A Very Simple Answer to Impeachment Charges

 

Did President Trump pressure President Zelensky of Ukraine? The Democrats say yes he did and, because Ukraine is so dependent upon America and President Trump is so powerful, Zelensky is afraid to say he was pressured. Both Trump and Zelensky many times have publicly denied any pressure.

With Trump facing impeachment and the entire world watching, why would Zelensky be afraid? He need only say that he was pressured and Trump would be gone. Both articles of impeachment are based on that simple question. They are in the principal’s office and if Zelensky said he was bullied by Trump, the bully would be kicked out of school.

If there wasn’t any pressure, of course, the Democrats will just make up something else.

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  1. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    PHCheese: Of course the Democrats would just make up something else.

    They have already said they will. If he dares to win in 2020, we will see it all again.

    • #1
  2. Juliana Member
    Juliana
    @Juliana

    Arahant (View Comment):

    PHCheese: Of course the Democrats would just make up something else.

    They have already said they will. If he dares to win in 2020, we will see it all again.

    This is so disheartening. At what point do even the democrat voters say, “Enough already, let’s move on.”

    • #2
  3. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Juliana (View Comment):
    At what point do even the democrat voters say, “Enough already, let’s move on.”

    When they win everything.

    • #3
  4. Seawriter Contributor
    Seawriter
    @Seawriter

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Juliana (View Comment):
    At what point do even the democrat voters say, “Enough already, let’s move on.”

    When they win everything.

    Which is why – until Trump started pushing back – they were always winning. 

    • #4
  5. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    PHCheese: The point I would like to make is with Trump facing impeachment and the entire world watching why would Zelensky be afraid? All he would need do was say he was pressured and Trump is gone.

    There is a clear record of pressure on Ukraine politicians from the Obama Administration. Vice-President Joe Biden had himself recorded bragging before the Council on Foreign Relations with a description of what method he used to coerce the firing of the Ukrainian Prosecutor-General. The method Biden used involved withholding a billion dollar loan guarantee that was to benefit Ukraine. That pressure worked. The Prosecutor-General was fired.

    Zelensky is smart to avoid going back to that Democrat regime. 

    My question to you is why in the world would he want to revert to the previous arrangement where pressure is assured?

    • #5
  6. Stad Coolidge
    Stad
    @Stad

    PHCheese: The point I would like to make is with Trump facing impeachment and the entire world watching why would Zelensky be afraid? All he would need do was say he was pressured and Trump is gone.

    Good point!

    • #6
  7. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    The Democrats’ big mistake was going all in on impeachment. If they had settled for censure not only would it have likely passed, but they probably would have gotten a few Republican votes. To use your school metaphor: The Democrats demanded expulsion when detention would have sufficed. Because of their overreach it is likely that not only will the President get off with no punishment at all, the Democrats will likely be shamed at best. 

    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    • #7
  8. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Why, you sunny-eyed optimist, you.

    • #8
  9. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Why, you sunny-eyed optimist, you.

    I did say, “At best.”

    • #9
  10. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Why, you sunny-eyed optimist, you.

    Yeah. None of that 20% is on the Judicial Committee or the Intelligence Committee.

    • #10
  11. Gumby Mark (R-Meth Lab of Demo… Coolidge
    Gumby Mark (R-Meth Lab of Demo…
    @GumbyMark

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    The Democrats’ big mistake was going all in on impeachment. If they had settled for censure not only would it have likely passed, but they probably would have gotten a few Republican votes. To use your school metaphor: The Democrats demanded expulsion when detention would have sufficed. Because of their overreach it is likely that not only will the President get off with no punishment at all, the Democrats will likely be shamed at best.

    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Same mistake the GOP made in 1998 with Clinton. 

    • #11
  12. PHCheese Inactive
    PHCheese
    @PHCheese

    Bob Thompson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Why, you sunny-eyed optimist, you.

    Yeah. None of that 20% is on the Judicial Committee or the Intelligence Committee.

    Democrats on the Intelligence Committee is an oxymoron .

    • #12
  13. WillowSpring Member
    WillowSpring
    @WillowSpring

    PHCheese: The Democrats say yes he did and because the Ukraine is so dependent upon America and President Trump is so powerful Zelensky is afraid to say he was pressured.

    Don’t forget that Trump is also taller than Zelensky – adding even more pressure according to Hank (“Will Guam tip over”) Johnson.

    • #13
  14. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    The Democrats’ big mistake was going all in on impeachment. If they had settled for censure not only would it have likely passed, but they probably would have gotten a few Republican votes. To use your school metaphor: The Democrats demanded expulsion when detention would have sufficed. Because of their overreach it is likely that not only will the President get off with no punishment at all, the Democrats will likely be shamed at best.

