A Pointed 104 Seconds on the Marriage Debate

 

Here at Stanford this past spring, the Anscombe Society braved threats and intimidation of all kinds to host a conference in favor of traditional marriage. In this video one of the speakers, the marvelously articulate and completely fearless Ryan Anderson, replies to a questioner. Watch the video, if you have 104 seconds to spare, and then note, if you would, my questions below:

Without quite realizing it, I saw when I listened to this exchange, I’d been sliding toward at least a grudging acceptance of the libertarian position on marriage—namely, that we should get the government out of the business of defining marriage altogether. Which leads to:

1) Anderson is right, isn’t he, that such an approach leads inevitably to viewing marriage as merely a subset of contract law? If a man wants to marry a man, fine; let them draw up a legally binding contract. If one man wants to marry six women; or two men, two women; or one woman another—again, fine. Let them simply draw up the proper contracts, and let the government enforce them as it would any contract.

2)  This really won’t do, will it? Marriage between one man and one woman really is different, and the state needs to recognize that reality, or—what? Or chaos. Yes?

Published in General
Like this post? Want to comment? Join Ricochet’s community of conservatives and be part of the conversation. Join Ricochet for Free.

There are 124 comments.

Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.
  1. Grendel Member
    Grendel
    @Grendel

    As I’ve said before, bring on Gay Marriage.  Let the Bureau of Licenses give out Certificates of Gay Marriage.  Let Hallmark sell “Happy Gay Marriage Anniversary” cards.

    • #121
  2. Midget Faded Rattlesnake Member
    Midget Faded Rattlesnake
    @Midge

    JimGoneWild:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake: If it’s not a contract and not a civil sacrament, what kind of civil institution is marriage? If the only useful thing civil marriage does is to make a specific type of agreement between two people public and binding, then why should civil marriage be anything other than a particular type of contract?

    It’s a contract and little bit more. Like a Trust, LLC, C Corp or S Corp, marriage creates a legal entity. A civil union would create a new type entity.

    So, in addition to binding the spouses like a contract, it also gives the married couple juridical personhood, similar to what corporations and registered associations enjoy? That’s the first plausible answer I’ve heard recently. Thanks.

    So… for an LLC, you choose a name, file your articles of organization, obtain any required licenses and permits, and perhaps create an operating agreement. Many of those licenses and permits may be rather useless, so licensing perhaps shouldn’t be a vital step in the LLC process.

    How far do we extend this analogy to marriage? Are marriages like corporations? Perhaps. Mr Rattler calls us a corporation, and it doesn’t bug me.

    • #122
  3. user_645127 Lincoln
    user_645127
    @jam

    Floydz:

    Jennifer:

    I would still like an answer to the question I first posed in #8. Does society have a duty to enforce a nature-based limitation on the number of legally recognized parents for children?

    Society? Definitely not, it’s none of societies business. The Federal Gov’t? No, again I hold that it is none of the Federal Gov’ts business. State and local gov’t.? They should be able to decide for themselves.

    So in your view, if a state decided that children should belong to whole communities, would that be OK? If not, why not? What is the principle you would employ to stop this from happening?

    • #123
  4. user_645127 Lincoln
    user_645127
    @jam

    From a practical standpoint, I think it boils down to a few simple things:

    1. Do we need the legal doctrine known as the “marital presumption of paternity”? In other words, do we need fathers to be legally attached to their families? Or a little more broadly: do we need the legal recognition of fathers (defined as the male who gave rise to a specific child)?

    2. Do we need to enforce a nature-based limitation on the number of parents that are legally recognized for children? Do we need a default setting for this that applies to all (ie, “two”)? Shall we open up the idea that handling it on a case by case basis is beneficial or just?

    • #124
Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.