Boris and Blighty’s Big Day

Around these parts, we strive to provide Class A Punditry® no matter where in the world the news happens. So this week, we jump across the pond to cover last night’s stunning Tory victory in the Mother Country. To do that, we call on our mate Toby Young (he of the London Calling podcast, aka Great Britain’s fastest growing chat show) who takes us through all of the machinations and expectations of this historic election. Then, it’s back home where we get a visit from our newly minted Ricochet Podcast Chief Impeachment Pundit, Professor John Yoo, esq. (if you’re not listening to his Law Talk with Epstein & Yoo and Pacific Century podcasts, you are missing out). The Professor takes us through the week’s events with lots of legal insight and analysis with no spin. We wish our good pal Pat Sajak a speedy recovery by awarding the highly coveted Lileks Post of The Week badge to @PHCheese for his post Get Well Fast Pat Sajak and we’ve got a new Long Poll question for you. Finally, Rob attends a Christmas party with a bunch of frogs, Peter is rocking out on Handel, and Lileks will blow your snow if you ask him. Leave your requests in the comments.

Music from this week’s show: Rose of England by Nick Lowe

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There are 63 comments.

  1. Spin Coolidge
    Spin Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Looking forward to the drive home, now…

    • #1
    • December 13, 2019, at 3:44 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  2. Henry Castaigne Member

    Is it just me or is Lileks slowly and with great reluctance becoming Trumpy? More so because of progressive overreach than because of anything about Trump but I still sense it. In fact it, even Jpod and Rob Long seem to be forced to say in essence, “eh Trump. Not that bad really.”

    Or am I drunk off of the UK victory.

    • #2
    • December 13, 2019, at 3:56 PM PST
    • 12 likes
  3. kedavis Member

    The news from Britain isn’t all that great. It should have been far more lop-sided. Sure, the Conservatives won 365 seats. But Labo(u)r still got 203. Which shows that a lot of Brits still aren’t very Bright.

    Contrary to Rob’s mini-tirade or whatever that was, 203 vs 365 is not a thin sliver.

    • #3
    • December 13, 2019, at 4:52 PM PST
    • Like
  4. kedavis Member

    And I have my glassware in protective bubble wrap. before John Yoo comes on.

    • #4
    • December 13, 2019, at 4:56 PM PST
    • Like
  5. MKM Member
    MKM

    Bully for the Brits. How long will it take for the rest of Europe to get tired of being bossed around by the Germans? 

    • #5
    • December 13, 2019, at 5:18 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  6. Arahant Member

    Half the music from James’ youth was already “seasonal” music, rather than Christmas music. If we’re going with seasonal music, I’ll have an old wassailing song, thank you very much.

    • #6
    • December 13, 2019, at 5:20 PM PST
    • 1 like
  7. Jon1979 Lincoln

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Is it just me or is Lileks slowly and with great reluctance becoming Trumpy? More so because of progressive overreach than because of anything about Trump but I still sense it. In fact it, even Jpod and Rob Long seem to be forced to say in essence, “eh Trump. Not that bad really.”

    Or am I drunk off of the UK victory.

    Despite not being on the coasts like Peter or Rob, James apparently gets to have the most woke, progressive representative of the three in Ilhan Omar. Brings into pretty sharp reality the contrast-and-compare between Trump and the Trump alternatives.

    Also I thought John Yoo was already the Ricochet Podcast’s official McRib Pundit®. Didn’t know you could hold dual titles.

    • #7
    • December 13, 2019, at 5:43 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  8. kedavis Member

    MKM (View Comment):

    Bully for the Brits. How long will it take for the rest of Europe to get tired of being bossed around by the Germans?

    WW III, perhaps?

    • #8
    • December 13, 2019, at 6:05 PM PST
    • 1 like
  9. Belt Member

    Regarding the politicians gravely talking about the ‘deep divide’ in the country, this usually shows up after a drubbing, and it usually implies that they want the healing to begin with the victors reaching out towards them and compromising. In this case, the leftists have been digging that chasm for years, and it turns out that the gulf is between them, and the vast majority of the country, including a sizable portion of their own voters.

     

    • #9
    • December 13, 2019, at 6:22 PM PST
    • 11 likes
  10. Peter Robinson Founder

    Belt (View Comment):

    Regarding the politicians gravely talking about the ‘deep divide’ in the country, this usually shows up after a drubbing, and it usually implies that they want the healing to begin with the victors reaching out towards them and compromising. In this case, the leftists have been digging that chasm for years, and it turns out that the gulf is between them, and the vast majority of the country, including a sizable portion of their own voters.

