exacerbating a separation from reality.
    5. The attacks on family values, faith, the lack of support for marriage and two parent households.

    It’s a combination of a modern, open, free society without boundaries and a moral compass.

    I take issue with your first point. There are already restrictions on who can buy guns and where. It isn’t the guns, it’s crazy people. Change involuntary commitment laws, and get rid of gun-free zones where the deranged know that they will have five to twenty minutes to commit mayhem unimpeded. If nothing else, there are way fewer crazies than guns, they are easier to find (their friends and families are begging for help in many cases), and there’s nothing in the Bill of Rights that protects their right to terrorize others.

    As for “the capacity to kill many people”, that’s the point. I need effective weapons to defend myself against gangs of criminals, whether they are ordinary criminals or a tyrannical government.

    Fatherlessness is the single most common factor in most mass murderers

    Again

    This also explains the massive problem we have with everyday violence in the black community. The estimates are 70% of Black males grow up fatherless. The White population is now at levels that Blacks reached in the 1980’s. The trends are not reassuring.

    Spot on.  I said similar but you had a nice links.

    • #94
  5. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Cato Rand (View Comment):
    I think you are over reacting. Not that you are wrong, just over generalizing. This is a huge diverse country and while we undoubtedly have a leftward drift in the culture, we have nothing like the kind of menacing, intimidation of the Wiemar and early Nazi period pushing everyone in the same direction at the point of a baton. Yes, some children are brainwashed at the hands of leftist teachers and a leftist media, but I see no sign that it’s anything near universal. There is massive resistance to it and whole swathes of the country where it’s well nigh unheard of. What you posit is a real threat, but as yet it is largely unrealized.

    I appreciate your comment, @catorand. You may not be able to answer this question, but are there signs you would look for indicate wen the threat is becoming serious?

    • #95
  6. Stad Coolidge
    Stad
    @Stad

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):
    The abundance of rapid fire assault weapons in a civil society available to anyone, for sale at any gun show or on line, that have the capacity to kill many people in minutes.

    This is not quite accurate.  Abundance is not the problem, it’s availability to people who should not have a weapon of any kind in the first place that’s the problem.

    As for rapid fire, a semi-automatic rifle only fires as fast as you can pull the trigger.  Bump stocks are a way around this, and even the NRA wants them banned.

    The term “assault rifle” is used incorrectly by everyone in the media.  A true assault rifle is a fully automatic weapon used by the military.  Taking the term out of context links fully automatic military weapons with semi-automatic civilian weapons.  Anti-gunners also dislike the appearance of the semi-automatic versions of military weapons, and want to ban them based on appearance alone.  This is nonsense!  I could take an AR-15 and replace all the “scary” components with a wood stock and call it a “hunting rifle”.

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):
    Violence in video games, movies, television and social media and exacerbating a separation from reality.

    I would argue this is also a red herring.  The things you cite might affect some individuals, but not society as a whole (IMHO).  Besides, violence in art and literature has been around for ages.  For example, Goethe’s book The Sorrows of Young Werther caused many young men at the time to commit suicide in the same fashion as the book’s protangonist.

    No, I believe your # 2, 3, and 5 are the culprits we have to deal with.  I’m not willing to give up my semi-autos or violent video games just because some lunatic goes on a rampage.

    • #96
  7. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    @Manny  This is a good example of how Austrians comprehensively think about social problems. I can’t find the YouTube that actually goes with it. It might be thisSame topic.

    You may not find it persuasive.

    • #97
  8. Chuckles Coolidge
    Chuckles
    @Chuckles

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why:  In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?”  Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then.  Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    • #98
  9. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why: In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?” Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then. Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    Exactly. Austrians see this as a comprehensive problem. Men have crazy sex drives but the economy is so regressive the average guy can’t be a “man” in the head of household sense. (just one tiny-short example, don’t go nuts me, please)

    • #99
  10. DJ EJ Member
    DJ EJ
    @DJEJ

    I read this post after having just finished watching a five part documentary on youth organizations in Nazi Germany. On Amazon Prime it’s called “The Hitler Youth”, but on YouTube it’s called “Hitler’s Children”. The five episodes are titled Education, Dedication, Seduction, War, and Sacrifice. They’re ordered differently on Amazon versus YouTube.

    Seduction: Travel opportunities, camping, community spirit and identity were offered as incentives for young people to join the Nazi youth organizations. All other youth organizations (including church groups) were phased out, supplanted (sometimes through intimidation and violence), and eventually made illegal.

    Education: At the age of 10 children joined the “Jungvolk” movement, at 14 they joined the Hitler Youth, and at 18 they joined the party, the “Wehrmacht”, the SA, or the SS.

    Dedication: Concerns the Bund Deutscher Mädel (BDM), the League of German Girls (Maidens), formed in 1930 as the female branch of the Hitler youth movement.

    War: Children were put to work on the home front, but as Germany’s fortunes in the war worsened, their roles shifted to manning anti-aircraft batteries and other military deployments.

    Sacrifice: Children, fully indoctrinated to the point of fanaticism, were used as cannon fodder by Hitler and his generals in the closing days of the war against the Americans and the Soviets.

