John U. Bacon is a veteran journalist and book-author. He has written on a variety of subjects, especially sports—sports at the University of Michigan, in particular. He and Jay grew up together (though on rival teams) in Ann Arbor. The athletic department at the U of M is now beset by scandal. Problems in Ann Arbor are ones being experienced all across the country. They have to do with racism, sexual abuse, the removing of names and statues, etc. John Bacon handles all these subjects with exceptional care and expertise. He and Jay also talk a bit about the old days, and the question: Should college athletes be paid? Much to chew on. 

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