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About Those Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Nominations
If this morning’s nominations for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Class of 2016 are any indication, rock isn’t quite dead. Not yet, anyway. But it does appear to be resting.
We could — and probably will — argue about whether the existence of such an institution is in itself a nullification of the spirit of rock’n’roll. I await your comments.
In the meantime, here — though precisely no one asked for it — is my take on each of the nominees.
- Chicago. I’m pretty sure that Chicago deserves this, but I feel sort of dirty for saying so. For me, their horn-heavy super hits of the ’70s were sort of overshadowed by their soft-rock turn in the ’80s (and Peter Cetera’s gloppish solo career), but okay. Chicago goes in.
- Cheap Trick. Not a top-tier rock band by any stretch. We could sink a lot of beers debating the relative merits of their two (or three) well-known songs, but this is a big stretch. Cheap Trick is a no.
- Deep Purple. Heavy metal hall of fame, yes. Rock and roll hall of fame, no. I ain’t turning off “Smoke on the Water” or “My Woman from Tokyo” if they come on the radio, but I could say the same about “Last Train to Clarksville.”
- The Cars. I can support this nomination unreservedly. The Cars were/are a solid band that sold a lot of records and broke through to a wide audience during the early days of MTV. Their well-crafted pop songs are still in heavy rotation on the radio and their influence on several generations of crafty rock tunesmiths is both real and ongoing.
- Chaka Khan. I don’t think I know enough about the Queen of Funk to judge for certain whether she belongs in the Hall. My gut says no. If you really think otherwise, I feel for you.
- Chic. Um, disco sucks. What are we talking about?
- The J.B.’s. James Brown’s original band has got to be the funkiest thing I can think of, but is it a rock and roll outfit? Naw — maybe — I guess so — I don’t know. Whatever. This is the kind of thing that makes record store geeks feel good about the world, so let them have it.
- Janet Jackson. This is a crime against three chords and the truth. What has become of us?
- Los Lobos. I know I’m supposed to like Los Lobos, but I don’t know how. Probably there is some desire among the powers-that-be to get some diversity in the hall, but this seems like a big stretch.
- Steve Miller. Yeah, okay. Since there’s no separate Folk Rock Hall of Fame, I guess the Gangster of Love goes in.
- N.W.A. Seriously, what are we doing here? As the kids say these days: I. Can’t. Even.
- Nine Inch Nails. Anything made mostly with computers shouldn’t be in the Hall. Period.
- The Smiths. This is a yes. Make that a hell yes. Influential. Successful. Poetic. Unique. Funny (at times — in a dark way). Guitar-driven. Maybe not for everyone, but The Smiths definitely belong in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
- The Spinners. Sure. Why not?
- Yes. I expect there to be some serious discussion on this. I’m not myself a fan of proggy noodling, but groups like Yes are a big deal to some. It’s a “no” from me, but I’m willing to hear your case.
Come at me, bros.
Published in Entertainment
The hall has been around long enough that it needs a pruning committee, say, every ten years or so, to take out the stinkers that have slipped through. And I agree with the comments that it should be the R&R Hall, not pop music hall or music that had some cachet when rock was developing. Patsy Cline was a great artist, but she shouldn’t be in the hall, especially when Grand Funk Railroad is not due to the pecksniff sensibilities of the nominating committees.
Careful now. Chicago gets little credit for practically inventing a whole new rock sound. And their early stuff was definitely rock – very sophisticated rock. As for their later stuff, I can’t fault a band for doing what they gotta do to not only survive, but to jump start a whole new career.
In my highly subjective personal opinion – and let’s face it it’s all subjective – the following bands from your list should be in;
All the rest…no
Top of my list is Chicago. Unbelievably prolific.
25 Or 6 To 4 and every Boomer’s favorite prom song,
Colour my world.
Ok, is Blue Oyster Cult or Kansas in the Hall? If not, should they be?
When I posted “River Deep, Mountain High” as the Saturday Night Classic, I don’t think there was one comment.
I would put both in before all of the bluegrass, rap, and soul artists that are in there.
Cheap Trick and Grand Funk deserve the nod solely for The Flame and We’re An American Band.
Kansas should be. Supertramp should be. The Moody Blues should be.
I think you can make a very strong case for Journey and Styx too.
If I had to pick five from that list it’d be:
I predict that if Janet Jackson doesn’t get in then someone will cry sexism because they let her brothers in.
Los Lobos will get in because of political correctness.
And I continue grinding my teeth over the fact that Duran Duran has yet to be nominated.