     

    Beautifully put!

    • #10
    • December 13, 2019, at 6:47 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  11. Jon1979 Lincoln

    Belt (View Comment):

    Regarding the politicians gravely talking about the ‘deep divide’ in the country, this usually shows up after a drubbing, and it usually implies that they want the healing to begin with the victors reaching out towards them and compromising. In this case, the leftists have been digging that chasm for years, and it turns out that the gulf is between them, and the vast majority of the country, including a sizable portion of their own voters.

    It is worth remembering that after his and the Democrats’ big win in 2008 and his inauguration in ’09, Barack Obama’s response to John Boehner was “I won” when Boehner asked him to consider Republican concerns in putting out his first-year governing agenda. Curt and dismissive, but within his rights after the Dems’ landslide, while those within the media continued to gush about his calm and healing nature.

    Obama and the Democrats in general in the 2009-10 period were as dismissive of Republican concerns as Adam Schiff or Jerry Nadler have been during the current impeachment hearings. But that type of “my way or the highway” talk never draws anything close to the hyperventilating that arises when the shoe’s on the other foot, as was the case after the 2016 election. Vapors were had and pearls were clutched by thousands outraged that Trump was going to not just simply run roughshod over the Democrats’ concerns, but no doubt turn America into a dystopian and a totalitarian nightmare by the time Ground Hog Day rolled around in 2017.

    Parties that win control of both the Legislative and Executive Branches generally have the right to do as they please (even moreso since Harry Reid started killing the filibuster, under the belief that somehow the Senate Democrats would never be in the minority again). But you only see the calls for respecting the minority party’s rights echoed in the media in situations like Thursday in England, when it’s the left that’s been thumped and is destined to wander in the wilderness for the next couple of years.

    • #11
    • December 13, 2019, at 7:56 PM PST
    • 8 likes
  12. Belt Member

    Regarding that poll, I don’t believe the majority of Americans are any one of those things. A subset will think of themselves in those terms, but a majority are little bit of this, and a little bit of that, and mostly aren’t strongly one way or the other, when you get down to it.

    • #12
    • December 13, 2019, at 8:04 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  13. James Lileks Contributor

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):
    Is it just me or is Lileks slowly and with great reluctance becoming Trumpy? More so because of progressive overreach than because of anything about Trump but I still sense it.

    “Trumpy” is a loaded word – does that mean agreeing with the policies, or the tone? Or both? If you agree with the results of the president’s tenure, are you Trumpy – or does that require adding some smack-mouth? 

    I have examined my previous objections and concerns and compared them with reality, which is always a good exercise to undertake periodically. Was I wrong, and if so, why was I wrong? Or, conversely, was I right then, and if I have been persuaded otherwise, how did that happen? 

    Let’s just say that come 2020 I’m not voting D and I’m not voting for hopeless vanity candidates. 

    • #13
    • December 13, 2019, at 9:30 PM PST
    • 17 likes
  14. kedavis Member

    James Lileks (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):
    Is it just me or is Lileks slowly and with great reluctance becoming Trumpy? More so because of progressive overreach than because of anything about Trump but I still sense it.

    “Trumpy” is a loaded word – does that mean agreeing with the policies, or the tone? Or both? If you agree with the results of the president’s tenure, are you Trumpy – or does that require adding some smack-mouth?

    I have examined my previous objections and concerns and compared them with reality, which is always a good exercise to undertake periodically. Was I wrong, and if so, why was I wrong? Or, conversely, was I right then, and if I have been persuaded otherwise, how did that happen?

    Let’s just say that come 2020 I’m not voting D and I’m not voting for hopeless vanity candidates.

    You should write a book! In the tradition of Leonard Nimoy, you could call it “I Am Not Rob Long.” Or pick some other name.

    • #14
    • December 13, 2019, at 10:38 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  15. James Lileks Contributor

    kedavis (View Comment):
    You should write a book! In the tradition of Leonard Nimoy, you could call it “I Am Not Rob Long.” Or pick some other name.

    Except Being Not Rob Long would mean forswearing a life of Parisian boulevardiering and consulate parties and being generally and specifically smart and accomplished and funny. I’ll shoot for “I am Not Max Boot” but that really doesn’t narrow it down much, does it. 

