“Weiter so, Kanzler Scholz”- Volodomir Zelenski

 

Forgive the German spellings. Big news out of Berlin this evening, courtesy of the Süddeutsche Zeitung:

In a sea change in its policy line to this point, the Federal Government decided on Saturday evening to supply the Ukrainian armed forces with 1,000 anti-tank weapons and 500 Stinger missiles from the inventory of the Bundeswehr in order to support the Ukrainian military. This was announced by government spokesman Steffen Hebestreit this evening. The weapons will be delivered to Ukraine as quickly as possible. “The Russian attack on Urkaine marks a turning point,” Chancellor Scholz explained. “It threatens the entire post-war order. In this situation, it is our duty to  support the Ukraine to the best of our ability in the defense against the invading army of Vladimir Putin.  Germany is on the side of Ukraine.”

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  1. TGA Inactive
    TGA
    @TGA

    Also just read this from Fox Business. I would be more certain if it were Germany itself announcing it, but this is a good sign that perhaps the Germans are reluctantly growing a spine.

    • #1
  2. Front Seat Cat Member
    Front Seat Cat
    @FrontSeatCat

    What country are you in? What is the mood there? This is good news.

    • #2
  3. TGA Inactive
    TGA
    @TGA

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):

    What country are you in? What is the mood there? This is good news.

    His bio says Central Texas.  I know Texans often consider themselves a different country.  ;-)  But his post sounds like his life has updated since the bio was written!

    • #3
  4. Hartmann von Aue Member
    Hartmann von Aue
    @HartmannvonAue

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):

    What country are you in? What is the mood there? This is good news.

    I live outside of Augsburg. The mood …is hard to break down, but heavy, somber, angry…I am a missionary of sorts, so my sample is skewed…also by living in a smaller large city and not in a larger city like Frankfurt or Munich. 

    • #4
  5. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    WOLVERINES!!!

    • #5
  6. Rōnin Coolidge
    Rōnin
    @Ronin

    The Great Adventure (View Comment):

    Also just read this from Fox Business. I would be more certain if it were Germany itself announcing it, but this is a good sign that perhaps the Germans are reluctantly growing a spine.

    That’s because the Germans are being dragged into this kicking and screaming.  As explained by NATO’s first Secretary General, Lord Ismay: the purpose of NATO was “to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans down.”  It has always been expected by our NATO partners that the U.S. would carry most of the load in any conflict with Russia.  When the old Soviet Union fall, Europe collectively sighed with relief and went into “one world government” building mode because the EU believed, as the title of Francis Fukuyama book proclaimed about the end of the Cold War, it was: The End of History and the Last Man.  But history never ends, and we can never seem to learn from it.

    So now we have a situation were the Russians want in, the Americans want out, and the Germans are not down and will have to pick up the slack.  Yes, I can imagine the German population is not very happy about this, given their past government positions on immigration, energy, economy, so on and so forth, which has not put them into a good position to respond, and now this.  As this article in the The American TFP proclaims: “The End of History Just Ended.”  

     

    • #6
  7. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Rōnin (View Comment):

    The Great Adventure (View Comment):

    Also just read this from Fox Business. I would be more certain if it were Germany itself announcing it, but this is a good sign that perhaps the Germans are reluctantly growing a spine.

    That’s because the Germans are being dragged into this kicking and screaming. As explained by NATO’s first Secretary General, Lord Ismay: the purpose of NATO was “to keep the Russians out, the Americans in, and the Germans down.” It has always been expected by our NATO partners that the U.S. would carry most of the load in any conflict with Russia. When the old Soviet Union fall, Europe collectively sighed with relief and went into “one world government” building mode because the EU believed, as the title of Francis Fukuyama book proclaimed about the end of the Cold War, it was: The End of History and the Last Man. But history never ends, and we can never seem to learn from it.

    So now we have a situation were the Russians want in, the Americans want out, and the Germans are not down and will have to pick up the slack. Yes, I can imagine the German population is not very happy about this, given their past government positions on immigration, energy, economy, so on and so forth, which has not put them into a good position to respond, and now this. As this article in the The American TFP proclaims: “The End of History Just Ended.”

    But on the plus side, Germany may be able to get away with just sending weapons for the Ukrainians to use themselves.

    • #7
  8. Jim McConnell Member
    Jim McConnell
    @JimMcConnell

    Good for Germany. It’s great that someone is standing constructively alongside a democracy under attack, instead of standing safely in the background wringing their hands.

    • #8
  9. Skyler Coolidge
    Skyler
    @Skyler

    I gotta admit I’m not a fan of Germany starting a war with Russia again.

    • #9
  10. E. Kent Golding Moderator
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked.   Better late than never, I guess.