    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Because censure does not remove Trump from office and that is the goal.  

    • #14
  15. OkieSailor Member
    OkieSailor
    @OkieSailor

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Juliana (View Comment):
    At what point do even the democrat voters say, “Enough already, let’s move on.”

    When they win everything.

    No actually there is no end to Socialism except the grave since there can never be enough funding for any give away program. So if they win everything they will just accelerate their demands not end them.

    • #15
  16. OkieSailor Member
    OkieSailor
    @OkieSailor

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20%

    That seems a bit high to me ;>)

    • #16
  17. OkieSailor Member
    OkieSailor
    @OkieSailor

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    Bob Thompson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Why, you sunny-eyed optimist, you.

    Yeah. None of that 20% is on the Judicial Committee or the Intelligence Committee.

    Democrats on the Intelligence Committee is an oxymoron .

    No there were actual reasons to impeach Clinton, perjury comes to mind.

    • #17
  18. OkieSailor Member
    OkieSailor
    @OkieSailor

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    The Democrats’ big mistake was going all in on impeachment. If they had settled for censure not only would it have likely passed, but they probably would have gotten a few Republican votes. To use your school metaphor: The Democrats demanded expulsion when detention would have sufficed. Because of their overreach it is likely that not only will the President get off with no punishment at all, the Democrats will likely be shamed at best.

    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Because censure does not remove Trump from office and that is the goal.

    The real goal is to prevent re-election.

    • #18
  19. PHCheese Inactive
    PHCheese
    @PHCheese

    OkieSailor (View Comment):

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    The Democrats’ big mistake was going all in on impeachment. If they had settled for censure not only would it have likely passed, but they probably would have gotten a few Republican votes. To use your school metaphor: The Democrats demanded expulsion when detention would have sufficed. Because of their overreach it is likely that not only will the President get off with no punishment at all, the Democrats will likely be shamed at best.

    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Because censure does not remove Trump from office and that is the goal.

    The real goal is to prevent re-election.

    This is true but I think their long game is to also win back the Senate. They will use the up coming  Republican  exoneration of Trump against them next year.

    • #19
  20. Franco Member
    Franco
    @Franco

    The Democrats are flying blind and flailing. It looks to me that their left wing base were clamoring for blood, their media overlords/enablers wanted it also. Nancy tried to finesse it by holding ‘hearings’ but she couldn’t control it. They didn’t expect the Republicans to be so unified and put up such a fuss ( hopefully those days of appeasement are over)  and they thought they could score damage points on Trump.

    Trouble was, they’ve already spent all their ammunition on the Mueller thing and 24/7 media vilification, so this was just more of the same. Americans have chosen sides already, and those few who hadn’t got disgusted. 

    Now they’ve given us a concrete reason and teal incentives to flip the House back. Massive fail! I love it!!!

     

    • #20
  21. PHCheese Inactive
    PHCheese
    @PHCheese

    Franco (View Comment):

    The Democrats are flying blind and flailing. It looks to me that their left wing base were clamoring for blood, their media overlords/enablers wanted it also. Nancy tried to finesse it by holding ‘hearings’ but she couldn’t control it. They didn’t expect the Republicans to be so unified and put up such a fuss ( hopefully those days of appeasement are over) and they thought they could score damage points on Trump.

    Trouble was, they’ve already spent all their ammunition on the Mueller thing and 24/7 media vilification, so this was just more of the same. Americans have chosen sides already, and those few who hadn’t got disgusted.

    Now they’ve given us a concrete reason and teal incentives to flip the House back. Massive fail! I love it!!!

     

    Democrats might be happy to give up the House for the Senate because of the  supreme court picks. Just saying.

    • #21
  22. Stad Coolidge
    Stad
    @Stad

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    The Democrats’ big mistake was going all in on impeachment. If they had settled for censure not only would it have likely passed, but they probably would have gotten a few Republican votes. To use your school metaphor: The Democrats demanded expulsion when detention would have sufficed. Because of their overreach it is likely that not only will the President get off with no punishment at all, the Democrats will likely be shamed at best.

    This was a huge mistake on the part of the Democrats, but I’d put the likelihood of them learning their lesson at about 20% at best.

    Because censure does not remove Trump from office and that is the goal.

    True, but when the goal changes to saving House seats, then censure will be the solution . . .

    • #22
  23. PHCheese Inactive
    PHCheese
    @PHCheese

    The charge of obstruction of Congress is nullified because SCOTUS agreed to hear three cases brought by the Trump Administration regarding  subpoenas from Congress on Friday.

    • #23
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