The Future Is Unwritten

We’ve got a packed, super-sized show for you this week, so let’s get right to it: first up (right at the top of the show), tech columnist Benedict Evans who takes us through the Facebook v. Apple privacy controversy and explains why Apple may not have the moral high ground they think they do. Then, Grace Church High School math teacher Paul Rossi (you must read the article he wrote for our friend Bari Weiss’ site explaining what happened to him) on the insane (that’s really the only word for it) dynamics that are playing out in some of our schools right now. It’s an eye opening and very worrying conversation. Also, was Apollo 11 astronaut Michael Collins really “the loneliest man in the universe” during his moon mission? We ponder that one and who might go to Mars with Elon Musk and who definitely won’t be going.

Music from this week’s show: I Was in the House When the House Burned Down by Warren Zevon

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  1. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    MISTER BITCOIN (View Comment):

     

     

    What this actually means is, that government adopted a deflationary monetary standard in a world of deflation from trade and automation. Maybe not this extreme, but we should have done that 30 years ago. If money is deflating from progress all of the time, people don’t need that much money or work to get by. 

    • #31
  2. Mr. Michael Garrett Lincoln
    Mr. Michael Garrett
    @MichaelGarrett

    Everyone go out now and find a copy of “In the Shadow of the Moon” directed by David Sington and Christopher Riley.  

     

    • #32
  3. Samuel Block Support
    Samuel Block
    @SamuelBlock

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Rossi was great, but I wish our humble hosts had seen fit to drill down a bit more on the subject of how many kids are embracing Wokeness.

    Rossi said that girls are more likely to climb aboard the Woke train than guys are — but that was it. He didn’t elaborate, and Peter, James, and Rob didn’t follow-up.

    What’s more, you could tell how eager Rob was to protect his belief that young people are not internalizing the Woke worldview.

    ”They‘ll say whatever they have to in order to get the A,” Rob is fond of telling people. Rob’s been saying variations of this line for years.

    Now, Rob is no dummy (obviously), but he’s clearly in denial here. He clings stubbornly to the belief that young people have the same outlook today that they did in the ‘70s, ‘80s and ’90s. Rob prefers to think that the outlook that prevailed in Tom Wolfe’s college-based novel “I Am Charlotte Simmons” still obtains in 2021.

    If only. The truth is, we now have two generations of young people (Millennials and Gen Z) that regard things like Equity & Inclusion, Modern “Gender Science,” and Critical Race Theory — as received wisdom. Polling indicates that these kids unquestioningly accept these ideas — and why not? They’ve been getting them from an IV drip since the age of four.

    Okay, back to the subject at hand. This is what Rossi told Megyn Kelly on her podcast two weeks ago. He said that as far as he could tell, about 50% of boys and 80% of girls are Woke “true believers.” The rest are skeptics.

    Now consider those numbers for a moment (numbers, by the way, that comport with recent national polling): In a high school cafeteria of, say, 200 people – – equal parts boys and girls – – only 70 of the students can rightly be called skeptical.

    The other 130 are fully on board the Woke train.

    So, roughly 2/3 of kids are on board the Woke train.

    And, not surprisingly, that number is only growing.

    My experience is that it’s a superficial internalization-not to say it isn’t damaging. I don’t really know any conservatives my age but something interesting happens when I talk to my peers if it comes up that I’m not on the left. At first they’re surprised, but they quickly dive into all sorts of topics that they’ve become uneasy expressing around most of their friends. In fact, just the other day I was chatting with an ultra-hip DJ who was complaining about how some musicians he likes were cancelled. I didn’t even say anything to him, he just started going.

    Before Woke college students already loved prefacing statements with, “In our consumerist, capitalist society,” and they always seemed very impressed with themselves when they observed things like the fact that rich kids have advantages over poor kids. The difference that I see is that students used to talk this way in class, but when they were let out, they searched for the party. Now it’s brought to the party-oftentimes by a person with absolutely no sex appeal.

    I guess my point is that I think Rob is on to something. Progressives are really pushing their luck, and if the right can shift to being a party that encourages young people to be more confident, even a little reckless, I think this could be mostly cleared up in a year or so.

    • #33
  4. JennaStocker Member
    JennaStocker
    @JennaStocker

    Another engaging and topical show. What most stokes me is the hyper-focus on these elite, 1% schools. I don’t know if the well-heeled fully understand how foreign this concept is to working-class Americans. These elite (prep!) schools’ tuition is double my annual pay. These schools, the pipeline they perpetuate, are as unattainable as living on Mars These wealthy parents are punching an exclusive ticket granted at birth. It is the opposite of any meritorious effort. And they must be clear-eyed about what that ticket symbolizes: the continuous nepotism of elitist society. And as long as the incentives for these schools to grant admission based on social & economic status is greater than any negative consequences for lack of a classical liberal education, nothing changes. The symbol will always be of utmost importance. Get to Brearly, go to Smith, Yale, Harvard, etc., get a look from top Corporations in the nation. The cycle continues. Education on the traditional sense is secondary, at most. But conservatives who beat the drum won’t answer this: if faced with similar candidates for a job/internship, would they give more weight to a Columbia student, or one from Tiny Unknown School USA? They might have received a more authentic education, but who gets the look? The wealthy subscribe to a world that bars entry to parents like me whose choice isn’t “60k and maybe learn some CRT nonsense – BUT they’ll get the golden ticket to a comfortable life” vs public school. It’s “how can I take on another job to send my kid to private school so they get a good edu BUT the chances for getting that Gold ticket are still zero. It’s so incredibly hard to relate to. As long as there are enough believers in the pipeline nothing changes. The divisions persist. Parents will keep their mouths shut & write the check for that golden ticket.

