The Last Straw

This week, some rumination on Trump’s tete a tete with Putin (along with a history lesson for Rob Long), we introduce you to Elizabeth Heng, who is running for Congress in California’s 16th District, we get some #MeToo education from our good pal Mona Charen, (stop whatever you’re doing and buy her book Sex Matters right now) and the city of Santa Barbara declares that if you use a straw in that fair city, you’ll do time. Which sucks. Also, the Word of The Day is spizzerinctum.

Music from this week’s podcast: Sex Bomb by Tom Jones

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  1. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):
    Conservatives, like me, do not believe that Donald Trump is good for the country, despite most of his policies being good.

    Say what? Can you expand on that? What more can we expect of a conservative politician than good policies?

    A nice pants crease? A normal hair color? Suits that fit? A fulsome vocabulary? Essays in National Review instead of tweets?

    In brief, a candidate needs to not be a jerk and, I am using a legal term here, but need to clean it up for the CoC: the politican needs to not be an *ssh*le, which, in my experience, Trump is more than any of the 45 U.S. Presidents in history, or any Republican Nominee in history.  

    I will use the less offensive word “jerk” however I would frankly prefer that you substitute the word “*ssh*le” in your own mind when I use the word “jerk.”  (My sainted 88 year old mother has never used the “f” word in my presence, but even she will literally call Trump an “*ssh*le.”  She was never voted for a Democrat for President in her life.) 

    Trump was a jerk for being a Birther. 

    Trump was a jerk when after Obama came out with his long-form birth certificate, he said that he had sent two investigators out to Hawaii, and that we “would not believe what they were finding.”

    Trump was a jerk when questioned why he should disregard the comments of a captured war hero, that he preferred heroes who hadn’t been captured.

    Trump was a jerk for not paying vendors and builders who performed services for him.

    Trump was a jerk for declaring bankruptcy five times.

    Trump was a jerk for ripping people off with his so-called Trump University, where he cheated thousands of people of tens of thousands of dollars. 

    Trump was a jerk for being an over racialist, for not denouncing David Duke, or the KKK before the Southern primaries, and then claiming that he hadn’t heard the question due to a defective earpiece.  

    Trump was a jerk violating Reagan’s 11th Commandment, calling Jeb Bush, “Low Energy Jeb”, Ben Carson “Weak Ben Carson”, Ted Cruz “Lyin’ Ted”, Marco Rubio “Liddle’ Marco”, and John Kasich “1 For 38”.

    Trump was a jerk for promising to release his taxes and never doing so.

    Trump was a jerk for claiming that Ted Cruz’s father helped Lee Harvey Oswald.

    Trump was a jerk for claiming that the Colorado and Wyoming systems of choosing delegates are rigged.

    Trump was a jerk by fostering a Cult of Personality by braying at the Convention, “Only I can fix things.”

    I will never vote for Trump.  I will not vote for someone who who voted for Trump in the primaries.  I will not vote for someone who promotes themselves now as the “Trump Candidate,” and will often give money to their Democratic opponents.

     

     

     

    • #211
  2. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    I will use the less offensive word “jerk” however I would frankly prefer that you substitute the word “*ssh*le” in your own mind when I use the word “jerk.” (My sainted 88 year old mother has never used the “f” word in my presence, but even she will literally call Trump an “*ssh*le.” She was never voted for a Democrat for President in her life.)

    PJ O’Rourke says that his grandmother would never say the word “Democrat” in front of children.  She’d say “Bastards” [unredacted] instead.

    When he was in college and at the height of his 1960s anti-war greasy smelly hippy phase he came home one weekend in his unkempt hippy attire and his grandmother asked him suspiciously if he was becoming a Democrat.  He drew himself up in high dudgeon and loudly proclaimed that he would never support any of the American fascist militaristic parties, that he was a Communist.

    To which she replied, “That’s OK, as long as you’re not a Democrat.”

     

    Edit:  I associate myself firmly with PJ O’Rourke’s Grandmother.

     

    • #212
  3. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    In brief, a candidate needs to not be a jerk and, I am using a legal term here, but need to clean it up for the CoC: the politican needs to not be an *ssh*le, which, in my experience, Trump is more than any of the 45 U.S. Presidents in history, or any Republican Nominee in history.

    You don’t remember ol’ Andy, do ya? He made Trump look like an amateur.

    • #213
  4. Pagodan Member
    Pagodan
    @MatthewBaylot

    Al Kennedy (View Comment):

    Petty (View Comment):
    He bowed out specifically to stop Trump urging real Republicans to unite behind one candidate that could do that job.

    That plus the ego trips of Cruz, Kasich and about a dozen of the other losing candidates who never should have been candidates. The decision to go primarily to winner take all primaries were instituted because the 2012 primaries drug out the process while Romney was getting hammered by Democrats and couldn’t respond because of campaign contribution rules. This was a significant factor in his subsequent defeat.

    Maybe some others should never have been candidates, but I’m hard pressed to think of another candidate besides Cruz who came within striking distance of a nomination. Certainly not everyone’s third/fourth choice, Rubio. 

    • #214
  5. Pagodan Member
    Pagodan
    @MatthewBaylot

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Eustace C. Scrubb (View Comment):

    But…but… Gorsuch! (Has anyone said that yet? Just thought I’d throw that in.)

    We would have gotten Gorsuch and Kavanaugh and ACB with President Rubio or Cruz or Kasich.

    You would not have gotten Gorsuch or Kavanaugh with Hillary though. Supreme Court nominees were a general election issue. The “but Gorsuch” position was a conservative argument to support a less (far…far..less) than perfect candidate in the general election. It’s irrelevant whom Rubio, Cruz, or the dirtbag from Ohio would have nominated. (And I am not convinced you would have gotten the same nominees from a Rubio or Kasich, as it is.)

    • #215
  6. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Pagodan (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Eustace C. Scrubb (View Comment):

    But…but… Gorsuch! (Has anyone said that yet? Just thought I’d throw that in.)

    We would have gotten Gorsuch and Kavanaugh and ACB with President Rubio or Cruz or Kasich.

    You would not have gotten Gorsuch or Kavanaugh with Hillary though. Supreme Court nominees were a general election issue. The “but Gorsuch” position was a conservative argument to support a less (far…far..less) than perfect candidate in the general election. It’s irrelevant whom Rubio, Cruz, or the dirtbag from Ohio would have nominated. (And I am not convinced you would have gotten the same nominees from a Rubio or Kasich, as it is.)

    Three questions.  First, what evidence, if any, do you have to assert that Rubio, Cruz or Kasich would not appoint Federalist Society Judges like Gorsuch, Kavanaugh or ACB?  

    Second, given the wave of approval by voters to Trump’s statement that he would only be appointing Federalist Society Judges, is there any reason to believe that Republicans in the future will not be appointing Federalist Society Judges?

    Third, I know that Kasich is not a favored candidate of many Republicans, however wouldn’t it be more appropriate to refer only to Trump as “human filth,” or some such other equilavalent moniker?

    • #216
  7. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Pagodan (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Eustace C. Scrubb (View Comment):

    But…but… Gorsuch! (Has anyone said that yet? Just thought I’d throw that in.)

    We would have gotten Gorsuch and Kavanaugh and ACB with President Rubio or Cruz or Kasich.

    You would not have gotten Gorsuch or Kavanaugh with Hillary though. Supreme Court nominees were a general election issue. The “but Gorsuch” position was a conservative argument to support a less (far…far..less) than perfect candidate in the general election. It’s irrelevant whom Rubio, Cruz, or the dirtbag from Ohio would have nominated. (And I am not convinced you would have gotten the same nominees from a Rubio or Kasich, as it is.)

    Dammit!  I did not read what you said accurately.  My bad.  The one time when I buckled was when Trump issued his first excellent list.  However, after he brayed that conservatives had “no choice” but to vote for him, I refused to give him a pass on the dozen examples of Trump being an “*ssh*le” that I outlined in Comment 211.

    You are right, Hillary’s judicial selections would have sucked.

    • #217
  8. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Kasich is more troubled than any of them. The RINO from hell. He changed more than Joe Scarborough.

    • #218
  9. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Kasich is more troubled than any of them. The RINO from hell. He changed more than Joe Scarborough.

    Still a paragon of virtue compared to the AntiChrist commonly known as Trump.

    • #219
  10. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    what evidence, if any, do you have to assert that Rubio, Cruz or Kasich would not appoint Federalist Society Judges like Gorsuch, Kavanaugh or ACB?

