Biden Follows Up Disastrous Afghanistan Withdrawal with a Disastrous Speech

 

The weekend was filled with harrowing images from Kabul. Taliban soldiers executing Afghan allies, helicopters evacuating US embassy staff, the Kabul Airport overrun by desperate locals trying to escape, refugees falling to their death from wheel-wells of C-17s.

Following days of White House silence, President Biden interrupted his five-day vacation to calm the nation and her nervous allies. The 15-minute speech Monday was as calamitous as Biden’s Afghanistan withdrawal.

The Buck Stops with That Other Guy

Biden began his East Room address by blaming President Obama for not leaving Afghanistan ten years ago.

We went to Afghanistan almost 20 years ago with clear goals: get those who attacked us on Sept. 11, 2001, and make sure Al Qaeda could not use Afghanistan as a base from which to attack us again. We did that. We severely degraded Al Qaeda and Afghanistan. We never gave up the hunt for Osama bin Laden and we got him.

That was a decade ago. Our mission in Afghanistan was never supposed to have been nation-building. It was never supposed to be creating a unified, centralized democracy. Our only vital national interest in Afghanistan remains today what it has always been: preventing a terrorist attack on American homeland.

I’ve argued for many years that our mission should be narrowly focused on counterterrorism, not counterinsurgency or nation-building. That’s why I opposed the surge when it was proposed in 2009 when I was vice president. And that’s why as president I’m adamant we focus on the threats we face today, in 2021, not yesterday’s threats.

Though not mentioning Obama by name, that president approved the Afghanistan Surge which sent an additional 17,000 troops to the region in February 2009. On Monday, Biden called that decision a disastrous mistake and claimed he opposed it at the time.

But Biden’s primary scapegoat was Donald Trump:

When I came into office, I inherited a deal that President Trump negotiated with the Taliban. Under his agreement, U.S. forces would be out of Afghanistan by May 1, 2021, just a little over three months after I took office. U.S. forces had already drawn down during the Trump administration from roughly 15,500 American forces to 2,500 troops in country. And the Taliban was at its strongest militarily since 2001.

The choice I had to make as your president was either to follow through on that agreement or be prepared to go back to fighting the Taliban in the middle of the spring fighting season. There would have been no cease-fire after May 1. There was no agreement protecting our forces after May 1. There was no status quo of stability without American casualties after May 1. There was only a cold reality of either following through on the agreement to withdraw our forces or escalating the conflict and sending thousands more American troops back into combat in Afghanistan, and lurching into the third decade of conflict.

Upon entering office, Biden systematically reversed every Trump-era policy, from re-engaging Iran, distancing the US from Israel, even approving a sweetheart pipeline deal for Russia. Yet he claims Trump’s Afghanistan exit was somehow sacrosanct and irreversible. Of course, Biden rejected Trump’s actual plan for withdrawal, but his hands were apparently tied to the general concept.

Obama and Trump failed Biden but our Afghan allies failed him too:

The truth is, this did unfold more quickly than we had anticipated. So what’s happened? Afghanistan political leaders gave up and fled the country. The Afghan military collapsed, sometimes without trying to fight. If anything, the developments of the past week reinforced that ending U.S. military involvement in Afghanistan now was the right decision.

American troops cannot and should not be fighting in a war and dying in a war that Afghan forces are not willing to fight for themselves. We spent over a trillion dollars. We trained and equipped an Afghan military force of some 300,000 strong. Incredibly well equipped. A force larger in size than the militaries of many of our NATO allies. We gave them every tool they could need. We paid their salaries, provided for the maintenance of their air force, something the Taliban doesn’t have. Taliban does not have an air force. We provided close air support. We gave them every chance to determine their own future. What we could not provide them was the will to fight for that future.

…When I hosted President Ghani and Chairman Abdullah at the White House in June, and again when I spoke by phone to Ghani in July, we had very frank conversations. We talked about how Afghanistan should prepare to fight their civil wars after the U.S. military departed. To clean up the corruption in government so the government could function for the Afghan people. We talked extensively about the need for Afghan leaders to unite politically. They failed to do any of that. I also urged them to engage in diplomacy, to seek a political settlement with the Taliban. This advice was flatly refused. Mr. Ghani insisted the Afghan forces would fight, but obviously he was wrong.