    The big difference now that has larger consequences for average Americans is that children are being placed as centers of a political world. They are so often used as tools for agendas, they finally believe the burden of change – and the success or failure or an equitable society – rests on them. And adults are complicit. From gun control to climate change to now race, ‘children are the future’, which is different than the 1960s sit-in movements because there’s no peace & love aspect. It’s all or nothing evil & bigotry versus survival and ‘empathy or compassion’. And now as Bari Weiss has many times noted, those kids are now taking their cause to the adult/work environment. Sorry for the long comment, but it was a great show. Thank you!

    • #34
  5. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    ericB (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):
    …at this point the only “correction” might be to wait for it to crash and burn on its own.

    One might also nudge it along by shining a bright and revealing light on the internal inconsistencies.  It would be an important part of a beneficial education for people, young and old, to realize that the movement is at odds with reality and cannot live effectively within its own dogmas.

    But they believe they can re-make reality to suit themselves, and I don’t think they can be argued out of that with logic.

    • #35
  6. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Al Sparks (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    But on the serious side, I’m not very optimistic about a long-term colony on Mars until there’s something set up in place to deal with the less-than-40% gravity. Without that, even if there were a way to return to Earth, it’s likely that anyone who had lived on Mars for very long would not be able to come back anyway. And any children born on Mars might never be able to even visit Earth.

    Another vision is starting to form, that of rotating space stations where colonists would spend most of their time, and where the gravity of earth could be emulated.

    Another problem to solve is to protect humans from the radiation of space long term.

    Routine shuttling people to and from the space stations would require some major advancements in technology to be workable/affordable.

    • #36
  7. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    JennaStocker (View Comment):

    Another engaging and topical show. What most stokes me is the hyper-focus on these elite, 1% schools. I don’t know if the well-heeled fully understand how foreign this concept is to working-class Americans. These elite (prep!) schools’ tuition is double my annual pay. These schools, the pipeline they perpetuate, are as unattainable as living on Mars These wealthy parents are punching an exclusive ticket granted at birth. It is the opposite of any meritorious effort. And they must be clear-eyed about what that ticket symbolizes: the continuous nepotism of elitist society. And as long as the incentives for these schools to grant admission based on social & economic status is greater than any negative consequences for lack of a classical liberal education, nothing changes. The symbol will always be of utmost importance. Get to Brearly, go to Smith, Yale, Harvard, etc., get a look from top Corporations in the nation. The cycle continues. Education on the traditional sense is secondary, at most. But conservatives who beat the drum won’t answer this: if faced with similar candidates for a job/internship, would they give more weight to a Columbia student, or one from Tiny Unknown School USA? They might have received a more authentic education, but who gets the look? The wealthy subscribe to a world that bars entry to parents like me whose choice isn’t “60k and maybe learn some CRT nonsense – BUT they’ll get the golden ticket to a comfortable life” vs public school. It’s “how can I take on another job to send my kid to private school so they get a good edu BUT the chances for getting that Gold ticket are still zero. It’s so incredibly hard to relate to. As long as there are enough believers in the pipeline nothing changes. The divisions persist. Parents will keep their mouths shut & write the check for that golden ticket.

    The big difference now that has larger consequences for average Americans is that children are being placed as centers of a political world. They are so often used as tools for agendas, they finally believe the burden of change – and the success or failure or an equitable society – rests on them. And adults are complicit. From gun control to climate change to now race, ‘children are the future’, which is different than the 1960s sit-in movements because there’s no peace & love aspect. It’s all or nothing evil & bigotry versus survival and ‘empathy or compassion’. And now as Bari Weiss has many times noted, those kids are now taking their cause to the adult/work environment. Sorry for the long comment, but it was a great show. Thank you!

    So much of private-school discussion reminds me of this bit from The Critic:

     

    • #37
  8. filmklassik Inactive
    filmklassik
    @filmklassik

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Rossi was great, but I wish our humble hosts had seen fit to drill down a bit more on the subject of how many kids are embracing Wokeness.

    So, roughly 2/3 of kids are on board the Woke train.

    And, not surprisingly, that number is only growing.

    My experience is that it’s a superficial internalization-not to say it isn’t damaging. I don’t really know any conservatives my age but something interesting happens when I talk to my peers if it comes up that I’m not on the left. At first they’re surprised, but they quickly dive into all sorts of topics that they’ve become uneasy expressing around most of their friends. In fact, just the other day I was chatting with an ultra-hip DJ who was complaining about how some musicians he likes were cancelled. I didn’t even say anything to him, he just started going.

    Before Woke college students already loved prefacing statements with, “In our consumerist, capitalist society,” and they always seemed very impressed with themselves when they observed things like the fact that rich kids have advantages over poor kids. The difference that I see is that students used to talk this way in class, but when they were let out, they searched for the party. Now it’s brought to the party-oftentimes by a person with absolutely no sex appeal.

