Ricochet is the best place on the internet to discuss the issues of the day, either through commenting on posts or writing your own for our active and dynamic community in a fully moderated environment. In addition, the Ricochet Audio Network offers over 50 original podcasts with new episodes released every day.
Breaking News: War is Hell
I clicked on Drudge last night and found this article. I am not so afflicted by Murray Gell-Mann amnesia as to think this quote may be believed without independent verification, but offer it to you as an interesting thing that perhaps someone said or didn’t:
“He said his husband has heard senior noncommissioned officers use homophobic slurs.”
I note that when I laughed loudly about this, on Twitter, there were people who were very scandalized that I laughed.
Now, I don’t know what’s going on there back home. I don’t know if the quote is accurate, or who these people on Twitter are. But in case it is — and in case anyone is confused — let me explain.
First: I would not use “a homophobic slur” in an inappropriate context. I’m not only not “homophobic,” I’m totally homo-indifferent. Like most people who grew up in Seattle. Marriage? I’m in no position to give anyone marital advice, straight or gay, given that I’ve never been married so much as once. Fine with me.
Now you may say, “If you think you’re in no position to say much about marriage, why would you think you’re in a position to say much about war?” Good point! Haven’t been in one of those either.
But I’ll tell you one thing. I’ve spoken to many people about both. Marriage? People who’ve experienced it say it’s heaven or hell and many things in between. Really wide range of opinion on that.
War? Total unanimity. One oddly matched by the literature.
So… I think I would not be going far beyond the limits of “reasonable and appropriate conclusions to draw” when I say that I believe that rumor may be true. And thus very puzzled by anyone who doesn’t quite grasp that someone who enlists has — voluntarily — signed up for at least a possibility of the closest thing he’ll know in this life to hell. And possibly the real thing, depending whether he’s right with God when it happens. Because among the things war is best known for is leaving young men dead. Or maimed, mutilated, and many other unpleasant things. Dead women, too. Dead soldiers of any skin color, religion, or sexual orientation.
I’d also be quite surprised by anyone who doesn’t understand that this isn’t a totally abstract risk, given the state of the world.
I may not have been in a war, but I’ve seen excellent evidence of this. You presumably have too, if you’ve ever seen a military cemetery, perhaps? Or noticed that often young people who come back from wars are, say, missing limbs? I’m sure you have. Yes?
So tell me: How could anyone not grasp that the least of your concerns if you’re in a war is “a slur?” And that “war” is in fact what a military is for? And that if that’s not what they’re preparing for, give me my money back, because that is a ridiculous amount to spend on the military, otherwise? Or why it would be quite odd indeed to imagine a senior NCO who had never used a slur, homophobic or otherwise? Hilarious, in fact?
Why, I reckon such a person might occasionally let slip words totally unsuitable for Ricochet. Where of course we would not permit that. Nor should we. Different context.
Where do these people live, exactly? How do I move there? Or should I? Maybe I’d go nuts around people who could be that naive. Maybe that would be its own special kind of hell.
But as I said: Haven’t been in a war. Now, it would be quite hard to convince me that what was foremost on the minds of the men in the photo above was the fear they might encounter a homophobic slur.
But give it your best shot: bring on your arguments, if you know better. If you’ve actually been in a war, and you’re gay, tell me why that was your bigger concern.
Me? Haven’t been in one. Not gay, either.
But I reckon I’d quite gladly be called any number of offensive things — things I would not gladly be called in other contexts — by someone who was reliably good at helping me stay alive. I’d take that pansy any day over the real man who politely refrained, but was otherwise useless.
Published in General
There are actually quite a few little miss prissy pants in the army.
In fact we had one NCO that was quite scandalized that a young man had pictures of a woman…… in a bikini….. who was his wife……… in his locked wall locker. He had to take it down because she was offended.
It would.
I’d like to comment calmly and intelligently on this post, but I can only think of one word and it’s not CofC compliant… starts with a “P” ends with an — no, I can’t do it.
This is what happens when the military is used for social experimentation rather than “making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country” or cause.
You must all be CoC compliant here. Rule. Appropriate one. Follow it.
In which Claire does her best William Shatner impression.
Oh the horror.
Notice the language, though.
(Hey wait a minute…)
Funny. This is unfortunate timing for the guy who (allegedly) made this comment. Here we just got through the Charlie Hebdo attack, where the whole world responded by telling radical Islam to get a thick skin if you’re being offended … and now we hear the indignation over a schoolyard name.
I’m not in the mood, I guess …
A great many are raised to think the military is for social work. For them: contempt, disdain, and slight regard.
I’m far much more frightened by what’s going on in America right now than I am by what is in France.
That people could fail to grasp that war is a real thing? And hell?
I’m not in the mood at all.
OK. Army vet. War vet.
