Imagining an Alternate Universe

 

As we head toward the 100-day mark of the Trump Era, I think it’s fair to say we have elected the most interesting man ever to inhabit the White House. He has angered some conservatives; he has continued to enrage liberals; he has inspired marches replete with everything from vaginas to Form 1040s; he has caused major media outlets to explode with bile; he has bombed Syria and Afghanistan (in the latter case, finally allowing the MOAB designation to be removed from my 1989-90 CBS talk show); he has moved ships toward North Korea; he has upset his supposed BFF Vladimir Putin; he has shared Dover sole with Chinese President Xi Jinping, announcing, “We have developed a friendship” (with the President, not the sole); he has whiffed on Obamacare but homered on SCOTUS; he has — well, you get the idea. It’s been an interesting three months.

So while we pause and try to catch our breath, here’s a question: What would a Hillary Clinton administration look like at this point? Also, since this is strictly — and happily — a mental exercise, let’s assume the Republican Senate fell along with Trump (a reasonable assumption). What would be going on in the country and in the world? What would the media be writing and talking about? Who would be the power brokers? How would the Republicans deal with the internal warfare that contributed to the results? How would the next four or eight years be shaping up?

Of course, we can’t know any of this. Think of it as a Ricochet parlor game. Still, as we march closer to 100 days of Donald Trump, it might be useful to reflect on the alternative and think about what might have been.

Published in General
Like this post? Want to comment? Join Ricochet’s community of conservatives and be part of the conversation. Join Ricochet for Free.

There are 85 comments.

Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.
  1. cirby Inactive
    cirby
    @cirby

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):
    I had it figured for “Bill dies, and Hillary comes out as the first lesbian President”.

    The left is bordering on “don’t ask, don’t tell, don’t look, don’t even think about it” for all forms of sexuality, across the whole of society.

    They’re not very far away from outlawing any mention of public sexuality as it is, and Hillary’s admission would give them that last excuse.

     

    • #61
  2. Paula Davidson Inactive
    Paula Davidson
    @PaulaDavidson

    I think the direction Hillary Clinton would have taken the United States would have been problematic for the country’s existence as a free country. But its possible the real problem might have been in getting her out of office when her term (or god forbid terms) in office was up.  Hillary Clinton seems to be a corrupt old white woman totally obsessed with becoming president. So obsessed in fact that I  wonder if she had been elected would we  have had trouble getting her out of the White House?  Can’t you just imagine her  pointing  to some sort of manufactured trouble in the world (possibly involving cyber security and the wiping of servers, she is after all handy with a cloth) and she offers, no demands, to stay president a “just little longer”  because her experience makes her the ONLY person who can solve this issue (whatever this issue is going to be). The U.N. might have even spoken in support of her request to stay president a little longer to help all of us deplorable average Americans who are not capable of helping ourselves. The movers would have been  peeling her fingertips off the front door as she fought  with all her might to stay in the White House.

    • #62
  3. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    cirby (View Comment):

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):
    I had it figured for “Bill dies, and Hillary comes out as the first lesbian President”.

    The left is bordering on “don’t ask, don’t tell, don’t look, don’t even think about it” for all forms of sexuality, across the whole of society.

    They’re not very far away from outlawing any mention of public sexuality as it is, and Hillary’s admission would give them that last excuse.

    Say what?  That seems to be the exact opposite of my observations.  The left is obsessed with sex, and refuses to shut the hell up about it.

    • #63
  4. Lazy_Millennial Inactive
    Lazy_Millennial
    @LazyMillennial

    So I’m seeing lots of folks ruminating that Clinton wouldn’t have been as hawkish as Trump has been. I disagree. Consider her history:

    • Goldwater girl in ’64
    • Watched her husband regret not intervening in Rwanda
    • Watched her husband not regret intervening in Kosovo
    • Voted for the Iraq War
    • Bombed Libya & Syria

    Has there ever been an intervention Clinton didn’t support at the time of proposal? Usually Dems start out dovish and get more hawkish through their Presidency, but HRC already had that experience with her husband.

    Consider also the North Korea situation- it was apparently what Obama pressed Trump on as important. If the Dem government elites were considering action under Obama, it would have continued under Clinton.