    I guess my point is that I think Rob is on to something. Progressives are really pushing their luck, and if the right can shift to being a party that encourages young people to be more confident, even a little reckless, I think this could be mostly cleared up in a year or so.

    No, Rob’s not on to something.  Sorry.  And no, it can’t “be mostly cleared up in a year or so.”  It’s been metastasizing for several now, and the reason for that is simple:  Wokeness is a religion.  It has all the features of a religion:  Dogma, scripture, liturgies, holy men (and women), heresies, heretics, infidels, Original Sin, an imperviousness to logic and data, a hostility toward questions and debate …

    It’s a religion, one its adherents derive genuine meaning from.   John McWhorter has written extensively about this.  So have many other people.  It’s a religion.  And it is not unique to America, either.  For the past several years, it has been endemic to the West.  

    And — once again, and crucially — it’s growing.  

    • #38
  9. SParker Member
    SParker
    @SParker

    Everyone knows the purpose of learning base-8 is so you can grow up to program a Digital Equipment PDP-11 or PDP-8 in assembly language.  The reason for that radix being convenient for the purpose escapes me.  I’ve grown up too far.

    As for old-time education…if you say the word “tedium” to me it creates an image of myself (as young Ebenezer Scrooge) sitting in a 6th-grade classroom in the attic of an elementary school in Valley City ND multiplying and dividing unreasonably large by even more unreasonably large numbers on a beautiful Spring afternoon.  (Fun fact: a future congressman for the state was sitting right behind me doing same.)  Much later it occurred to me:  “O Snap!  They were training us to become clerks in a dry-goods emporium in Aberdeen SD.  I get it now!”

    • #39
  10. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Well done, except at the end, there was a question of what would happen when the Derek Chauvin verdict would come in?  Was that from last week, and put on to this show by mistake?

    • #40
  11. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    SParker (View Comment):

    Everyone knows the purpose of learning base-8 is so you can grow up to program a Digital Equipment PDP-11 or PDP-8 in assembly language.

     

    Indeed!

     

    The reason for that radix being convenient for the purpose escapes me. I’ve grown up too far.

     

    It’s because the PDP-8 (and a few other systems) instruction codes translated easily into groups of 3 bits, and 3 bits make up a base 8 (i.e., Octal) digit.

    For example, the first/top 3 bits were the Op Code.

    000 = 0 = Logical AND from memory address content with Accumulator (AC).

    001 = 1 = Two’s Complement Add (TAD) from memory address content with Accumulator (AC).

    010 = 2 = Increment and Skip if Zero (ISZ) with memory address content.

    011 = 3 = Deposit and Clear Accumulator (DCA) to memory address content.

    100 = 4 = Jump to Subroutine (JMS) to memory address.

    101 = 5 = Unconditional Jump (JMP) to memory address.

    110 = 6 = I/O instruction.

    111 = 7 = Operate instruction, mostly dealing with the Accumulator content (AC) and/or the Link (overflow/carry) bit (L).

     

    If the 12-bit PDP-8 (for example) instruction codes are expressed as 3 4-bit hexadecimal “digits” rather than 4 3-bit octal “digits,” the address codes get mixed in with the op codes, etc, and it’s a big mess.

     

    All Glory to the PDP-8!

     

     

     

    • #41
  12. J Ro Member
    J Ro
    @JRo

    Peter mentions manliness and courage coupled with military training as attributes of our late 20th C astronauts and wonders if it’s stuff that still exists.

    Alfred de Vigney described it beautifully in Servitude and Grandeur of Arms (1835):

    “I’ve been trying to account to myself for the essence of that attraction which resides for us in the blade of a sword. It’s an irresistible pull which keeps us in army service in spite of ourselves, and makes us be for ever waiting for a crisis or a war. I don’t know if it isn’t true to say, or write, that there inheres in armies a passion which is peculiar to them and gives them their life; a passion that partakes neither of the love of glory nor of ambition, but is a sort of hand-to-hand combat against Destiny, a struggle which is the source of a thousand delights unknown to the rest of mankind, and whose secret victories are replete with magnificence: in brief — the love of danger!

    “What is it that sustains the sailor on the sea, pray? — that consoles him for the tedium of being a man who sees only other men? He sails, and says goodbye to the land; goodbye to women’s smiles, goodbye to their love; goodbye to his chosen friends and to the gentle customs of his life; goodbye to his cherished old parents; goodbye to the natural beauties of the earth, to the trees, to the greensward, to the sweet-smelling flowers, to the shady cliffs and the melancholy woods thronged with wild and silent creatures; goodbye to the great cities, to the endless activity of the arts, to the sublime eruption of thought into the idleness of life, to the elegant, mysterious and passionate relationships of the great world: to all these he says goodbye — and sails. He sails to encounter three enemies: water, air, and man; and every moment of his life he will have to do battle with one of them. This magnificent tension frees him from tedium. He lives amidst continual victories; it’s a victory in itself to sail across the ocean and not be swallowed up in shipwreck; a victory to go where one chooses, and to plunge through in the teeth of contrary winds; a victory to run before the tempest, and to make it follow like a servant; a victory to sleep in the midst of it and establish there a working place. The sailor reclines on the ocean’s back with a regal feeling, like St Jerome on his lion, and rejoices in solitude, to which he is wedded. And it’s the love of danger which sustains him, which means he is never idle for a moment, that he’s conscious of a struggle and has a goal.”

