Imagining an Alternate Universe

 

As we head toward the 100-day mark of the Trump Era, I think it’s fair to say we have elected the most interesting man ever to inhabit the White House. He has angered some conservatives; he has continued to enrage liberals; he has inspired marches replete with everything from vaginas to Form 1040s; he has caused major media outlets to explode with bile; he has bombed Syria and Afghanistan (in the latter case, finally allowing the MOAB designation to be removed from my 1989-90 CBS talk show); he has moved ships toward North Korea; he has upset his supposed BFF Vladimir Putin; he has shared Dover sole with Chinese President Xi Jinping, announcing, “We have developed a friendship” (with the President, not the sole); he has whiffed on Obamacare but homered on SCOTUS; he has — well, you get the idea. It’s been an interesting three months.

So while we pause and try to catch our breath, here’s a question: What would a Hillary Clinton administration look like at this point? Also, since this is strictly — and happily — a mental exercise, let’s assume the Republican Senate fell along with Trump (a reasonable assumption). What would be going on in the country and in the world? What would the media be writing and talking about? Who would be the power brokers? How would the Republicans deal with the internal warfare that contributed to the results? How would the next four or eight years be shaping up?

Of course, we can’t know any of this. Think of it as a Ricochet parlor game. Still, as we march closer to 100 days of Donald Trump, it might be useful to reflect on the alternative and think about what might have been.

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  1. Joe P Member
    Joe P
    @JoeP

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Quake Voter (View Comment):
    I see no policy differences between the two, or at least none that would justify nominating and supporting such a … yeah, that whole line is pretty risible, right?

    …in hindsight.

    Even then, I might wait a week or two to see how this Kushner/Bannon war ends up playing out before declaring it totally risible. Just to be sure.

    • #31
  2. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    One of my colleagues came in the next day and I could hear her crying in her cubicle all day.

    I suppose it’s unhealthy how much I enjoy tales of woe from the Left…

    #DenyHillaryAndBatheInHerTears

    • #32
  3. Matt White Member
    Matt White
    @

    Ryan M(cPherson) (View Comment):

    Arjay (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Bishop Wash (View Comment):
    Most of the Ricochet podcasts would be happier, crowing about defeating those icky Trump supporters and saying ‘we told you so’.

    Wrong.

    Not wrong. They’d be busily scribbling about how they would lead the rebuild of the “real” Republican Party, at some undefined future time.

    Nonsense. And I’m not entirely sure why so many people feel the need to rag on folks they disagree with in this manner. “person X disagrees with me, therefore I’ll attribute the worst motives I can think of to that person all the time.” Seems if you feel that way about podcasts, don’t listen. Not sure why people seek to join the “smart, civil, center-right conversation,” and then troll the heck out of those who keep this website afloat.

    Isn’t that what a lot of people were saying while they predicted Trump’s defeat?  It was important to stop him to save conservatism. I wouldn’t expect “Happier”, but the crowing was already going on with all the polls predicting a massive defeat. They would certainly be talking about rebuilding conservatism and the Republican Party.

    • #33
  4. Paul DeRocco Member
    Paul DeRocco
    @PaulDeRocco

    It would be trans everything, 24/7.

     

    • #34
  5. Julie Snapp Coolidge
    Julie Snapp
    @JulieSnapp

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    One of my colleagues came in the next day and I could hear her crying in her cubicle all day.

    I suppose it’s unhealthy how much I enjoy tales of woe from the Left…

    #DenyHillaryAndBatheInHerTears

    Same here! I had taken a break from Facebook in the days leading up to the election because my leftist friends were getting unbearable. I had intended to take a break for an indeterminate amount of time afterwards as well. As my husband and I watched the election turn to Trump’s favor, I was logging in about 1AM just so I could see the lamentations. I almost felt like a terrible person but it was the best entertainment I’d had in years.

    • #35
  6. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    The thankfully counter-factual Clinton administration, would frankly be not that different from the sadly factual Obama’s:

    1 more “Under pants gnome” policies (Like 1> Bomb a dictator out of office. 2> ______________ 3> Stability in the middle east.)

    2 less American leadership, the gas attack that sparked Trump to use missiles in Syria, would have gone largely unnoticed by a Clinton administration (and unreported by a friendly media) as would continued missile tests in Iran and North Korea.

    3 Tax increases. Carbon tax, “Sin” taxes, estate taxes… every penny that could be pried from the people would be.

    4. Economic stagnation continues, soon America has a lost decade. Having spent trillions on economic stimulus to little effect. (other than enriching cronies, paying off union support, and co-opting “independent” NGOs) All those scary 80’s articles about Japan being America’s economic future, will come true, and be scary for entirely unforeseen reasons.

    5 Trust in media disappears. Stories like “wildfires in Oklahoma” or “Dam bursts in California” just dont make it into the news cycle anymore. After all its only 24/7, gotta make room to discuss that outrageous tweet from a dimwit. Less news about the real world, more time spent discussing less.

    6. SCOTUS would be stacked. Garland would still not be on the court, he’d be dumped for a “La Raza” radical (and unknown) law professor from California. 1,2 and 4th amendments virtually disappear – or are so distorted no rational person would recognize.

     

    • #36
  7. JcTPatriot Member
    JcTPatriot
    @

    Sorry, Pat, but I’m not going to bite. I’ll just say that the relief I felt, as Obama’s helicopter carried him away along with eight years of frustration and fear – that’s right, fear for the future of America – almost overwhelmed my emotions.

    We won, and I have seen on Ricochet that even those who do not feel affection for our new President still acknowledge it is a much better White House  than if the Cloud of Corruption that follows the Clintons everywhere had returned to the White House.

    I’ll add on that anything I could imagine at this point would probably not come close to how bad it would really be.

    • #37
  8. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    -word limit-

    7. Surveillance state becomes the norm. Political opponents, critics and independent thinkers are routinely hacked, tapped and leaked against. For both public shaming and framing.

    8. Police state emerges. local and state police agencies are federalized and militarized, middle America feels occupied. Redress of police misconduct becomes almost unheard of, abuses like Chicago’s Homan Square become common. Civil forfeiture becomes viral, to the point that driving through some bankrupt counties is dangerous – as the police may seize your car.

    9 Unified primaries. States are forced to unify the primary process, thus deny republicans, and 3rd parties access to the general election ballot. California already has this system, promoted as cost saving measure, it eventually becomes national.

    10. Bonds begin to fail. First Puerto Rico then a few counties, then entire states like Illinois can no longer make bond payments. The first few maybe bailed out. (Puerto Rico definitely will be) But soon the debts will be forceably restructured. Thankfully the government already has the precedent of the GM bankruptcy to rely on.

    Well if that dont cheer you up, I dont know whats wrong with y’all. Some of these things are happening anyway – I dont see how Trump can stop it all… But its just a thought experiment on how quickly an open society can be closed down.

     

    Take your freedoms seriously, and never foregranted.

    • #38
  9. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    One of my colleagues came in the next day and I could hear her crying in her cubicle all day.

    I suppose it’s unhealthy how much I enjoy tales of woe from the Left…

    #DenyHillaryAndBatheInHerTears

    I cried on election night too. Once it was clear that Trump had won, I was so happy – I had one of my best cries in years.

    • #39
  10. PHenry Inactive
    PHenry
    @PHenry

    Pat Sajak: What would a Hillary Clinton administration look like at this point?

    Unbridled, unashamed rampant corruption of all aspects of government.  Including, and particularly, the destruction of the opposition for the foreseeable future through the demonizing and criminalizing of speech and opinions deemed ‘hateful’ ( not liberal).

    But please don’t imply the election choice was binary, them are fightin’ words ’round these parts!