    If I may answer this, Gary: While there can be no concrete evidence as to what a politician would or would not do, I am dubious about Kasich appointing the kind of judges that Gorsuch and Kavanaugh represent. We need originalist judges and, based on the way Kasich has been talking for some time now, I don’t trust him to pick them. Democrats are always speaking as if judges were legislators and how they have to a “feel” for the poor, etc. Kasich has been talking like that too, with his bringing Godly actions into legislative actions. I just wouldn’t feel comfortable with him in the Presidency. He is better than today’s Democrat, to be sure. But shouldn’t we want more than that?

    I would trust Rubio, but not Kasich.

    • #220
  11. Mrs. Ink Inactive
    Mrs. Ink
    @MrsInk

    for Mr. Robbins

    Luke 18:10-14

    • #221
  12. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    for Mr. Robbins

    Luke 18:10-14

    And now does that have anything to do with anything?

    • #222
  13. Mrs. Ink Inactive
    Mrs. Ink
    @MrsInk

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    • #223
  14. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    Not towards his supporters, who include family members.  

    But towards Trump himself.  I was asked why I can’t support him, when I like him on Judges, regulations and taxes.  

    It is because Trump’s behavior is the worse behavior I have ever seen between all Republican Presidents and all Republican Nominees since we became a Party in 1856.  If it makes me a bad Christian in your eyes to object to Trump as outlined in Comment 211, then so be it.  

    Thank goodness our relationship with God is judged by God, and not our fellow man.

    • #224
  15. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    I happen to agree with Gary on many of his points. But, even if I didn’t, I would never say that a man’s opinion on someone is not very Christian. That comment, by itself, is not very Christian. One should not judge another’s heart.

    • #225
  16. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    I happen to agree with Gary on many of his points. But, even if I didn’t, I would never say that a man’s opinion on someone is not very Christian. That comment, by itself, is not very Christian. One should not judge another’s heart.

    Could you explain why you feel it’s OK to say Mrs. Ink’s comments are “not very Christian,” but she shouldn’t say Gary’s attitude is un-Christian?

    • #226
  17. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    …since we became a Party in 1856.

    1854

    • #227
  18. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Trump was a jerk violating Reagan’s 11th Commandment…

    Trump was a jerk for claiming that the Colorado and Wyoming systems of choosing delegates are rigged.

    I don’t need to explain the hypocrisy of the first one.

    You just said a day or two ago that the whole primary system was rigged.

    So while you’re busy calling yourself a jerk, I would frankly prefer…

    • #228
  19. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    I happen to agree with Gary on many of his points. But, even if I didn’t, I would never say that a man’s opinion on someone is not very Christian. That comment, by itself, is not very Christian. One should not judge another’s heart.

    Could you explain why you feel it’s OK to say Mrs. Ink’s comments are “not very Christian,” but she shouldn’t say Gary’s attitude is un-Christian?

    Very simple. Gary is entitled to his opinion on Mr. Trump. Many people have said the same thing, or worse, about Mr. Obama, and I do not think that anyone called those anti-Christian. When someone suggests that by criticizing a president, he is being anti-Christian that is acting as a judge to say what is one’s heart. You can say he is being mean-spirited, if you want. I’d disagree. But to go further, and to bring in Christ, is wrong.

    • #229
  20. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    I happen to agree with Gary on many of his points. But, even if I didn’t, I would never say that a man’s opinion on someone is not very Christian. That comment, by itself, is not very Christian. One should not judge another’s heart.

    Could you explain why you feel it’s OK to say Mrs. Ink’s comments are “not very Christian,” but she shouldn’t say Gary’s attitude is un-Christian?

    Very simple. Gary is entitled to his opinion on Mr. Trump. Many people have said the same thing, or worse, about Mr. Obama, and I do not think that anyone called those anti-Christian. When someone suggests that by criticizing a president, he is being anti-Christian that is acting as a judge to say what is one’s heart. You can say he is being mean-spirited, if you want. I’d disagree. But to go further, and to bring in Christ, is wrong.

    No one said that criticizing the president was anti-Christian. You did say that Mrs. Ink’s criticism of Gary was “not very Christian.” Why are you better suited to judge Mrs. Ink than she is to judge Gary?

    • #230
  21. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Mrs. Ink (View Comment):

    Your attitude towards the President and his voters is decidedly unChristian.

    I happen to agree with Gary on many of his points. But, even if I didn’t, I would never say that a man’s opinion on someone is not very Christian. That comment, by itself, is not very Christian. One should not judge another’s heart.

    Could you explain why you feel it’s OK to say Mrs. Ink’s comments are “not very Christian,” but she shouldn’t say Gary’s attitude is un-Christian?