The withdrawal plan, or lack thereof, was created and implemented by the Biden Administration. Without warning, they shut down the Bagram Airbase, the only secure facility to ship people and materiel out of the collapsing nation. They relied instead on the civilian Kabul airport, which is not under U.S. military control. They slow-tracked applications of interpreters and other Afghan allies, leaving even American citizens to wait for the Taliban invasion. They offered happy talk to the media, assuring them that Kabul was in no danger for the next several months.

The failed withdrawal was all Biden’s doing, but Monday he insisted everyone else was to blame.

Insincere Promises Soon to Be Broken

Biden briefly acknowledged the painful images coming out of Kabul.

I also want to acknowledge how painful this is to so many of us. The scenes that we’re seeing in Afghanistan, they’re gut-wrenching, particularly for our veterans, our diplomats, humanitarian workers — for anyone who has spent time on the ground working to support the Afghan people. For those who have lost loved ones in Afghanistan, and for Americans who have fought and served our country in Afghanistan, this is deeply, deeply personal. It is for me as well.

I’ve worked on these issues as long as anyone. I’ve been throughout Afghanistan during this war, while the war was going on, from Kabul to Kandahar, to the Kunar Valley. I’ve traveled there on four different occasions. I’ve met with the people. I’ve spoken with the leaders. I spent time with our troops, and I came to understand firsthand what was and was not possible in Afghanistan.

This is tough on me too, you know. He then offered false hope to desperate Afghans and NGO staff that will never materialize.

We will continue to support the Afghan people. We will lead with our diplomacy, our international influence and our humanitarian aid. We’ll continue to push for regional diplomacy and engagement to prevent violence and instability. We’ll continue to speak out for the basic rights of the Afghan people, of women and girls, just as we speak out all over the world.

I’ve been clear, the human rights must be the center of our foreign policy, not the periphery. But the way to do it is not through endless military deployments. It’s with our diplomacy, our economic tools and rallying the world to join us.

In other words, you’re on your own, Afghanistan.

Let me lay out the current mission in Afghanistan: I was asked to authorize, and I did, 6,000 U.S. troops to deploy to Afghanistan for the purpose of assisting in the departure of U.S. and allied civilian personnel from Afghanistan, and to evacuate our Afghan allies and vulnerable Afghans to safety outside of Afghanistan. Our troops are working to secure the airfield and ensure continued operation on both the civilian and military flights. We’re taking over air traffic control. We have safely shut down our embassy and transferred our diplomats. Our diplomatic presence is now consolidated at the airport as well.

Over the coming days we intend to transport out thousands of American citizens who have been living and working in Afghanistan. We’ll also continue to support the safe departure of civilian personnel — the civilian personnel of our allies who are still serving in Afghanistan. Operation Allies Refuge, which I announced back in July, has already moved 2,000 Afghans who are eligible for special immigration visas and their families to the United States. In the coming days, the U.S. military will provide assistance to move more S.I.V.-eligible Afghans and their families out of Afghanistan.

The spin doctors made sure to include many weasel words. “[W]e intend to transport out thousands of American citizens.” “We’ll also continue to support the safe departure of civilian personnel.” It is reminiscent of Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s Sunday tweet that “The President is to be commended for the clarity of purpose of his statement on Afghanistan.” Nervous Taiwanese watching China’s massive military buildup might not be reassured by Biden’s clarity of purpose of statements about reports.

The reality is that American citizens and Afghan allies cannot even get to Kabul’s airport without going through multiple Taliban checkpoints where they likely will be seized if not summarily executed.

We’re also expanding refugee access to cover other vulnerable Afghans who work for our embassy. U.S. nongovernmental organizations and Afghans who otherwise are a great risk in U.S. news agencies — I know there are concerns about why we did not begin evacuating Afghan civilians sooner. Part of the answer is some of the Afghans did not want to leave earlier, still hopeful for their country. And part of it because the Afghan government and its supporters discouraged us from organizing a mass exodus to avoid triggering, as they said, a crisis of confidence.

Again, the Afghans are to blame. Biden didn’t mention the thousands who have begged to get out for months but were mired in bureaucratic inertia.

