How Do You Solve a Problem Like The Donald?

 

TrumpDescentIf you’re in the market for a Republican presidential candidate who wants to start a trade war with China, thinks there’s a causal link between vaccines and autism, believes there’s no need for entitlement reform, and led the charge on the birther movement, today’s your lucky day: As Johnny Dubya notes below, Donald Trump — probably the only candidate in this field who spent his announcement speech noodling on the state of America’s ‘brand’ — is now officially in the race.

Now, it’s easy enough to dismiss Trump as a sideshow. As Reid Epstein and Heather Haddon note in their report on the announcement in the Wall Street JournalNBC is still going forward on the assumption that Trump will tape the new season of Celebrity Apprentice in the fall — something he can’t do if he’s an active candidate — which may mean that he’s just taking his quadrennial exercise in publicity-seeking to new lengths. Either way, Republicans are still going to have to deal with the fact that every asinine utterance that comes out of the bloated gourd atop his shoulders will be gleefully seized upon by the Left and the media as evidence of the fundamental unseriousness of the GOP. They’ll also have to reckon with this:

Mr. Trump is likely to qualify for the Republican National Committee-sanctioned presidential debates, which Fox News and CNN have limited to candidates who place in the top 10 in national polling.

With his broad name recognition, he has received between 3% and 5% support in recent national polls, enough to qualify for the Aug. 6 Fox News debate. Candidates such as former Texas Gov. Rick Perry and Sen. Lindsey Graham (R., S.C.) may not make the cut. Also in jeopardy of exclusion is Carly Fiorina, the former Hewlett-Packard chief executive and the only prominent woman in the GOP contest.

Could there be a more depressing thought for the GOP than Carly Fiorina — a woman who’s recently become the pacesetter for how Republicans should handle themselves with the media — sitting at home while Trump uses a presidential forum to pimp a 30-year-old book?

Here’s the question: what, if anything, does the GOP do? Leave it alone and count on Trump to expose himself as a buffoon in the debates? Try to find a way to keep him out? Does an enterprising candidate try to put points on the board by sticking it to The Donald onstage (paging Chris Christie)?

What would you do?

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  1. Troy Senik, Ed. Member
    Troy Senik, Ed.
    @TroySenik

    Mendel:

    Troy Senik, Ed.:Either way, Republicans are still going to have to deal with the fact that every asinine utterance that comes out of the bloated gourd atop his shoulders will be gleefully seized upon by the Left and the media as evidence of the fundamental unseriousness of the GOP.

    I’m not particularly worried about this. Trump is so well-known in the American psyche that most Americans do not associate him with the GOP, or with NBC, or even with the Trump Hotel Vegas. He is a solitary figure, and I think most people will understand that anything ridiculous he says represents his own view and nobody else’s.

    There is probably a danger of overstating how much it will hurt. There are a fair amount of voters out there, however, who aren’t terribly fond of Democrats but regard Republicans as unserious. Trump does us no favors with that cohort. The damage may be marginal, but there’s no offsetting benefit so it’s still a net negative for us to have him in this field.

    What worries me more are GOP voters who get excited when he says incredibly bone-headed things. Trump will eventually leave the party again – those voters won’t.

    We are in complete agreement on this one.

    • #31
  2. user_280840 Inactive
    user_280840
    @FredCole

    BenMSYS:There has to be a mechanism that kicks in before the delegate selection process for the party to say some equivalent of “Thanks, but you really don’t represent the views of the party. Good luck as an independent.”

    Any such additional mechanism would be unnecessary.  The process screens out wackos without additional mechanics.

    What you describe would be far more likely to be used by one faction within the GOP as a weapon against another.

    • #32
  3. Ricochet Member
    Ricochet
    @

    Troy Senik, Ed.:

    All granted, but there’s a certain crassness to describing the global esteem of a great nation in the same terms as your line of cologne.

    I could imagine worse. I give you The Most American Thickburger from Carl’sJr: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjSJj_Pdjys

    • #33
  4. Quinn the Eskimo Member
    Quinn the Eskimo
    @

    Troy Senik, Ed.:I do, however, think this is emblematic of something that the chattering classes are only now starting to realize: that there is a huge swath of the Republican electorate that will not turn to Jeb under any circumstances. It’s not a matter of marketing or positioning. They’re just not interested in what he’s selling — and they have way too many other options. I regard that as basically insurmountable. I don’t care how much money he raises — I have a hard time seeing how he gets the nomination.

    Not impossible.  A race where Rand Paul wins Iowa, Jeb finishes second even with low numbers because there is a enough of a split between Cruz/Rubio/Walker etc in a large and fragmented field.  Panic ensues.  I’m not sure how likely, but it is the scenario I worry about at night.