You lanced the boil perfectly, Claire. An NCO who never offended anyone was a failure. Which means he’d get people killed unnecessarily. What’s the fastest way to get some idiot’s attention? Either physical or emotional distress. I was called many things, as a fresh recruit especially, and suffered physically because I was lazy or indifferent. I eventually became a well-trained effective soldier, with no lasting damage. I ended up appreciating the results of such abuse.
The military life, and it’s deadly mission, is no place for sissies.
As usual, you made a great post. I also want to thank you for all your recent posts on what is occurring in France. Please keep writing and we will keep reading. And I hope you start your own podcast soon… I am sure many of us would listen to it religiously.
Seems the verdict remains unanimous. I will keep waiting to hear someone explain that war is heaven and I should pray for it. As opposed to what everyone in the world has always said, without any exception, even once, in the whole history of humanity. Except maybe someone who has somehow managed to grow up without ever speaking to anyone who has ever been anywhere near a war or even heard about such a thing, even seventh-hand. Or even learning to read.
But I will keep waiting–just because I haven’t seen a black swan, etc.
Just shows how one’s orientation can affect things other than physical attraction. I thought, Claire, that you were going to write, “So tell me: How could anyone not grasp that the least of your concerns if you’re in a war is whether or not the guy next to you is ‘a pansy'” and not “So tell me: How could anyone not grasp that the least of your concerns if you’re in a war is ‘a slur?’”
That said, I totally take your point and would hope that were I a soldier, I would worry about sticks and stones breaking my bones but never about words hurting me.
“Homo-” means “same”.
Therefore “homophobic” means “fear of the same”, not “fear of homosexuals”.
A far more correct term would be “homoerastophobic”.
Bad word coinage drives me batty.
Misthio,
You’re funny.
Claire,
Yes, I would say that what you are talking about is an absurdity. However, we are the captive audience to an even greater absurdity. Let’s review.
Bergdahl wasn’t 19 and drafted like a the guys in WWI, WWII, Korea, and Vietnam. There was no draft so he wasn’t forced to go in the first place. He enlisted at age 22 in 2008. The War in Iraq and Afghanistan had been going on for 5 years. With Cable and the Internet he had thousands of News sources to tell him a narrative about the War that was anything but encouraging. Still he enlisted knowingly.
Bergdahl deserted. He had pulled guard duty and in the middle of the night slipped away from his post. This was in very dangerous territory and just leaving his post on guard duty for an hour would have been a serious risk to his unit. His unit went on a search for him and various estimates have put it at about 8 men dying searching for this deserter.
However, all of the above isn’t the really big story. The really big story is that he could not have survived 5 days in captivity much less 5 years without collaborating! The President of the United States honored an enemy collaborator on the White House lawn. No one so far has estimated how many men’s deaths he could have caused by collaborating with the enemy.
Just another day in the neighborhood.
Regards,
Jim
Funny “ha ha” or funny “a living nightmare”?
(Place that reference Rob Long!)
I bet you swing both ways.
Are these the only two choices?
Are we good with Black troops being called N___s or female troops being called B___s and C___s or gay troops being called F____s so long as the guy using the words knows his warfare? Are there any good reasons for this not being okay in the armed forces?
What did strike me as very odd in the article was:
??
I skimmed over that article until I got to the part about the “pervasive sexual assault.”
Hogwash. I was in the USN 1986-1990 and we heard plenty about the fragile flowers that were women in the military. In my job most washed out, many departing with nothing more than a child to remember their military service. I have extremely negative opinions about women in the military, courtesy of my own experience.
I also recall a guy who was known by everyone to be gay, but wasn’t thrown out because of it. In fact he received more chances to stay in because the chain of command was worried that he hadn’t been given a fair shot to succeed, because he was gay. Nice guy, but eventually he was discharged because he kept getting caught sleeping on watch, etc.
Yep, bad old days. Yet we won the cold war then, and we’ve lost the hot wars since.
This isn’t the fault of the people in uniform, but the people who command them. Those people plainly don’t regard war as hell, merely another bureaucratic challenge.
I have a grim expectation that eventually they will be taught the harsh truth, along with the rest of the United States.
Saying “I’m afraid of spiders.” is not a slur on spiders.
Yeah, I was thinking of that. I usually don’t like to pull the “my education is more rarified than yours” card, but I did feel like saying, “Please look at my CV. Notice that there’s a doctorate from Oxford University there. If I had a phobia, that would be quite an odd place for me to have spent so much time.”
I mean–arachnophobes do not happily spend years in a zoo full of tarantulas, do they? I’m pretty sure they’d be desensitized by the end of the experience. To the point of … total indifference.
Which is actually where I started, having grown up in Seattle.
Your time at Oxford was happily spent? I’ve been led to believe that all graduate work is an exercise in torture and self-abuse.
;-)
I’m too nostalgic about that time to remember it that way. I remember I had some grad-student-ish angst about some things–but it sure wasn’t war. And definitely had nothing to do with Oxford’s famous proclivity for high-camp.
Most of those words are already commonly used by those they may apply to, ironically or not.