    • #42
  13. Samuel Block Support
    Samuel Block
    @SamuelBlock

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Rossi was great, but I wish our humble hosts had seen fit to drill down a bit more on the subject of how many kids are embracing Wokeness.

    So, roughly 2/3 of kids are on board the Woke train.

    And, not surprisingly, that number is only growing.

    My experience is that it’s a superficial internalization-not to say it isn’t damaging. I don’t really know any conservatives my age but something interesting happens when I talk to my peers if it comes up that I’m not on the left. At first they’re surprised, but they quickly dive into all sorts of topics that they’ve become uneasy expressing around most of their friends. In fact, just the other day I was chatting with an ultra-hip DJ who was complaining about how some musicians he likes were cancelled. I didn’t even say anything to him, he just started going.

    Before Woke college students already loved prefacing statements with, “In our consumerist, capitalist society,” and they always seemed very impressed with themselves when they observed things like the fact that rich kids have advantages over poor kids. The difference that I see is that students used to talk this way in class, but when they were let out, they searched for the party. Now it’s brought to the party-oftentimes by a person with absolutely no sex appeal.

    I guess my point is that I think Rob is on to something. Progressives are really pushing their luck, and if the right can shift to being a party that encourages young people to be more confident, even a little reckless, I think this could be mostly cleared up in a year or so.

    No, Rob’s not on to something. Sorry. And no, it can’t “be mostly cleared up in a year or so.” It’s been metastasizing for several now, and the reason for that is simple: Wokeness is a religion. It has all the features of a religion: Dogma, scripture, liturgies, holy men (and women), heresies, heretics, infidels, Original Sin, an imperviousness to logic and data, a hostility toward questions and debate …

    It’s a religion, one its adherents derive genuine meaning from. John McWhorter has written extensively about this. So have many other people. It’s a religion. And it is not unique to America, either. For the past several years, it has been endemic to the West.

    And — once again, and crucially — it’s growing.

    I’m absolutely confident that it’s not growing, not it any meaningful sense. It had been growing for decades, accelerated when I was in grade school (Bush years) through matriculation (Obama) and hit its peak when Trump was elected. I went back to college to a state school in 2017 to get a liberal arts degree. I’ll concede to other members on almost every subject, except on what the kiddies are up to. Sorry. That’s my territory.

    Wokeness has crested. There’s way more of it than there should be, but less of it than there was yesterday. Its decline is likely to continue and it could be accelerated if ordinary conservatives can settle on some sort of hopeful messaging. It’s not their strong suit, I know…

    I really like John McWhorter but he’s an amiable atheist. He doesn’t know the difference between valuable religion and the innumerable worthless counterparts. And for all the flak Rob takes around here, I’m disappointed that there’s less appreciation that he at least admits he’s actually conservative, even if a “squishy” one. McWhorter is smart enough to know that’s what he is but it’s a dirty word among respectable New Yorkers, so he won’t own it.

    I agree this is a disease. I really hope we beat it. The good news is that we can, but it’s no forgone conclusion. I hadn’t heard of Paul Rossi until a few days ago, nor Andrew Guffman until a week before that. I’d bet it all on the belief that America has others cut from the same cloth. If we have one-tenth of the enemy’s numbers cut from that cloth, we win. No problemo. I am already betting a lot on the belief that we have more than one-tenth their forces. (Trust me, becoming a conservative while being single and white and male isn’t the most advantageous social move, but I’m not suicidal.)

    We’re growing.

    • #43
  14. Samuel Block Support
    Samuel Block
    @SamuelBlock

    And here’s what I mean filmklassik. This video is 9 hours old, viewed 157,000 times, on a Saturday no less.

    I remember when this guy’s channel was small. He was just another Californian who liked eating healthy, exercise and meditation/“spirituality,” but who felt compelled to poke fun at how hyper-serious these scenes were. A handful of jokes, left-wing outrage and a million subscribers later and what do we have… a conservative grown man.

    • #44
  15. Cosmik Phred Member
    Cosmik Phred
    @CosmikPhred

    Functionary (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Well, he’s agreed with my choices in the past, and wished he had used my choice instead.

    Sorry, @ kedavis. My criticism was unkind. But, I think the Blue Yeti made the right call. Warren Zevon, may he RIP, has met the test of time.

     

    Yes, great call on Warren, the self-described heavy metal folk singer. 

    • #45
  16. filmklassik Inactive
    filmklassik
    @filmklassik

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    No, Rob’s not on to something. Sorry. And no, it can’t “be mostly cleared up in a year or so.” It’s been metastasizing for several now, and the reason for that is simple: Wokeness is a religion. It has all the features of a religion: Dogma, scripture, liturgies, holy men (and women), heresies, heretics, infidels, Original Sin, an imperviousness to logic and data, a hostility toward questions and debate …

    It’s a religion, one its adherents derive genuine meaning from. John McWhorter has written extensively about this. So have many other people. It’s a religion. And it is not unique to America, either. For the past several years, it has been endemic to the West.

    And — once again, and crucially — it’s growing.

    I’m absolutely confident that it’s not growing, not it any meaningful sense.