    • #100
  11. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    @Manny This is a good example of how Austrians comprehensively think about social problems. I can’t find the YouTube that actually goes with it. It might be this. Same topic.

    You may not find it persuasive.

    Thanks Rufus but I disagree whole heartedly about legalizing drugs, even pot.  No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit.  You are substituting one problem for another.  That is moral relativism, which is exactly what Libertarianism is.

    • #101
  12. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why: In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?” Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then. Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    Well, sure.  There are an innumerable reasons.

    • #102
  13. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Manny (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    @Manny This is a good example of how Austrians comprehensively think about social problems. I can’t find the YouTube that actually goes with it. It might be this. Same topic.

    You may not find it persuasive.

    Thanks Rufus but I disagree whole heartedly about legalizing drugs, even pot. No conservative tradition would argue that you can’t promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit. You are substituting one problem for another. That is moral relativism, which is exactly what Libertarianism is.

    Well, good luck using more and more government force.

    The fiscal math on enforcement is insane. It ends up being more like teacher’s union graft.

    • #103
  14. Chuckles Coolidge
    Chuckles
    @Chuckles

    Manny (View Comment):

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why: In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?” Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then. Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    Well, sure. There are an innumerable reasons.

    really?  are you sure they aren’t all subordinate?

    In any case, sometimes the root cause for a fatal condition is identifiable, but no cure can be found.  Sometimes all we can do is treat the symptoms and make the patient as comfortable as we can.  Hospice care.

    Pardon my eeyore.

    • #104
  15. Randy Weivoda Moderator
    Randy Weivoda
    @RandyWeivoda

    Manny (View Comment):
    Thanks Rufus but I disagree whole heartedly about legalizing drugs, even pot. No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit. You are substituting one problem for another. That is moral relativism, which is exactly what Libertarianism is.

    If something is legal, that means the government is promoting it?  It’s one hundred percent legal for me to quit my job, go to the liquor store and buy enough booze to drink myself to death providing I drink it fast enough.  Does that mean that because the government allows me to do this it is promoting it?  It is totalitarian thinking that nothing should be legal unless that activity promotes the public good.  It’s not that libertarians think different things are good and bad and that’s why they want things to be legal that you dislike.  Many libertarians also things that things are bad which you think are bad.  But they believe that individuals should be free to make their own choices rather than the government making them.

    • #105
  16. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    If we had a more libertarian / Austrian economy, a million social problems would take care of themselves. People need agency.

    • #106
  17. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why: In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?” Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then. Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    Well, sure. There are an innumerable reasons.

    really? are you sure they aren’t all subordinate?

    In any case, sometimes the root cause for a fatal condition is identifiable, but no cure can be found. Sometimes all we can do is treat the symptoms and make the patient as comfortable as we can. Hospice care.

    Pardon my eeyore.

    OK, so what’s your root cause?

    • #107
  18. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Manny (View Comment):

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why: In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?” Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then. Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    Well, sure. There are an innumerable reasons.

    really? are you sure they aren’t all subordinate?

    In any case, sometimes the root cause for a fatal condition is identifiable, but no cure can be found. Sometimes all we can do is treat the symptoms and make the patient as comfortable as we can. Hospice care.

    Pardon my eeyore.

    OK, so what’s your root cause?

    Keynesianism, cultural Marxism, and too much centralized government.

     

    • #108
  19. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Randy Weivoda (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    Thanks Rufus but I disagree whole heartedly about legalizing drugs, even pot. No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit. You are substituting one problem for another. That is moral relativism, which is exactly what Libertarianism is.

    If something is legal, that means the government is promoting it? It’s one hundred percent legal for me to quit my job, go to the liquor store and buy enough booze to drink myself to death providing I drink it fast enough. Does that mean that because the government allows me to do this it is promoting it? It is totalitarian thinking that nothing should be legal unless that activity promotes the public good. It’s not that libertarians think different things are good and bad and that’s why they want things to be legal that you dislike. Many libertarians also things that things are bad which you think are bad. But they believe that individuals should be free to make their own choices rather than the government making them.

    That’s Libertarian thinking.  It’s not conservative thinking.  There is no reason to legalize drugs other than to escape problems, and thereby creating a host of other social problems that are much more inherently dangerous and unobservable because it is indirect, such as the breakdown of the family.  I just argued above that the breakdown of the family is at the root of these young men shooting up people.  Legalizing drugs only adds to the breakdown of the family.

    • #109
  20. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Manny (View Comment):

    Randy Weivoda (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    Thanks Rufus but I disagree whole heartedly about legalizing drugs, even pot. No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit. You are substituting one problem for another. That is moral relativism, which is exactly what Libertarianism is.

    If something is legal, that means the government is promoting it? It’s one hundred percent legal for me to quit my job, go to the liquor store and buy enough booze to drink myself to death providing I drink it fast enough. Does that mean that because the government allows me to do this it is promoting it? It is totalitarian thinking that nothing should be legal unless that activity promotes the public good. It’s not that libertarians think different things are good and bad and that’s why they want things to be legal that you dislike. Many libertarians also things that things are bad which you think are bad. But they believe that individuals should be free to make their own choices rather than the government making them.