    • #10
  11. DrewInWisconsin, Oik Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oik
    @DrewInWisconsin

    So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.

    Because I just don’t see Putin saying “Ah well, I guess that didn’t work,” and end the hostilities.

    • #11
  12. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked. Better late than never, I guess.

    They did get some before, it sounds like they’re being re-supplied now that it can be seen that they’re not just cutting and running like the Afghan military did.

    • #12
  13. Jim McConnell Member
    Jim McConnell
    @JimMcConnell

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik (View Comment):

    So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.

    Because I just don’t see Putin saying “Ah well, I guess that didn’t work,” and end the hostilities.

    Remember, the Russians failed in Afghanistan before we did.

    • #13
  14. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Jim McConnell (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik (View Comment):

    So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.

    Because I just don’t see Putin saying “Ah well, I guess that didn’t work,” and end the hostilities.

    Remember, the Russians failed in Afghanistan before we did.

    Except we “failed” the same way we “failed” in Vietnam, by leaving prematurely.  The Russian failure was different.

    • #14
  15. Skyler Coolidge
    Skyler
    @Skyler

    Jim McConnell (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik (View Comment):

    So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.

    Because I just don’t see Putin saying “Ah well, I guess that didn’t work,” and end the hostilities.

    Remember, the Russians failed in Afghanistan before we did.

    They didn’t really fail.  They won.  They left the Afghans to live there without them.  Everyone who ever tries conquers Afghanistan.  But there is no reason to stay so they eventually leave.  And the Afghans lose because they have to stay.  It’s a pathetic part of the globe and there’s no reason to live there.

    If someone told you that  you had to live in Afghanistan and you weren’t allowed to leave, would you consider that a good thing?  No one does.  Leaving means winning.  The only error the US made was in staying too long and leaving people there with the losers.

    • #15
  16. OmegaPaladin Moderator
    OmegaPaladin
    @OmegaPaladin

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik (View Comment):

    So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.

    Because I just don’t see Putin saying “Ah well, I guess that didn’t work,” and end the hostilities.

    Well, sending Ukraine weapons is not a problem.  Biden’s handlers know that getting into a fight with Russia is not popular outside of a fringe of the hawks.  (The whole rage at neocons is misplaced, honestly.  Victor Hanson and a lot of people who are respected on the Right supported the Iraq War.  It’s just that reasonable people can realize when a situation changes.   Others are still on Kristol meth)

    • #16
  17. Hartmann von Aue Member
    Hartmann von Aue
    @HartmannvonAue

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked. Better late than never, I guess.

    Agreed.

    • #17
  18. Rodin Member
    Rodin
    @Rodin

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked. Better late than never, I guess.

    Maybe the Taliban have a few to spare. Just say’n.

    • #18
  19. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    About as important-perhaps more so- is the German announcement that they will increase defense spending by 100B and exceed the 2% target (which previously they claimed would take about between 5 years to forever to achieve). The Germans are beginning to realize the danger Russia poses.

    • #19
  20. E. Kent Golding Moderator
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):
    Others are still on Kristol meth

    Brilliant.   Wish I had thought of it. 

    • #20
  21. E. Kent Golding Moderator
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    MiMac (View Comment):

    About as important-perhaps more so- is the German announcement that they will increase defense spending by 100B and exceed the 2% target (which previously they claimed would take about between 5 years to forever to achieve). The Germans are beginning to realize the danger Russia poses.

    I will believe it when I see it.  There have been promises and commitments before.

    • #21
  22. Unsk Member
    Unsk
    @Unsk

    So what is Senile Joe doing? Sending  small arms and armor? Hey that’l work Right? Nope. Imbecile. 

    We should be sending thousands of Blackwater mercenary troops with A-10 Warthogs , killer drones, tactical missiles  and maybe like 100 rail guns to shell the holy living crap out of the Ruskies. Make them pay. Dearly. 

    If Ukraine  can hold on, Belarus and Crimea are in trouble because the major Russian assaults came from there, and it will be open season on the Russkie collaborators there  from now on till eternity .  The Ukrainians will have long memories. These collaborators were ultimately complicit in the destruction of Ukraine. They have forever made their deadly bed and now they will have to sleep in it. 

    “So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.”

    When you  attack a country with little justification just restore your insane dreams of Empire, you need to be put down.

    We don’t have to put “boots on the ground” or directly confront the Russkies, but there are so many other military options open to use. The Russkie heavy armor has to stay on the roads because it is winter and if they try go off road they will get stuck in the mud. They are sitting ducks waiting to be plucked. So pluck them. 

    • #22
  23. Unsk Member
    Unsk
    @Unsk

    The military response of our Woke Military has been totally asinine. Time for them all to be courtmartialed and cashiered out of the military without pensions. 