    Very simple. Gary is entitled to his opinion on Mr. Trump. Many people have said the same thing, or worse, about Mr. Obama, and I do not think that anyone called those anti-Christian. When someone suggests that by criticizing a president, he is being anti-Christian that is acting as a judge to say what is one’s heart. You can say he is being mean-spirited, if you want. I’d disagree. But to go further, and to bring in Christ, is wrong.

    No one said that criticizing the president was anti-Christian. You did say that Mrs. Ink’s criticism of Gary was “not very Christian.” Why are you better suited to judge Mrs. Ink than she is to judge Gary?

    You are going to continue this until doomsday. I am not playing. What I am saying is that this person started it. I do not agree that what Gary said was un-Christian, and for Mrs. Ink to say it makes that comment as un-Christian as anything. Let is lie. 

    • #231
  22. Roderic Fabian Coolidge
    Roderic Fabian
    @rhfabian

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    Trump allegdedly sold his soul to the Russians to get financing.

    Deutsche Bank facilitated loans from Russians in 2006. The IRS has been giving him a colonoscopy the whole time.

    Let’s see Trump’s tax returns.

    Much of your case against the President relies on your ability to read his mind.  Why don’t you tell us what’s on the tax returns?

    The President has been under continuous audit by the IRS for decades now.  Do you really think that they contain anything illicit?

    • #232
  23. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    Trump allegdedly sold his soul to the Russians to get financing.

    Deutsche Bank facilitated loans from Russians in 2006. The IRS has been giving him a colonoscopy the whole time.

    Let’s see Trump’s tax returns.

    Much of your case against the President relies on your ability to read his mind. Why don’t you tell us what’s on the tax returns?

    The President has been under continuous audit by the IRS for decades now. Do you really think that they contain anything illicit?

    I personally don’t care about his tax returns. I believe we should limit our criticism to the man’s actions and words, not including policy. And his behavior, as well as his nasty demeanor, hardly add up to a case of mind-reading.

    • #233
  24. Roderic Fabian Coolidge
    Roderic Fabian
    @rhfabian

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):
    Conservatives, like me, do not believe that Donald Trump is good for the country, despite most of his policies being good.

    Say what? Can you expand on that? What more can we expect of a conservative politician than good policies?

    A nice pants crease? A normal hair color? Suits that fit? A fulsome vocabulary? Essays in National Review instead of tweets?

    Nothing I can say will convince you. It is one of those things that you either get or you don’t.

    I’ve written several Posts about conservatism since joining Ricochet. Briefly stated, conservatism is not just about policy. Morals + Manners + Policy = Conservatism. If you don’t agree, that’s fine. Just don’t make fun of something I take very seriously.

    I’m not unsympathetic to discomfort about Trump.  He makes me cringe with his verbal antics sometimes.  But, seriously, we fielded candidates with good taste and manners and the liberal media always tore them to pieces.  As nice as the other Republican candidates were I doubt any of them could have taken down the Blue Wall the way Trump did.  And then where would we be?

    Imagine Jeb Bush winning and then following conservative policies, tax cuts, regulation cuts, aggressive moves on foreign trade and illegal immigration, conservative judge appointments.  (I know, I know, but indulge me.)  I don’t think that the opposition coming from the usual suspects on the left would be any less vitriolic than it is now, good manners notwithstanding.

    • #234
  25. George Townsend Inactive
    George Townsend
    @GeorgeTownsend

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):
    Conservatives, like me, do not believe that Donald Trump is good for the country, despite most of his policies being good.

    Say what? Can you expand on that? What more can we expect of a conservative politician than good policies?

    A nice pants crease? A normal hair color? Suits that fit? A fulsome vocabulary? Essays in National Review instead of tweets?

    Nothing I can say will convince you. It is one of those things that you either get or you don’t.

    I’ve written several Posts about conservatism since joining Ricochet. Briefly stated, conservatism is not just about policy. Morals + Manners + Policy = Conservatism. If you don’t agree, that’s fine. Just don’t make fun of something I take very seriously.

    I’m not unsympathetic to discomfort about Trump. He makes me cringe with his verbal antics sometimes. But, seriously, we fielded candidates with good taste and manners and the liberal media always tore them to pieces. As nice as the other Republican candidates were I doubt any of them could have taken down the Blue Wall the way Trump did. And then where would we be?