    • #34
  5. Troy Senik, Ed. Member
    Troy Senik, Ed.
    @TroySenik

    Quinn the Eskimo:Attack the press. Say that the MSM complains year after year that the primaries are not serious and now it is spending resources on Trump. Particularly in a year with as many solid candidates as there are.

    Directly engaging with Trump is like wrestling with a pig.

    Sound advice all around.

    • #35
  6. Ricochet Member
    Ricochet
    @

    Quinn the Eskimo:

    Troy Senik, Ed.:I do, however, think this is emblematic of something that the chattering classes are only now starting to realize: that there is a huge swath of the Republican electorate that will not turn to Jeb under any circumstances. It’s not a matter of marketing or positioning. They’re just not interested in what he’s selling — and they have way too many other options. I regard that as basically insurmountable. I don’t care how much money he raises — I have a hard time seeing how he gets the nomination.

    Not impossible. A race where Rand Paul wins Iowa, Jeb finishes second even with low numbers because there is a enough of a split between Cruz/Rubio/Walker etc in a large and fragmented field. Panic ensues. I’m not sure how likely, but it is the scenario I worry about at night.

    For some reason, I don’t worry about this scenario (mainly because Rand Paul won’t get that many delegates from IA to stay in that long). In fact, one of the best things that could happen to the GOP in many decades would be for, say, Marco Rubio and Jeb Bush to need the delegates of, say, South Dakota (primary June 7, 2016) in order to get the nomination. Or to simply hash it out in Cleveland.

    • #36
  7. Troy Senik, Ed. Member
    Troy Senik, Ed.
    @TroySenik

    Richard Fulmer:Changing the rules to keep him out of the debates would just give him more publicity and hand the Dems a club with which to beat us about the head and shoulders.

    I have my doubts about the latter half of that equation. What’s the liberal argument going to be? That Republicans aren’t sufficiently inclusive because they’re not including a candidate in the debates that most everyone on the Left thinks should be read out of polite society? Even for a liberal press known for its intellectual, ahem, flexibility, that’s probably too much of a trick shot to pull off.

    • #37
  8. Vance Richards Inactive
    Vance Richards
    @VanceRichards

    I don’t really want him as the nominee, but if he does get it the show where everyone competes to be his VP could be a lot of fun

    • #38
  9. user_184884 Inactive
    user_184884
    @BrianWolf

    I think it gives a chance for a win against all the serious candidates.  Gain up on Trump and let him be shown to be a fool and blowhard that he is.  All the other candidates gain stature by and have some defense against the charges of being wingnuts themselves but being able to show they helped show Trump the door when it mattered.  Don’t give Trump any more respect than he deserves and then show him up.

    • #39
  10. Troy Senik, Ed. Member
    Troy Senik, Ed.
    @TroySenik

    Tuck:Who really cares what the Democrats—which includes the media—thinks of Republican candidates?

    If we adopted that standard we wouldn’t have had President Reagan, who they also considered a buffoon.

    There’s a pretty sizable difference between a candidate who draws fire from the Left because he embodies the conservative belief system and one who draws flak because he’s recognized, even by a huge percentage of the party he ostensibly identifies with, as fundamentally unserious.

    • #40
  11. 6foot2inhighheels Member
    6foot2inhighheels
    @6foot2inhighheels

    I’m especially annoyed at the prospect of pushing Fiorina out, since she is the only one who can effectively and safely attack another female candidate; she can actually say, “I don’t understand how any woman of substance would do the things you’ve done, Hillary.”

    • #41
  12. user_989419 Inactive
    user_989419
    @ProbableCause

    Mendel:I’m not particularly worried about this. Trump is so well-known in the American psyche that most Americans do not associate him with the GOP, or with NBC, or even with the Trump Hotel Vegas. He is a solitary figure, and I think most people will understand that anything ridiculous he says represents his own view and nobody else’s.

    Agreed.  Going further, I argue Trump will make the rest of the field look good (presidential, adult) by comparison.  And he might get some folks to tune in who otherwise wouldn’t.

    I still say Fiorina should run for the Democrat nomination.  The world desperately needs to see her debating Hillary directly on a regular basis.

    • #42
  13. Troy Senik, Ed. Member
    Troy Senik, Ed.
    @TroySenik

    Fred Cole:

    BenMSYS:There has to be a mechanism that kicks in before the delegate selection process for the party to say some equivalent of “Thanks, but you really don’t represent the views of the party. Good luck as an independent.”

    Any such additional mechanism would be unnecessary. The process screens out wackos without additional mechanics.

    I’m not sure I agree with Ben’s prescription, as I think the costs may be much higher than the benefits. That said, there’s a crucial distinction to be made here: the process “screens out wackos” insofar as it keeps them from getting the nomination.