    • #40
  11. Stina Member
    Stina
    @CM

    Bishop Wash (View Comment):
    There’s a good question about how the foreign policy/military action would work out. There was some people pushing the idea that Hillary would be more of a hawk than Obama. Hard not to be. She wouldn’t have given her commanders free rein to do what they need to do, so no use of the MOAB.

    My issue with this line of reasoning is that we are pushing men into some idealized vision of femininity and women into masculinity. Just because Obama was a pansy doesn’t mean Clinton would have been.

    There is also historical analysis that shows female leaders are far more likely to go to war than male counterparts.

    I think WWIII would be more likely under Hillary.

    • #41
  12. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    Pat Sajak: So while we pause and try to catch our breath, here’s a question: What would a Hillary Clinton administration look like at this point?

    “If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face – forever.”

    • #42
  13. I Walton Member
    I Walton
    @IWalton

    “he has continued to enrage liberals; he has inspired marches replete with everything from vaginas to Form 1040s; he has caused major media outlets to explode with bile;”

    He hasn’t done this, they’re reacting to things rattling around in their heads and are being pointed by operatives and funders because they lost power and have to find ways to clammer back and reattach their shunts.  None of their issues are  real.  Conservatives may have legitimate worries because he isn’t a conservative, but liberals?

     

    What would a Hillary win have meant?  Continued decline and stagnation, exactly how it would unfold would have depended entirely on how opportunities for parasitism, rent seeking, and power building presented themselves.    We know how they behave but we cant know the future.

    • #43
  14. Phil Turmel Inactive
    Phil Turmel
    @PhilTurmel

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Quake Voter (View Comment):
    I see no policy differences between the two, or at least none that would justify nominating and supporting such a … yeah, that whole line is pretty risible, right?

    …in hindsight.

    … for those caught in the elite bubble.  Fortunately, ~90% of Republicans and substantial numbers of independents not only weren’t caught in any bubble, but had the foresight to make this particular debate possible.

    • #44
  15. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Arjay (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Bishop Wash (View Comment):
    Most of the Ricochet podcasts would be happier, crowing about defeating those icky Trump supporters and saying ‘we told you so’.

    Wrong.

    Not wrong. They’d be busily scribbling about how they would lead the rebuild of the “real” Republican Party, at some undefined future time.

    Maybe. But the part about them being “happier” that Hillary won is wrong. At worst they’d be saying it’s a tragedy and blaming the Trumpists for trying to shove the least electable candidate down our throats. The fact that we were proven wrong on some (but by no means all) of our concerns has no relevance to the information we had at the time.

    But I’m done trying to explain this. The inability/refusal of Trumpists to accept that a person could have believed that both Trump and Hillary were unacceptable at the time can’t be explained through anything other than bad faith at this point.

    • #45
  16. Remodern America Inactive
    Remodern America
    @RemodernAmerica

    America would be drowning in waves of illegal aliens after she announced permanently open borders

    • #46
  17. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Quake Voter (View Comment):

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    Quake Voter (View Comment):
    I see no policy differences between the two, or at least none that would justify nominating and supporting such a … yeah, that whole line is pretty risible, right?

    …in hindsight.

    No Umbra. It was all there in front of your nose on November 8. [redacted]

    Yes, we had the word of a life long New York Democrat who said some nice things but had no record of actually doing anything. Okay, he kept some of his promises, and in hindsight he turned out to be more trustworthy than we thought, but we had no way of knowing any of this would happen during the campaign.

    It must be nice to be so able to trust politicians so readily. Personally, I stopped doing that when I was 15.

    • #47
  18. danok1 Member
    danok1
    @danok1

    Cato Rand (View Comment):
    He probably gets some extra points for unpredictability, but she’d get them back for sobriety,

    Probably shouldn’t use the word “sobriety” in reference to Hillary “Crown Royal” Clinton.

    • #48
  19. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    PHenry (View Comment):

    But please don’t imply the election choice was binary, them are fightin’ words ’round these parts!

