Academia, Radicals, Democrats and Journalists have become the four horsemen of their dreamed-of apocalypse. Andrew discusses President Trump getting tough on looters and rioters – and why the media hate that, as well as Trump standing in front of St. John’s Episcopal Church with a bible, which the media somehow hate too. The press also would have you believe that looting and rioting are a good thing, who saw that coming? Then, Andrew bring on Jonah Goldberg to talk about their disagreements about Trump, Kayleigh McEnany and more.

 

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  1. Bryan Van Blaricom Member
    Bryan Van Blaricom Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Oh dear. So Jonah feels that he’s a neutral who’s not on either side? As an SF fan, he should remember Heinlein’s statement (actually Lazarus Long’s) that he’d never heard of a neutral winning anything. I can’t help but get the feeling from listening to him that his true desire is to return to his comfortable world of ineffectually arguing against our liberal overlords and that actually doing what’s necessary to fight back is just too icky to contemplate.

    • #1
    • June 2, 2020, at 3:23 PM PDT
    • 8 likes
  2. Brent Chambers Member

    I wrote an irritable reply to some of Jonah’s points. I had to delete it as I remembered Andrew’s oft repeated comment, “When Jesus said, ‘Judge not,’ He meant, ‘Judge not.'”

    • #2
    • June 2, 2020, at 6:31 PM PDT
    • 1 like
    • This comment has been edited.
  3. Nerina Bellinger Member

    I had to stop when Jonah said he referred to Kaleigh McEnany as “MAGA barbie.” Given recent events and the general mood of the country, I couldn’t force myself to listen after that point.

    • #3
    • June 2, 2020, at 7:03 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
    • This comment has been edited.
  4. Architectus Coolidge

    Nerina Bellinger (View Comment):

    I had to stop when Jonah said he referred to Kaleigh McEnany as “MAGA barbie.” Given recent events and the general mood of the country, I couldn’t force myself to listen after that point.

    Hmmm. He is certainly offering a well-reasoned argument there, isn’t he. 

    Can’t wait for him to remind us again how terrible Trump is when he makes clever and degrading nicknames for his opponents.

    • #4
    • June 2, 2020, at 7:25 PM PDT
    • 7 likes
  5. Kervinlee Member
    Kervinlee Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Goldberg is off his rocker. He does hate Trump. Just read his last half-dozen dreary NR columns; all grasping at straws for something to condemn Trump. Goldberg seems to want a marble statue for a president. Or an Obama, who “tried” to be president to everybody. Right.

    And, Kayleigh McEnany is “MAGA Barbie?” Now that’s grotesque, Jonah.

    • #5
    • June 2, 2020, at 7:38 PM PDT
    • 3 likes
    • This comment has been edited.
  6. Manny Member

    Bryan Van Blaricom (View Comment):

    Oh dear. So Jonah feels that he’s a neutral who’s not on either side? As an SF fan, he should remember Heinlein’s statement (actually Lazarus Long’s) that he’d never heard of a neutral winning anything. I can’t help but get the feeling from listening to him that his true desire is to return to his comfortable world of ineffectually arguing against our liberal overlords and that actually doing what’s necessary to fight back is just too icky to contemplate.

    Jonah Goldberg is the biggest nothing burger in all of conservative commentary. There really isn’t much there. Pretentious is his middle name.

    • #6
    • June 2, 2020, at 8:08 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  7. OccupantCDN Coolidge

    I was surprised at how shallow Jonah’s defense was. The “MAGA Barbie” crack was dismissive and unwise.

    I had expected more from him. He can be quite humorous at times.

    • #7
    • June 2, 2020, at 11:34 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  8. colleenb Member
    colleenb Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Kervinlee (View Comment):

    Goldberg is off his rocker. He does hate Trump. Just read his last half-dozen dreary NR columns; all grasping at straws for something to condemn Trump. Goldberg seems to want a marble statue for a president. Or an Obama, who “tried” to be president to everybody. Right.

    And, Kayleigh McEnany is “MAGA Barbie?” Now that’s grotesque, Jonah.

