If I emigrated to China or Russia, I certainly wouldn`t expect either of those countries to change to become like me. And if I became a citizen of either country, I would expect to try to become like the people of my new, chosen country.

In fact, that is what I did when I moved to Canada and became a citizen: I WANTED to assimilate. I AM a CANADIAN first and foremost, and I LOVE this country with a passion. I expect this of others.

Like everything else, it all depends on the viewpoint, GFL!

It's too bad Islam has the violent injunctions. I grew up in a time when Lawrence of Arabia was still in my mother`s living memory, and all the mystic and romantic visions around that.

Rudolph Valentino starred in the film, The Sheik: of Araby  and had women swooning over that whole, romantic image.

Here is Nelson Eddy singing, Òne Alone`, from Desert Song 1937. I challenge any woman to listen to this and remain unaffected by the dream of an Arab Sheik so affected by her. :-) I have to admit it `sends`me.  

When the beautiful architecture of the Muslim world is admired, and all the wonderful artifacts from Persia, it is difficult not to to fall under the spell of the middle east. And to listen to the Qur`an recited in Arabic is to be transported to another world. It is such a melodious language. 

How I would love to be able to admire it all, without any remembrance of the other side.

They are not quite "two peas in a pod", FD!

The Christian God, whether one believes that Jesus is the incarnation of that God on earth or not, is portrayed as a loving parent who, like any loving parent, wants all we children to love and support each other. Also, the teaching encourages us to grow up and "be the best that I can be", as the hymn sings. Meaning, develop our talents and use them to contribute to society.

Allah, who is said, in the Exordium at the beginning of the Qur'an, to be "the Compassionate, the Merciful", also exhorted the faithful to, "make war on them (unbelievers) until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." Sura 8: 40. 

Not two peas in a pod!

"10 cents

Mum,

You do make a son proud with your clear to the point writing. That asking a person to read the Qur'an could be seen as Islamophobic is  laughable. Bernard Lewis, the great Middle Eastern scholar, says that Jesus is to Christianity as the Qur'an is to Islam. It is that important to Islam."

Lewis, of course, is quite right in what he says, my boy. ("My boy" is a term of endearment for anyone who might take exception to my using it.)

Muslims believe that the Qur'an is the direct word of Allah, given through Muhammad, as he "channeled it from the Angel Gabriel. So anyone who claims the Qur'an as their Holy Book as the direct word of Allah, directly to that individual, has to obey the injunctions in it to "kill the infidel and apostate".

I am very sorry to have to say, that is anyone were to tell me that they believe the Qur'an fundamentally, I would be very wary of them.

Not all Muslims do believe, any more than Jews or Christians believe the injunctions in the Bible stone people to death, but I would like an assurance. 

To quote what is happening in Canada again, (I can hear all those American groans! :-)), our Immigration Laws have been revised to accept only those people who have hopes of finding a job in Canada. It is considered "unfair" to accept people who won't be able to integrate into our society. We have had too many people claiming to be doctors and professors in their homelands, driving taxis here in Canada.

The guide book for immigrants has also been revised to make it quite clear that people who come to Canada must abide by our social norms of equality for women, etc. People may practice their religion freely, but it is against the law to incite to violence. This is specifically there for fundamentalist Muslims because there has been so many "honour killings", and foiled terrorist attacks, all in the name of Islam. 

Contd. from #74:

All of church history is ours. The Christian Faith did not spring into being at the time of the Reformation in the 16th century. It started in the first century with Christ. All that has happened since then is to some extent a description of us. The church with all of its ups and downs, its times of glory and its hours of sad despair: these speak to us of ourselves.  ...

If we are catholic in this sense, then our outlook should be one of love and generosity of spirit to all Christians of whatever denomination. Wherever Jesus Christ is honoured as Lord, there we rejoice.

I was given this book as an Elder, and conducted Study Groups on it. I also conducted a Study Group in my church, the First Presbyterian Church, Edmonton, on the latest Catechism as that was being developed.

As you can see, Christians are all equal. No one denomination is "better", nor should any even be considered too "different", by any other. 

Of course, they have had their differences in the past, and the history is not too pleasant at times, in reality. But this is the idealized theory.

The question in the title of this post was taken from the context of the report on the conference, Zafar. The Muslims are reported to be demanding that Islam be stated to be the equal of Christianity in Germany.

Being a Presbyterian in Canada Today by Stephen A. Hayes, which is the textbook used by the Presbyterian Church of Canada for Inquirers, Elders, Confirmation Classes, and Study Groups, states, as follows:

2. We are Catholic

"Catholic" does not mean "Roman Catholic". The word catholic means universal, or world-wide. To belong to the catholic church is to say that we belong to the church as it is found around the world, and throughout the ages. All of church history is ours. 

Contd. below:

I have to disagree with you, Zafar. My understanding of what the Germans want is to have "moderate" Muslims work with them to find, root out, and deal with the "immoderate" Muslims who are following literally Muhammad's injunctions in the Qur'an to kill the infidels and apostates. 

I've just found this video by Steve Crowder. I have been suggesting for years that people read the Qur'an for themselves. Now the world is catching up with me:

http://politichicks.tv/2013/05/new-steven-crowder-video-slams-quran/

Great questions, Zafar! I am just on my way out to beat up my Bridge group, so don't have time to answer them properly. Will do so when I get back. :-) 

Wish me luck at Bridge! We play social Bridge therefore much depends on the cards, and partners, one gets. Sometimes I do actually win, if the Force has been with me. :-)

It is so comforting to find that others have the same concerns as I do about Islam. 

Agreed, Edward, Muhammad is nothing like Jesus of Nazareth. 

Muhammad was a warrior, and unfortunately, the post-Mecca part of his life seems the most influential.

 Many Muslims, I suspect, haven't read the Qur'an, and without the injunctions to kill the infidel and apostate, the beliefs are similar to Judaism and Christianity. The three religious systems are all from the same source of the Semitic people.  

It does my heart good to hear you give this discerning analysis, Richard.

All I ever say to people is suggest that they ought to read the Qur'an for themselves, and even that is enough to have me branded as suffering from Islamophobia. 

That is one view point, Simon!

We all know the answer to that question, Donald! 

I also follow Ayaan Hirsi Ali, ET. She is such a courageous person. Her writings are so enlightening. And Islam, I agree, it totally incompatible with Western Civilization.

I wish more people would just read the Qur'an for themselves. It is the Holy Book of Islam, and Muhammad's words directly from Allah, and his example, have to be followed by true Muslims. Scary!