    Wokeness has crested. There’s way more of it than there should be, but less of it than there was yesterday. 

    Okay, I really, really, really disagree with this.  Strongly.  Strenuously.  In no uncertain terms.   What you’re saying right now makes zero sense to me since it comports with no measurable data or any observable cultural patterns.  In fact it feels more like wishcasting than anything else.  

    Regardless, you’re entitled to your own assessment of the situation, and perhaps my strongest rebuttal (beyond the world outside our doors) is time.  You’re making these pronouncements (“Wokeness has crested” and “There’s less of it than there was yesterday”) on May 1, 2021.  I’ve taken a screenshot of your reply.  We can revisit it at a later date.

    Meanwhile, I’m curious to know what you’d have to see in order to revise your beliefs? — in order to say, “Uh oh.  Maybe Wokeness hasn’t crested and things are as bad as McWhorter and co. indicated“?

    Seriously — and please be as specific as you can — what would you need to see in order to revise your beliefs? 

    • #46
  17. Peter Robinson Contributor
    Peter Robinson
    @PeterRobinson

    Al Sparks (View Comment):

    Listening to the latter part of the podcast where they discussed Michael Collins passing and the astronauts who first landed on the moon, I found the discussion to be disjointed, starting with the assertion by Peter that you don’t see that kind of a combination of military competence, training and courage anymore. First, they’re a dying breed, but there are still pilots landing on aircraft carriers. But if you were to look for that kind of military based courage and competence, look towards the various elite fighters such as the Navy SEALs and the Army Special Forces (Green Berets).

    The seat of your pants pilot is functionally extinct. And depending on a pilot like Neil Armstrong to land on Mars is very unlikely. The landings will be automated. I don’t see the need, by the way, to designate a pilot to be the mission commander. The emphasis will be on scientific and engineering survival skills and leadership will come from that still to be formed community.

    The astronauts were a generation or two from the pilots as exemplified by Charles Lindbergh, and their generation was exemplified by Chuck Yeager. By the way, to show how informal things were becoming, no one called Lindbergh, Chuck.

    On the optimism, or lack thereof, that Peter Robinson was decrying, I’d remind him that while the moon program started on a wave of optimism, when the people running the country were the people who had fought in World War II as young men and boys, by the time of the first moon landing occurred the country was in a funk that had only just started and was to last for another 10-15 years. The first moon landing was the last vestiges of that optimism of the 1950’s and early nineteen-sixties.

    And the moon landing wasn’t an example of capitalism and innovation, but government and innovation. Yes, there was some capitalism mixed in with civilian contractors, but the moon landings were an example of a newly created bureaucracy, NASA. Often newly created government agencies show a lot of energy and innovation before they become ossified. Another example is the Manhattan Project, which turned into the Atomic Energy Commission and then the Department of Energy. Since Peter brought up nuclear power, I thought I’d mention that too.

    But let’s talk about the optimism of the early 1960’s, and what it mostly brought us. It’s an example of pride going before the fall. There was a war in Vietnam and a war on poverty, brought about by that same optimism which turned into arrogance. The Great Society programs were an example of new government agencies imbued with energy and that same optimism as NASA, until they became ossified and ineffective. In the end, they weakened private charitable groups and state and local governments. And that centralization is a big reason why this country is so divided, since it attempts to impose a uniformity that this country is too large to absorb.

    And compare the astronauts that Peter admires so much to an explorer like Christopher Columbus. Columbus raised the money for this venture, arranged for his ships to be built, and then led the expedition.

    The astronauts were the tip of a very big spear, and their contribution was very small compared to Columbus. They actually were very competent and brave specialists who were very focused on what they had to do but they, exemplified by Neil Armstrong, weren’t people with a lot of imagination or vision. Let’s face it. They were expendable.

    Elon Musk, if he’s successful with his venture to land people on Mars, will likely be remembered more than the first crew that sets foot on Mars. And rightfully so. And it’s a truer example of capitalism and innovation, though like Columbus, he’s getting a lot of his funding from a government.

    You make a whole slew of fascinating points.

    • #47
  18. Peter Robinson Contributor
    Peter Robinson
    @PeterRobinson

    JennaStocker (View Comment):

    Another engaging and topical show. What most stokes me is the hyper-focus on these elite, 1% schools. I don’t know if the well-heeled fully understand how foreign this concept is to working-class Americans. These elite (prep!) schools’ tuition is double my annual pay. These schools, the pipeline they perpetuate, are as unattainable as living on Mars These wealthy parents are punching an exclusive ticket granted at birth. It is the opposite of any meritorious effort. And they must be clear-eyed about what that ticket symbolizes: the continuous nepotism of elitist society. And as long as the incentives for these schools to grant admission based on social & economic status is greater than any negative consequences for lack of a classical liberal education, nothing changes. The symbol will always be of utmost importance. Get to Brearly, go to Smith, Yale, Harvard, etc., get a look from top Corporations in the nation. The cycle continues. Education on the traditional sense is secondary, at most. But conservatives who beat the drum won’t answer this: if faced with similar candidates for a job/internship, would they give more weight to a Columbia student, or one from Tiny Unknown School USA? They might have received a more authentic education, but who gets the look? The wealthy subscribe to a world that bars entry to parents like me whose choice isn’t “60k and maybe learn some CRT nonsense – BUT they’ll get the golden ticket to a comfortable life” vs public school. It’s “how can I take on another job to send my kid to private school so they get a good edu BUT the chances for getting that Gold ticket are still zero. It’s so incredibly hard to relate to. As long as there are enough believers in the pipeline nothing changes. The divisions persist. Parents will keep their mouths shut & write the check for that golden ticket.