    In Trump’s case, you have the relatively rare prospect of someone whose very presence on the debate stage threatens to turn the whole thing into a circus (does anyone think he’ll sit there and quietly wait his turn during debates?). It’s not that we haven’t had crazies like that before, but I’m hard-pressed to think of a case where they came into the ring with this much visibility and celebrity.

    Now, maybe that’s just the cost of doing business and there’s nothing to be done about it. But I’m not quite as sanguine as Fred that the whole thing sorts itself out.

    • #43
  14. Marion Evans Inactive
    Marion Evans
    @MarionEvans

    2011 Economist article about Trump running then:

    Though it is obvious that he is no fool, he has no fear of saying foolish things. People are used to it. Indeed, he seems impervious to criticism of almost any kind except of his remarkable hairstyle (or, the unkind aver, his hairpiece). At public meetings or in television interviews he brushes off boos, taunts and evidence with a supreme insouciance. He has little to lose by flirting with politics, and, when you think about it, rather a lot to gain.

    http://www.economist.com/node/18586584

    • #44
  15. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    Troy Senik, Ed.:

    There’s a pretty sizable difference between a candidate who draws fire from the Left because he embodies the conservative belief system and one who draws flak because he’s recognized, even by a huge percentage of the party he ostensibly identifies with, as fundamentally unserious.

    OK, clearly Trump’s not Reagan, but I think the “fundamentally unserious” part is mostly a matter of taste.  But I have a big problem with letting the Democrats vet Republican candidates.  Even if they’re right.

    Trump personifies the flashy, bombastic nouveau riche ethos that turns most Americans off.  Except for that percent of Americans that made him a billionaire…

    But to answer your question, I’d have to go with:

    “Leave it alone and count on Trump to expose himself as a buffoon in the debates”

    As I don’t think we have much to worry about.  See the chart at the link:

    Donald Trump Is The Most Hated Candidate.”

    • #45
  16. Misthiocracy Member
    Misthiocracy
    @Misthiocracy

    Troy Senik, Ed.: (anyone see any evidence that Newt’s attack dog style rubbed off on Romney in 2012?)

    I think Romney became a better debater after sparring with Newt.

    Didn’t help in the end, but still, he did improve.

    • #46
  17. David Knights Member
    David Knights
    @DavidKnights

    Troy Senik, Ed.:

    I’ll happily concede Trump’s talents for making money and generally adoring Donald Trump at an inappropriate volume. The “buffoon” characterization was of him as a political figure. To give another example: Ben Carson is nothing short of a genius as a surgeon — but he has no clue what’s he doing when it comes to politics or policy. The salient difference in my mind: Carson at least seems to be running in earnest (not that he’d mind selling more books as a result), whereas Trump appears to be gaming the entire process for the purposes of a brand awareness exercise.

    So, only professional politicians need apply?  I am not endorsing Trump, and I wish he would run as a Democrat, but the professional politician will be the death of this country.

    • #47
  18. Leigh Inactive
    Leigh
    @Leigh

    Troy Senik, Ed.:

    Richard Fulmer:Changing the rules to keep him out of the debates would just give him more publicity and hand the Dems a club with which to beat us about the head and shoulders.

    I have my doubts about the latter half of that equation. What’s the liberal argument going to be? That Republicans aren’t sufficiently inclusive because they’re not including a candidate in the debates that most everyone on the Left thinks should be read out of polite society? Even for a liberal press known for its intellectual, ahem, flexibility, that’s probably too much of a trick shot to pull off.

    That was my thought too.  If the RNC can come up with some plausible way to keep him out, I’m in favor of it.  I’m not too worried about his protests doing great harm to the GOP “brand” if he’s complaining from the outside.

    • #48
  19. Ricochet Member
    Ricochet
    @IWalton

    After losing to one of the others, he’ll run as an independent and elect Hillary?   but what’s his angle?  Threaten to run as an independent?  Did he do that well under Obama?  Perhaps.

    • #49
  20. Petty Boozswha Inactive
    Petty Boozswha
    @PettyBoozswha

    The problem is not that Trump is going to be a buffoon, the problem is that he is going to suck up all the oxygen that people like Kasich are going to need.

    • #50
  21. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    Petty Boozswha:The problem is not that Trump is going to be a buffoon, the problem is that he is going to suck up all the oxygen that people like Kasich are going to need.

    I don’t know that they breathe the same air…

    Are there really folks who are undecided between Kasich and Trump?

    • #51
  22. billy Inactive
    billy
    @billy

    Troy Senik, Ed.:

    billy:

    Maybe competing with The Donald will push the eventual nominee into being more assertive.

    Seems like a stretch to me. By the time you get to the general, you’re playing to a different audience and I doubt that you’re taking stylistic cues from someone you beat in the primaries (anyone see any evidence that Newt’s attack dog style rubbed off on Romney in 2012?).

    Plus, I don’t think you compete with Trump in a primary debate by trying to ape his style. No one’s going to do it better than him. You go the other way.