    • #15
    • December 13, 2019, at 10:56 PM PST
    • 12 likes
  16. Bereket Kelile Member
    Bereket Kelile Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    James’ parting comment at the end of the interview with Toby deserves more attention: the Reds should be red. 

    You’re right, James, but we don’t have to do it backwards here. In fact, I don’t know why we decided to stick with this convention which, as best as I can tell, goes back to Tim Russert and the 2000 election. Since then, it’s been fairly standardized across the country. 

    Around the world, though, not only is it understood that it’s the Commies who red, but market-based, freedom-loving, center-right parties are always blue. When Reagan won in 1980, Tom Brokaw called it “This steamroller, this wave–I’m running out of metaphors!” David Brinkley surveyed the giant NBC map–colored Reagan blue–and labelled it “a suburban swimming pool.”

    Back in 2014, my colleagues led an initiative to make the official color of the California Republican Party Reagan Blue. The measure passed. Unfortunately, Republicans around the country have accepted red without any thought (or maybe even awareness?) of its historical background.

    I imagine the same could be done at the national party if an effort was made to push a proposal to make blue the official color. I would love to be a part of that campaign.

    • #16
    • December 13, 2019, at 11:03 PM PST
    • 8 likes
  17. kedavis Member

    Bereket Kelile (View Comment):

    James’ parting comment at the end of the interview with Toby deserves more attention: the Reds should be red.

    You’re right, James, but we don’t have to do it backwards here. In fact, I don’t know why we decided to stick with this convention which, as best as I can tell, goes back to Tim Russert and the 2000 election. Since then, it’s been fairly standardized across the country.

    Around the world, though, not only is it understood that it’s the Commies who red, but market-based, freedom-loving, center-right parties are always blue. When Reagan won in 1980, Tom Brokaw called it “This steamroller, this wave–I’m running out of metaphors!” David Brinkley surveyed the giant NBC map–colored Reagan blue–and labelled it “a suburban swimming pool.”

    Back in 2014, my colleagues led an initiative to make the official color of the California Republican Party Reagan Blue. The measure passed. Unfortunately, Republicans around the country have accepted red without any thought (or maybe even awareness?) of its historical background.

    I imagine the same could be done at the national party if an effort was made to push a proposal to make blue the official color. I would love to be a part of that campaign.

    Main problem there probably is, I can’t imagine the left going along with becoming known as “the red party.” What does that leave, two different shades of blue?

    • #17
    • December 13, 2019, at 11:40 PM PST
    • 1 like
  18. The Cynthonian Member

    James Lileks (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):
    You should write a book! In the tradition of Leonard Nimoy, you could call it “I Am Not Rob Long.” Or pick some other name.

    Except Being Not Rob Long would mean forswearing a life of Parisian boulevardiering and consulate parties and being generally and specifically smart and accomplished and funny. I’ll shoot for “I am Not Max Boot” but that really doesn’t narrow it down much, does it.

    For some odd reason, in recent years I cannot hear the name “Max Boot” without thinking of this old comedy skit:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfMcxmOBmpk

     

     

    • #18
    • December 13, 2019, at 11:52 PM PST
    • Like
  19. Arahant Member

    James Lileks (View Comment):
    Let’s just say that come 2020 I’m not voting D and I’m not voting for hopeless vanity candidates. 

    We’ll take that.

    • #19
    • December 14, 2019, at 1:18 AM PST
    • 5 likes
  20. kedavis Member

    Arahant (View Comment):

    James Lileks (View Comment):
    Let’s just say that come 2020 I’m not voting D and I’m not voting for hopeless vanity candidates.

    We’ll take that.

    But he didn’t exclude the possibility of not voting at all.

    • #20
    • December 14, 2019, at 2:48 AM PST
    • Like
  21. kedavis Member

    Regarding British elections etc, I recommend the GLoP podcast from 6/13/17.

    • #21
    • December 14, 2019, at 2:50 AM PST
    • Like
  22. EJHill Podcaster
    EJHill Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Re: Party colors

    Americans don’t care. In 1976 Jimmy Carter’s people chose green and white as his campaign colors. 

    There was a time in America when “opinion” demanded that the Cincinnati Reds become the “Redlegs,” because some people were afraid that a World Series headline of “Reds Slaughter Yanks” might induce panic. (That wouldn’t happen until 1976. And it was glorious.)