    The big difference now that has larger consequences for average Americans is that children are being placed as centers of a political world. They are so often used as tools for agendas, they finally believe the burden of change – and the success or failure or an equitable society – rests on them. And adults are complicit. From gun control to climate change to now race, ‘children are the future’, which is different than the 1960s sit-in movements because there’s no peace & love aspect. It’s all or nothing evil & bigotry versus survival and ‘empathy or compassion’. And now as Bari Weiss has many times noted, those kids are now taking their cause to the adult/work environment. Sorry for the long comment, but it was a great show. Thank you!

    Just looked it up: The median household income this year–and I repeat, this figure is for household income, meaning that it combines the income of every member of the household, husband, wife and any working children–is $66,000. In other words, Jenna, you’re right again as usual: For most of us, a school that charges $60,000 a year in tuition might as well be on another planet.

    • #48
  19. Samuel Block Support
    Samuel Block
    @SamuelBlock

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    Wokeness has crested. There’s way more of it than there should be, but less of it than there was yesterday.

    Okay, I really, really, really disagree with this. Strongly. Strenuously. In no uncertain terms. What you’re saying right now makes zero sense to me since it comports with no measurable data or any observable cultural patterns. In fact it feels more like wishcasting than anything else.

    I doubt I’m anywhere close to being in the consensus here, but I’m still very confident. I’m certain it isn’t wish-casting. I’m well aware of the consequences if you’re right. I’ve thought about them and dealt with some of them (all sorts of strained or broken relationships). I was raised around this lefty-religion. If by specifics you mean relevant wide-ranging stories to build my case: I swear I could go on for hours. 

    I’m no statistician and I wouldn’t blame someone for dismissing my emphatically un-humble opinion for that, but would you really think I’m ridiculous if I said that polls on what young people think might not be all that reliable after election cycles. 

    Regardless, you’re entitled to your own assessment of the situation, and perhaps my strongest rebuttal (beyond the world outside our doors) is time. You’re making these pronouncements (“Wokeness has crested” and “There’s less of it than there was yesterday”) on May 1, 2021. I’ve taken a screenshot of your reply. We can revisit it at a later date.

    Seriously — and please be as specific as you can — what would you need to see in order to revise your beliefs?

    Well I wouldn’t say my beliefs are set in stone. I’ll revise them as soon as I realize they’re wrong. I do reconsider them often but my general take is somewhat consistent… I think. 🤔

    I’m curious to know what you’d have to see in order to revise your beliefs? — in order to say, “Uh oh. Maybe Wokeness hasn’t crested and things are as bad as McWhorter and co. indicated“?

    I’m to the right of JM pretty much all around. That’s why I vote the way I do. He’s the one who voted for Joe Biden. 

    • #49
  20. JennaStocker Member
    JennaStocker
    @JennaStocker

    Peter Robinson (View Comment):

    JennaStocker (View Comment):

    Another engaging and topical show. What most stokes me is the hyper-focus on these elite, 1% schools. I don’t know if the well-heeled fully understand how foreign this concept is to working-class Americans. These elite (prep!) schools’ tuition is double my annual pay. These schools, the pipeline they perpetuate, are as unattainable as living on Mars These wealthy parents are punching an exclusive ticket granted at birth. It is the opposite of any meritorious effort. And they must be clear-eyed about what that ticket symbolizes: the continuous nepotism of elitist society. And as long as the incentives for these schools to grant admission based on social & economic status is greater than any negative consequences for lack of a classical liberal education, nothing changes. The symbol will always be of utmost importance. Get to Brearly, go to Smith, Yale, Harvard, etc., get a look from top Corporations in the nation. The cycle continues. Education on the traditional sense is secondary, at most. But conservatives who beat the drum won’t answer this: if faced with similar candidates for a job/internship, would they give more weight to a Columbia student, or one from Tiny Unknown School USA? They might have received a more authentic education, but who gets the look? The wealthy subscribe to a world that bars entry to parents like me whose choice isn’t “60k and maybe learn some CRT nonsense – BUT they’ll get the golden ticket to a comfortable life” vs public school. It’s “how can I take on another job to send my kid to private school so they get a good edu BUT the chances for getting that Gold ticket are still zero. It’s so incredibly hard to relate to. As long as there are enough believers in the pipeline nothing changes. The divisions persist. Parents will keep their mouths shut & write the check for that golden ticket.

    The big difference now that has larger consequences for average Americans is that children are being placed as centers of a political world. They are so often used as tools for agendas, they finally believe the burden of change – and the success or failure or an equitable society – rests on them. And adults are complicit. From gun control to climate change to now race, ‘children are the future’, which is different than the 1960s sit-in movements because there’s no peace & love aspect. It’s all or nothing evil & bigotry versus survival and ‘empathy or compassion’. And now as Bari Weiss has many times noted, those kids are now taking their cause to the adult/work environment. Sorry for the long comment, but it was a great show. Thank you!

