Historic Snooker

 

The headline writers adore the word “historic.” It was ubiquitous in reporting on the April meeting between Kim Jung Un and Moon Jae-in. Kim shook Moon’s hand and then guided him over the military demarcation line to step onto North Korean territory. This prompted swoons. What rot. If that was a bona fide gesture of peaceful intent, time will tell. In the meantime, let’s assume it was a stunt.

So too with the summit between Kim Jung Un and Donald Trump, though in this case the media hype couldn’t compete with Mr. Trump’s own. He has basked in talk of a Nobel Peace Prize and predicted that he and the butcher of Pyongyang were “going to have a great discussion and a terrific relationship.” Obviously panting for a meeting, Trump was reportedly livid with National Security Advisor John Bolton, whose May comments about a “Libya solution” to the nuclear weapons problem apparently spooked Kim into withdrawing from the summit. Trump insisted that it was he who canceled, just as he did with the Philadelphia Eagles’ White House visit.

But he showed quite a lot of ankle in his note. “I felt a wonderful dialogue was building up between you and me,” he cooed, closing with words conceding that it was Kim, not Trump, who had actually canceled. “If you change your mind having to do with this most important summit, please do not hesitate to call me or write.” Kim reeled in his catch. He sent an oversized letter Trump could pose with, grinning like a winner of the Publishers Clearing House sweepstakes.

Why is our president smiling? You can always argue that democratic leaders must treat with dictators and even villains of various stripes for the sake of winning a war or securing the peace. You can even argue that sometimes presidents flatter unsavory leaders to build trust and ease tensions. But no historical comparisons can illuminate Trump’s ricochets between hysterical threats (“fire and fury”) and pusillanimous praise (“very talented”) without any substantive change on the part of the dictator. What has changed since the State of the Union address in which Trump honored the memory of Otto Warmbier and detailed the atrocities of the North Korean regime? In gratitude for the exchange of pleasantries, the release of a few hostages, and vague offers of “denuclearization” Trump has made himself Kim’s doormat.

As a matter of substance, the Singapore summit achieved less than nothing. It was a profound defeat for U.S. world influence and for democratic decency, arguably the worst summit outcome since Yalta. Kim promised to consider “denuclearization,” exactly as his father and grandfather had done repeatedly over the past several decades – breaking their promises each and every time. For this puff of cotton candy, Trump agreed to halt “U.S. war games” (using the North Korean term for joint military exercises with South Korea) which Trump himself called provocative! He invited Kim to the White House. He also issued the risible tweet announcing, ahem, peace in our time: “There is no longer a nuclear threat from North Korea.”

It’s difficult to determine just how stupid Trump thinks the American people are. But there is no question that Trump’s affection for strongmen and thugs, evident before in his praise of the Chinese murderers of Tiananmen, and his warm words for Putin, Duterte, and Xi, has now extended to the worst tyrant/killer on the planet. Trump did far more than overlook Kim’s atrocious human rights abuses, he became Kim’s PR man.  “he’s a very talented man and I also learned he loves his country very much.” He has a “great personality” and is “very smart.”

Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy: “His country does love him. His people, you see the fervor. They have a great fervor.”

In 2014, a United Nations report concluded that North Korea’s crimes against humanity “entail extermination, murder, enslavement, torture, imprisonment, rape, forced abortions and other sexual violence, persecution on political, religious, racial and gender grounds, the forcible transfer of populations, the enforced disappearance of persons and the inhumane act of knowingly causing prolonged starvation.”

What of all that? Trump is understanding, even impressed. “Hey, he’s a tough guy. When you take over a country — a tough country, tough people — and you take it over from your father, I don’t care who you are, what you are, how much of an advantage you have. If you can do that at 27 years old, I mean, that’s one in 10,000 that could do that. So he’s a very smart guy. He’s a great negotiator.”

What was Trump’s chief argument in 2016? The U.S. had been the victim of “bad deals,” with other countries and he was the great deal maker. He fingered the Iran deal as the worst deal in history. His defenders will excuse the truckling to Kim as a clever gambit to extract concessions. But Kim has offered absolutely nothing. All of the concessions have come from the United States, including the most crucial one – we’ve put ourselves on the same moral plane as North Korea. That’s what Make America Great Again has achieved.

Published in Foreign Policy
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  1. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Kevin Schulte (View Comment):
    I am amazed you can’t see that the details were worked out long in advance of this summit.