    That’s Libertarian thinking. It’s not conservative thinking. There is no reason to legalize drugs other than to escape problems, and thereby creating a host of other social problems that are much more inherently dangerous and unobservable because it is indirect, such as the breakdown of the family. I just argued above that the breakdown of the family is at the root of these young men shooting up people. Legalizing drugs only adds to the breakdown of the family.

    And the cartels’ power compounds by the minute. Which keeps the cops employed, accomplishing very little.

    • #110
  21. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Randy Weivoda (View Comment):

    If something is legal, that means the government is promoting it?

    If you’re in Oaksterdam and other cities and states heavily taxing cannabis, and have cannabis trade shows…

    • #111
  22. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    Manny (View Comment):
    No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit.

    As a conservative, I don’t want to “promote” drugs. I just want to take away the government’s power to ban them.

    If you can’t call that conservative thinking, then call it American thinking. We are allowed to make our own (often terrible) decisions, and face the consequences.

    • #112
  23. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Randy Weivoda (View Comment):

    If something is legal, that means the government is promoting it?

    If you’re in Oaksterdam and other cities and states heavily taxing cannabis, and have cannabis trade shows…

    I’m not going to go into it right now, but legalizing hard drugs should have been done first and this is one of the reasons why. Freaking (pejorative name for a prostitute).

    • #113
  24. Chuckles Coolidge
    Chuckles
    @Chuckles

    Manny (View Comment):

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Chuckles (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    In my opinion what’s at the heart of all this is the break down of the family. In this case, the father died of a heart attack. It was not a typical broken home. Nonetheless like quite a few of these shooters, the boy – and I believe 100% of the time it’s been a male – have come from fatherless homes. There have always been at risk kids, but there are more of them today. One in three boys grow up without a father in the home. All children need fathers, but especially boys.

    Manny, I think you need to keep asking why: In this case, the immediate question is , “What is behind the breakdown of the family?” Until the cause is identified it can’t be restored – and perhaps even then. Now if I were leading a totalitarian state I could fix all this…

    Well, sure. There are an innumerable reasons.

    really? are you sure they aren’t all subordinate?

    In any case, sometimes the root cause for a fatal condition is identifiable, but no cure can be found. Sometimes all we can do is treat the symptoms and make the patient as comfortable as we can. Hospice care.

    Pardon my eeyore.

    OK, so what’s your root cause?

    More interested in yours.  You stated breakdown of the family is behind our current issue.  Can you identify a proximate cause?  If so how far down that thread can you go?

    • #114
  25. Nanda Panjandrum Member
    Nanda Panjandrum
    @

    ST (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    Nanda Panjandrum (View Comment):
    Paging @simontemplar, @bossmongo, @dajoho, and others of the brotherhood (sisterhood, too, for that matter). What say you all?

    What is the question?

    See #s 47, 49, 55-58, re: military service and maturity…Thanks!, Howdy! & S/F! :-)

    • #115
  26. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit.

    As a conservative, I don’t want to “promote” drugs. I just want to take away the government’s power to ban them.

    If you can’t call that conservative thinking, then call it American thinking. We are allowed to make our own (often terrible) decisions, and face the consequences.

    So let me ask you, which drugs besides pot would you legalize?  Cocaine?  Heroin?  LSD?

    • #116
  27. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Manny (View Comment):

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit.

    As a conservative, I don’t want to “promote” drugs. I just want to take away the government’s power to ban them.

    If you can’t call that conservative thinking, then call it American thinking. We are allowed to make our own (often terrible) decisions, and face the consequences.

    So let me ask you, which drugs besides pot would you legalize? Cocaine? Heroin? LSD?

    For starters, watch the William F. Buckley youtube on this. 7 minutes.

    • #117
  28. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    Manny (View Comment):

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit.

    As a conservative, I don’t want to “promote” drugs. I just want to take away the government’s power to ban them.

    If you can’t call that conservative thinking, then call it American thinking. We are allowed to make our own (often terrible) decisions, and face the consequences.

    So let me ask you, which drugs besides pot would you legalize? Cocaine? Heroin? LSD?

    Yes.

    • #118
  29. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    For starters, watch the William F. Buckley youtube on this. 7 minutes.

    For anyone who wants to see it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTyucBinXnY

    I watched it, and I need to think about it. I’m not convinced yet. To me, it’s more than just about the misspent funds.

    • #119
  30. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    No conservative tradition would argue that you can promote an immoral activity and think it will have positive benefit.

    As a conservative, I don’t want to “promote” drugs. I just want to take away the government’s power to ban them.

    If you can’t call that conservative thinking, then call it American thinking. We are allowed to make our own (often terrible) decisions, and face the consequences.

    So let me ask you, which drugs besides pot would you legalize? Cocaine? Heroin? LSD?

    For starters, watch the William F. Buckley youtube on this. 7 minutes.

    I’ve got a brain for myself.  I don’t need to know what he thinks.

    • #120
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