    Just looked it up: The median household income this year–and I repeat, this figure is for household income, meaning that it combines the income of every member of the household, husband, wife and any working children–is $66,000. In other words, Jenna, you’re right again as usual: For most of us, a school that charges $60,000 a year in tuition might as well be on another planet.

    I just really appreciate the intelligent discussion, and having such openness to different perspectives. Especially on this issue, it seems easier to be entrenched in one’s station or socioeconomic situation without considering the impact of American communities across the country. $60k a year is twice my annual income, and I would absolutely find a way to make the best future for my children as I could- just as millions of parents would likely do the same. The stakes are different but the goals are the same. Thanks again, and keep up the great conversations!

    • #50
  21. filmklassik Inactive
    filmklassik
    @filmklassik

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    Samuel Block (View Comment):

    Wokeness has crested. There’s way more of it than there should be, but less of it than there was yesterday.

    Okay, I really, really, really disagree with this. Strongly. Strenuously. In no uncertain terms. What you’re saying right now makes zero sense to me since it comports with no measurable data or any observable cultural patterns. In fact it feels more like wishcasting than anything else.

    I doubt I’m anywhere close to being in the consensus here, but I’m still very confident. I’m certain it isn’t wish-casting. I’m well aware of the consequences if you’re right. I’ve thought about them and dealt with some of them (all sorts of strained or broken relationships). I was raised around this lefty-religion. If by specifics you mean relevant wide-ranging stories to build my case: I swear I could go on for hours.

    I’m no statistician and I wouldn’t blame someone for dismissing my emphatically un-humble opinion for that, but would you really think I’m ridiculous if I said that polls on what young people think might not be all that reliable after election cycles.

    Regardless, you’re entitled to your own assessment of the situation, and perhaps my strongest rebuttal (beyond the world outside our doors) is time. You’re making these pronouncements (“Wokeness has crested” and “There’s less of it than there was yesterday”) on May 1, 2021. I’ve taken a screenshot of your reply. We can revisit it at a later date.

    Seriously — and please be as specific as you can — what would you need to see in order to revise your beliefs?

    Well I wouldn’t say my beliefs are set in stone. I’ll revise them as soon as I realize they’re wrong. I do reconsider them often but my general take is somewhat consistent… I think. 🤔

    I’m curious to know what you’d have to see in order to revise your beliefs? — in order to say, “Uh oh. Maybe Wokeness hasn’t crested and things are as bad as McWhorter and co. indicated“?

    I’m to the right of JM pretty much all around. That’s why I vote the way I do. He’s the one who voted for Joe Biden.

    Yes, he did.  But McWhorter understands that the culture is more important than presidential elections — much more important — because elections are a function of the culture.  Indeed, the culture is everything.  And if the Right would focus more on the culture (i.e., education; scripted entertainment; education; news platforms; social media; and of course, education) the Enlightenment (aka Classic Liberalism) would not be on life support, and the religion of Wokeness would not be ascendant.  

    • #51
  22. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    filmklassik (View Comment):
    Yes, he did.  But McWhorter understands that the culture is more important than presidential elections — much more important — because elections are a function of the culture.  Indeed, the culture is everything.  And if the Right would focus more on the culture (i.e., education; scripted entertainment; education; news platforms; social media; and of course, education) the Enlightenment (aka Classic Liberalism) would not be on life support, and the religion of Wokeness would not be ascendant.  

    Okay, but how does voting for Biden HELP the CULTURE?

    • #52
  23. filmklassik Inactive
    filmklassik
    @filmklassik

    kedavis (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):
    Yes, he did. But McWhorter understands that the culture is more important than presidential elections — much more important — because elections are a function of the culture. Indeed, the culture is everything. And if the Right would focus more on the culture (i.e., education; scripted entertainment; education; news platforms; social media; and of course, education) the Enlightenment (aka Classic Liberalism) would not be on life support, and the religion of Wokeness would not be ascendant.

    Okay, but how does voting for Biden HELP the CULTURE?

    It doesn’t. And it’s not clear to me that a Trump victory would’ve helped it either.  Which is why I didn’t vote top-of-ticket last year or in 2016, either.  All of the candidates disgusted me. 

    But one thing I do know for sure — sure as the sun is going to rise in the east tomorrow — is that the GOP’s fixation on elections elections elections and who’s ahead here and are we going to keep the House and the Senate and Trump would’ve done this instead of that and Trump would never have let that happen and Trump Trump Trump Trump …

    — is a big reason why we are losing the culture.  

    What the Ricochet crowd and almost all Republicans everywhere tend to do is keep their eye on the ballot box and yield everything else – – media, education, entertainment, HR departments, publishing, more and more churches, Madison Avenue, you name it – – everything else – – everything cultural – – everything that makes a big difference in our daily lives and that, ironically, eventually affects the ballot box – – they leave all these things to the Left.  And it’s murdering us.

    You and I have gone around and around on this before, kedavis.  Many times.  

    The culture does not count for very much.  Trust me, I wouldn’t be pounding the table like this if it did.  

    Once again:  The culture does not count for very much.  

    It counts for everything.   