    And I am amazed – not necessarily surprised – that you cannot (or refuse to) see the difference between criticizing that a summit has taken place, and the aftermath. Leaders have summits. It is the disgusting way Mr. Trump chose to ingratiate himself in the wake of that get together. Kim had an American citizen killed called for stealing a poster; he starves his people; he even murdered his own family members. You are completely muddying the waters if you can’t see that it is the language that Trumps used to flatter this ruthless and evil man that people like Mona and I, and others, take exception to, not the  summit itself.

    Kevin Schulte (View Comment):

    Does anybody remember

    Pootie-Poot

    I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy. We had a very good dialogue. I was able to get a sense of his soul

    GW

    I may be wr0ng, but I think Bush said he was wrong. And the worse you can say about it is Bush was idiocally carried away. He is a good man, who made a huge mistake in this case. But he never said that Putin didn’t do bad things. You just can’t excuse Trump, and it is folly to try.

    • #61
  2. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    I’m not sure what to make of the Trump/North Korea meeting.

    How do you fault Trump for attempting to make the world safer from nuclear war (…besides it appears the most interested party South Korea wants some sort of “peace” with the Norks).

    At the same time how to you make nice with a totalitarian murderous regime.

    But one thing is clear, getting a down the middle unbiased analysis from Mona Charen is not going to happen.

    Mona’s analysis was spot on, and I am at pains to understand how any but the already predisposed Mona-haters cannot see it.

    I don’t hate Mona, but it is apparent to most dispassionate observers that since the Republican nomination and election of 2016, Donald Trump has taken up permanent residence in poor Mona’s cranium.

    This kind of condescension is even worse than hatred.

    • #62
  3. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    “He is the strong head. Don’t let anyone think anything different. He speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” President Donald Trump on Kim Jong Un.

    Disgusting!

    • #63
  4. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    While it is too soon to assess exactly what will come of this, Mona got it right, as she usually does. There was absolutely no reason for Trump to gush like a school girl – as Valiuth put it – over this evil little runt. Has Trump no dignity – or decency? The man is a murderer, pure and simple. We may have to wait to see the final results of this, but our leader’s behavior does not give hope. If Obama had acted this way, the same people praising Trump would be crying impeachment.

    Obama did behave this way with the Iranians and there was no cry for impeachment …. of course Obama’s two terms were nearly complete at the time he gave $$Billions$$ (in exchange for 10 years of pretending to not be developing nukes) to the worlds chief sponsor of terror ….. so why bother with impeaching a guy as he’s walking out the door.

    My point was and is that our side never let up on Obama for his horribles actions. Now Trump does even worse, and is lionized by some.

    • #64
  5. Skyler Coolidge
    Skyler
    @Skyler

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    While it is too soon to assess exactly what will come of this, Mona got it right, as she usually does. There was absolutely no reason for Trump to gush like a school girl – as Valiuth put it – over this evil little runt. Has Trump no dignity – or decency? The man is a murderer, pure and simple. We may have to wait to see the final results of this, but our leader’s behavior does not give hope. If Obama had acted this way, the same people praising Trump would be crying impeachment.

    Obama did behave this way with the Iranians and there was no cry for impeachment …. of course Obama’s two terms were nearly complete at the time he gave $$Billions$$ (in exchange for 10 years of pretending to not be developing nukes) to the worlds chief sponsor of terror ….. so why bother with impeaching a guy as he’s walking out the door.

    My point was and is that our side never let up on Obama for his horribles actions. Now Trump does even worse, and is lionized by some.

    Worse?

    • #65
  6. Kevin Schulte Member
    Kevin Schulte
    @KevinSchulte

    George do you really believe the President got historically snookered ?

    Other than his over the top rhetoric to Kim.

    • #66
  7. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Kevin Schulte (View Comment):

    George do you really believe the President got historically snookered ?

    Other than his over the top words to Kim.

    To quote the third greatest President in our history: “There you go again.” I never said, nor implied, that he got snookered. It is a judgment that needs time to determine. What I say is that his words (which it is generous to call over the top) will, in my judgment, do nothing to reform North Korea. Evil does not change because of nice words, and Trump is showing his none-understanding of the world by thinking they can.

    • #67
  8. EDISONPARKS Member
    EDISONPARKS
    @user_54742

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    I’m not sure what to make of the Trump/North Korea meeting.

    How do you fault Trump for attempting to make the world safer from nuclear war (…besides it appears the most interested party South Korea wants some sort of “peace” with the Norks).