I have to agree. For all the attention they’ve received on “classic rock” stations, Led Zeppelin didn’t get a lot of airtime back in the day. Until “Stairway to Heaven,” LZ on pop radio was pretty much limited to “Whole Lotta Love.” People who followed blues-based rock (including me) loved them – particularly the first two albums – but they weren’t as prominent on pop radio as bands such as Deep Purple or even Steppenwolf, both of whom were more influential in hatching the “heavy metal” sound. In fact, Steppenwolf’s “Born to be Wild” is often considered to be the first metal song and it even includes the term “heavy metal thunder,” which is likely the origin of “heavy metal” (as it was called in my day) and later just “metal.”
Of course, alternative stations were playing other stuff, including LZ, Jethro Tull, Grateful Dead, Moby Grape, and on and on. Man, good times!
If we’re adding non-rock acts like NWA and Janet Jackson, we have to start looking at people like John Coltrane, Gram Parsons, Dick Dale, etc.
Rock acts not in the hall of fame:
Electric Light Orchestra
Supertramp
Dire Straits
T Rex
The Guess Who
Bad Company
The Pixies
Boston
J Geils Band
Joe Cocker
Blue Oyster Cult
Todd Rundgren
Carole King
Stevie Nicks
Foreigner
Jimmy Buffett
Ry Cooder
Pat Benatar
Diana Ross
Tina Turner
King Crimson
Eurythmics
Joe Walsh
Billy Idol
The Doobie Brothers
Ozzy Osborne
The Replacements
Herbie Hancock
Journey
Jane’s Addiction
I would put ALL those bands and people in before Janet Jackson. And how in the world does she jump the queue over Diana Ross??? Carole King’s ‘Tapestry’ is a masterpiece, and her songwriting credits seemingly include half the hits of the 1960’s adn 1970’s. Look at this list of songs, and tell me: How is she not in the hall of fame?
I think you (and the OP) have an overly narrow definition of “rock.” I’d put Dick Dale in there without a second thought.
In baseball, maybe 1 to 2 % of the players make it to the hall of fame. In rock and roll, over 90% of the bands with name recognition seem to make in in the hall. It’s ridiculous and not worth the paper it’s written on. Of those bands nominated for this year, only Chicago should probably be in the hall.
I wouldn’t induct Ms. Jackson, but I have to say: To Hell with three-chords-and-the-truth. The reason rock music is not taken seriously as an art form is because too many of its fans confuse lack of talent with “authenticity.” I cringe knowing that someday The White Stripes will be in the Hall of Fame.
At least Chic knew how to play their instruments.
Jack White is a very good guitar player, and a great songwriter and producer. He’s not eligible for the RRHOF yet, but if he was I would have no problem with his induction. And he pretty much was the White Stripes. Meg was just there for atmosphere, but her childish drumming fit perfectly with what he was trying to do at the time.
Los Lobos did the same long before Los Lonely Boys, have had a number of albums, and are much more than their Richie Valens cover.
guitars, drums and bass. not rock?
It would be so rich if The Smiths get nominated. Just to watch King Morrissey wiggle his way out of showing up unless the RRHofF promise his highness that they won’t serve meat. Plus, I would love to see the look on his face if he has to be in the same room as Johnny Marr.
BTW. I love The Smiths. They should be inducted!
Jack White played some of the freshest blues-based riffing this side of Led Zeppelin, and seems able to find high notes in places other guitar places don’t know exists. I burned a copy of their second album for someone one time, and I was told he had no idea Jack White could play slide guitar like this:
I would make the argument for both Chicago and Yes. I played in rock bands in the late 60s and early 70s, and although I was just a guitar noodler, other band members were serious musicians who played multiple instruments, including brass and woodwinds. They gravitated toward jazz and big band, and didn’t give rock much respect until Chicago came along. Unless you were around then, it’s hard to grasp how big Chicago were during the time period of their first few albums. For some time they were the highest paid band in rock (owing partly to the large number of band members). From their Wikipedia page:
“Second only to The Beach Boys in Billboard singles and albums chart success among American bands, Chicago is one of the longest-running and most successful rock groups, and one of the world’s best-selling groups of all time, having sold more than 100 million records.”
Similarly, Yes helped move rock into a new direction that fused rock with jazz and classical music. According to their Wikipedia page:
“Nine of their twenty studio albums have reached the top ten in either the UK or US, with two reaching number one in the UK. They have sold 13.5 million certified units in the US.”
Both of these bands came along at the end of the 60s when people were tiring of “golden age” rock and protest music and were looking for something more artistically challenging.
