Great Crash to Rival ’29?

 

howling-bear-head-tattoo-designThe good news, as Allister Heath puts it, is it’s not yet clear whether this is the beginning of a major recession. It could just be a major correction, right? (This debate has the feeling you have when you live in an earthquake-prone area and the ground rumbles. Was that a foreshock? Maybe the earth just relieved a little excess pressure and now it’ll be okay?)

The bad news is that I think he’s right about what would happen if there were another financial crash. I think it would sink capitalism for good and probably liberal democracy with it:

We are too fragile, fiscally as well as psychologically. Our economies, cultures and polities are still paying a heavy price for the Great Recession; another collapse, especially were it to be accompanied by a fresh banking bailout by the taxpayer, would trigger a cataclysmic, uncontrollable backlash.

The public, whose faith in elites and the private sector was rattled after 2007-09, would simply not wear it. Its anger would be so explosive, so-all encompassing that it would threaten the very survival of free trade, of globalisation and of the market-based economy. There would be calls for wage and price controls, punitive, ultra-progressive taxes, a war on the City and arbitrary jail sentences.

For fear of allowing extremist or populist parties through the door, mainstream politicians would end up adopting much of this agenda, with devastating implications for our long-term prosperity. Central banks, in desperation, would embrace the purest form of money-printing: they would start giving consumers actual cash to spend, temporarily turbo-charging demand while destroying any remaining respect for the idea that money needs to be earned.

History never repeats itself exactly, but the last time a recession was met by pure, unadulterated populism was in the Thirties, when the Americans turned a stock market crash and a series of monetary policy blunders into a depression. …

You can read the whole grim thing, which unfortunately I think is exactly right, and tell me whether you agree with his conclusion:

The sorry truth is that there is very little that governments can do at this stage, apart from battening down the hatches and hoping that central banks succeed in kicking our problems even further down the road.

Can you think of a better idea?

And what’s your theory about why the markets are doing this? Everyone has one, but there’s so little way of testing any of them that I’m thinking “animal spirits” is about as good an explanation as any. In other words, The Stock Market Wotan is Angry.

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  1. derek Inactive
    derek
    @user_82953

    Capitalism ended in 2008, so don’t worry about that. We are seeing the Chavez toilet paper shortages on a macro scale; a controlled market where prices are fixed creating secondary effects that prompt more policy interventions. With further cascading effects, which we are experiencing.

    There won’t be a revival of socialism. It will be Fergusonism, a kleptocracy where anything you have will be seized. Legally.

    I said to a friend the other day that we are witnessing the collapse of globalization. The only way things can work as currently organized is a roaring economy somewhere. The tide is going out and an amazing number of the best and brightest are exposed as naked. I am shocked at how poorly managed US corporations are. They need 4% growth and free money to cover for their blithering stupidity. There is a monoculture in thought with ideas and assumptions that only very intelligent highly educated people could have. And it is working as designed. To everyone’s chagrin.

    2008 was an opportunity to humiliate a nation, to force the questioning of faulty assumptions, to force the elites to justify their existence. The trillions from the Fed and Treasury enabled business as usual. This is the result.

    • #61
  2. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    David Sussman: Imagine if we taught kids (and reminded ourselves) how to navigate through challenge instead of blaming bogeymen. How many of those kids would turn into another Mark Cuban or Bill Gates?

    This deserves a standing ovation. :) :)

    • #62
  3. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    David Sussman:

    Fake John/Jane Galt:

    David Sussman: Yet the unsophisticated public are lead by shiny objects like Mexican financed border walls or pitchforks and torches being handed out at the corner of Wall Street and Broad. Even worse, most don’t care. We’re too busy fattening ourselves on TMZ and freedom fries.

    Why should they care? There is absolutely nothing they can do about it and they know it. They have to worry about how to keep their jobs and feed their family. The economy and the markets are for the rich, something they know they will never ever be.

    Assuming you are voicing their perspective, and not what truly is. People of all ages and socioeconomic status would do themselves well to learn that America’s movement (economic mobility) between classes are still the most versatile in the world, (tip of the hat to entrepreneurship). The numbers of people who will at at least one time in their lives enter the ‘upper class’ is unparalleled elsewhere.

    Which is just another way of saying shut up it is worse elsewhere.  So what and why should they care?  That is those people problem.  They are worried about their own.

    • #63
  4. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Claire Berlinski, Ed.:

    David Sussman: . I fear the biggest threat to capitalism is ourselves.

    So did FDR. I mean, that is why we got the New Deal.

    And there is the Ur, the genesis of the problem we have today.

    FDR took a run of the mill financial panic and turned it into the Great Depression.  We are still dealing with the damage he did to the Constitution and how we function as a Republic.

    • #64
  5. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Vance Richards:

    BrentB67:The most prescient comment on the thread courtesy of SoS:

    But as a result, market levels have been driven by policy forecasts rather than economic fundamentals

    This is the bane of our existence.

    I keep seeing headline like, “Dow down on strong jobs numbers” or “Yellen sees weakness in economy, markets surge.” It seems that rather than investing in companies, people are betting on what the Fed will do.

    Of course they are.  It’s what really matters.

    fedbalancesheet1

    It’s a trap.  The market is now addicted to the Fed cheap money heroin.  Even the threat of taking away the next fix is causing the market to shudder.

    • #65
  6. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Fake John/Jane Galt:

    David Sussman:

    Fake John/Jane Galt:

    David Sussman: Yet the unsophisticated public are lead by shiny objects like Mexican financed border walls or pitchforks and torches being handed out at the corner of Wall Street and Broad. Even worse, most don’t care. We’re too busy fattening ourselves on TMZ and freedom fries.

    Why should they care? There is absolutely nothing they can do about it and they know it. They have to worry about how to keep their jobs and feed their family. The economy and the markets are for the rich, something they know they will never ever be.

    Assuming you are voicing their perspective, and not what truly is. People of all ages and socioeconomic status would do themselves well to learn that America’s movement (economic mobility) between classes are still the most versatile in the world, (tip of the hat to entrepreneurship). The numbers of people who will at at least one time in their lives enter the ‘upper class’ is unparalleled elsewhere.

    Which is just another way of saying shut up it is worse elsewhere. So what and why should they care? That is those people problem. They are worried about their own.

    Yeah, we have a lot of mobility. And lately much of it is down.

    waiter bartender vs MFG LTMwaiter bartender vs MFG since 2007_0Full vs Part Time May_1_0_0part rate aug_1_0

    But lets mock the people who are concerned about immigration…

    foreign 2_0foreign 5_0

    • #66
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