    At the same time how to you make nice with a totalitarian murderous regime.

    But one thing is clear, getting a down the middle unbiased analysis from Mona Charen is not going to happen.

    Mona’s analysis was spot on, and I am at pains to understand how any but the already predisposed Mona-haters cannot see it.

    I don’t hate Mona, but it is apparent to most dispassionate observers that since the Republican nomination and election of 2016, Donald Trump has taken up permanent residence in poor Mona’s cranium.

    This kind of condescension is even worse than hatred.

    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    In all fairness to Mona, her TDS is less severe as compared to other conservatives  (Rick Wilson, Ralph Peters, Bill Kristol, Charlie Sykes, to name a few) whom I also sincerely like … other than their skewed analysis of anything Trump.

    And I freely agree Trump is many of the things those who dislike him proclaim.   My critique of those TDS stricken conservatives is:   OK …. Trump bad….. now what?

    What is TDS end game.

    Once I concur with your Trump is bad analysis what do I do with it?

    My take on Trump is to get as much conservative(or not Lefty) administrative and legislative reform as is possible until the elective pendulum swings the other way, which it inevitably will, with or without Trump.

    • #68
  9. DrewInWisconsin Member
    DrewInWisconsin
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Mona Charen: Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy

    This essentially a meaningless criticism. It’s what you complain about when you have nothing else.

    • #69
  10. Kevin Schulte Member
    Kevin Schulte
    @KevinSchulte

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Kevin Schulte (View Comment):

    George do you really believe the President got historically snookered ?

    Other than his over the top words to Kim.

    To quote the third greatest President in our history: “There you go again.” I never said, nor implied, that he got snookered. It is a judgment that needs time to determine. What I say is that his words (which it is generous to call over the top) will, in my judgment, do nothing to reform North Korea. Evil does not change because of nice words, and Trump is showing his none-understanding of the world by thinking they can.

    Well, I went there again because of what I thought you said.

    While it is too soon to assess exactly what will come of this, Mona got it right, as she usually does. 

    The title of Moana’s piece was 

    Historic Snooker

    You can’t have it both ways. However, you have made yourself clear.

    Hope you can see how I misunderstood you.

     

    • #70
  11. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):
    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    I happen to think that condescension is worse than hatred. If you’d think about it, you’d realize I am right. If you ever say anything like that I should get a hold  of my senses again, I will be gone!

    To answer the rest of the statement: If enough people were like me, Trump might realize he is going down an incendiary path. Of course he probably wouldn’t, but we need his conservative critics to remind that our ideology is about more than just policy.

    • #71
  12. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Mona Charen: Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy

    This essentially a meaningless criticism. It’s what you complain about when you have nothing else.

    Why? 

    • #72
  13. DrewInWisconsin Member
    DrewInWisconsin
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Franco (View Comment):

    Never Trump Republicans have to be the most ineffective people I’ve ever encountered. They have one playbook. Take the moral high ground and wag a gigantic finger at those below. Always parading themselves and our country as some kind of pillar of virtue that can shame their opponents into compliant awe.

    They do this in elections and lose, and they do it with foreign policy and lose. 

    • #73
  14. DrewInWisconsin Member
    DrewInWisconsin
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Mona Charen: Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy

    This essentially a meaningless criticism. It’s what you complain about when you have nothing else.

    Why?

    The left would prefer that all of those out of favor are treated like non-persons. You must shun! And if you don’t, it’s guilt-by-association. They leave no room for constructive engagement, because that grants “legitimacy.” Jimmy Kimmel interviews the President and the left cries “Oh noes! He granted him legitimacy!” The President met with Li’l Kim and that gave him “legitimacy.” It doesn’t mean anything. “Legitimacy.” What is Kim gonna do with that? Spend it on hookers and blow? 

     

    • #74
  15. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Mona Charen: Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy

    This essentially a meaningless criticism. It’s what you complain about when you have nothing else.

    Why?

    The left would prefer that all of those out of favor are treated like non-persons. You must shun! And if you don’t, it’s guilt-by-association. They leave no room for constructive engagement, because that grants “legitimacy.” Jimmy Kimmel interviews the President and the left cries “Oh noes! He granted him legitimacy!” The President met with Li’l Kim and that gave him “legitimacy.” It doesn’t mean anything. “Legitimacy.” What is Kim gonna do with that? Spend it on hookers and blow?