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked.

    Great Point. One has to ask what the hell are these Generals thinking? A credible and competent military would have war-gamed this situation to the max well before hand and would have had multiple deadly responses lying in wait for the Russkies including sticking  military poison pills all  over the Ukraine for the Russkies to confront. 

    Republicans in Congress need to right now call these Clown Generals on the carpet to force a better response and to negate any celebratory credit grabbing from our Supreme Leader if things go  well in Ukraine.  

    • #23
  24. Rōnin Coolidge
    Rōnin
    @Ronin

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik (View Comment):

    So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.

    Because I just don’t see Putin saying “Ah well, I guess that didn’t work,” and end the hostilities.

    Vlad can’t back out now, he’s committed.

    • #24
  25. Clifford A. Brown Member
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):

    MiMac (View Comment):

    About as important-perhaps more so- is the German announcement that they will increase defense spending by 100B and exceed the 2% target (which previously they claimed would take about between 5 years to forever to achieve). The Germans are beginning to realize the danger Russia poses.

    I will believe it when I see it. There have been promises and commitments before.

    The Germans have a strong starting point, if they just started maintaining a portion of the massive fleet of air and land combat equipment they built through the last decade of the Cold War, and paying for training days, fuel, parts, and ammo.

    • #25
  26. Skyler Coolidge
    Skyler
    @Skyler

    Unsk (View Comment):

    So what is Senile Joe doing? Sending small arms and armor? Hey that’l work Right? Nope. Imbecile.

    We should be sending thousands of Blackwater mercenary troops with A-10 Warthogs , killer drones, tactical missiles and maybe like 100 rail guns to shell the holy living crap out of the Ruskies. Make them pay. Dearly.

    If Ukraine can hold on, Belarus and Crimea are in trouble because the major Russian assaults came from there, and it will be open season on the Russkie collaborators there from now on till eternity . The Ukrainians will have long memories. These collaborators were ultimately complicit in the destruction of Ukraine. They have forever made their deadly bed and now they will have to sleep in it.

    “So it looks like we’re going to get dragged into this sooner rather than later.”

    When you attack a country with little justification just restore your insane dreams of Empire, you need to be put down.

    We don’t have to put “boots on the ground” or directly confront the Russkies, but there are so many other military options open to use. The Russkie heavy armor has to stay on the roads because it is winter and if they try go off road they will get stuck in the mud. They are sitting ducks waiting to be plucked. So pluck them.

    1.  It wasn’t entirely stupid to not do anything until the Ukraine showed an ability to fight.  That’s a pretty normal response.
    2. “We” don’t send blackwater.  They aren’t the government, they are mercenaries and have nothing to do with our government.  Machiavelli explained quite clearly why no nation should ever rely on mercenaries, but regardless they are not ours to send anywhere.
    3. Providing arms at this point is not a bad idea, but it is certainly a provocative move on our part and Congress should debate it and vote on it.  We definitely do not want a direct involvement in the Ukraine.  We have very little to gain there, and we should be concentrating on Taiwan, where we do have a lot involved.
    • #26
  27. Jim McConnell Member
    Jim McConnell
    @JimMcConnell

    Unsk (View Comment):

    The military response of our Woke Military has been totally asinine. Time for them all to be courtmartialed and cashiered out of the military without pensions.

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked.

    Great Point. One has to ask what the hell are these Generals thinking? A credible and competent military would have war-gamed this situation to the max well before hand and would have had multiple deadly responses lying in wait for the Russkies including sticking military poison pills all over the Ukraine for the Russkies to confront.

    Republicans in Congress need to right now call these Clown Generals on the carpet to force a better response and to negate any celebratory credit grabbing from our Supreme Leader if things go well in Ukraine.

    With Austin and Milley in charge, they are making sure they have their diversity and equity quotas in order before they take any other actions.

    • #27
  28. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Jim McConnell (View Comment):

    Unsk (View Comment):

    The military response of our Woke Military has been totally asinine. Time for them all to be courtmartialed and cashiered out of the military without pensions.

    Weapons from Germany, and from the US, would have been much more useful BEFORE the Russians attacked.

    Great Point. One has to ask what the hell are these Generals thinking? A credible and competent military would have war-gamed this situation to the max well before hand and would have had multiple deadly responses lying in wait for the Russkies including sticking military poison pills all over the Ukraine for the Russkies to confront.

    Republicans in Congress need to right now call these Clown Generals on the carpet to force a better response and to negate any celebratory credit grabbing from our Supreme Leader if things go well in Ukraine.

    With Austin and Milley in charge, they are making sure they have their diversity and equity quotas in order before they take any other actions.

    If Milley is into equity, why aren’t they all generals like him?

    • #28
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