    • #53
  24. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):
    Yes, he did. But McWhorter understands that the culture is more important than presidential elections — much more important — because elections are a function of the culture. Indeed, the culture is everything. And if the Right would focus more on the culture (i.e., education; scripted entertainment; education; news platforms; social media; and of course, education) the Enlightenment (aka Classic Liberalism) would not be on life support, and the religion of Wokeness would not be ascendant.

    Okay, but how does voting for Biden HELP the CULTURE?

    It doesn’t. And it’s not clear to me that a Trump victory would’ve helped it either. Which is why I didn’t vote top-of-ticket last year or in 2016, either. All of the candidates disgusted me.

    But one thing I do know for sure — sure as the sun is going to rise in the east tomorrow — is that the GOP’s fixation on elections elections elections and who’s ahead here and are we going to keep the House and the Senate and Trump would’ve done this instead of that and Trump would never have let that happen and Trump Trump Trump Trump …

    — is a big reason why we are losing the culture.

    What the Ricochet crowd and almost all Republicans everywhere tend to do is keep their eye on the ballot box and yield everything else – – media, education, entertainment, HR departments, publishing, more and more churches, Madison Avenue, you name it – – everything else – – everything cultural – – everything that makes a big difference in our daily lives and that, ironically, eventually affects the ballot box – – they leave all these things to the Left. And it’s murdering us.

    You and I have gone around and around on this before, kedavis. Many times.

    The culture does not count for very much. Trust me, I wouldn’t be pounding the table like this if it did.

    Once again: The culture does not count for very much.

    It counts for everything.

    I don’t know about you, but there’s not much I can do for – or about – the culture, aside from voting.

    • #54
  25. filmklassik Inactive
    filmklassik
    @filmklassik

    kedavis (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    filmklassik (View Comment):
    Yes, he did. But McWhorter understands that the culture is more important than presidential elections — much more important — because elections are a function of the culture. Indeed, the culture is everything. And if the Right would focus more on the culture (i.e., education; scripted entertainment; education; news platforms; social media; and of course, education) the Enlightenment (aka Classic Liberalism) would not be on life support, and the religion of Wokeness would not be ascendant.

    Okay, but how does voting for Biden HELP the CULTURE?

    It doesn’t. And it’s not clear to me that a Trump victory would’ve helped it either. Which is why I didn’t vote top-of-ticket last year or in 2016, either. All of the candidates disgusted me.

    But one thing I do know for sure — sure as the sun is going to rise in the east tomorrow — is that the GOP’s fixation on elections elections elections and who’s ahead here and are we going to keep the House and the Senate and Trump would’ve done this instead of that and Trump would never have let that happen and Trump Trump Trump Trump …

    — is a big reason why we are losing the culture.

    What the Ricochet crowd and almost all Republicans everywhere tend to do is keep their eye on the ballot box and yield everything else – – media, education, entertainment, HR departments, publishing, more and more churches, Madison Avenue, you name it – – everything else – – everything cultural – – everything that makes a big difference in our daily lives and that, ironically, eventually affects the ballot box – – they leave all these things to the Left. And it’s murdering us.

    You and I have gone around and around on this before, kedavis. Many times.

    The culture does not count for very much. Trust me, I wouldn’t be pounding the table like this if it did.

    Once again: The culture does not count for very much.

    It counts for everything.

    I don’t know about you, but there’s not much I can do for – or about – the culture, aside from voting.

    Oy.

    Boy are we in trouble.  

    • #55
  26. The Cloaked Gaijin Member
    The Cloaked Gaijin
    @TheCloakedGaijin

    Wikipedia says that as of 2019 that The Minneapolis Star Tribune is largest newspaper non-national newspaper not based out of New York City, Los Angeles, or Washington, DC, and the 7th largest newspaper in the United States even larger than The Chicago Tribune and The Boston Globe

    I didn’t expect to see that.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_newspapers_in_the_United_States

    • #56
  27. OwnedByDogs Lincoln
    OwnedByDogs
    @JuliaBlaschke

    This all reminds me of the story of the emperor who fell for a venal and dishonest tailor. A grifter who sold a lie that everyone had to believe and parrot or suffer dire consequences. I can only hope that there are many more teachers like Mr. Rossi who will stand up and shout “The emperor has no clothes!”

    • #57
  28. StephenHenstock Lincoln
    StephenHenstock
    @StephenHenstock

    Mark Alexander (View Comment):

    The woke curriculum consumes so much class time, which is fine, since all that racist reading, writing, arithmetic, and history requires real thought and effort, and are beyond the capabilities of all tribal groups except whites and asians.

    I went from earning a teaching award from my Canadian public school board for my work with immigrant students to be suspended for asking for evidence of systemic barriers in the classroom in a span of three months. 

    • #58
  29. James Lileks Contributor
    James Lileks
    @jameslileks

    The Cloaked Gaijin (View Comment):

    Wikipedia says that as of 2019 that The Minneapolis Star Tribune is largest newspaper non-national newspaper not based out of New York City, Los Angeles, or Washington, DC, and the 7th largest newspaper in the United States even larger than The Chicago Tribune and The Boston Globe.

    I didn’t expect to see that.

    Our Sunday paper circ is 5th in the country. We’re not perfect, but we have a newsroom full of good people devoted to local coverage, and a lot of loyal readers. 

    • #59
  30. Charlotte Member
    Charlotte
    @Charlotte

    Peter’s giggle at about 1:26:50 is adorable.

    • #60
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