    Were there more than two choices?

    Yes.

    Thus, not binary.

    • #49
  20. Umbra Fractus Inactive
    Umbra Fractus
    @UmbraFractus

    Phil Turmel (View Comment):

    … for those caught in the elite bubble. Fortunately, ~90% of Republicans and substantial numbers of independents not only weren’t caught in any bubble, but had the foresight to make this particular debate possible.

    I’ll say it before and I’ll say it again, if making $32K a year shuffling papers makes me “elite,” the word has no meaning.

    • #50
  21. PHenry Inactive
    PHenry
    @PHenry

    Umbra Fractus (View Comment):

    PHenry (View Comment):

    But please don’t imply the election choice was binary, them are fightin’ words ’round these parts!

    Were there more than two choices?

    Yes.

    Thus, not binary.

    As I said… ;)

    • #51
  22. Songwriter Inactive
    Songwriter
    @user_19450

    ctlaw (View Comment):

    Damocles (View Comment):
    I’ve always been intrigued by the premise of this book:

    https://www.amazon.com/Weapons-Choice-Axis-Time-Trilogy/dp/0345457137

    At the start of Australian author Birmingham’s stellar debut novel, a United Nations battle group, clustered around the U.S.S. Hillary Clinton (named after “the most uncompromising wartime president in the history of the United States”), is tasked in the year 2021 with stopping ethnic cleansing by an Islamist regime in Indonesia.

    I’ll take that as an excuse to watch this clip:

    One of the Zeros in that film was flown by an uncle of mine. The planes were owned operated by members of the Confederate Air Force.

    • #52
  23. Songwriter Inactive
    Songwriter
    @user_19450

    JcTPatriot (View Comment):
    Sorry, Pat, but I’m not going to bite. I’ll just say that the relief I felt, as Obama’s helicopter carried him away along with eight years of frustration and fear – that’s right, fear for the future of America – almost overwhelmed my emotions.

    We won, and I have seen on Ricochet that even those who do not feel affection for our new President still acknowledge it is a much better White House than if the Cloud of Corruption that follows the Clintons everywhere had returned to the White House.

    I’ll add on that anything I could imagine at this point would probably not come close to how bad it would really be.

    Agreed.  I generally like such thought exercises, but Pat’s proposal is too terrifying to imagine. I voted for Trump reluctantly. Despite his occasional missteps in office, I only have to remind myself that the alternative was to elect The Worst Candidate in the Known Universe, who would have brought along for the ride her slime ball husband, the Prince of Darkness.

    • #53
  24. Johnny Dubya Inactive
    Johnny Dubya
    @JohnnyDubya

    In the alternative reality:

    There is a smarmy press secretary who spins half-truths and lies, and the press eats it up.

    In contrast to MLK’s admonishment to judge a person based on the content of his character, the cabinet is carefully curated with regard to sex and ethnicity, with qualifications being a secondary consideration.

    President Rodham is asked hard-hitting questions such as, “What has most enchanted you about being president?”

    Chelsea is getting even more press, if such a thing is possible.

    Bill is chasing skirts. (That happens in every alternative reality.)

    • #54
  25. Front Seat Cat Member
    Front Seat Cat
    @FrontSeatCat

    More red lines would be crossed, and the world’s thugs would keep slaughtering, with no worries.

    Much bigger increases on entitlements and new ones created, like “free college”, where magic tuition money falls from the sky.

    Endless illegal immigrants continue pouring across the borders, including criminals, drug traffickers, etc.

    Large donations would pour into the Clinton Foundation just because…..

    Huma would turn the Lincoln Bedroom into a bed and breakfast.

    The media would be gushing about increased funding for more abortion clinics, crappy art, and the new multi-gender, multi-spouse marriage rules – what’s one more mother-in-law.

    More regulations would be added to business and energy sectors, taxes would go up, and the national debt would continue to skyrocket.