    Consider also the praise for Trump’s Syria strike that has come from former Obama admin officials. The more that comes out about the Obama administration, the more it seems that everyone from the base-level analysts to the people in front of the President’s desk were arguing for more intervention. Switch the person behind the desk, and I think we see different actions.

    Consider also Clinton’s post-campaign hatred of the Russians.

    Consider, finally, the power of the narrative that the lefties could have pushed with Clinton as their “Iron Lady”, or Clinton-May as “Iron Ladies.” She could have artfully played the Wilson-FDR role, the reluctant Dem drawn into world conflict.

    Not saying she would have been competent. But I think she would have been more hawkish than Obama.

    • #64
  5. drlorentz Member
    drlorentz
    @drlorentz

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    I was logging in about 1AM just so I could see the lamentations. I almost felt like a terrible person but it was the best entertainment I’d had in years.

    Lamentations, you say?

    • #65
  6. Ryan M(cPherson) Inactive
    Ryan M(cPherson)
    @RyanM

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Quake Voter (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Quake Voter (View Comment):
    I see no policy differences between the two, or at least none that would justify nominating and supporting such a … yeah, that whole line is pretty risible, right?

    …in hindsight.

    No Umbra. It was all there in front of your nose on November 8. [redacted]

    Yes, we had the word of a life long New York Democrat who said some nice things but had no record of actually doing anything. Okay, he kept some of his promises, and in hindsight he turned out to be more trustworthy than we thought, but we had no way of knowing any of this would happen during the campaign.

    It must be nice to be so able to trust politicians so readily. Personally, I stopped doing that when I was 15.

    It would also be nice to be taken in good faith by our fellow conservatives. Many of these comments say, essentially, “what you’re saying about your own motives is a lie.”

    • #66
  7. Phil Turmel Inactive
    Phil Turmel
    @PhilTurmel

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Phil Turmel (View Comment):

    … for those caught in the elite bubble. Fortunately, ~90% of Republicans and substantial numbers of independents not only weren’t caught in any bubble, but had the foresight to make this particular debate possible.

    I’ll say it before and I’ll say it again, if making $32K a year shuffling papers makes me “elite,” the word has no meaning.

    “caught in an elite bubble” does not require one to be an elite.  Simply to identify with them and get all one’s trusted information from them.  Numerous Ricochetti pleaded with the NTs to see what was plain to everyone else, and to vast numbers of non-Ricochetti.  Your claim that this situation could only be identified in hindsight is patently false, thoroughly documented on the pages of Ricochet and all over the internet.  You can dispute my contention that an elite bubble is to blame for one’s lack of foresight, but your claim that it wasn’t foreseeable is pure and utter [expletive].

    • #67
  8. cirby Inactive
    cirby
    @cirby

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    cirby (View Comment):

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):
    I had it figured for “Bill dies, and Hillary comes out as the first lesbian President”.

    The left is bordering on “don’t ask, don’t tell, don’t look, don’t even think about it” for all forms of sexuality, across the whole of society.

    They’re not very far away from outlawing any mention of public sexuality as it is, and Hillary’s admission would give them that last excuse.

    Say what? That seems to be the exact opposite of my observations. The left is obsessed with sex, and refuses to shut the hell up about it.

    You’re thinking about last decade’s version of the left. While they might tout gays and other alt-sex types, you’re supposed to tolerate them, not talk about their actual sexuality, and keep your own heterosexuality in the closet where it belongs.

     

    • #68
  9. Bishop Wash Member
    Bishop Wash
    @BishopWash

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Arjay (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Bishop Wash (View Comment):
    Most of the Ricochet podcasts would be happier, crowing about defeating those icky Trump supporters and saying ‘we told you so’.

    Wrong.

    Not wrong. They’d be busily scribbling about how they would lead the rebuild of the “real” Republican Party, at some undefined future time.

    Maybe. But the part about them being “happier” that Hillary won is wrong. At worst they’d be saying it’s a tragedy and blaming the Trumpists for trying to shove the least electable candidate down our throats. The fact that we were proven wrong on some (but by no means all) of our concerns has no relevance to the information we had at the time.