Changing the Subject

The goal of Biden’s speech was to explain his disastrous implementation of the withdrawal and to reassure America and her allies that the multiple failures have been fixed. Instead, he fled from the motte to the bailey, focusing on the easy defense of not staying in Afghanistan forever. The majority of Americans want to leave Afghanistan but none asked to do so with maximum loss of life and a national black eye.

If a wife tells her husband she wants to leave a party, the husband shouldn’t flip the table, punch the host, and get the couple tossed out of a back window by an angry mob. Then the husband certainly shouldn’t blame his wife, saying, “well, you wanted to leave the party didn’t you?” That’s essentially Biden’s play; of course, it won’t work.

The events we’re seeing now are sadly proof that no amount of military force would ever deliver a stable, united, secure Afghanistan, as known in history as the graveyard of empires. What’s happening now could just as easily happen five years ago or 15 years in the future. We have to be honest, our mission in Afghanistan made many missteps over the past two decades.

I’m now the fourth American president to preside over war in Afghanistan. Two Democrats and two Republicans. I will not pass this responsibility on to a fifth president.

Yes, you got us out of the party, dear. But maybe we should have used the front door.

If You Think About It, I’m the Hero

After spending an entire speech blaming others and avoiding the main subject, Biden recasts himself as the tough, truth-telling hero even laughably claiming, “the buck stops with me.”

I will not mislead the American people by claiming that just a little more time in Afghanistan will make all the difference. Nor will I shrink from my share of responsibility for where we are today and how we must move forward from here. I am president of the United States of America, and the buck stops with me.

I’m deeply saddened by the facts we now face. But I do not regret my decision to end America’s war-fighting in Afghanistan and maintain a laser focus on our counterterrorism mission, there and other parts of the world. Our mission to degrade the terrorist threat of Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and kill Osama bin Laden was a success. Our decades-long effort to overcome centuries of history and permanently change and remake Afghanistan was not, and I wrote and believed it never could be.

I cannot and will not ask our troops to fight on endlessly in another country’s civil war, taking casualties, suffering life-shattering injuries, leaving families broken by grief and loss. This is not in our national security interest. It is not what the American people want. It is not what our troops who have sacrificed so much over the past two decades deserve. I made a commitment to the American people when I ran for president that I would bring America’s military involvement in Afghanistan to an end. While it’s been hard and messy and, yes, far from perfect, I’ve honored that commitment.

More importantly, I made a commitment to the brave men and women who serve this nation that I wasn’t going to ask them to continue to risk their lives in a military action that should’ve ended long ago. Our leader did that in Vietnam when I got here as a young man. I will not do it in Afghanistan.

I know my decision will be criticized. But I would rather take all that criticism than pass this decision on to another president of the United States, yet another one, a fifth one. Because it’s the right one, it’s the right decision for our people. The right one for our brave service members who risked their lives serving our nation. And it’s the right one for America.

Thank you. May God protect our troops, our diplomats and all brave Americans serving in harm’s way.

Let’s pray that God does protect us. He might not get a lot of help from Joe Biden.

Following the speech, the president refused to answer questions and fled back to his vacation at Camp David. His press secretary, Jen Psaki, remains on vacation and is sending all inquiries to her voice mail. Perhaps she’ll circle back once the Taliban control Kabul airport entirely.

Published in Foreign Policy, Islamist Terrorism, Military, Politics
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  1. She Reagan
    She
    @She

    As I said on another post, it is a sickening disgrace that Biden did not address the service and sacrifice of the men and women who’ve served their country in Afghanistan over the past twenty years, that he did not praise their honor and valor to the skies, thank them, explain why their sacrifice, and that of their families was worthwhile, and assure the country that they will never be forgotten.  

    But perhaps Biden’s minders have come to the conclusion that it’s safer not to put words up on the teleprompter that the CinC clearly doesn’t believe himself, because they can’t be sure what direction his thoughts and words will take when the drift sets in.

    Just appalling.

    • #1
  2. Seawriter Contributor
    Seawriter
    @Seawriter

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    • #2
  3. navyjag Coolidge
    navyjag
    @navyjag

    And we are stuck with this idiot for another 3 and a half years? Maybe Kamala wouldn’t be so bad after all.  

