There are 19 comments.

  1. Member

    This is stunning. As long as we conservatives only view racism from within the narrow sphere of how it affects “our side” in the culture war, we will lose. The best thing we could do is run cretins like Milo as far away from our side as possible and let them know that they aren’t welcome anywhere near us.

    If we don’t harbor racists, that becomes a less successful mode of attack by the left. As long we hold them up as examples of how the media/left treat US poorly, we’re damning ourselves.

    I’m looking forward to joining whatever non-racist party emerges from the ashes of the GOP after this disastrous election.

    • #1
    • July 21, 2016, at 3:38 PM PDT
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  2. Contributor

    Take it easy. There’s some place in this new world of celebrity anger for people like Mr. Yiannopoulos. I don’t like his combative attitude–I don’t think it’ll do any of the great good suggested by his fans, but he’s not what’s wrong with conservatism–or anything else for that matter. It’s inevitable that some of the crazy stuff on the social- & state-control side of Progress is going to create crazy stuff on the Individualism-is-the-only-true-religion side of Libertarianism. Moralism cannot stop that. Mr. Yiannopoulos is as good as it gets so far as that is concerned.

    • #2
    • July 21, 2016, at 3:43 PM PDT
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  3. Member

    I don’t consider him a conservative in the least; he’s a provocateur who correctly determined that the left is the easiest and most fun to provoke. However, in doing so, he’s dragging conservatism through the mud with him, and I’d rather not have any part of it.

    If you think what he’s up to — frankly, all of Breitbart.com has become a cesspool that seems eager to justify all of the most scurrilous liberal attacks — is helping the GOP/center right/conservatives look LESS like the racist stereotypes the left has pinned on us, then maybe it’s already lost cause.

    • #3
    • July 21, 2016, at 3:56 PM PDT
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  4. Contributor

    I don’t think the left is easiest or most fun to provoke. I see no end of people on the left who have no difficulty provoking the right–there is also far more to acquire that way, by way of prestige or a career.

    I share your dislike of Breitbart. I’ll add, poor Breitbart in the grave…

    Dorrk:

    If you think what he’s up to is helping the GOP/center right/conservatives look LESS like the racist stereotypes the left has pinned on us, then maybe it’s already lost cause.

    I don’t think that.

    The guy certainly is conservative in many obvious ways–all the free speech stuff is about defending how things have been. Fighting the social justice warrior is about the same thing–keeping things as they were.

    • #4
    • July 21, 2016, at 4:07 PM PDT
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  5. Inactive

    I have to wonder whether, as he launched into his anti-Erdogan litany, James was aware of Trump’s recent praise of Erdogan.

    • #5
    • July 21, 2016, at 6:18 PM PDT
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  6. Inactive

    Titus Techera: Take it easy. There’s some place in this new world of celebrity anger for people like Mr. Yiannopoulos. I don’t like his combative attitude–I don’t think it’ll do any of the great good suggested by his fans, but he’s not what’s wrong with conservatism…

    If for no other reason than that he is not conservative in any meaningful way.

    Milo is certainly of the right, but that’s not the same thing as being conservative.

    • #6
    • July 21, 2016, at 6:20 PM PDT
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  7. Contributor

    Salvatore Padula:

    Titus Techera: Take it easy. There’s some place in this new world of celebrity anger for people like Mr. Yiannopoulos. I don’t like his combative attitude–I don’t think it’ll do any of the great good suggested by his fans, but he’s not what’s wrong with conservatism…

    If for no other reason than that he is not conservative in any meaningful way.

    Milo is certainly of the right, but that’s not the same thing as being conservative.

    I agree. I’m of the opinion that conservatives should learn to get along with all sorts of people, maybe learn something about how democracy works & maybe about democratic coalitions, too. I don’t know how the party can get more oligarchic than it is…

    • #7
    • July 21, 2016, at 10:20 PM PDT
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  8. Contributor

    Salvatore Padula:I have to wonder whether, as he launched into his anti-Erdogan litany, James was aware of Trump’s recent praise of Erdogan.

    As with every other such example, it doesn’t matter.

    But I’ll tell you–I don’t feel all that different about politicians I support. My main interest would be the only concern, up until laws human or sacred are transgressed. I’d let crazy things slide…

    That seems to me inevitable any kind of serious partisan fight.