    • #22
    • December 14, 2019, at 6:00 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  23. Bishop Wash, Blk X-man/Wh pilot Member

    Does Peter call Toby a cuck because that would be funny? For those who don’t listen to London Calling, the other host, James Delingpole, playfully calls Toby a cuck. 

    • #23
    • December 14, 2019, at 6:08 AM PST
    • Like
  24. EJHill Podcaster
    EJHill Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Bishop WashDoes Peter call Toby a cuck because that would be funny? For those who don’t listen to London Calling, the other host, James Delingpole, playfully calls Toby a cuck.

    Don’t listen!?! That is frowned upon in this establishment.

    • #24
    • December 14, 2019, at 6:29 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  25. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… Member

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Bereket Kelile (View Comment):

    James’ parting comment at the end of the interview with Toby deserves more attention: the Reds should be red.

    You’re right, James, but we don’t have to do it backwards here. In fact, I don’t know why we decided to stick with this convention which, as best as I can tell, goes back to Tim Russert and the 2000 election. Since then, it’s been fairly standardized across the country.

    Around the world, though, not only is it understood that it’s the Commies who red, but market-based, freedom-loving, center-right parties are always blue. When Reagan won in 1980, Tom Brokaw called it “This steamroller, this wave–I’m running out of metaphors!” David Brinkley surveyed the giant NBC map–colored Reagan blue–and labelled it “a suburban swimming pool.”

    Back in 2014, my colleagues led an initiative to make the official color of the California Republican Party Reagan Blue. The measure passed. Unfortunately, Republicans around the country have accepted red without any thought (or maybe even awareness?) of its historical background.

    I imagine the same could be done at the national party if an effort was made to push a proposal to make blue the official color. I would love to be a part of that campaign.

    Main problem there probably is, I can’t imagine the left going along with becoming known as “the red party.” What does that leave, two different shades of blue?

    How about green and purple? Like the Drazi.

    • #25
    • December 14, 2019, at 7:02 AM PST
    • 1 like
  26. Kozak Member
    Kozak Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    EJHill (View Comment):

    Bishop Wash: Does Peter call Toby a cuck because that would be funny? For those who don’t listen to London Calling, the other host, James Delingpole, playfully calls Toby a cuck.

    Don’t listen!?! That is frowned upon in this establishment.

    • #26
    • December 14, 2019, at 7:25 AM PST
    • Like
  27. Kozak Member
    Kozak Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    James Lileks (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):
    Is it just me or is Lileks slowly and with great reluctance becoming Trumpy? More so because of progressive overreach than because of anything about Trump but I still sense it.

    “Trumpy” is a loaded word – does that mean agreeing with the policies, or the tone? Or both? If you agree with the results of the president’s tenure, are you Trumpy – or does that require adding some smack-mouth?

    I have examined my previous objections and concerns and compared them with reality, which is always a good exercise to undertake periodically. Was I wrong, and if so, why was I wrong? Or, conversely, was I right then, and if I have been persuaded otherwise, how did that happen?

    Let’s just say that come 2020 I’m not voting D and I’m not voting for hopeless vanity candidates.

    • #27
    • December 14, 2019, at 7:33 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  28. Taras Coolidge

    I’ve always thought it was a masterstroke, when some very smart liberal media people got together, and made red the color for Republicans on political maps, and blue the color for Democrats.

    And then some very stupid conservative media people (e.g., Fox News), went along with it!

    As it was intended, it continues to sow confusion. I recall trying to explain to a liberal friend that ex-communist David Horowitz refers to himself as a “red diaper baby”, because he went to communist day camp as a child.

    P.S.: When I tried to reply to some of the comments on this subject, the software filled in “unsubscribe” instead of the comments.

    • #28
    • December 14, 2019, at 9:33 AM PST
    • 5 likes
  29. Locke On Member

    For those who want more Toby, here’s his parallel Quillette article:

    https://quillette.com/2019/12/13/britains-labour-party-got-woke-and-now-its-broke/

    • #29
    • December 14, 2019, at 11:48 AM PST
    • 1 like
  30. James Lileks Contributor

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):

    James Lileks (View Comment):
    Let’s just say that come 2020 I’m not voting D and I’m not voting for hopeless vanity candidates.

    We’ll take that.

    But he didn’t exclude the possibility of not voting at all.

    I hereby exclude that possibility!

    • #30
    • December 14, 2019, at 12:46 PM PST
    • 4 likes