    Imagine Jeb Bush winning and then following conservative policies, tax cuts, regulation cuts, aggressive moves on foreign trade and illegal immigration, conservative judge appointments. (I know, I know, but indulge me.) I don’t think that the opposition coming from the usual suspects on the left would be any less vitriolic than it is now, good manners notwithstanding.

    “…Taken down the blue wall….” I’m afraid I don’t follow. In any case. why do some of today’s conservatives insist upon letting the Left dictate to us? Of course they hate our philosophy. They always will. To say that this should make us get a character like Trump to counteract is silly beyond beliefs. He is, in fact, verifying what they think of us. By calling people names, and by indulging in their disgusting antics himself, he is saying to the world that there is no difference  between the way conservatives act and the way liberals act. We know there, but Trump is making it seem there isn’t. Politics is about convincing others that you are right. By making excuses for his bombast, all we are doing is convincing others that we have a guy who can be just as noisy and out-of-control as they. In the end, that hurts our cause. 

    • #235
  26. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):
    14

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    …since we became a Party in 1856.

    1854

    You are right.  Our first Presidential Candidate was in 1856.

    • #236
  27. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    TheSockMonkey (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Trump was a jerk violating Reagan’s 11th Commandment…

    Trump was a jerk for claiming that the Colorado and Wyoming systems of choosing delegates are rigged.

    I don’t need to explain the hypocrisy of the first one.

    You just said a day or two ago that the whole primary system was rigged.

    So while you’re busy calling yourself a jerk, I would frankly prefer…

    I was quoting the Master.

    • #237
  28. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):
    Trump allegdedly sold his soul to the Russians to get financing.

    Deutsche Bank facilitated loans from Russians in 2006. The IRS has been giving him a colonoscopy the whole time.

    Let’s see Trump’s tax returns.

    Much of your case against the President relies on your ability to read his mind. Why don’t you tell us what’s on the tax returns?

    The President has been under continuous audit by the IRS for decades now. Do you really think that they contain anything illicit?

    My point was that Trump promised to release his tax returns, but never did so.  After the election, Sarah Sanders said that the public didn’t care about the issue.  

    No, the issue is that Trump lied.  I believe that he had no intention of ever releasing his taxes.

    • #238
  29. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):

    Roderic Fabian (View Comment):

    George Townsend (View Comment):
    Conservatives, like me, do not believe that Donald Trump is good for the country, despite most of his policies being good.

    Say what? Can you expand on that? What more can we expect of a conservative politician than good policies?

    A nice pants crease? A normal hair color? Suits that fit? A fulsome vocabulary? Essays in National Review instead of tweets?

    Nothing I can say will convince you. It is one of those things that you either get or you don’t.

    I’ve written several Posts about conservatism since joining Ricochet. Briefly stated, conservatism is not just about policy. Morals + Manners + Policy = Conservatism. If you don’t agree, that’s fine. Just don’t make fun of something I take very seriously.

    I’m not unsympathetic to discomfort about Trump. He makes me cringe with his verbal antics sometimes. But, seriously, we fielded candidates with good taste and manners and the liberal media always tore them to pieces. As nice as the other Republican candidates were I doubt any of them could have taken down the Blue Wall the way Trump did. And then where would we be?

    Imagine Jeb Bush winning and then following conservative policies, tax cuts, regulation cuts, aggressive moves on foreign trade and illegal immigration, conservative judge appointments. (I know, I know, but indulge me.) I don’t think that the opposition coming from the usual suspects on the left would be any less vitriolic than it is now, good manners notwithstanding.

    Almost any Republican would have won in 2016.  Since the 22nd Amendment was adopted in 1951, American voters have alternated between the two parties every eight years in 15 out of 17 elections, with the only exceptions concerning the Greatest President of the Twentieth Century, Ronald Reagan.

    What is remarkable is not that Trump won, but that he almost lost an almost sure thing.  We could have President Rubio, Cruz, Kasich or Jeb.  Instead we are stuck with Trump, who is leading our party over the cliff.

    • #239
  30. TheSockMonkey Inactive
    TheSockMonkey
    @TheSockMonkey

    George Townsend (View Comment):
    You are going to continue this until doomsday. I am not playing. What I am saying is that this person started it. I do not agree that what Gary said was un-Christian, and for Mrs. Ink to say it makes that comment as un-Christian as anything. Let is lie. 

    I’ll take my answer off the air.

    • #240
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