    Maybe happier is the wrong word, but I meant it in a comparative sense. Not that they’d be happy, per se, but not as sad as the podcasts were after November 8.

    There seemed to be a class of commentator who thought they wouldn’t be affected by Hillary’s policies and in four years we’d be able to win with their choice, whoever that would be. They’d be able to, as you mention, rail against Hillary and those who voted for Trump in the primaries.

    • #69
  10. Bishop Wash Member
    Bishop Wash
    @BishopWash

    Johnny Dubya (View Comment):
    Bill is chasing skirts. (That happens in every alternative reality.)

    Except for that one strange alternate reality where everything is the same except everyone is the opposite sex. Of course that Bill is chasing slacks.

    • #70
  11. drlorentz Member
    drlorentz
    @drlorentz

    Phil Turmel (View Comment):
    “caught in an elite bubble” does not require one to be an elite. Simply to identify with them and get all one’s trusted information from them.

    The converse is also true. A person with the demographic characteristics of the elite (e.g., Murray’s income/education measure of SES in Coming Apart) need not agree with their values and opinions nor sympathize with their aims. The conflation of having the superficial characteristics of a group with aligning with its values and objectives is commonplace and wrong.

    • #71
  12. drlorentz Member
    drlorentz
    @drlorentz

    Bishop Wash (View Comment):
    Maybe happier is the wrong word, but I meant it in a comparative sense.

    Happier is exactly the right word. It is a comparative. A person can be happier without being very happy.

    • #72
  13. tabula rasa Inactive
    tabula rasa
    @tabularasa

    I couldn’t bring myself to vote for Trump, but there is no doubt that things would be horrible under Hilary Clinton and a Democrat Senate.

    Following are a few of the not-so-prominent results:

    • Tens of thousands would pray for deafness so as not to be able to hear Hilary’s laughter during sycophantically-depressing press conferences.
    • Merrick Garland would not be on the Supreme Court, but Chelsea would.
    • Companies that sell odd-colored pantsuits would be enjoying extremely high stock prices.
    • Teresa May would be heard on a hot mike saying to Angela Merkel:  “You get to speak to her through an interpreter, I have to listen to her screeching at me in my own language.”
    • It Takes a Village would be mandatory reading.
    • Hope would be irrevocably lost in America.
    • #73
  14. Captain Kidd Inactive
    Captain Kidd
    @CaptainKidd

    Take your freedoms seriously, and never foregranted.

     

    • #74
  15. Captain Kidd Inactive
    Captain Kidd
    @CaptainKidd

    I have to say that I love your use of foregranted. That’s exactly how I feel on my course’s par 3 when I assume I’ll hit the green on my tee shot. I always take it foregranted. Alas, I am always disappointed.

    • #75
  16. Captain Kidd Inactive
    Captain Kidd
    @CaptainKidd

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):
    -word limit-

    7. Surveillance state becomes the norm. Political opponents, critics and independent thinkers are routinely hacked, tapped and leaked against. For both public shaming and framing.

    8. Police state emerges. local and state police agencies are federalized and militarized, middle America feels occupied. Redress of police misconduct becomes almost unheard of, abuses like Chicago’s Homan Square become common. Civil forfeiture becomes viral, to the point that driving through some bankrupt counties is dangerous – as the police may seize your car.

    9 Unified primaries. States are forced to unify the primary process, thus deny republicans, and 3rd parties access to the general election ballot. California already has this system, promoted as cost saving measure, it eventually becomes national.

    10. Bonds begin to fail. First Puerto Rico then a few counties, then entire states like Illinois can no longer make bond payments. The first few maybe bailed out. (Puerto Rico definitely will be) But soon the debts will be forceably restructured. Thankfully the government already has the precedent of the GM bankruptcy to rely on.

    Well if that dont cheer you up, I dont know whats wrong with y’all. Some of these things are happening anyway – I dont see how Trump can stop it all… But its just a thought experiment on how quickly an open society can be closed down.

    Take your freedoms seriously, and never foregranted.

    It’s time I learned how to quote a specific line of someone’s comment. Please inform me. I thought I quoted this last line (and even erased everything above it so as to just quote the last), but it just quoted me. (Which I recommend to no one.) Please tell me the ABC’s of separating one line out of the multitude. Thank you much.