    • #3
  4. Gary Robbins Reagan
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread?  It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    • #4
  5. Guruforhire Member
    Guruforhire
    @Guruforhire

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread? It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    Gaslighting yourself is the dumbest gaslighting.

    • #5
  6. Columbo Member
    Columbo
    @Columbo

    Predicted.

    • #6
  7. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread? It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    Yet were blind to Slow Joe’s. 

    • #7
  8. Columbo Member
    Columbo
    @Columbo

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread? It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    Where is the review of Robert Gate’s take on the Biden foreign policy nature?

    • #8
  9. CuriousKevmo Member
    CuriousKevmo
    @CuriousKevmo

    Okay, admittedly I’m not an experienced and nuanced foreign policy expert but wouldn’t it have been better to:

    1. Quietly and calmly get Americans and Afghan allies out of the country
    2. Slowly start to pull out our military
    3. Finally as the last of them leave (with continued air support) announce our departure?

     

    • #9
  10. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    Jon Gabriel, Ed.: When I hosted President Ghani and Chairman Abdullah at the White House in June, and again when I spoke by phone to Ghani in July, we had very frank conversations. We talked about how Afghanistan should prepare to fight their civil wars after the U.S. military departed. To clean up the corruption in government so the government could function for the Afghan people.

    When you got to the part about cleaning up corruption, Joe, did Ghani have to suppress a laugh?

    • #10
  11. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens
    @BryanGStephens

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread? It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    You were proud to vote for this man, Gary. 

    You own this. 

    • #11
  12. Brian Watt Inactive
    Brian Watt
    @BrianWatt

    From The Atlantic:

    By the time Biden became vice president in 2009, the disastrous war in Iraq, the endemic corruption of the Afghan government, and the return of the Taliban had made him a deep skeptic of the American commitment. He became the Obama administration’s strongest voice for getting out of Afghanistan. In 2010, he told Richard Holbrooke, Obama’s special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan, that the U.S. had to leave Afghanistan regardless of the consequences for women or anyone else. According to Holbrooke’s diary, when he asked about American obligations to Afghans like the girl in the Kabul school, Biden replied with a history lesson from the final U.S. withdrawal from Southeast Asia in 1973: “F*** that, we don’t have to worry about that. We did it in Vietnam, Nixon and Kissinger got away with it.”

    Such is the exemplary character of the current sitting President who just scampered back to Camp David to hide. Do you think feminist groups will be outraged  anytime soon? CNN? MSNBC?

    • #12
  13. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens
    @BryanGStephens

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    From The Atlantic:

    By the time Biden became vice president in 2009, the disastrous war in Iraq, the endemic corruption of the Afghan government, and the return of the Taliban had made him a deep skeptic of the American commitment. He became the Obama administration’s strongest voice for getting out of Afghanistan. In 2010, he told Richard Holbrooke, Obama’s special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan, that the U.S. had to leave Afghanistan regardless of the consequences for women or anyone else. According to Holbrooke’s diary, when he asked about American obligations to Afghans like the girl in the Kabul school, Biden replied with a history lesson from the final U.S. withdrawal from Southeast Asia in 1973: “F*** that, we don’t have to worry about that. We did it in Vietnam, Nixon and Kissinger got away with it.”

    Such is the exemplary character of the current sitting President who just scampered back to Camp David to hide. Do you think feminist groups will be outraged anytime soon? CNN? MSNBC?

    Never.  Remember,  they wanted to give Clinton one free grope. 

    • #13
  14. davidbatig Coolidge
    davidbatig
    @davidbatig

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds? 

    • #14
  15. Vince Guerra Member
    Vince Guerra
    @VinceGuerra

    I can’t wait to hear the sanctimonious drivel from the NeverTrump media prognosticators shirking their culpability in propping up this puppet and legitimizing his fake presidency, all because they were too cowardly – or too eager – to cast off Trump that they neglected to even look at the overwhelming evidence that the election was a sham.

    They own this too. They gave him the keys, they helped him into the seat, they put his greasy hands on the wheel and set him on his way.

    We tried to stop them. We’re still trying but they refuse to listen. It doesn’t have to continue…unless they want it to.

