How Do You Experience G-d?

 

Although we’ve had a number of discussions on Ricochet about the damage that the Left is inflicting on those who are religious, we’ve seen very little about how people begin and nurture a religious life when there is so much disparagement by those who are secular. I also have been thinking that there are many people who are either atheist, agnostic, or who have no particular interest in having a relationship with religion, and with G-d in particular. I assume that they may be respectful (or not) toward those who believe in G-d, but the idea of pursuing or deepening their understanding of religion seems alien and not a helpful way to spend their time.

I’m not looking to motivate people to become religious if they are not inclined that way. The people I’ve been thinking about are those who, at some level, would like to have a relationship with G-d, but have all kinds of preconceptions about what that means in their lives. I’d also like to propose that their assumptions might be incorrect and make it difficult for them to find a relationship with G-d.

So, I’d like to propose that people from as many religions as possible share what it means to them to experience G-d. “Experience” is a broad and inclusive term, so you aren’t limited in describing your experience. You might describe prayers, particular prayers, meditation, rituals, holidays, study, music, and any other practice that allows you to sense or know that G-d is in your life. No one should try to judge your experience, because it is yours alone. This is not a competition to determine whether one practice is better or wiser than another. I encourage people to share experiences, as opposed to actively proselytizing; that approach has the risk of pushing people away. That doesn’t mean that if you experience Jesus as part of all of your practice, that you shouldn’t share it; on the contrary, that centrality might be important and precious to you.

To give you an example of the ways you might describe how you experience G-d, I’ll speak about myself.

First, I have a general sense of Presence most of my waking hours. It is subtle, but always there. G-d’s Presence is amplified when I hear sacred music—particularly Jewish songs, but even gospel music. I experience G-d in Torah study; I assume He wants me to learn from Him. I experience Him when I pray, especially when I pray in Hebrew; when I meditate in silence; and sometimes when I am with a loved one: I sometimes feel that G-d has blessed both of us and our time together. I recently saw the new grandchild of a friend; even on Zoom, that was a sacred moment. Finally, I often sense G-d when I’m outside when I’m walking; I think the silence around me, even when I listen to a podcast, is palpable. There are other moments as well, but that gives you an idea of what I’d love for you to share in your experience of G-d.

I also believe that G-d may show up without your seeking him, but the odds are not high. Some people have a profound experience in the beginning, but many of us have started in baby steps and seen the relationship mature. It can take time and attention.

The whole idea is for people to realize that one’s experience of G-d can be subtle or profound; connected to formal prayer and study or everyday life; alone or in worship.

* * * * *

You may have noticed that I didn’t mention practicing a specific religion or denomination. I think for many, the idea of connecting to a religion and its teachings is a daunting task. Don’t misunderstand: I think pursuing a relationship with G-d through a religious framework is a key component of a deep practice. I also believe it’s essential for the moral tenets it provides and a supportive community. I think that many people have a difficult time creating a moral framework that isn’t about personal preferences; those are the people who call themselves “spiritual.” I think that pursuing a relationship with G-d first, followed by an exploration of religion, is achievable by most people.

* * * * *

For those of us who believe that G-d is beyond time and always present and available, we only need to reach out to find Him. Feel free to share a single practice or several of them that you find especially helpful.

Would you share your experiences of G-d?

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  1. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    God is easy.  I am not sure how anybody can deny Him.  He is in the sunrise, the curl of a woman’s back, a baby’s hand, a rainbow’s glow, a tornado’s chaos, the whisper of the wind in the forest and the sound of birds chirping in the morning.  Religion, that is harder.

    • #31
  2. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):
    No. G-d made me too, and if I’m a big jerk why would you blame G-d? G-d made sticks, and if I use them to hurt people why would you blame the sticks?

    That isn’t the same as observing biology. Please address the anti-nature arguments that the cartoon makes. The entire system of evolution creates creatures that are pretty terrible.

    I did address them. It looks like you’re missing the point entirely.

    You (and the cartoon) are making a problem of evil challenge. You have something to address: the religious responses to the problem of evil.

    I don’t think you explain yourself very well. 

    • #32
  3. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):
    No. G-d made me too, and if I’m a big jerk why would you blame G-d? G-d made sticks, and if I use them to hurt people why would you blame the sticks?

    That isn’t the same as observing biology. Please address the anti-nature arguments that the cartoon makes. The entire system of evolution creates creatures that are pretty terrible.

    I did address them. It looks like you’re missing the point entirely.

    You (and the cartoon) are making a problem of evil challenge. You have something to address: the religious responses to the problem of evil.

    I don’t think you explain yourself very well.

    Your concern with the Designer based on the bad state of nature is a version of the problem of evil.

    Are you following me so far?

    • #33
  4. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):
    No. G-d made me too, and if I’m a big jerk why would you blame G-d? G-d made sticks, and if I use them to hurt people why would you blame the sticks?

    That isn’t the same as observing biology. Please address the anti-nature arguments that the cartoon makes. The entire system of evolution creates creatures that are pretty terrible.

    I did address them. It looks like you’re missing the point entirely.

    You (and the cartoon) are making a problem of evil challenge. You have something to address: the religious responses to the problem of evil.

    I don’t think you explain yourself very well.

    Or maybe it would be better to start here: Are you familiar with the term “the problem of evil”?

    • #34
  5. Hartmann von Aue Member
    Hartmann von Aue
    @HartmannvonAue

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Heisenberg (View Comment):
    He isn’t Cthulhu.

    True! Seriously, @ heisenberg, it’s not a silly question at all. Those of us who practice Judaism seriously are not permitted to write G-d’s name or speak it; technically, that’s in Hebrew. But Jews I know like to remind themselves of His holy name whenever we use it, however, we use it, so writing His name as G-d is a way to remind ourselves of His holiness. It’s not necessary, but it’s a way to communicate our belief to G-d and to others. Some people who aren’t Jewish have been using that spelling on the site; I don’t know if they do it for the same reasons or out of respect for Jews; I certainly don’t expect them to.

    Some Jews also use the name HaShem, which translates to “the name.” It’s for the same reasons.

    I once had a young Orthodox Jewish student named Tamar who wrote the Hebrew initials for  “HaShem” at the top of every piece of paper she submitted. When I talked to her about the matter, she was surprised that I knew what it was. Her explanation was rather  moving and was exactly what you describe here: A desire to honor the Lord’s holiness in her everyday life. Modern Christians- especially in my stream of Christianity- can learn a lot from this attitude.

    • #35
  6. Hartmann von Aue Member
    Hartmann von Aue
    @HartmannvonAue

    Regarding the discussion on the so-called problem of evil: Oh grow up. Get a clue about the nature of post-lapsarian humanity. No human deserves a life absolutely free of even the possibility of privation, loss, pain or death. I don’t. No one reading this does. No one does. And precisely that assumption- absolute human innocence- is necessary in every instance for evil to be a problem. And that’s just physical evil- not getting into moral evils that we inflict on each other willfully for which God is not at all culpable. We asked for a world in which we could do those things and the Lord is somehow how to blame? Spare me. 

    Then there is the fact that anything less  than God  and any time-bound creature is going to be necessarily subject to certain forms of suffering that attend its mortality and limitations in time. Those seem to be what many people mistake for the theodicy problem, i.e. a mortality problem or more properly a problem accepting and coping with mortality. 

    At lastly in this brief comment that my time-bound nature limits me to: Satan has a point at the beginning of Job. If one is doing good only because one is absolutely certain that it will be rewarded every time, then one is not truly doing good. 

    The real problem it seems to me is that God’s grace, mercy, wrath, judgement, favor and correction are all at work in all human lives and all human history at once. Of course that’s going to make that picture confusing to those who only see 40, 50…70, 80, 90 years of life. 

    • #36
  7. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Hartmann von Aue (View Comment):

    Regarding the discussion on the so-called problem of evil: Oh grow up. Get a clue about the nature of post-lapsarian humanity. No human deserves a life absolutely free of even the possibility of privation, loss, pain or death. I don’t. No one reading this does. No one does. And precisely that assumption- absolute human innocence- is necessary in every instance for evil to be a problem. And that’s just physical evil- not getting into moral evils that we inflict on each other willfully for which God is not at all culpable. We asked for a world in which we could do those things and the Lord is somehow how to blame? Spare me.

    Then there is the fact that anything less than God and any time-bound creature is going to be necessarily subject to certain forms of suffering that attend its mortality and limitations in time. Those seem to be what many people mistake for the theodicy problem, i.e. a mortality problem or more properly a problem accepting and coping with mortality.

    At lastly in this brief comment that my time-bound nature limits me to: Satan has a point at the beginning of Job. If one is doing good only because one is absolutely certain that it will be rewarded every time, then one is not truly doing good.

    The real problem it seems to me is that God’s grace, mercy, wrath, judgement, favor and correction are all at work in all human lives and all human history at once. Of course that’s going to make that picture confusing to those who only see 40, 50…70, 80, 90 years of life.

    You remind me of this woman.

    Russian Woman, Who Claims to Be World’s Oldest at 129 …

    Russian Woman, Who Claims to Be World’s Oldest at 129, Says She’s Had One Happy Day in her Life By Jason Lemon

    • #37
  8. Freeven Member
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    I don’t experience God, though I envy those who do. I find the notion of an “accidental” universe dismal and depressing. The notion of a just, loving God providing guidance is much more attractive to me. But wanting something doesn’t make it so, and I’ve never been able to “get there.” Episodically, I’ve tried reading and studying the Bible, attending various churches, praying regularly for guidance and understanding. For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.” In either case, I’ve pretty much given up — though I still pray from time to time. You can only bang your head against the wall for so long.

    • #38
  9. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I don’t experience God, though I envy those who do. I find the notion of an “accidental” universe dismal and depressing. The notion of a just, loving God providing guidance is much more attractive to me. But wanting something doesn’t make it so, and I’ve never been able to “get there.” Episodically, I’ve tried reading and studying the Bible, attending various churches, praying regularly for guidance and understanding. For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.” In either case, I’ve pretty much given up — though I still pray from time to time. You can only bang your head against the wall for so long.

    Just out of curiosity, and I don’t mean this to be pejorative in any way, but do you say grace before a meal?  Do you give thanks for your car when you get in it in the morning?  Are you grateful generally?

    Added: I’m sure you do, and are.  It’s just that maybe (and I don’t know for sure, though I’m sure He treats everyone differently and personally) but maybe that’s plenty.  Maybe we want, but we don’t really need, in God’s economy, any more proof of His existence or personal involvement in our lives than He already is giving us.

    • #39
  10. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    I experience God through my conscience mostly.  When I get an urge to do what I have read in the Bible that God calls good and commands, or an urge not to do what He prohibits.  Beyond that God has spoken audibly to me maybe twice.  And has given me specific, informative dreams in answer to prayers maybe twice, and other dreams several times unrequested.  And He has answered prayer in a miraculous (statistically improbable to impossible) way a few times.  But I also experience him when I realize that He has protected me with His invisible overarching caring for me, that I often don’t see until days or weeks or years later.

    • #40
  11. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Freeven (View Comment):
    For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.”

    You might have been doing it wrong. The revelation was already given, and it wasn’t a personal thing for you or for me.

    • #41
  12. Freeven Member
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I don’t experience God, though I envy those who do. I find the notion of an “accidental” universe dismal and depressing. The notion of a just, loving God providing guidance is much more attractive to me. But wanting something doesn’t make it so, and I’ve never been able to “get there.” Episodically, I’ve tried reading and studying the Bible, attending various churches, praying regularly for guidance and understanding. For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.” In either case, I’ve pretty much given up — though I still pray from time to time. You can only bang your head against the wall for so long.

    Just out of curiosity, and I don’t mean this to be pejorative in any way, but do you say grace before a meal? Do you give thanks for your car when you get in it in the morning? Are you grateful generally?

    When I was in my teens I began a practice of something akin to grace. Since I wasn’t sure what to make of God, it was simply a pause before a meal to reflect and be grateful for all I had. At times that morphed into something closer to saying grace, though it’s not something I do regularly anymore. My life and experiences have lead me to believe that a lack of gratitude is at the heart of many individual and societal ailments. I also believe that gratitude is an outgrowth of genuine humility and my efforts at self-improvement have focused on fostering and expressing both gratitude and humility. I don’t make New Years Resolutions, but I adopted three resolutions about a decade ago that I try to keep going forward: 1) Be more humble; 2) Be more selfish (that’s another post entirely); and 3) Listen more closely for the voice of God.

    Added: I’m sure you do, and are. It’s just that maybe (and I don’t know for sure, though I’m sure He treats everyone differently and personally) but maybe that’s plenty. Maybe we want, but we don’t really need, in God’s economy, any more proof of His existence or personal involvement in our lives than He already is giving us.

     

    • #42
  13. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Mark Camp (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Mark Camp (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn: I’m not looking to motivate people to become religious if they are not inclined that way.

    Why not?

    Because I have been offended when people tried to push their religion on me–unsolicited by me. It was rude and condescending.

    That is your answer to “Why do you not try to push your religion on people?” and “Why are you not rude and condescending to people?” but not to my question.

    The very act itself, no matter how nice a person is, is rude and condescending. It assumes that I’m in need of their information. As a Jew in particular, I’ve had people approach me when I’m not interested, nor have I asked for their input. I don’t like it.

    • #43
  14. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Mark Camp (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Mark Camp (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn: I’m not looking to motivate people to become religious if they are not inclined that way.

    Why not?

    Because I have been offended when people tried to push their religion on me–unsolicited by me. It was rude and condescending.

    That is your answer to “Why do you not try to push your religion on people?” and “Why are you not rude and condescending to people?” but not to my question.

    The very act itself, no matter how nice a person is, is rude and condescending. It assumes that I’m in need of their information.

    I don’t get it. Aren’t all of us in need of information other people have sometimes?

    • #44
  15. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I don’t experience God, though I envy those who do. I find the notion of an “accidental” universe dismal and depressing. The notion of a just, loving God providing guidance is much more attractive to me. But wanting something doesn’t make it so, and I’ve never been able to “get there.” Episodically, I’ve tried reading and studying the Bible, attending various churches, praying regularly for guidance and understanding. For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.” In either case, I’ve pretty much given up — though I still pray from time to time. You can only bang your head against the wall for so long.

    I’m so sorry, @freeven, that you feel disappointed. I find that I naturally moved into a mindset of being grateful for so much–a beautiful sunrise this morning, a gorgeous cardinal calling out, the silence of the morning–that I find myself saying, Baruch HaShem–thank you G-d. It’s not an intentional practice, but it helps me make a special connection. I sense G-d in those moments. No fireworks, no bugles. Just that.

    • #45
  16. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Flicker (View Comment):
    But I also experience him when I realize that He has protected me with His invisible overarching caring for me, that I often don’t see until days or weeks or years later.

    It’s so interesting how we see those loving moments in hindsight, isn’t it @flicker

    • #46
  17. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    I don’t think there is any single way.  I think prayer, communal service, constant talking to G-d as the day goes on.  It all forms a seamless feeling that I am in His presence.  In Roman Catholicism we have Holy Communion, which is a physical ingesting of G-d.  But don’t minimize the communal activity.  Knowing that you are doing something with others adds to an integration with the divine.  That solidarity is important.  In the end, you have to know that what you believe is true.  

    • #47
  18. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Manny (View Comment):

    I don’t think there is any single way. I think prayer, communal service, constant talking to G-d as the day goes on. It all forms a seamless feeling that I am in His presence. In Roman Catholicism we have Holy Communion, which is a physical ingesting of G-d. But don’t minimize the communal activity. Knowing that you are doing something with others adds to an integration with the divine. That solidarity is important. In the end, you have to know that what you believe is true.

    Beautiful, @manny. Yes, I think some of us make comments to G-d throughout the day–mine is usually gratitude. I think he inspires some of my ideas during meditation, too. We’re blessed.

    • #48
  19. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Hartmann von Aue (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Heisenberg (View Comment):
    He isn’t Cthulhu.

    True! Seriously, @ heisenberg, it’s not a silly question at all. Those of us who practice Judaism seriously are not permitted to write G-d’s name or speak it; technically, that’s in Hebrew. But Jews I know like to remind themselves of His holy name whenever we use it, however, we use it, so writing His name as G-d is a way to remind ourselves of His holiness. It’s not necessary, but it’s a way to communicate our belief to G-d and to others. Some people who aren’t Jewish have been using that spelling on the site; I don’t know if they do it for the same reasons or out of respect for Jews; I certainly don’t expect them to.

    Some Jews also use the name HaShem, which translates to “the name.” It’s for the same reasons.

    I once had a young Orthodox Jewish student named Tamar who wrote the Hebrew initials for “HaShem” at the top of every piece of paper she submitted. When I talked to her about the matter, she was surprised that I knew what it was. Her explanation was rather moving and was exactly what you describe here: A desire to honor the Lord’s holiness in her everyday life. Modern Christians- especially in my stream of Christianity- can learn a lot from this attitude.

    I’ve known Catholics that put JMJ on the top of every page or under their signature.  For Jesus, Mary, and Joseph.  That’s actually fairly common among Catholics.

    • #49
  20. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I don’t experience God, though I envy those who do. I find the notion of an “accidental” universe dismal and depressing. The notion of a just, loving God providing guidance is much more attractive to me. But wanting something doesn’t make it so, and I’ve never been able to “get there.” Episodically, I’ve tried reading and studying the Bible, attending various churches, praying regularly for guidance and understanding. For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.” In either case, I’ve pretty much given up — though I still pray from time to time. You can only bang your head against the wall for so long.

    Mother Teresa admitted to multi decade dry spell from experiencing G-d.  This is not unusual. When I said I experienced G-d I was not referring to any mystical experiences.  Perhaps – and then it depends on how one defines a mystical experience – I have only had one or two experiences that felt super natural.  What is important is your faith and your practice.  How G-d penetrates into our being is varied.

    • #50
  21. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Manny (View Comment):
    Mother Teresa admitted to multi decade dry spell from experiencing G-d. This is not unusual.

    Maybe my commitment to Judaism for short time is the reason I haven’t had that “dark night of the soul”–isn’t that what it’s called, Manny? But then since my experience is mostly subtle anyway, perhaps that’s why. I’ve not had anything I would call a mystical experience.

    • #51
  22. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    Mother Teresa admitted to multi decade dry spell from experiencing G-d. This is not unusual.

    Maybe my commitment to Judaism for short time is the reason I haven’t had that “dark night of the soul”–isn’t that what it’s called, Manny? But then since my experience is mostly subtle anyway, perhaps that’s why. I’ve not had anything I would call a mystical experience.

    Actually I’ll be reading the book Dark Night of the Soul with my book club for March!  Yes some people refer to it as that.  I will see what the book says! ;)

    • #52
  23. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Manny (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    Mother Teresa admitted to multi decade dry spell from experiencing G-d. This is not unusual.

    Maybe my commitment to Judaism for short time is the reason I haven’t had that “dark night of the soul”–isn’t that what it’s called, Manny? But then since my experience is mostly subtle anyway, perhaps that’s why. I’ve not had anything I would call a mystical experience.

    Actually I’ll be reading the book Dark Night of the Soul with my book club for March! Yes some people refer to it as that. I will see what the book says! ;)

    Maybe you should write a post on it.

    • #53
  24. CB Toder aka Mama Toad Member
    CB Toder aka Mama Toad
    @CBToderakaMamaToad

    Manny (View Comment):
    I’ve known Catholics that put JMJ on the top of every page or under their signature. For Jesus, Mary, and Joseph. That’s actually fairly common among Catholics.

    My Marist brother math teacher in high school would only accept homework that had “JMJC” on top, which stood for “All for Jesus, all through Mary, all in imitation of you, good St. Joseph and Blessed Marcellin Champagnat (the founder of the Marist brothers).”

    • #54
  25. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I don’t experience God, though I envy those who do. I find the notion of an “accidental” universe dismal and depressing. The notion of a just, loving God providing guidance is much more attractive to me. But wanting something doesn’t make it so, and I’ve never been able to “get there.” Episodically, I’ve tried reading and studying the Bible, attending various churches, praying regularly for guidance and understanding. For years I attended church weekly. I sang in the choir, even became it’s director at one point — in what I hoped was an act of faith that would lead to some kind of revelation. Years later, I tried again, even to the point of being baptized in the hope and faith that God would show me the way to Him. After many years of this, I have only disappointment to show for it. I’ve concluded that either God doesn’t exist or I’m “doing it wrong.” In either case, I’ve pretty much given up — though I still pray from time to time. You can only bang your head against the wall for so long.

    I’ve been thinking about your post, I think Jesus gave an answer that may be applicable here.

    “Therefore they said to Him, “What are we to do, so that we may accomplish the works of God?”  Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.”  Believing is the only “work” that is required of you.  Any good works are the secondary consequences.

    The order of experiencing God is Fact, Faith, Feeling.  I find this to be true.

    As for the “fact” part, I think there are three things that convince me that Jesus is God.  (1) Jesus came and was cut off when God said He would, at the end of the 69th week of Daniel, or 483 years from the time of “the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem”; (2) the existence and perseverance of bloodline and culture of God’s chosen people, the Jews, despite the demonic hatred and unsuccessful attempts to destroy them throughout the millennia (God’s promises to them are not yet all fulfilled); and (3) the experience of God in my own life.

    But my personal experience of God occurred after I accepted the fact of His existence, His identity, and His coming in the first place.

    • #55
  26. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Susan Quinn (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    Mother Teresa admitted to multi decade dry spell from experiencing G-d. This is not unusual.

    Maybe my commitment to Judaism for short time is the reason I haven’t had that “dark night of the soul”–isn’t that what it’s called, Manny? But then since my experience is mostly subtle anyway, perhaps that’s why. I’ve not had anything I would call a mystical experience.

    Actually I’ll be reading the book Dark Night of the Soul with my book club for March! Yes some people refer to it as that. I will see what the book says! ;)

    Maybe you should write a post on it.

    I’ll take that up. Great idea. 

    • #56
  27. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Flicker (View Comment):

    As for the “fact” part, I think there are three things that convince me that Jesus is God. (1) Jesus came and was cut off when God said He would, at the end of the 69th week of Daniel, or 483 years from the time of “the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem”; (2) the existence and perseverance of bloodline and culture of God’s chosen people, the Jews, despite the demonic hatred and unsuccessful attempts to destroy them throughout the millennia (God’s promises to them are not yet all fulfilled); and (3) the experience of God in my own life.

    Add to that the historical evidence for the Resurrection.

    Why do people think empiricism and religion are not the same thing?

    • #57
  28. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Flicker (View Comment):
    Believing is the only “work” that is required of you. Any good works are the secondary consequences.

    Genuine faith is itself a life-change. Belief as a purely mental phenomenon with no practical aspect is not a biblical concept. Faith without works is dead (James).  Faith is the reproof (Greek elegchos) or life-change required by the unseen deeds (Greek pragmaton) of Christ (Hebrews 11:1).  Noah believed and was saved by G-d’s mercy because he acted on his belief. Ruth placed herself in faith under the wings of the G-d of Israel by her deeds and not merely her profession “Your G-d will be my G-d.”

    • #58
  29. Mark Camp Member
    Mark Camp
    @MarkCamp

    Saint Augustine (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):
    Believing is the only “work” that is required of you. Any good works are the secondary consequences.

    Genuine faith is itself a life-change. Belief as a purely mental phenomenon with no practical aspect is not a biblical concept. Faith without works is dead (James). Faith is the reproof (Greek elegchos) or life-change required by the unseen deeds (Greek pragmaton) of Christ (Hebrews 11:1). Noah believed and was saved by G-d’s mercy because he acted on his belief. Ruth placed herself in faith under the wings of the G-d of Israel by her deeds and not merely her profession “Your G-d will be my G-d.”

    Amen, brother.

    • #59
  30. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    CB Toder aka Mama Toad (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    I’ve known Catholics that put JMJ on the top of every page or under their signature. For Jesus, Mary, and Joseph. That’s actually fairly common among Catholics.

    My Marist brother math teacher in high school would only accept homework that had “JMJC” on top, which stood for “All for Jesus, all through Mary, all in imitation of you, good St. Joseph and Blessed Marcellin Champagnat (the founder of the Marist brothers).”

    There is a Marist high school on Long Island.  I forget the name.  Did he teach there?  

    • #60
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