     

    Consolidate his power internally in his own country through propaganda. Use it to engage more broadly with other countries in the world.

    There’s a reason many of us criticized Obama for meeting with the leadership of Cuba or Iran with no preconditions. I’m taking a wait and see approach on this event since it could still work out, but lets not pretend that this isn’t something we found fault with the previous administration. 

    • #75
  16. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Kevin Schulte (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Kevin Schulte (View Comment):

    George do you really believe the President got historically snookered ?

    Other than his over the top words to Kim.

    To quote the third greatest President in our history: “There you go again.” I never said, nor implied, that he got snookered. It is a judgment that needs time to determine. What I say is that his words (which it is generous to call over the top) will, in my judgment, do nothing to reform North Korea. Evil does not change because of nice words, and Trump is showing his none-understanding of the world by thinking they can.

    Well, I went there again because of what I thought you said.

    While it is too soon to assess exactly what will come of this, Mona got it right, as she usually does.

    The title of Moana’s piece was

    Historic Snooker

    You can’t have it both ways. However, you have made yourself clear.

    Hope you can see how I misunderstood you.

    Glad you are being reasonable, Kevin.

    For the record, I do not remember if Mona used to the word in her column. She does not write them for Ricochet. It is a syndicated column that goes out to numerous newspapers (I forget the number; hundreds I think). Others put that name to the column. I am not sure she would have used “snookered”.

    • #76
  17. EDISONPARKS Member
    EDISONPARKS
    @user_54742

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):
    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    I happen to think that condescension is worse than hatred. If you’d think about it, you’d realize I am right. If you ever say anything like that I should get a hold of my senses again, I will be gone!

    To answer the rest of the statement: If enough people were like me, Trump might realize he is going down an incendiary path. Of course he probably wouldn’t, but we need his conservative critics to remind that our ideology is about more than just policy.

    The “grab hold of your senses” was meant in jest to make light of your “worse than hatred” because it is in fact way overstated.

    I believe the Trump Presidency to date illustrates how conservative pro-growth policy can succeed without regard to the character of the individual who administers the policy.   Lower taxes, less regulation, and policy which encourages the harvesting and production of fossil fuels will in fact produce economic growth no matter which party is in office or which individual is the sitting President.

    • #77
  18. Hoyacon Member
    Hoyacon
    @Hoyacon

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    “He is the strong head. Don’t let anyone think anything different. He speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” President Donald Trump on Kim Jong Un.

    “I’m kidding!” the president said. “You don’t understand sarcasm!”  President Donald Trump, a bit later.

    • #78
  19. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    “He is the strong head. Don’t let anyone think anything different. He speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” President Donald Trump on Kim Jong Un.

    “I’m kidding!” the president said. “You don’t understand sarcasm!” President Donald Trump, a bit later.

    Sure he did. 

    • #79
  20. Hoyacon Member
    Hoyacon
    @Hoyacon

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    “He is the strong head. Don’t let anyone think anything different. He speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” President Donald Trump on Kim Jong Un.

    “I’m kidding!” the president said. “You don’t understand sarcasm!” President Donald Trump, a bit later.

    Sure he did.

    Pardon me for filling out the picture.  And for lacking your power to read minds.

     

    • #80
  21. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    “He is the strong head. Don’t let anyone think anything different. He speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” President Donald Trump on Kim Jong Un.

    “I’m kidding!” the president said. “You don’t understand sarcasm!” President Donald Trump, a bit later.

    Sure he did.

    Pardon me for filling out the picture. And for lacking your power to read minds.

     

    I mean it’s not like he’s heaped obsequious praise on dictators before…

    • #81
  22. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    Trump on President Xi of China: “He’s an incredible guy. You know, essentially president for life. That’s pretty good.”

    Trump on Putin: “He’s running his country and at least he’s a leader, unlike what we have in this country. I think our country does plenty of killing also, Joe, so you know. There’s a lot of stupidity going on in the world right now, a lot of killing going on, a lot of stupidity.”

    Trump on Putin: “If he says great things about me, I’m going to say great things about him. I’ve already said, he is really very much of a leader. I mean, you can say, ‘Oh, isn’t that a terrible thing’—the man has very strong control over a country. Now, it’s a very different system, and I don’t happen to like the system. But certainly, in that system, he’s been a leader, far more than our president has been a leader.”

