The King of Stuff welcomes Gabriella Hoffman, media strategist, consultant, award-winning outdoor writer, and host of the weekly “District of Conservation” podcast. Jon and Gabby discuss the difference between conservation and preservation, the wildfire and energy mess on the West Coast, and Trump’s successes at the EPA.

Subscribe to the King of Stuff Spotify playlist featuring picks from Jon and his guest. Gabriella’s song of the week is “Waiting for Lightning” by The National Parks, and Jon’s is “Kings and Queens” by The Ocean Blue.