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How, Pray, Am I to Reply?
From a friend:
I can’t say I agree that GOP candidates should make efforts to appeal to the hypothetical 5% who would otherwise vote for Trump. If someone would actually vote for Donald Trump to be the President of the United States, I don’t want that person anywhere close to influencing policy discourse. I suppose if it was purely a protest vote, that might be one thing, but still…
“Trump now occupies the Penthouse suite in middle America’s middle finger.” –
Pseudodionysius, Esq.
We are long past any high-minded principles like democracy or the rule of law.
There are some 15 other candidates in this field, and not all of them are stupid. Some of them get exactly what’s going on with Trump. Some of them are also much better politicians than he is. (Don’t tell me what a smart, savvy businessman he is. That’s not politics. Smart, savvy businessmen have learned the hard way before that it’s a different field.) Sooner or later, someone who is better at this game is going to steal his thunder — and with all the baggage he has, Trump will be remembered as the Flavor of the Month of July, 2015.
At this point, when his poll numbers go back to sane levels, he may very well decide to go back to making money.
Why do we need to do anything about him?
Tell the voters what we’re for and how we intend to accomplish it. Then (and only then) hammer the Democrats for their racism, their cronyism, and their contempt for Americans. No need to deal with The Toupee at all.
Eric Hines
Okay, I’m being a tad bombastic.
But seriously why would we not make it hard for him to mess with us. The man is a joke. Elections have rules, rules we write, and as the saying goes all is fair in love and war. He can appeal, or sue. But why make it easy for him to hamstring us. I reject all of Trumps reasons and justifications. He isn’t a serious candidate but a practical joke. His entry threshold should be appropriately high as a result. Now if on the other hand Bernie wanted to go rouge I would make sure he got on every ballot in the country, twice!
They said the same thing about Foreman-Cooney. Substitute Jeb for Cooney:
Calm down. “The Donald” will melt down as he has always done. He is the master of grabbing the spot light for 15 minutes of fame here and there but hold it for as long as an election takes? He has never done that before and I doubt he can now. The public will grow weary of him way before then.
As several others have suggested, co-opt his popular issues.
I thought that the Dems had the monopoly on Low Information Voters. If so, why are we concerned that he’s going to pull disproportionately from Republicans?
Not all of the 65M or so people who voted for Obama were Ivy League professors or welfare cases.
Treat him with the same respect that is due to every other candidate. He will be less likely to run 3rd party if he’s given a fair hearing in the primaries. Sadly, this ship seems to have already sailed. So soon Republicans have forgotten the Eleventh Commandment.
I am NOT a Trump fan.
Period.
But let me ask, how is he any less electable than Bob Dole, John McCain or Mitt Romney? How is he any worse than “W” who allowed wasteful spending unlike anything the Democrats had imagined up to that time.
Trump is what we get when we hold our noses and vote (R) even when we know the candidate stinks. We own Trump. We earned him. We bought him. This is why Trump is so popular with the media and the Democrats. They know he represents how badly the (R) party has behaved in the recent (and not so recent) past. They love him for what he is showing the world about Republicans.
What to do about Trump? See Austin Murrey in comment #5. He’s got it right.
If only the GOP were more conservative, no trouble like Mr. Trump? I wonder if there is any political problem in America that could not be solved by more conservatism in GOP politics!
Wait till you read the thing I just wrote.
So long as the GOP focuses on “some one else not running” for them to win, they deserve to lose. Why not focus on winning instead? This can only be done by getting better: getting better at winning our own electorate and getting people to cross over. Not by focusing on what someone else is doing.
Shouldn’t the threshold be equally high? Then we let the marketplace of ideas sort things out?
Two things:
1. Maybe you are. I’m not.
2. You can use that above statement to rationalize just about anything.
Well the threshold is equally high. What determines if you get on is the political power behind you. Frankly if you can’t win one electoral vote you have no reason to be on the ballot. If a third party or independent cares that much they can work on building an actual political base first. Win some local election, capture a senate, or house seat.
Running for president is like putting up a cardboard sign on the side of your house declaring yourself a blue chip company when all you have is a garage business. I’m not saying you can’t become a Google or Apple starting in your garage, but you have to put some real ground work in. You can’t just expect to be listed on the NASDAQ right after you incorporate.
I partially agree and partially disagree. There is very little doubt that a 3rd party candidate can appeal more to voters of one party than the other. Because there are very few voters who would waver between Hillary and Donald, any likely voters are likely to be ones who might otherwise vote Republican. That should be simple noncontroversial math. Now, does it operate at the margins? Yes, I think that if our candidate was strong enough, a 3rd party candidate would make no difference, and that should be our goal. Yet, I don’t think a 3rd party socialist would give the GOP any cause for concern, and it should give the democrats cause for concern … because it wouldn’t appeal to any conservative voters. This is the same thing. If the race is close, it simply will make a difference, and I’d prefer to not see that.
p.s. I agree with the latest GLoP assessment that maybe Trump is actually trying to win the race for Hillary. That is not too far outside the scope of realistic possibility.