    • #15
  16. GlennAmurgis Coolidge
    GlennAmurgis
    @GlennAmurgis

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread? It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    Why didn’t they know Biden’s – he has been in the public eye just as long.

    He created “Borking” and his behavior during the Justice Thomas trail was horrible

    His family long history of using his name for fun and profit has been long a well documented

    • #16
  17. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    • #17
  18. Gary Robbins Reagan
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    CuriousKevmo (View Comment):

    Okay, admittedly I’m not an experienced and nuanced foreign policy expert but wouldn’t it have been better to:

    1. Quietly and calmly get Americans and Afghan allies out of the country
    2. Slowly start to pull out our military
    3. Finally as the last of them leave (with continued air support) announce our departure?

    YES!  And do it in the dead of winter while the Taliban were holed up.

    • #18
  19. Brian Watt Inactive
    Brian Watt
    @BrianWatt

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds?

    Mike Pompeo disagrees with you.

    Pompeo said that while Trump had planned on pulling out of Afghanistan, he would not have allowed the Taliban to take over. He said the deal the Trump administration reached with the Taliban called for “a conditions-based withdrawal” and allowed the U.S. to take action if necessary.

    “We made abundantly clear that if they did not live up to that piece of paper … we weren’t going to allow them to just walk away from any deal that they struck, we were going to go crush them,” Pompeo said.

     

    • #19
  20. GlennAmurgis Coolidge
    GlennAmurgis
    @GlennAmurgis

    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf (View Comment):

     

    I would add

    Johnson – War on Poverty

    Nixon  – Wage and Price Controls

    Nixon/Ford/Carter – no addressing inflation

     

    • #20
  21. Gary Robbins Reagan
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf (View Comment):

    I think that for Trump you forgot the 1/6 Capitol Riot, and Trump being the first U.S. President in history since 1789 to attempt to thwart the peaceful transfer of power.   

    • #21
  22. davidbatig Coolidge
    davidbatig
    @davidbatig

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds?

    Mike Pompeo disagrees with you.

    Pompeo said that while Trump had planned on pulling out of Afghanistan, he would not have allowed the Taliban to take over. He said the deal the Trump administration reached with the Taliban called for “a conditions-based withdrawal” and allowed the U.S. to take action if necessary.

    “We made abundantly clear that if they did not live up to that piece of paper … we weren’t going to allow them to just walk away from any deal that they struck, we were going to go crush them,” Pompeo said.

     

    Sure. The Trump Administration was going to relitigate a shooting war with an enemy he wanted us to believe was our peace partner without the American people [REDACTED] a brick. All talk.

    • #22
  23. Brian Watt Inactive
    Brian Watt
    @BrianWatt

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds?

    Mike Pompeo disagrees with you.

    Pompeo said that while Trump had planned on pulling out of Afghanistan, he would not have allowed the Taliban to take over. He said the deal the Trump administration reached with the Taliban called for “a conditions-based withdrawal” and allowed the U.S. to take action if necessary.

    “We made abundantly clear that if they did not live up to that piece of paper … we weren’t going to allow them to just walk away from any deal that they struck, we were going to go crush them,” Pompeo said.

     

    Sure. The Trump Administration was going to relitigate a shooting war with an enemy he wanted us to believe was our peace partner without the American people [REDACTED] a brick. All talk.

    Well, I’m sure you know best.

    • #23
  24. Franco Member
    Franco
    @Franco

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Welp, this is what the Never-Trumpers voted for. Just like the frog carrying the scorpion across the stream they knew Biden’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread? It could be said that Never Trumpers voted for Biden because they knew Trump’s nature.

    Let’s not hijack this thread, which is about how bad Biden and Democrats are. Interesting how which sad-sack Republicans love to focus on, unless there’s a Republican in office they don’t personally like. Now they don’t have to defend themselves, so embarrassed that some ‘lout’ represents their supposed side.

    They can complain and bond with other Republican leaners in solidarity that Biden is demented, stupid and is leading our country to ruin. Yea! Biden Sucks! We all agree! 

    Thin gruel.

    But this has always been and we realize it now. 

    The White House is a PR operation. And everything is political with these people. 

    Biden is beyond mockery because he is a pathetic creature. It’s unfair and cheap. It’s actually very difficult.

