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With the election just about upon us, (hooray!) we strive to bring both points of view to the candidate. Representing the #NeverTrump position we’ve got Wisconsin talk radio show host Charlie Sykes, who takes us through his reasons for opposing Trump. On the other side, it’s Victor Davis Hanson, who makes his case with his usual clarity and logic. Fair and balanced, that’s what we are. Also, the Al Smith dinner, the impact of Wikileaks, and a recap of last week’s meet up in Manhattan. Personal to Mr. Charles Berry of St. Louis, MO: a hearty and happy 90th birthday, sir, and thanks for all the great tunes. Many more of both, please.
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Music from this week’s podcast: Too Much Monkey Business by Chuck Berry
The brand new opening sequence for the Ricochet Podcast was composed and produced by James Lileks.
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What you say is most certainly a possibility. The Nevers, I’m afraid, seem to be reluctant to ascribe blame to the Clinton campaign. It’s very confusing.
I’m not denying it’s possible, but Occam’s razor says these people are legit until proven otherwise.
I fail to see how Occam’s razor applies here ?
Well, as Cher was wont to say, cui bono, sonny.
The two theories are:
Option 1 is clearly the simpler theory. That doesn’t mean 2 is definitely wrong, but 2 requires more evidence to be accepted.
Does not the existence of a similar operation at Trump campaign events provide substantial support for option 2?
How are they similar? The strategy at the Trump events was for paid progressive toadies to yell at Trump supporters until Trump supporters lashed out with violence. There wasn’t any actual subterfuge, just a bet that those who they expected to behave poorly would behave poorly when provoked.
Are you suggesting that the DNC hired fake double-agent Trump supporters to beat up either planted or authentic anti-Trump protesters? Was it all theater? (Did the Trump rallies even actually occur?) And, further, that their motives were not simply to create an aura of violence but some kind of meta long-con?
And the internet strategy was to have hired progessive toadies spew racist/antisemetic garbage at never-Trumpers until they were confirmed in their belief that anyone (even Hillary) was an acceptable alternative to Trump.
But originally you said this:
What is the Trump campaign’s involvement in either strategy?(internet and campaign rallies) In both scenarios the malfeasance is coming from the other side against Trump.
Great job, now you’re given the DNC and their “community organizer” friends the blueprint to the old “fake double agent Trump supporter beating up the planted anti-Trump supporter” trick.
I think I’ve met a couple of those people in my travels.
Should have said targeting Trump campaign eventd.
**edit** didn’t read what I was responding to thoroughly enough. Decided to delete comment.
I know what Occam’s Razor is; thanks anyway. @Umbra (didn’t link) was referring to some specific incidences that have happened in the campaign.
Annefy dearest, I had to look it up. How is it that I attended all those years of college, have read thousands of books and didn’t know what it was? Maybe it was on one of those finals I stayed up all night to study for and promptly forgot. Since Google was invented, I find it’s no longer necessary to remember anything. :-)
Learned about Occam’s razor from reading Scott Adams (Dilbert) and Cecil Adams (The Straight Dope)
Raise your hand if you’ve spent more time on the internet than in college – that would be me ✋?
It’s probably close. My tombstone should read: “Work in progress, so much to learn, so little time.”
Well, since there’s been talk about agents, double agents, and a theory now about the Dems making mischief posing as alt-right hooligans, go ahead and throw this Politico story into the mix: “Breitbart coordinated with liberal activist and organizer who disrupted GOP primary campaign events” — to take out Marco Rubio and Ted Cruz. Enjoy.
What about when their commentary doesn’t disturb me? Isn’t that the more insidious case?
Bias is at least as much what is *not* reported as it is what is reported.
It can be. But, if the last 8 years have shown anything is that it becomes readily apparent that lies are being peddled as truth. Just one example, “Climate Change is the country #1 national security threat.” If this narrative doesn’t disturb people then we are worse off than imagined and maybe deserve to die as a Republic because of our own stupidity.
Excuses can always be made for not being vigilant. Most Americans understandably get fatigued by politics. It’s not a priority in their lives. Unfortunately as the federal government becomes more intrusive into every American’s life and is run by those with overt or cover socialist/share-the-wealth agendas, that should be more than enough reason to become more vigilant rather than less.
Jumping in here late, as I’m not done listening to the podcast, but I found both Sykes and VDH engaging and enlightening discussions. Here, in NC, VDH is almost enough to inspire what I’ll do in a few short weeks.
@victordavishanson,
A thousand times thank you for your passionate exposé of mystifying hypocrisy at NR. I thought I’d smelled this, but had carefully withheld judgement since I don’t have time to read everything there and thought I could easily have missed something exculpatory.
Dr. Miguelito Quixote Loveless ?
I won’t vote for Trump, but I admit that the fact that VDH and Thomas Sowell will vote for him gave me pause. Both men are beyond brilliant, and I ain’t. People whom I respect will vote for Trump because he’s not Hillary, and people I respect will vote for neither Trump nor Hillary. I agree with VDH that neither position is immoral.
We’ve been put in the impossible position of trying to divine which candidate will do the least damage to the country and the world. Make either one president and people will be hurt. Given the foreign mess that Obama is leaving behind, it’s likely that people will die. Elect Trump and these people are hurt and those die. Elect Hillary and those people are hurt and these die.
The fact that, “Who will do the least damage?” is the question is all I really need to know.
Cannot tell you how much I enjoyed and appreciated Victor Davis Hanson’s interview on this podcast. It was by far the most persuasive statement in favor of voting Trump I have heard to date. While I cannot bring myself to vote for Trump, I do have many friends I respect who plan to. Unfortunately, conservative Trump supporters and detractors too often assume the worst about one another and just name call or at best talk past each other. I am ashamed to say that I have done both this election cycle. It was refreshing to listen to a respectful conversation between people on either side of this decision. It is good to be reminded of what we share. I hope after the election those with conservative beliefs can bury the hatchet and once again make common cause.
The vocal #Never Trumps who have actively worked against the nominee on cable, through newspapers, magazines and social media, have made that just about impossible. It’s one thing to not support the nominee of your party because your guy didn’t win in the primaries, but it’s quite another thing to actively work against him to the point that it helps the other party. Don’t look for a Kumbaya moment when this election ends.
If we don’t hang together we will most assuredly hang separately. (B. Franklin)
Will this ridiculous meme never die?
Boy was I dead wrong about the outcome. And I’m guessing that I’m in the group on the outs…Michigan and Wisconsin; wow!