    New Supreme Court judges would pass muster if promising to always be politically  correct and legislate from the bench.

    Cyber threats would increase and military funding would decrease. Veteran Affairs would remain unimproved, and IRS would continue to discriminate.

    Inner cities would continue to decline and black lives wouldn’t really matter, especially in Chicago.

    Healthcare and drug costs would continue to skyrocket, where only the rich could afford to be healthy.

    Trump is only coming up on 90 days work, but at least he is attempting to tackle long standing problems that have brought our country down.

     

     

    • #55
  26. cirby Inactive
    cirby
    @cirby

    Johnny Dubya (View Comment):
    Bill is chasing skirts. (That happens in every alternative reality.)

    Nope – in a whole bunch of timelines, Bill drops dead suddenly (and inexplicably) the day after the Electoral College meets, and Hillary gets four solid years of “the strong but quietly suffering Widow Clinton” from the press, leading up to her second term after “you wouldn’t vote against a widow, would you?” becomes her campaign slogan in 2020.

    Then, when Hillary’s health problems catch up to her, “Vote for Chelsea, she’s an orphan” sweeps her into office in 2024 and 2028, until the next generation of Kennedy brats start becoming available in 2032. In 2040, they just say “the hell with it” and change back to royal titles, just in time for Chelsea’s children to seize the crown after the youngest female Kennedy fails to produce an heir on cue.

    • #56
  27. Throat Wobbler Mangrove Inactive
    Throat Wobbler Mangrove
    @ThroatWobblerMangrove

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    Same here! I had taken a break from Facebook in the days leading up to the election because my leftist friends were getting unbearable. I had intended to take a break for an indeterminate amount of time afterwards as well. As my husband and I watched the election turn to Trump’s favor, I was logging in about 1AM just so I could see the lamentations. I almost felt like a terrible person but it was the best entertainment I’d had in years.

    Facebook has remained utterly insufferable ever since the election.  Non-stop whining from the left.

    • #57
  28. Julie Snapp Coolidge
    Julie Snapp
    @JulieSnapp

    Throat Wobbler Mangrove (View Comment):

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    Same here! I had taken a break from Facebook in the days leading up to the election because my leftist friends were getting unbearable. I had intended to take a break for an indeterminate amount of time afterwards as well. As my husband and I watched the election turn to Trump’s favor, I was logging in about 1AM just so I could see the lamentations. I almost felt like a terrible person but it was the best entertainment I’d had in years.

    Facebook has remained utterly insufferable ever since the election. Non-stop whining from the left.

    I’d still rather see whining than crowing.

    • #58
  29. Richard O'Shea Coolidge
    Richard O'Shea
    @RichardOShea

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):

    Throat Wobbler Mangrove (View Comment):

    Julie Snapp (View Comment):
    Same here! I had taken a break from Facebook in the days leading up to the election because my leftist friends were getting unbearable. I had intended to take a break for an indeterminate amount of time afterwards as well. As my husband and I watched the election turn to Trump’s favor, I was logging in about 1AM just so I could see the lamentations. I almost felt like a terrible person but it was the best entertainment I’d had in years.

    Facebook has remained utterly insufferable ever since the election. Non-stop whining from the left.

    I’d still rather see whining than crowing.

    I have to be on Facebook for business reasons.  I wish I didn’t.

    I do block all stupid memes one at a time from political sites that get “shared”.  I am now down to only about twenty a day……..

    • #59
  30. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    cirby (View Comment):

    Bill is chasing skirts. (That happens in every alternative reality.)

    Nope – in a whole bunch of timelines, Bill drops dead suddenly (and inexplicably) the day after the Electoral College meets, and Hillary gets four solid years of “the strong but quietly suffering Widow Clinton” from the press, leading up to her second term after “you wouldn’t vote against a widow, would you?” becomes her campaign slogan in 2020.

    I had it figured for “Bill dies, and Hillary comes out as the first lesbian President”.

     

    • #60
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