    That sounds sexist – and anti-toy too. 😉

    • #8
    • June 3, 2020, at 12:55 AM PDT
    • Like
  9. Patrick McClure Coolidge

    I listened to the podcast and read the comments, but I am a boob who voted for Trump, so I wasn’t able to understand anything.

    • #9
    • June 3, 2020, at 4:16 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  10. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge

    I love Andrew Klavan and most of the Daily Wire team. Unfortunately the media whore Jonah Goldberg has managed to destroy another one of my guilty listening pleasures. He is entitled to his opinion but he seems determined to stick it in our faces and make us swallow.

    • #10
    • June 3, 2020, at 5:52 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  11. Hank Rhody, Badgeless Bandito Contributor

    Supposing Trump’s tweets do actually make it up in volume? The thing is, he won the last election. He was doing the same sorts of things (taking every unfavorable news cycle for an opponent and wrenching it around into an unfavorable news cycle for him) all along. A great deal of us have looked at that and decided there’s something happening there that we don’t understand. I’d like to ask Jonah if he can envision any set of circumstances which would change his mind about that.

    Re a President for all, one of the complaints about the Borgia popes was the blatantness of their corruption. “It used to be that we referred to the nephews of the pope, but these guys come out and refer to the pope’s sons!”. It always seemed like a weak objection to me; the problem isn’t with the lack of hypocrasy, it’s with the popes, both the Borgia and the previous, ignoring their vows. I’m not going to worry about Trump breaking any political conventions when the political conventions were only nodded at previously.

    Re Flynn being a bad guy; stipulated. It’s also irrelevant to the discussion. 

    • #11
    • June 3, 2020, at 6:00 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  12. The Cynthonian Member

    The Jonah discussion was so disappointing. He just brushed aside Klavan’s points with what amounted to a dismissive “yeah, I’ve been hearing the same stuff for the last three years.” I haven’t read or listened to him since he began to lack the perspective to understand that Trump is a corrective to years of Bush/McCain/Romney style rolling over to the Democrats and the forces arrayed against us who want to destroy the USA. 

    I would like to see Klavan do a longer form interview with Jonah, and ask him the following:

    Please explain how “nationalism” is more dangerous than what we’re seeing from the Democrats, who are aligning with the BLM/Antifa types.

    Please explain how globalism has worked out well for this country, and succeeded in getting China and other dangerous nations to play nicely with the rest of the world.

    Please explain how Trump is supposed to work with people who illegally spied on him and his incoming team, have investigated every little thing they say or do, created mountains out of molehills, tried to impeach him on the flimsiest of pretexts, and continue fighting him at every turn, with every ounce of energy they possess?

    If you knew Obama was only playing at being president of all of us, why is that important? Is being lied to in a smooth, reassuring tone really worth that much?

    I guess I have different priorities.

    • #12
    • June 3, 2020, at 6:10 AM PDT
    • 8 likes
  13. Wolfsheim Member

    I’ve long been a huge fan of Jonah Goldberg, but Andrew Klavan, polite and decent as ever, poses the zinger question at the end, and, alas, JG dodges it. 

    As an antidote to the shamelessly biased “mainstream” American media outlets I read from faraway, I turn to National Review, which has no qualms about criticizing Trump, including his appearance in front of St. John’s Church…Where does the left reciprocate the “fairness”? (And it’s debatable just how fair it really is…) Silly question. Of course, it doesn’t.

    George Will? Will has always been first and foremost a snob. He is everything that Trump isn’t in his command of knowledge and language. But he clearly cannot contemplate losing the acceptance of his cocktail-party elitist friends. It is indeed a great temptation. 

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    • #13
    • June 3, 2020, at 7:24 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  14. LibertyDefender Member

    Kervinlee (View Comment):

    Goldberg seems to want … an Obama, who “tried” to be president to everybody. Right.

    The Cynthonian (View Comment):

    If you knew Obama was only playing at being president of all of us, why is that important? Is being lied to in a smooth, reassuring tone really worth that much?