     

    With the last guy, it was easy because he refused to accept the many non-sensical presuppositions that we all know intuitively are wrong.That was taboo.

    Even though they were relentless in attacking him, these guys and gals could be easily prodded to denounce him for yet other offenses. Did they not know, were they not told of the slander? Now they are piling on because he didn’t sign-on automatically to their outdated commitments and botched plans?

     He didn’t make the Neo-cons happy either, but yet he was tough. He saw the shakedowns coming – he never put himself above it, himself. It’s really a jungle out there people! – and dealt with them as such.   It’s a dog-eat-dog world  more than anything.   But he accepted it. They are dog’s and he is a dog. Let’s just all acknowledge we are all in it for ourselves and go from there. This is anti-globalist because they want to promote the pretense that if the world unites it’s to the benefit of all.

    Obama – Biden – Clinton pretended these realities didn’t exist. For a price.

    1. They become  very wealthy and get government services for free. The politician is the trump card of power and status. Your private aircraft gets precedence. Billionaires run for Senator, Governor or Mayor of New York for the status, the privilege and fanfare -or secrecy and protection.

    Walk right on arrive in comfort with no waiting at all. That, and Big Media, a force which is immensely powerful. 

     

    2 Accolades enshrined into the I-Saved-The World Hall of Fame of World Politics and Global Concerns. Nobel Prizes, Emmy’s. They are trophy hunters, bribing the officials. Covers on Vogue!

    3 Crushing the enemies you made in your ignominious and underhanded climb to the top. 

    But no mean tweets.

     

     

    • #24
  25. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf (View Comment):

    I think that for Trump you forgot the 1/6 Capitol Riot, and Trump being the first U.S. President in history since 1789 to attempt to thwart the peaceful transfer of power.

    I know the stereotype is that lawyers lie, but why reinforce it?

    • #25
  26. Vince Guerra Member
    Vince Guerra
    @VinceGuerra

    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf (View Comment):
    I know the stereotype is that lawyers lie, but why reinforce it?

    “It’s not a lie if you believe it’s true.” – George Castanza

    • #26
  27. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds?

    No he did not and would not.

    In fact, under Trump, the death toll for Americans had declined dramatically. Trump absolutely knew what he was doing in Afghanistan. There were only 9 Americans killed in Afghanistan in 2020.

    The Kurds have nothing to do with the Afghanistan situation today. That was thirty years ago and it was 41.

    • #27
  28. davidbatig Coolidge
    davidbatig
    @davidbatig

    MarciN (View Comment):

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds?

    No he did not and would not.

    In fact, under Trump, the death toll for Americans had declined dramatically. Trump absolutely knew what he was doing in Afghanistan. There were only 9 in 2020.

    The Kurds have nothing to do with the Afghanistan situation today. That was thirty years ago and it 41.

     

    The situation in Afghanistan was stable. Not a single combat death since Jan 2020.  But we were talking about pulling out. This is a different set of possibilities. Your certainty in what Trump would have done is impossible to predict. 

    • #28
  29. Brian Watt Inactive
    Brian Watt
    @BrianWatt

    Just in from FoxNews:

    Despite the Taliban’s long history of oppression of women and iron-fisted rule, U.S. State Department spokesman Ned Price Monday urged Afghanistan’s new leaders to form an inclusive government that had women in it.

    Question for Mr. Price (anticipating a question from his Taliban counterpart): Is it important that the women have faces unscarred or unburned from acid and that they have noses?

    • #29
  30. Brian Watt Inactive
    Brian Watt
    @BrianWatt

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    MarciN (View Comment):

    davidbatig (View Comment):

    I voted for Trump twice, but I’m not naïve enough to believe Trump wouldn’t have done this exact same thing in his second term. Remember the Kurds?

    No he did not and would not.

    In fact, under Trump, the death toll for Americans had declined dramatically. Trump absolutely knew what he was doing in Afghanistan. There were only 9 in 2020.

    The Kurds have nothing to do with the Afghanistan situation today. That was thirty years ago and it 41.

     

    The situation in Afghanistan was stable. Not a single combat death since Jan 2020. But we were talking about pulling out. This is a different set of possibilities. Your certainty in what Trump would have done is impossible to predict.

    Yet you have predicted it. Make up your mind.

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