In defense of Los Lobos, I really like the album “How Will the Wolf Survive?” I’m not saying that a single album should mean a spot in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, but there is more to them than the La Bamba soundtrack.
Meanwhile, I was driving home from work with my Joan Jett Greatest Hits CD playing. She was inducted last year and I realized that of the 11 tracks on the album, more than half of the songs were covers. I like her, but it did raise some questions about the selection criteria.
And when will Weird Al be nominated? Totally serious.
Ozzy Osborne biting the head off a pigeon in front of a bunch of record producers is the most rock n’ roll thing ever and strong enough evidence to put him in the HOF alone. How is he not in the Hall???
It’s probably because Wierd Al has already gotten plenty of attention via another platform. Although it’s not a true “awards” event, he’s been recognized via the Dr. Demento show’s Funny Five (and other permutations) at least a hundred times. While I’m with you in spirit, I think Weird Al would find more satisfaction in getting an award from an organization which is more discriminating, and we both know that Dr. Demento is just that. <ahem>
Any other Dementites or Dementoids amongst the Ricochetti?
(Lest I forget the requested purpose for a reply, I’m all in for including Yes, and cannot believe that Pat Benatar isn’t already in.)
The Pop Music Hall of Fame During the Rock and Roll Era with Some Nods to Folk, Jazz, Country, Soul, Funk, Disco, Reggae, Punk, Hip Hop, Etc., Etc.
Might as well let everyone in.
So Chicago? Sure. Other jazz and jazzish acts are in–Charlie Christian, Miles Davis, and in a different vein, Steely Dan. Chicago had a lot of hits and a good sound.
Cheap Trick? Meh. But why not? If Live at Budokan qualifies, then Peter Frampton oughta be in for Frampton Comes Alive. Beastie Boys are in, and they sampled Live at Budokan. Dream Police is catchy.
Deep Purple? Frank Zappa is in, and DP sings about him in Smoke on the Water. Other hard rock acts are already in–Cream, Led Zeppelin.
The Cars? Absolutely! Add New Wave to the list.
Chaka Khan? Sure. Donna Summer is there.
Chic? Bee Gees, Earth Wind and Fire, Michael Jackson. Why not?
The J.B.s? The Famous Flames are in. Also Parliament/Funkadelic, Sly and Family Stone, Isaac Hayes, and Curtis Mayfield.
Janet Jackson? Why not? See Chaka Khan and Chic above.
Los Lobos? Absolutely! Some will say it’s a sop to the multi-cultural crowd, but this band is truly great! One of the best concerts I ever saw was NRBQ and Los Lobos featuring a surprise appearance of Iggy Pop singing Wooly Bully. Also Santana and Richie Valens (and probably others) are in as Hispanic artists. Speaking of which, Sam the Sham oughta be in.
Steve Miller? Meh. But since everyone else gets in, let him join the club. He has some catchy tunes like Jungle Love and Big Old Jet Airliner. If Cheap Trick, then Steve Miller.
NWA? See Grand Master Flash, Run DMC, Public Enemy, and the Beastie Boys. So yes.
Nine Inch Nails? Yes. Computers ought not to disqualify. All kinds of proto-computerized, synthesizer, electronic sounds and effects have gotten other bands in. In fact, Electronic music is underrepresented. Induct Kraftwerk, Neu!, Brian Eno, New Order. Radiohead and Stereolab too. Besides Johnny Cash is in, and he had a late hit with his cover of Hurt.
The Smiths? Yes. Of course. But so too should many other “post-punk” bands of a variety of styles–Husker Du, The Cure, Joy Division, New Order, Pixies.
The Spinners? The O’Jays are in. What about later R&B acts like The Commodores, Heatwave, The Gap Band, and Cameo? Why not?
Yes? It’s long delayed and Prog Rock is also underrepresented. Genesis is in. King Crimson, Jethro Tull, The Soft Machine should be too. And American style Prog Rock too–Styx, Boston, and Kansas.
Apart from others mentioned above Dire Straits, Supertramp, NRBQ, The Replacements, The Minutemen, Black Flag, Billy Idol, Journey, Ry Cooder, Willie Nelson, Waylon Jennings, Kris Kristofferson, etc.
So what the hell! Let ’em all in!
Here at the office we range from millennials to me (64), and not one person has heard of the Smiths.
I saw Yes in 1971, when they opened for Jethro Tull in Dallas – the only opening act I ever saw to be called back for multiple encores.
To me, it’s not about Weird Al getting satisfaction from the “Rock Establishment.” It’s about the “Rock Establishment” giving the man his due.
I’ve heard OF them, but can’t say that I’ve ever heard them.