    I guess I have different priorities. 

    Evidently Jonah prefers sonorous lies to the successful implementation of policies he claims to support.

    I admit I was impressed by how effectively Jonah filibustered by laying down a completely false premise while pretending to answer Klavan‘s question about Jonah‘s criticism of Kayliegh McEnany using the press’s own words to shame them. 

    The Red Eye Radio Guys have it right: since Reagan, the best we’ve gotten out of any Republican president is maaaaybe agreeing with 40% – 50% of the things they implemented. With Trump, honest conservative Republicans have to agree with 60 % – 70% of what he’s managed to get done. And he’s gotten a lot more done than any Republican president since Reagan.

    • #14
    • June 3, 2020, at 7:47 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  15. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge

    I think one of the big separation of the NeverTrump like Jonah and the rest of us is the tweets. The majority of the world does not live on Twitter. Can care less about what somebody says on Twitter and do not understand why anybody cares since it is basically a bunch of self important idiots snarking on each other in order to get some sort of kudos / feedback about their ego. If it was not for the MSM obsessing about what anybody tweets I would not know what was on it and I do not understand why it has replaced journalism.

    • #15
    • June 3, 2020, at 7:52 AM PDT
    • 8 likes
  16. The Cynthonian Member

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):

    I think one of the big separation of the NeverTrump like Jonah and the rest of us is the tweets. The majority of the world does not live on Twitter. Can care less about what somebody says on Twitter and do not understand why anybody cares since it is basically a bunch of self important idiots snarking on each other in order to get some sort of kudos / feedback about their ego. If it was not for the MSM obsessing about what anybody tweets I would not know what was on it and I do not understand why it has replaced journalism.

    I completely agree. I do not use Twitter, and I refuse to monetize it when I am well-aware they censor conservatives. I wouldn’t have the slightest idea what Trump tweeted if the MSM didn’t constantly tell me via other means. 

    • #16
    • June 3, 2020, at 6:03 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  17. Full Size Tabby Member

    I appreciate that @andrewklavan let @jonahgoldberg speak as Mr. Goldberg wanted. That way the hole that Mr. Goldberg dug himself into was of his own doing, and not a creation of the critics of Mr. Goldberg.

    On his own, Mr. Goldberg offered up nothing but insults about individuals with which he disagrees, and utter contempt for large swaths of the American public.

    Maybe if Mr. Goldberg offered up constructive criticism instead of just rhetorical bomb throwing, and didn’t repeatedly insult a third or more of the American public, the American public would take him more seriously and he wouldn’t feel like such a “remnant” (a misnomer if ever I heard one, but that’s a different discussion). 

    • #17
    • June 4, 2020, at 5:16 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  18. Matt Bartle Member
    Matt Bartle Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    I’m getting really tired of this “President of all the people” talk. Heard that several times now, most recently Gen. Mattis.

    In what universe is that even possible any more?? Didn’t George W. try really hard to be just that? How did it work our for him?

    Trump had, from before he was elected, a coordinated “resistance” movement trying to take him down. How is supposed to reach out to them so they would regard him as their President? It’s not going to happen.

    • #18
    • June 4, 2020, at 10:02 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  19. Architectus Coolidge

    Matt Bartle (View Comment):

    I’m getting really tired of this “President of all the people” talk. Heard that several times now, most recently Gen. Mattis.

    In what universe is that even possible any more?? Didn’t George W. try really hard to be just that? How did it work our for him?

    Trump had, from before he was elected, a coordinated “resistance” movement trying to take him down. How is supposed to reach out to them so they would regard him as their President? It’s not going to happen.

    I too believe that George W genuinely tried to be “everyone’s” president, and was abused regardless. Some will always say “not my president”, so whatever. 

    Trump didn’t bother with that silliness, and just went about ‘reaching out’ by driving down unemployment for all, selecting great judges for all, deregulating the economy for all, etc. He helped them, whether they liked it or not…

    He knows better than to wait for their thanks.

    • #19
    • June 5, 2020, at 8:27 PM PDT
    • 4 likes