The problem with the “marketplace of ideas” is that there is no real marketplace. For an interesting read on this topic, consider Mike Munger’s most recent book. Because politics cannot (and, more importantly, does not) constitute an actual market, it is subject to some unfortunate manipulation (e.g. gerrymandering). The insertion of Trump into the race would only realistically be considered to contribute to the marketplace of ideas if there was such a marketplace. So, let us suppose that the democrats were not so tight with their barriers to entry and liberals had an actual multitude of choices between Hillary, O’Malley, Sanders, etc… and so did Republicans. If every one of these people were on the ballot, then I’d agree with your analogy, Fred. But they’re not. So it’s not a true marketplace. When competition is introduced on one side and not the other (e.g. unions!), the outcome will be a false reflection of voter preference. Hillary has a monopoly, and the only possible way to achieve any version of a realistic outcome will be for the GOP candidate to have a monopoly as well.
To put it another way (again, as I did in the previous comment); Would you disagree with my assessment that the introduction of Bernie Sanders on a 3rd party ticket would be a good thing for conservatives?
Maybe we should spend less time fretting over whether Trump will run as a third party candidate and try to figure out what he is saying that so resonates with many American voters. Evidently voters are so tired of mealy mouthed politicians parcing their words, afraid of offending someone that Trump is a welcome change. I am convinced that many who support Trump don’t believe in the radical ideas he promotes but are pleased to see someone take an unpopular position and be willing to take the heat for doing so. Remember Reagan was no shrinking violet when it came to calling out the foolishness of his opponent’s position.
Like the way you think.
We need to go after his hairs, too.
Keep calm and carry on. He is burning bright like a road flare and he will burn out, and early. It remains a Bush, Walker, Rubio and a 4th TBD candidate who will emerge. Have faith!
Basil Fawlty:”We need to go after his hairs, too.”
—
They must be made to pay.
I’ve heard the Hillary stalking horse stuff and I find it a stretch. I’m hoping he qualifies for a debate and gets (further) exposed.
After all, there is precious little oxygen to suck out of a room with 17 other better qualified/informed opponents.
Waterboard anybody within the professional commentariat who comes within 2 light years of “white jerk vote.”
You can’t win if your voters hate you more than they fear the democrats.
When there is such a disconnect between party leadership and the base, this is what we get. If Priebus, Boehner, McConnell et. al. would fight against immigration, Obamacare, Obamatrade etc., there would be no Trump. Trump is merely a symbol.
Look, I am not voting for Trump in the primary, but it stinks that I look at the 16 others, and I say to myself, “Eh.”
The only person that is acting like a conservative and wants to win and stick it to the libs seems to be Fiorina, but she won’t get the time of day.
So, Mr. Robinson, tell your friend that if he has any sway, to tell the Republicans to fire the consultants and get off their butts and fight. Forget tone, forget the independents and remember who they representing.
* He’s got name recognition and is ‘on TV!’
* He’s staked out a stand (no matter how opportunistic) on illegal immigration that clearly resonates with a sizable portion of the electorate that is not being addressed by the GOP or the 2016 candidates.
* Whether he runs as a third party candidate or not, we’re dealing with 17 (?) ambitious people. If he flames out, someone will pick that issue up and make it their own if they want 2-10% of the vote. Trump might not run as 3rd party but someone else might. There are plenty 3rd & 4rh tier candidates that may well want to try – there’s enough P.O.’d people out there to give that 3rd party candidate 2-10%(?). This issue is not going away GOPe – someone will fill that void. Ignore at your own peril. You have no one to blame but yourselves on this one (i.e. – Santorum picks up the Illegal Immigration vote and his vaunted ‘homeschooling vote’, he’s got nothing else to do and his career is over but even he could tilt this thing).
*This issue won’t go away or won’t go away quietly. I don’t think this faction of the Base is gonna swerve in this game of chicken the Moderates this year.
I’ve said on previous threads that Trump will hurt our party in his quest to be the Howard Stern of these debates, and that Priebus, Ailes and co. have created a monster. I would wager every dollar in my 401(k) that if Trump wants his name in the history books like he wants it on his buildings he will run as a third party spoiler. I would also wager that if his sliver of the vote tips swing states to Hillary he will claim, post hoc, that that was his plan all along to show the dark seamy side of Repub intolerance and evil, and thereby enact the national health care, leftist judges and other lib policies he’s supported his entire life.