    I take that to be a reason not to be on the side of breaking the system, as Mr. Delingpole is, but so far as I can tell, anyone with political ambition in these times it likely to go to that extreme. Moderation receives only abject condescendence from important people, only lukewarm support from the decent folks who most benefit by the civil peace, & the burning hatred or contempt of the ambitious. It is possible we’re coming around to a situation where men of moderation have to do extreme things.

    • #8
    • July 21, 2016, at 10:30 PM PDT
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  9. Inactive

    Titus Techera:

    Salvatore Padula:

    Titus Techera: Take it easy. There’s some place in this new world of celebrity anger for people like Mr. Yiannopoulos. I don’t like his combative attitude–I don’t think it’ll do any of the great good suggested by his fans, but he’s not what’s wrong with conservatism…

    If for no other reason than that he is not conservative in any meaningful way.

    Milo is certainly of the right, but that’s not the same thing as being conservative.

    I agree. I’m of the opinion that conservatives should learn to get along with all sorts of people, maybe learn something about how democracy works & maybe about democratic coalitions, too. I don’t know how the party can get more oligarchic than it is…

    Well, I’ve been seriously considering monarchism.

    • #9
    • July 21, 2016, at 10:41 PM PDT
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  10. Inactive

    James- If “Milo doesn’t need to be racist” who does?

    • #10
    • July 21, 2016, at 10:55 PM PDT
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  11. Contributor

    Salvatore Padula:James- If “Milo doesn’t need to be racist” who does?

    Well put. I think Mr. Young made the obvious objection–it’s all of common sense to ask why are people so hysterical & why is anyone excited about making people more hysterical? The Delingpole defense used to be known to our Marxist friends as heightening the contradictions. I’m all for learning from our enemies, but not for doing our best impression of them…

    • #11
    • July 21, 2016, at 11:15 PM PDT
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  12. Contributor

    • #12
    • July 21, 2016, at 11:33 PM PDT
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  13. Inactive

    Often when fighting an enemy one has to get down into the muck with them, staying above the fray is a luxury and right now we have lost the culture and we need folks like Milo to fight fire with fire. Twitter and Facebook are not consistent with their censorship policies, they allow black lives matter and other leftist actually post things that insite violence but ban Milo for the comments of his followers. Also the actress in question have posted pretty racist things herself but since she’s black and on the left gets a pass.

    also regarding NATO. Understandably NATO has kept Europe safe for many years, but far too many European elites have turned up their noses at America as war mongering, religious troglodytes, and have noted that America should be more sophisticated and enlightened like Europeans. Unfortunately for Europe the US has leadership that wants to emulate Europe and we are paying a price for it. And trump has said that he wants Europe to started contributing to the cost of their security, which I don’t think is unreasonable

    • #13
    • July 22, 2016, at 6:47 AM PDT
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  14. Contributor
    1. Has Mr. Yiannopoulos won anything? Is he poised to win anything? What is he promising to win? What do you expect him to win & more or less how? These are all fantasies–stories–but they might at least clarify what hope comes to those who despair of having lost the culture…
    2. Yes, the EU spits on American gallantry. One can never forget the man’s answer to the French demand to rid themselves of American arms: Shall we dig up our dead of Normandy & Bastogne as well? I paraphrase here…
      Yes, American liberalism is guilty for the European oligarchies’ proud laziness.
      No, that does not mean that counting money today makes you prudent. It only means you’re finding an excuse to destroy or risk the destruction of the alliances you do have. If you believe the system must be burnt down, as so many say in our internet democracy, fine. But if you do not believe that, let us not fool ourselves.
      Instead, let us recall the guiding genius of Ricochet: Calvin Coolidge, who famously asked Britain to pay back her war loans. If that is still the faith of conservatism in foreign affairs, then America will suffer again as she has before. It is pious economics to count the money. There is moral truth behind these foolish economies, too. But it is only a new irresponsibility of conservatism after the irresponsibility of liberalism. It is vengeance answering to vengeance; partisan insanity answering partisan insanity. Not prudence–nor dignity.
    • #14
    • July 22, 2016, at 7:03 AM PDT
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  15. Inactive
    1. This culture war will take decades to fight back on, this is just the beginning and the problem is so vast and ingrained that Milo is merely one foot soldier in a much much bigger war. And yes I think he has made inroads on college campuses in fighting back on the Social justice and showing young people the tyranny of the left on their campus. This this a. Victory