    Trump on Rodrigo Duarte: “I just wanted to congratulate you because I am hearing of the unbelievable job on the drug problem.” (the unbelievable job he’s talking about is the extra-judicial murders of suspected drug users and dealers)

    Trump on Erdogan: “Frankly, he’s getting very high marks. He’s also been working with the United States. We have a great friendship and the countries—I think we’re right now as close as we’ve ever been … a lot of that has to do with a personal relationship.”

    Trump on al-Sissi: “We agree on so many things. I just want to let everybody know in case there was any doubt that we are very much behind President el-Sisi. He’s done a fantastic job in a very difficult situation. We are very much behind Egypt and the people of Egypt. The United States has, believe me, backing, and we have strong backing.” (a man currently committing human rights abuses in his own country after seizing power in a coup)

    Oh and then there’s this: 

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/703900742961270784 

    • #82
  23. DrewInWisconsin Member
    DrewInWisconsin
    @DrewInWisconsin

    I find the common argument that no President from Eisenhower to Obama has ever agreed to meet with North Korean leadership! unpersuasive. Is “business as usual” what we want? If we feel that no progress is being made, should we continue to take the same approach? How has this helped? It hasn’t. The situation has worsened.

    I’m sure that a constant state of agitation with NK benefits someone, but I’m not convinced it benefits us. So why not try a different approach? Why not engage? We can’t do worse than we’ve already done, which is nothing. And doing nothing has gotten us to the point where the Norks are developing Nukes.

    What’s the argument for following the same path that got us here?

     

    • #83
  24. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):
    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    I happen to think that condescension is worse than hatred. If you’d think about it, you’d realize I am right. If you ever say anything like that I should get a hold of my senses again, I will be gone!

    To answer the rest of the statement: If enough people were like me, Trump might realize he is going down an incendiary path. Of course he probably wouldn’t, but we need his conservative critics to remind that our ideology is about more than just policy.

    The “grab hold of your senses” was meant in jest to make light of your “worse than hatred” because it is in fact way overstated.

    I believe the Trump Presidency to date illustrates how conservative pro-growth policy can succeed without regard to the character of the individual who administers the policy. Lower taxes, less regulation, and policy which encourages the harvesting and production of fossil fuels will in fact produce economic growth no matter which party is in office or which individual is the sitting President.

    I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person, which is your right.

    By the way, to believe that condescension is worse than hatred  is a well thought-out formulation, which indicats the ability to think about things in a more than superficial way. Because you disagree with it is no reason to make fun of it. It speaks volumes about you.

    Have a g00d life.

    • #84
  25. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Mona Charen: Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy

    This essentially a meaningless criticism. It’s what you complain about when you have nothing else.

    Why?

    The left would prefer that all of those out of favor are treated like non-persons. You must shun! And if you don’t, it’s guilt-by-association. They leave no room for constructive engagement, because that grants “legitimacy.” Jimmy Kimmel interviews the President and the left cries “Oh noes! He granted him legitimacy!” The President met with Li’l Kim and that gave him “legitimacy.” It doesn’t mean anything. “Legitimacy.” What is Kim gonna do with that? Spend it on hookers and blow?

     

    Consolidate his power internally in his own country through propaganda. Use it to engage more broadly with other countries in the world.

    Because Kim was aaaaaaaaaalmost going to be overthrown before Trump came and ruined everything! 

    • #85
  26. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    I find the common argument that no President from Eisenhower to Obama has ever agreed to meet with North Korean leadership! unpersuasive. Is “business as usual” what we want? If we feel that no progress is being made, should we continue to take the same approach? How has this helped? It hasn’t. The situation has worsened.

    I’m sure that a constant state of agitation with NK benefits someone, but I’m not convinced it benefits us. So why not try a different approach? Why not engage? We can’t do worse than we’ve already done, which is nothing. And doing nothing has gotten us to the point where the Norks are developing Nukes.

    What’s the argument for following the same path that got us here?

    Quite right. 

    Conservatives reasonably – even notoriously – prefer to follow old paths, but even the most hidebound person will eventually realize that tried-and-failed is not the same as tried-and-true. 

    Long-term problems require either experimentation or acceptance of failure. 

    • #86
  27. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    TBA (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Jamie Lockett (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Mona Charen: Trump granted Kim’s legitimacy

    This essentially a meaningless criticism. It’s what you complain about when you have nothing else.

    Why?