    Except Romney overcame Newt by carpet bombing the airwaves with negative ads. Even so, his performance in the first debate was rather Newt-ian.

    I am just speculating that other candidates will see Trump’s ” I am the only candidate who will tell it like is and I won’t back down from nothing” approach and make it his own.

    Only with less buffoonery. (hopefully)

    • #52
  23. billy Inactive
    billy
    @billy

    Tuck:

    Petty Boozswha:The problem is not that Trump is going to be a buffoon, the problem is that he is going to suck up all the oxygen that people like Kasich are going to need.

    I don’t know that they breathe the same air…

    Are there really folks who are undecided between Kasich and Trump?

    Of course not. Kasich doesn’t have near the support that Trump has.

    • #53
  24. Petty Boozswha Inactive
    Petty Boozswha
    @PettyBoozswha

    Oxygen was a metaphor for air time.

    • #54
  25. Mendel Inactive
    Mendel
    @Mendel

    Actively excluding Trump from the primary process would be counterproductive in several ways.

    Frantically jury-rigging an ad hoc system to exclude a potentially influential candidate would make the GOP look weak, scared, and unprepared.

    And for better or worse, Trump does have supporters among the Republican electorate, supporters who tend to view the rest of the party with disdain but whose votes are important. Pushing out Trump would mean disillusioning these voters even more.

    Just let him play and wait for him to self-deport out of the primaries.

    • #55
  26. Troy Senik, Ed. Member
    Troy Senik, Ed.
    @TroySenik

    David Knights:

    Troy Senik, Ed.:

    I’ll happily concede Trump’s talents for making money and generally adoring Donald Trump at an inappropriate volume. The “buffoon” characterization was of him as a political figure. To give another example: Ben Carson is nothing short of a genius as a surgeon — but he has no clue what’s he doing when it comes to politics or policy. The salient difference in my mind: Carson at least seems to be running in earnest (not that he’d mind selling more books as a result), whereas Trump appears to be gaming the entire process for the purposes of a brand awareness exercise.

    So, only professional politicians need apply? I am not endorsing Trump, and I wish he would run as a Democrat, but the professional politician will be the death of this country.

    Not at all. But if you’re not a careerist, you better know your stuff. That’s not true of Trump or Carson. Fiorina (who, granted, did run for office before) is a different story.

    I tend to think we use the experience variable as a rather imperfect proxy for a certain mindset. Yes, many (most?) people who spend their career in the political system start to develop certain callouses. But there are exceptions.

    Tom Coburn spent 16 years in Congress, but I doubt many of us would fault him for being a careerist, because he always maintained that outsider’s perspective.

    Let’s face it: Scott Walker is a career politician. He was 22 the first time he ran for office and 25 the first time he was elected. Yet, as the collective bargaining fight demonstrated, he never developed the timidity that tends to come with being a political veteran.

    Point being: there are outsiders who are in over their head and longtime politicos who don’t fall into the native pathologies of being a professional politician. We’re always better off trying to judge these people as individuals rather than using their backgrounds as heuristic shortcuts.

    • #56
  27. Petty Boozswha Inactive
    Petty Boozswha
    @PettyBoozswha

    The reason we tolerated vanity candidates like Herman Cain or Santorum last time is because a lot of us were praying for Mitch Daniels to save us from an obvious loss with Romney. This time we have an abundance of good candidates and don’t need to pander to clowns like Trump.

    • #57
  28. Leigh Inactive
    Leigh
    @Leigh

    Petty Boozswha:Oxygen was a metaphor for air time.

    This only matters if Kasich (et al) has a chance to begin with.  I do think we have our natural front-runners in Bush, Walker, and Rubio, and that unless one or two of those three plummet badly it will take more than a little extra airtime for someone like Kasich or Jindal to break through.

    Misthiocracy:

    Troy Senik, Ed.: (anyone see any evidence that Newt’s attack dog style rubbed off on Romney in 2012?)

    I think Romney became a better debater after sparring with Newt.

    Didn’t help in the end, but still, he did improve.

    Debating Trump might have been good practice for debating Biden.

    • #58
  29. Quinn the Eskimo Member
    Quinn the Eskimo
    @

    David Knights:

    So, only professional politicians need apply? I am not endorsing Trump, and I wish he would run as a Democrat, but the professional politician will be the death of this country.

    I’m not sure that only professional politicians need apply, but I think there are some skills I would like to see a preview of before the election.  I’d like to see how a president handles an elected legislature, for example.  I’d like to see how a president handles difficult times.

    • #59
  30. Titus Techera Contributor
    Titus Techera
    @TitusTechera

    Excellent post, Troy-

    Start at 2 minutes. There is at least one room in which Mr. Trump is not the weird guy.

    • #60
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