The King of Stuff talks with professional artist, writer, and icon carver Jonathan Pageau. Jonathan explores the symbolic structures that underlie our experience of the world through his popular YouTube channel and podcast, titled The Symbolic World. We chat about his long friendship with Jordan Peterson, the failure of the angry “New Atheists,” Orthodoxy, and the renewed search for meaning and structure in our culture.

You can see Jonathan’s art on his carving website, his Patreon Art page, or you can follow him on social media. His most recent viral hit was his conversation about faith with Jordan Peterson (1.5 million views and counting). And since Jonathan offers so much of his work on YouTube, this is the first time I’m uploading a video version of the King of Stuff podcast: