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Musings on Cirque Des Crazi

 

If you look at my bio, you will see I list myself as a “Heinlein American”. I grew up cutting my teeth on Robert Heinlein’s juvenile Sci Fi and went on to read nearly everything he wrote. He came from a 1930-40s progressive background and evolved considerably rightward as time went on and progressives abandoned many things he held dear.

One of his books which scared me sleepless when I was eight was “The Puppet Masters” 1951, a solid exploration of the mind controlling alien invasion theme.

puppet5290f1b93fa0b5ed3beb2c43184d32cc

Normal, everyday people were one by one made helpless slaves to the alien presence.

At eight, thinking your parents could become someone they were not was the thing of sleepless nights. Later in life I met children of addicts who actually had it happen to them.

This piece constitutes some musings of a Heinlein American curmudgeon on the fight many of us find is happening all around us in what had been a civil society.

The Redheaded Irish Wisecracker (aka my wife of four and a half decades) is severely upset that long time and dear friends from her childhood days are batcrap looney, angry, mean and distempered crazies before, during and since the election. She and I went to K-12 the whole way with those two. One is now a senior nun and the other is a retired IRS manager. Yes, they are Hilaryites. They are the scourge of her Facebook, showing no mercy or measure of humanity. Both use language that would make Trump blush.

Many people on Ricochet have reported similar insanity and we all watch the media created Cirque Des Crazi on the streets of blue cities and the academic child care centers formerly known as Higher Education.

Now for the observational musings:

  1. We live in the end result of forty years of information war. A large percentage of the population has been living in a morass of accused racism, homophobia, islamophobia, white supremacy, misogyny, intolerance fear with language control in the form of PC. The progressives have moved from their old technique of optimism to a never ending series of THINGS YOU MUST NOT BE. The list is so long now the wheels are coming off their model of persuasion.
  2. The people you encounter are not rational in this area. The programming is well embedded at their emotional core, deep below critical thinking and intellect.
  3. Our hope is the immune, the uninfected, the street wise minorities and the young. Those infected are far gone. To change will require a self-discovery of their basic identity.
  4. This battle will shape up to be as futile and messy as the European religious wars of the reformation era. Look up the Thirty Years War if you have the courage.
  5. Progressivism offers the promise those of little skill to get rich- diversity, media, scribblers, public employees, like a religious power base employs the faithful over the useful. Many people barely capable of serving coffee have good paying jobs as diversity counselors, media pundits and community outreach monitors. Fear of a society where actual useful stuff is rewarded creates massive fear reaction and even cases of hives in the faithful but useless.
  6. Progressives message to the financially comfortable is “Do not be a (racist, homophobe, sexist…….ad nauseum) and you shall be part of the elite. Their message to the uncomfortable is “You are uncomfortable because of the (racism, sexism …..ad nauseum) of those others.
  7. Conservatives message to the financially comfortable has been “You are smarter and your ideas are better, be happy with superior ideas. We will win someday”. Their message to the uncomfortable has been “Too bad you are a loser, go away you obsolete people”
  8. Progressives offer a secular theology. Global Warming is the threat of Hell on Earth , paying for the sins of man. The heaven is a world free of (racism, sexism…….ad nauseum) where we all get along and are comfortable. Do not overlook the need for a theology in a secular world.
  9. Conservatives offer a philosophy but no theology. It is a belief in the individual. People are tribal, have been since we hunted in packs and gathered for mutual protection. Conservatism offers no theology, no community. It is a partial bundle, needing to be connected to other things like religion and nation. Progressivism is the whole package.
  10. Progressivism is emotional at its core in appeal. Conservatism as presented to the public is intellectual. It functions best when coupled with a tribal, emotional appeal like nationalism. (See 1980, 2016). Progressivism is most successful when coupled with nationalism (See 1932,1936,1940,1944,1948,1964, 1968)
    1. Progressives today proclaim the moral person

    2. Conservatism shies away from raw emotional morality.

    3. Nationalism and Globalism are emotionally driven concepts. Both can pair with Progressivism or Conservatism.

 

 

Musings on going forward:

 

  1. Brace yourself for a very long information and emotional struggle. The infection of emotional progressivism is wrapped around the brainstems of a lot of people.
  2. Use the opportunities in front of us.
    1. The young. The first generation where their prospects are truly worse than their parents are waiting for their prosperity. Deliver it at all cost. The side that does this will grab their hearts and minds for their lives.
    2. There are emotional progressives – the comfortable. There are also transactional progressives- the poor, minority working class and lower middle class. Their allegiance to the cause is not emotional as much as pragmatic, with the exception of their comfortable college social justice majors. Transactional progressives need communications and demonstration of delivery.
    3. Progressives used to own Optimism when they were Nationalist Progressives. Nationalist Conservatives can now own Optimism again.

 

End musings:

  • Talking to the emotional progressives will be counter productive. The winning strategy is continuing to talk to the faithful, the hopeful, the young and the minorities and deliver a few visible, tangible goods. Ignore the media. Make sure the media report anything you say after it has been seen on every smartphone and tablet through your tweets, streams and apps.

phonethSS0RVLES

  • Promise bold things without a thousand qualifiers. Successful leadership is more like a love letter than a series of disclaimers. Imaging the success rate of “I will love you forever” followed by “In this case, the use of ‘forever’ is not to be construed as eternal, but an expression of passion at the time” in fine print. Good luck with that.

(An earlier version of this piece appeared on another site http://balldiamondball.com/blog/?p=1299 , feel free to join in the conversation there also)

Members have made 45 comments.

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  1. Profile photo of valis Coolidge

    If they love Hillary, they will outgrow it. If they work, they will learn, if they don’t, we all pay for them. Not much extra food in a nonprofit world.

    • #1
    • November 27, 2016 at 11:26 pm
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  2. Profile photo of dnewlander Member

    I like this, mainly for the shout-out to RAH. I’m not sure I have enough well-formed opinion to actually respond right now. But definite thanks for putting it out there.

    • #2
    • November 27, 2016 at 11:38 pm
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  3. Profile photo of OmegaPaladin Coolidge

    Not bad, but I have a few points:

    The Thirty Year’s War featured skilled combatants on both sides. Do you think that the Left can actually handle an opponent that fights back?

    Do not underestimate the power of the limited government/politicization message. People tend to react poorly to politics being stuffed into non-political realms – witness GamerGate turning geeks against the Left.

    Why do we need a secular religion? What about actual religion that refers to God? Conservatism in the US has always been tied to the Judeo-Christian tradition – at least for the most part. (Sorry Objectivists, but you are not the majority even though you are cool) This tradition says all humans have dignity and are worthy of respect – rich and poor alike. This also creates a sense of obligation beyond simple self-interest – voluntary self-sacrifice is made praiseworthy. It also has plenty of optimism, with the promise of heaven.

    We can argue that we need to get government out of the way so we can step up and help out. Government is not your friend. Your family and friends, your community, your church or other religious group – they actually care about you. I’d rather let people be dependent on their family / church than government – after all, that’s how we handle children.

    How do you avoid crushing disappointment when you make bold promises? If I say I’ll love you forever, and I can’t deliver, there’s going to be heartbreak.

    • #3
    • November 27, 2016 at 11:53 pm
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  4. Profile photo of TKC1101 Inactive
    TKC1101 Post author

    OmegaPaladin: Why do we need a secular religion?

    I said in a secular society, people search for a religion and Progressivism has positioned itself as an alternative. I commented on a fact, an observation.

    OmegaPaladinThe Thirty Year’s War featured skilled combatants on both sides. Do you think that the Left can actually handle an opponent that fights back?

    It also used peasants as fodder. Actually, the left never quits the information war and are the professionals. It is the Right that never fights back until the most recent campaign. Aside from Reagan and Trump, the GOP fields infowar amateurs along with a consultant class that fights the war from two wars ago. The question is, can the Right fight back every day, every hour , not just during an election.

    OmegaPaladin Do not underestimate the power of the limited government/politicization message.

    I believe this is wishful thinking coupled with projection. If the message was that powerful, explain the last fifty years of big government growth. Consider this: Americans want government that works well. They do not want bad big government but also do not want ineffective small government. Conservatives assume small makes it good. Wrong. No guarantee. They also assume giving it to the states makes it good. No guarantee.

    OmegaPaladin How do you avoid crushing disappointment when you make bold promises? If I say I’ll love you forever, and I can’t deliver, there’s going to be heartbreak.

    A Leader that caveats everything has no followers. Sometimes you have to put yourself on the line to get the public support. Conservatives absolutely suck at that. Promising love risks heartbreak. Welcome to life. See how effective a conditional promise of love is. You get to sleep alone a lot.

    • #4
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:10 am
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  5. Profile photo of Judge Mental Member

    TKC1101: A Leader that caveats everything has no followers.

    It’s better to not make the promise than to caveat everything. Look at the pledges to support the winner of the GOP primaries as the nominee, and to accept the results of the general election. The only one who refused the pledge, who said it depended on the results, was Trump. And then half the Republican candidates and Hillary have failed to live up to theirs.

    Make a simple promise. And then keep it.

    • #5
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:52 am
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  6. Profile photo of Majestyk Thatcher

    TKC1101: Conservatives message to the financially comfortable has been “You are smarter and your ideas are better, be happy with superior ideas. We will win someday”. Their message to the uncomfortable has been “Too bad you are a loser, go away you obsolete people”

    That’s both ghastly and incorrect.

    • #6
    • November 28, 2016 at 6:20 am
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  7. Profile photo of Stina Member

    Majestyk: That’s both ghastly and incorrect.

    If its financially uncomfortable, I’m betting that’s the U-Hauler message… and TKC is pretty spot on on that (go back to school, get a better job, move where the jobs are… if you don’t, your financial situation is ALL YOUR FAULT.)

    For the socially uncomfortable, its pretty much the same… Birchers being an excellent example and don’t deny that there were NTs fully expecting to purge Trump people out if he had lost.

    • #7
    • November 28, 2016 at 6:37 am
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  8. Profile photo of Majestyk Thatcher

    CM:

    Majestyk: That’s both ghastly and incorrect.

    If its financially uncomfortable, I’m betting that’s the U-Hauler message… and TKC is pretty spot on on that (go back to school, get a better job, move where the jobs are… if you don’t, your financial situation is ALL YOUR FAULT.)

    It is. What I haven’t understood until this day is why the idea of “personal responsibility” is so repellent when it comes to this. If you know that the industry that you’re involved in – particularly if it’s a low-skill sort of job or task – is on the downswing… either bail out or develop new skills. Ask Mike Rowe. Sometimes that may even involve – gasp – moving to a different place.

    For the socially uncomfortable, its pretty much the same… Birchers being an excellent example and don’t deny that there were NTs fully expecting to purge Trump people out if he had lost.

    One of the worst things that Trump did in my opinion was to give desperate people – who, make no mistake, are good people who want to work hard – false hope. False hope that life in rural America just needed a reversal of secular trends that have been years or decades in the making in order to be revitalized. False hope that it is government action that can “fix” what ails them. Sometimes it may be literally true that Government was the problem in the first place, as in the case of EPA restrictions, but that isn’t the case everywhere.

    Time will tell whether their hope was misplaced.

    • #8
    • November 28, 2016 at 6:50 am
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  9. Profile photo of She Moderator
    She

    TKC1101: Conservatives offer a philosophy but no theology. It is a belief in the individual. People are tribal, have been since we hunted in packs and gathered for mutual protection. Conservatism offers no theology, no community. It is a partial bundle, needing to be connected to other things like religion and nation. Progressivism is the whole package.

    How much of this is due to the Right’s determination to split its own birthright into ever smaller and smaller pieces, by defining what type of conservative you are, whether your rightness is limited by your religiosity, your ideas about finance, your ideas about society, your ideas about your country and its place in the world, how “comfortable” you are, or whether you are right of center left, or left of center right? Keep on going, and eventually, every single person on the “Right” will have his or her own unique pod, and there’ll be nothing remaining to unite us at all. Then, let the feasting begin. Each on the other.

    It seems to me that Conservatism is the whole package, also. But Conservatives, being a fractious lot, can’t won’t paper over a few of the seams in order to see the bigger picture.

    Progressives don’t have that problem. They’ll take anyone, they don’t eat their own, and they just keep moving forward, no matter how rickety the bus or how messy the wallpaper. Because they believe their cause that is greater than any single individual.

    If the Right continues its journey through the wood chipper for the next four years, I don’t think there’ll be much of it left by the end of them, no matter what Trump does.

    • #9
    • November 28, 2016 at 7:03 am
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  10. Profile photo of Stina Member

    Majestyk: It is. What I haven’t understood until this day is why the idea of “personal responsibility” is so repellent when it comes to this. If you know that the industry that you’re involved in – particularly if it’s a low-skill sort of job or task – is on the downswing… either bail out or develop new skills. Ask Mike Rowe. Sometimes that may even involve – gasp – moving to a different place.

    Its very cold in your world.

    Picking up new skills is not as easy as you make it out to be for everyone out there. Also, nomadic living hasn’t been in the dna in generations. It works for some. For others it is nigh impossible to cut family strings like that.

    Its not that I have issues with personal responsibility. Its that I have issues with us castigating people who made the right choices for their circumstances and families being written off as losers.

    Which you just did.

    • #10
    • November 28, 2016 at 7:21 am
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  11. Profile photo of Majestyk Thatcher

    CM:

    Majestyk: It is. What I haven’t understood until this day is why the idea of “personal responsibility” is so repellent when it comes to this. If you know that the industry that you’re involved in – particularly if it’s a low-skill sort of job or task – is on the downswing… either bail out or develop new skills. Ask Mike Rowe. Sometimes that may even involve – gasp – moving to a different place.

    Its very cold in your world.

    Picking up new skills is not as easy as you make it out to be for everyone out there. Also, nomadic living hasn’t been in the dna in generations. It works for some. For others it is nigh impossible to cut family strings like that.

    I lived in Colorado for 30 years. I moved to Louisiana last year because my wife could get a better job here. It involved tradeoffs, but not tradeoffs that were excessively onerous.

    The costs clearly were outweighed by the benefits. It can be done and it should be encouraged.

    Its not that I have issues with personal responsibility. Its that I have issues with us castigating people who made the right choices for their circumstances and families being written off as losers.

    Which you just did.

    Let me get this straight: Because some people can see the train coming and choose to not get off the tracks I’m supposed to feel bad for them?

    I’m not castigating them for being losers. To the extent that I’m castigating them at all I’m doing it for them being inflexible.

    • #11
    • November 28, 2016 at 7:32 am
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  12. Profile photo of She Moderator
    She

    CM:

    Majestyk: It is. What I haven’t understood until this day is why the idea of “personal responsibility” is so repellent when it comes to this. If you know that the industry that you’re involved in – particularly if it’s a low-skill sort of job or task – is on the downswing… either bail out or develop new skills. Ask Mike Rowe. Sometimes that may even involve – gasp – moving to a different place.

    Its very cold in your world.

    Picking up new skills is not as easy as you make it out to be for everyone out there. Also, nomadic living hasn’t been in the dna in generations. It works for some. For others it is nigh impossible to cut family strings like that.

    Its not that I have issues with personal responsibility. Its that I have issues with us castigating people who made the right choices for their circumstances and families being written off as losers.

    Which you just did.

    CM, what are you suggesting is the solution when one’s personal circumstances have taken a downturn, and there is no pleasant, or easy, alternative readily apparent?

    • #12
    • November 28, 2016 at 7:34 am
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  13. Profile photo of Majestyk Thatcher

    I should point this out as well: You know what makes the world cold? Being unemployed. Having no occupation or avocation. It leads to the utter disintegration of the very things you’re pointing to: Familial ties, tradition, morality and the like.

    Given the choice between “completely intact extended families” and “gainful employment” there’s no doubt where the balance should lie. If you don’t have the latter, you soon won’t have the former.

    • #13
    • November 28, 2016 at 7:36 am
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  14. Profile photo of TKC1101 Inactive
    TKC1101 Post author

    Majestyk: That’s both ghastly and incorrect.

    You are half right. President Romney was unavailable for comment.

    • #14
    • November 28, 2016 at 9:11 am
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  15. Profile photo of Nanda Panjandrum Thatcher

    “Rugged individualism”, “manifest destiny” and “exceptionalism” are all “civic theology/civil religion”, too. To say that conservatism has no theology save religious faith doesn’t quite hold up. I have more than once recently heard the Declaration and Constitution referred to as “sacred documents”. Just sayin’…

    • #15
    • November 28, 2016 at 9:17 am
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  16. Profile photo of TKC1101 Inactive
    TKC1101 Post author

    Nanda Panjandrum: “Rugged individualism”, “manifest destiny” and “exceptionalism” are all “civic theology/civil religion”, too. To say that conservatism has no theology save religious faith doesn’t quite hold up. I have more than once recently heard the Declaration and Constitution referred to as “sacred documents”. Just sayin’…

    I tend to find many conservatives are also people of faith and view their chosen religion to fill the need for a theology as opposed to progressives who have mixed morality and politics into a lumpy stew. The point is quite arguable from many points.

    • #16
    • November 28, 2016 at 9:21 am
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  17. Profile photo of Trinity Waters Thatcher

    Majestyk:I should point this out as well: You know what makes the world cold? Being unemployed. Having no occupation or avocation. It leads to the utter disintegration of the very things you’re pointing to: Familial ties, tradition, morality and the like.

    Given the choice between “completely intact extended families” and “gainful employment” there’s no doubt where the balance should lie. If you don’t have the latter, you soon won’t have the former.

    This appears to be a reformulation of Kevin Williamson’s cold prescription. But. Humans are tribal, and most resist moving just for economic reasons. There is of course a large minority who have good lives while rocketing around the world and living wherever necessary. I’ve done both, but nobody ever opined on which would be the best choice for me. The part that disturbs me about discussing this issue is in recommending difficult choices for others that ignores their personal version of humanity.

    For example, after the unions ruined the Rust Belt, most of the millions of displaced workers should relocate en mass to greener pastures? Never happen. A politically successful prescription, as well as a humane one for the individuals so affected, will not involve sterile ideology but rather local action. Now that the Federal behemoth is about to get out of the way, some profitable local businesses will likely be created. Point being, fostering a good business environment is all government can and should do.

    • #17
    • November 28, 2016 at 11:51 am
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  18. Profile photo of She Moderator
    She

    Trinity Waters:

    Majestyk:I should point this out as well: You know what makes the world cold? Being unemployed. Having no occupation or avocation. It leads to the utter disintegration of the very things you’re pointing to: Familial ties, tradition, morality and the like.

    Given the choice between “completely intact extended families” and “gainful employment” there’s no doubt where the balance should lie. If you don’t have the latter, you soon won’t have the former.

    This appears to be a reformulation of Kevin Williamson’s cold prescription. But. Humans are tribal, and most resist moving just for economic reasons.

    If this is indeed true, it must be a twenty-first century phenomenon. Millions of humans have moved, just for economic reasons, for hundreds and hundreds of years. Usually, they didn’t say they were moving for economic reasons, though. They said they wanted “a better life.”

    And many of them found it.

    • #18
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:07 pm
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  19. Profile photo of Majestyk Thatcher

    Trinity Waters:This appears to be a reformulation of Kevin Williamson’s cold prescription. But. Humans are tribal, and most resist moving just for economic reasons. There is of course a large minority who have good lives while rocketing around the world and living wherever necessary. I’ve done both, but nobody ever opined on which would be the best choice for me. The part that disturbs me about discussing this issue is in recommending difficult choices for others that ignores their personal version of humanity.

    If their “personal version of humanity” is actively self-destructive or debilitating, I don’t find it to be valid.

    This isn’t a question of the perfect being the enemy of the good. It’s a question of what’s better for people in the long run. It clearly is no good for them to remain in hollowed out communities where negative behavioral traits are reflected back at them and reinforced by friend and family alike.

    There’s something to the idea as well that the residue of people left behind in such places are the ones who didn’t have the sort of ambition to get out. I see it in my father’s home town in northern Idaho. It’s a small town of about 2,500 people that is slowly dying. Its primary industry is timber related with a healthy dose of tourism. The people who are willing and able to leave do, taking with them their talents and ambition, leaving behind people who still live in the houses their Grandparents built. They alternate between working at the lumber mill or logging and being on unemployment. But, they get to hunt and fish when they want to or ride around the back country on nice quads or side-by-sides.

    Plenty of “Make America Great” stickers on the back of old pickup trucks up there.

    Many of those people want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to be able to live in a beautiful location, near their family and friends and have a job that pays them a wage good enough to buy new cars and toys.

    Trump can’t fix their mismatch of expectations with what reality has to offer.

    For example, after the unions ruined the Rust Belt, most of the millions of displaced workers should relocate en mass to greener pastures? Never happen. A politically successful prescription, as well as a humane one for the individuals so affected, will not involve sterile ideology but rather local action. Now that the Federal behemoth is about to get out of the way, some profitable local businesses will likely be created. Point being, fostering a good business environment is all government can and should do.

    No doubt. However, technology’s march continues and modern equipment does work with one guy that used to require several. Nothing is going to change that fact.

    • #19
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:17 pm
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  20. Profile photo of Judge Mental Member

    She:If this is indeed true, it must be a twenty-first century phenomenon. Millions of humans have moved, just for economic reasons, for hundreds and hundreds of years. Usually, they didn’t say they were moving for economic reasons, though. They said they wanted “a better life.”

    And many of them found it.

    While the numbers of people who moved were vast, the percentages were not. Barring war or disease, it has been rare in history for entire populations to move once they’ve left behind a nomadic way of life.

    • #20
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:17 pm
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  21. Profile photo of Majestyk Thatcher

    Judge Mental:

    She:If this is indeed true, it must be a twenty-first century phenomenon. Millions of humans have moved, just for economic reasons, for hundreds and hundreds of years. Usually, they didn’t say they were moving for economic reasons, though. They said they wanted “a better life.”

    And many of them found it.

    While the numbers of people who moved were vast, the percentages were not. Barring war or disease, it has been rare in history for entire populations to move once they’ve left behind a nomadic way of life.

    True. I think America’s success has something to do with the fact that those who were seeking to immigrate here were most highly motivated members of the societies they were emigrating from. They didn’t come here looking to get something. They came looking to make something.

    Now there are entrenched communities here that are sedentary. We have a choice: Do we reinforce their entrenchment or do we at least ask them to meet us half way in changing their lives around.

    • #21
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:31 pm
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  22. Profile photo of Jamie Lockett Reagan

    TKC1101: Conservatives offer a philosophy but no theology. It is a belief in the individual. People are tribal, have been since we hunted in packs and gathered for mutual protection. Conservatism offers no theology, no community. It is a partial bundle, needing to be connected to other things like religion and nation. Progressivism is the whole package.

    This is quite possibly the most incorrect thing I’ve ever read on Ricochet.

    • #22
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:35 pm
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  23. Profile photo of She Moderator
    She

    Judge Mental:

    She:If this is indeed true, it must be a twenty-first century phenomenon. Millions of humans have moved, just for economic reasons, for hundreds and hundreds of years. Usually, they didn’t say they were moving for economic reasons, though. They said they wanted “a better life.”

    And many of them found it.

    While the numbers of people who moved were vast, the percentages were not. Barring war or disease, it has been rare in history for entire populations to move once they’ve left behind a nomadic way of life.

    I don’t think we’re talking about entire populations. I think we’re talking pockets of the country that have been left behind, hollowed-out, whatever you want to call it, by any number of factors–unions, government action/inaction, technology, energy policy, unfavorable trade, corporate greed, Democrat politics, you name it. I live in one of those regions. Many are doing quite well. Many are not.

    Under these sorts of circumstances, (for a global flavor, add in war, famine, terrorism, and any other sorts of international cataclysms that have been happening for centuries), millions have indeed migrated for a better life.

    I join those who hope that Trump’s policies return some sort of liquidity and promise to these desolate areas, but I deplore his paternalistic approach to the problem (the “I alone can do this” approach). Because such approaches by a political figure, I think, usually lead to disillusionment and failure, as those who expect the most benefit from them are not fully engaged in the process, but simply await the outcome.

    I hope that is not the case this time.

    • #23
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:39 pm
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  24. Profile photo of TKC1101 Inactive
    TKC1101 Post author

    Majestyk: Now there are entrenched communities here that are sedentary. We have a choice: Do we reinforce their entrenchment or do we at least ask them to meet us half way in changing their lives around.

    It is a good thing that others are deciding whose votes to write off or cede to the progressives. This is not a virtue discussion, it is a part of the battle with progressives.

    If conservatives cannot get behind a national imperative to have an environment that creates sufficient high value jobs for the citizens then just go on the cruise and leave the country to the progressives.

    “Get a U Haul” is the stupidest piece of political communication I have seen, worse than ‘basket of deplorables’.

    • #24
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:44 pm
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  25. Profile photo of Jamie Lockett Reagan

    TKC1101:

    Majestyk: Now there are entrenched communities here that are sedentary. We have a choice: Do we reinforce their entrenchment or do we at least ask them to meet us half way in changing their lives around.

    It is a good thing that others are deciding whose votes to write off or cede to the progressives. This is not a virtue discussion, it is a part of the battle with progressives.

    If conservatives cannot get behind a national imperative to have an environment that creates sufficient high value jobs for the citizens then just go on the cruise and leave the country to the progressives.

    “Get a U Haul” is the stupidest piece of political communication I have seen, worse than ‘basket of deplorables’.

    Who says we aren’t? We just don’t agree with your prescription of a top-down federally managed economy.

    • #25
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:46 pm
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  26. Profile photo of Keith SF Member

    Thank you for this TKC1101; you’ve touched upon some of the unease I’ve been feeling.

    My recent feelings of relief and schadenfreude have been tempered somewhat, seeing this anger and hysteria on the left– because it’s coming from so many people I’ve grown up with, attended school with, befriended, and worked with. I’ve always been aware of this divide, but it seems a lot less… rational(?) than I once imagined it.

    .

    • #26
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:47 pm
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  27. Profile photo of TKC1101 Inactive
    TKC1101 Post author

    Jamie Lockett: Who says we aren’t? We just don’t agree with your prescription of a top-down federally managed economy.

    Apparently you showed up with the usual supply of strawmen, Mr Lockett.

    Please state where I have ever advocated that canard you dragged in here. When it comes to markets , I want the government a referee at best. When it comes to economic warfare, I want to fight nation to nation , not send companies out against countries. You seem to confuse markets with battlefields.

    If that to you is ‘top down’ you may have invented a new meaning.

    .

    • #27
    • November 28, 2016 at 12:57 pm
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  28. Profile photo of Jamie Lockett Reagan

    TKC1101:

    Jamie Lockett: Who says we aren’t? We just don’t agree with your prescription of a top-down federally managed economy.

    Apparently you showed up with the usual supply of strawmen, Mr Lockett.

    Please state where I have ever advocated that canard you dragged in here. When it comes to markets , I want the government a referee at best. When it comes to economic warfare, I want to fight nation to nation , not send companies out against countries. You seem to confuse markets with battlefields.

    If that to you is ‘top down’ you may have invented a new meaning.

    You let me know where that line between your mythical battlefields and the rest of the economy is, ok?

    • #28
    • November 28, 2016 at 1:00 pm
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    TKC1101 Post author

    Jamie Lockett: You let me know where that line between your mythical battlefields and the rest of the economy is, ok?

    It is called trading outside the US and Foreign companies selling into the US. Every other country manages it. You would outsource our management of trade to every other country.

    • #29
    • November 28, 2016 at 1:04 pm
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  30. Profile photo of Jamie Lockett Reagan

    TKC1101:

    Jamie Lockett: You let me know where that line between your mythical battlefields and the rest of the economy is, ok?

    It is called trading outside the US and Foreign companies selling into the US. Every other country manages it. You would outsource our management of trade to every other country.

    Ah, so then, you want to top-down federally manage the economy. Thanks.

    • #30
    • November 28, 2016 at 1:09 pm
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