    2. I am not saying that I personally agree with trump’s position on NATO, (although side note what will we be responsible for regarding Turkey after the fall out from this military coup as turkey are NATO members?) I am merely pointing out that there are consequences to the arrogance of many European elites, you can’t deride the people who protect you for so long. I don’t share the view of many who agree with trump but I have heard that sentiment for years Trump did not just think of this. This has been bouncing around the American mindset for a long time and only now with a populist candidate is it coming to the surface.

    also what this election had really pointed out to me is how much more emotion effects people’s thinking. Most people aren’t rational ragarding these thing and yes it does seem to be vengeance

    • #15
    • July 22, 2016, at 7:14 AM PDT
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  16. Contributor

    It seems many people are learning just how political Americans are, even the GOP, even the conservatives–how much anger & contempt count with them. How many people used to claim the reasonable apolitical quality of conservative America? How many would dare repeat those claims?

    Well, now that the anger has got out of hand; now that the man has won who has done best to raise himself by this angry desire to bring so many things down; who is doing any of the thinking required to figure out what should be done &, to be realistic, what is likely to be done in case he wins the presidency?

    Who is doing the thinking & talking required to put his campaign on the best footing or at least to give it some seriousness of thought, so that there is at least one reasonable hope that it will not go to ruin?

    Are you reading anyone that inspires confidence in you? Have you heard of anyone who supports Mr. Trump who’s serious about such things, as opposed to conducting the partisan destruction of the GOP out of hatred for the establishment?

    • #16
    • July 22, 2016, at 7:35 AM PDT
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  17. Inactive

    I am in a bit of a unique position in that a friend of my father’s has worked for Donald Trump for years. I don’t know this guy very well and he’s a friend of my dads from the old neighborhood so only speaks to him occasionally. That being said he has told my father that Donald Trump is actually very good at listening to his advisors and taking their advise. He isn’t an irrational decision maker as some may believe considering the public personae he puts out there and his lack of impulse control when it comes to Twitter, but he wouldn’t have been so successful in business if he didn’t take the advise of others, so the fact that he has surrounded himself with bonafide conservatives and seems to have reverence for the military does give me some confidence that he could have a relatively successful presidency (well just not the unmitigated disaster so many Never Trumpers think), including remaining in NATO and heeding the call if an ally is attacked. But his success in winning the nomination does seem to be a rage against an political elite that is more emotion based rather than thought based.

    Much of this was predictable, as anyone who understands how much emotion plays into people’s thinking, which is why the Democrats are so success they rely on emotion rather than the rational. But God only knows what the future brings but I see rough seas ahead.

    • #17
    • July 22, 2016, at 8:05 AM PDT
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  18. Member

    Dorrk:I’m looking forward to joining whatever non-racist party emerges from the ashes of the GOP after this disastrous election.

    Me too! Far too many Trumpbots come across as the spiritual reincarnation of George Wallace. They’re a very scary bunch.

    And after the Great Purge, of course, our next challenge needs to be persuading the rest of the country that ANY hostility (or even preferences) shown toward people on the basis of race, sexuality or background is completely unacceptable.

    Because bigotry often cuts both ways. (See CAIR, #BlackLivesMatter, the BDS movement, GLAAD, etc etc)

    How long will that kind of reeducation take, do you think?

    • #18
    • July 22, 2016, at 9:06 AM PDT
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  19. Contributor

    Let me point out that you seem to me to be implying ‘that Democrats, unlike conservatives, are really rational. If people are so emotional, the rational will take that into consideration. Only the irrational would do otherwise. I’m not quite sure whether this is something that you intended to suggest.

    If it is, then surely, Mr. Trump’s rational decision to ‘surround himself with bona fide conservatives’ & his rational show of ‘reverence for the military’ are tactical. It would be irrational in him, to take one example, to believe the conservatives who have so long failed to win elections & have now lost their party to Mr. Trump. Surely, the rational thing for him to do is to parade them, not to take their advice. What bona fide conservatives helped create or worked for Mr. Trump? Taking them along for the ride after winning without them surely is a way to deceive the electorate–that’s the rational thing to do!

    • #19
    • July 22, 2016, at 9:39 AM PDT
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