    The left would prefer that all of those out of favor are treated like non-persons. You must shun! And if you don’t, it’s guilt-by-association. They leave no room for constructive engagement, because that grants “legitimacy.” Jimmy Kimmel interviews the President and the left cries “Oh noes! He granted him legitimacy!” The President met with Li’l Kim and that gave him “legitimacy.” It doesn’t mean anything. “Legitimacy.” What is Kim gonna do with that? Spend it on hookers and blow?

     

    Consolidate his power internally in his own country through propaganda. Use it to engage more broadly with other countries in the world.

    Because Kim was aaaaaaaaaalmost going to be overthrown before Trump came and ruined everything!

    Whew, it’s a good thing I didn’t say that…

    • #87
  28. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):
    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    I happen to think that condescension is worse than hatred. If you’d think about it, you’d realize I am right. If you ever say anything like that I should get a hold of my senses again, I will be gone!

    To answer the rest of the statement: If enough people were like me, Trump might realize he is going down an incendiary path. Of course he probably wouldn’t, but we need his conservative critics to remind that our ideology is about more than just policy.

    The “grab hold of your senses” was meant in jest to make light of your “worse than hatred” because it is in fact way overstated.

    I believe the Trump Presidency to date illustrates how conservative pro-growth policy can succeed without regard to the character of the individual who administers the policy. Lower taxes, less regulation, and policy which encourages the harvesting and production of fossil fuels will in fact produce economic growth no matter which party is in office or which individual is the sitting President.

    I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person, which is your right.

    By the way, to believe that condescension is worse than hatred is a well thought-out formulation, which indicats the ability to think about things in a more than superficial way. Because you disagree with it is no reason to make fun of it. It speaks volumes about you.

    Have a g00d life.

    Is ‘I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person,’ the sort of thing you want to write on the same thread that you stated your belief that condescension is worse than hatred? 

    • #88
  29. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    TBA (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):
    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    I happen to think that condescension is worse than hatred. If you’d think about it, you’d realize I am right. If you ever say anything like that I should get a hold of my senses again, I will be gone!

    To answer the rest of the statement: If enough people were like me, Trump might realize he is going down an incendiary path. Of course he probably wouldn’t, but we need his conservative critics to remind that our ideology is about more than just policy.

    The “grab hold of your senses” was meant in jest to make light of your “worse than hatred” because it is in fact way overstated.

    I believe the Trump Presidency to date illustrates how conservative pro-growth policy can succeed without regard to the character of the individual who administers the policy. Lower taxes, less regulation, and policy which encourages the harvesting and production of fossil fuels will in fact produce economic growth no matter which party is in office or which individual is the sitting President.

    I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person, which is your right.

    By the way, to believe that condescension is worse than hatred is a well thought-out formulation, which indicats the ability to think about things in a more than superficial way. Because you disagree with it is no reason to make fun of it. It speaks volumes about you.

    Have a g00d life.

    Is ‘I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person,’ the sort of thing you want to write on the same thread that you stated your belief that condescension is worse than hatred?

    What is the connection?

    • #89
  30. livingthenonScienceFictionlife Inactive
    livingthenonScienceFictionlife
    @livingthehighlife

    TBA (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    EDISONPARKS (View Comment):
    Please …. “worse than hatred” …. grab hold of your senses man.

    I happen to think that condescension is worse than hatred. If you’d think about it, you’d realize I am right. If you ever say anything like that I should get a hold of my senses again, I will be gone!

    To answer the rest of the statement: If enough people were like me, Trump might realize he is going down an incendiary path. Of course he probably wouldn’t, but we need his conservative critics to remind that our ideology is about more than just policy.

    The “grab hold of your senses” was meant in jest to make light of your “worse than hatred” because it is in fact way overstated.

    I believe the Trump Presidency to date illustrates how conservative pro-growth policy can succeed without regard to the character of the individual who administers the policy. Lower taxes, less regulation, and policy which encourages the harvesting and production of fossil fuels will in fact produce economic growth no matter which party is in office or which individual is the sitting President.

    I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person, which is your right.

    By the way, to believe that condescension is worse than hatred is a well thought-out formulation, which indicats the ability to think about things in a more than superficial way. Because you disagree with it is no reason to make fun of it. It speaks volumes about you.

    Have a g00d life.

    Is ‘I think we all understand that you are a very materialistic person,’ the sort of thing you want to write on the same thread that you stated your belief that condescension is worse than hatred?

    Condescension for me but not for thee.

    • #90
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