    P.S. Pat, loved your old show.

    Really.

    I was the one who was watching it.

    • #76
  17. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Phil Turmel (View Comment):
    “caught in an elite bubble” does not require one to be an elite. Simply to identify with them and get all one’s trusted information from them. Numerous Ricochetti pleaded with the NTs to see what was plain to everyone else, and to vast numbers of non-Ricochetti. Your claim that this situation could only be identified in hindsight is patently false, thoroughly documented on the pages of Ricochet and all over the internet. You can dispute my contention that an elite bubble is to blame for one’s lack of foresight, but your claim that it wasn’t foreseeable is pure and utter [expletive].

    Ryan M(cPherson) (View Comment):
    It would also be nice to be taken in good faith by our fellow conservatives. Many of these comments say, essentially, “what you’re saying about your own motives is a lie.”

    Keep dreaming, Ryan.

    • #77
  18. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Captain Kidd (View Comment):
    It’s time I learned how to quote a specific line of someone’s comment. Please inform me. I thought I quoted this last line (and even erased everything above it so as to just quote the last), but it just quoted me. (Which I recommend to no one.) Please tell me the ABC’s of separating one line out of the multitude. Thank you much.

    Hilight the bit you want to quote before clicking the “quote” link.

    • #78
  19. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    Captain Kidd (View Comment):
    I have to say that I love your use of foregranted. That’s exactly how I feel on my course’s par 3 when I assume I’ll hit the green on my tee shot. I always take it foregranted. Alas, I am always disappointed.

    It’s back to ESL for me. My spell chequer needs an update as well.

    Ive always heard that as one word, along the lines of Foreshadow, forewarned, foreboding and foreword.

     

    • #79
  20. PhilKolb Inactive
    PhilKolb
    @PhilKolb

    We wouldn’t have Marxist (or is it Maxine) Waters calling for the impeachment of the president and then not calling for the impeachment of the president.

    • #80
  21. JcTPatriot Member
    JcTPatriot
    @

    PhilKolb (View Comment):
    We wouldn’t have Marxist Waters calling for the impeachment of the president and then not calling for the impeachment of the president.

    Heh heh, good one. I saw that. She basically (almost literally) called herself a liar. On National television, no less. Then she was like, “Oh I tweeted that? Well, what I meant was not what I denied what I said but what I said was not what I denied. Now stop making me call myself a liar.”

    • #81
  22. Captain Kidd Inactive
    Captain Kidd
    @CaptainKidd

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):
    Hilight the bit you want to quote before clicking the “quote” link.

    Yay !!

    Thank you so much.

    • #82
  23. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    JcTPatriot (View Comment):

    PhilKolb (View Comment):
    We wouldn’t have Marxist Waters calling for the impeachment of the president and then not calling for the impeachment of the president.

    Heh heh, good one. I saw that. She basically (almost literally) called herself a liar. On National television, no less. Then she was like, “Oh I tweeted that? Well, what I meant was not what I denied what I said but what I said was not what I denied. Now stop making me call myself a liar.”

    I thought it was even more mindless – Since words have no meaning – she can mean nothing she says – and therefore she has even stopped paying to the stuff that falls out of her face. Her staff give her the speech, she recites it like an automaton, and forgets it.

    • #83
  24. Joe P Member
    Joe P
    @JoeP

    JcTPatriot (View Comment):

    PhilKolb (View Comment):
    We wouldn’t have Marxist Waters calling for the impeachment of the president and then not calling for the impeachment of the president.

    Heh heh, good one. I saw that. She basically (almost literally) called herself a liar. On National television, no less. Then she was like, “Oh I tweeted that? Well, what I meant was not what I denied what I said but what I said was not what I denied. Now stop making me call myself a liar.”

    You know, that’s only going to get worse in the upcoming years, because all of the Democrats are starting to get old.

    If you think it’s bad now, just wait until they all start getting dementia.

    • #84
  25. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Joe P (View Comment):

    If you think it’s bad now, just wait until they all start getting dementia.

    Start?

    • #85
Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.