Resisting Tyranny: California

 

A search on Pearl Harbor Day stories led to a surprising find at SFGATE, a sister-site to the San Francisco Chronicle.* Consider the trending stories late on December 7, 2020. Three of the top seven stories are skeptical, critical of the Democrats running the state and of so-called public health experts. This is a small hopeful sign from the heart of the radical left’s territory.

Soumya Karlamangla, of the Los Angeles Times wrote: “Many aren’t buying California’s ‘stay-at-home’ message. Experts say there’s a better way.” Public officials need to stop crying wolf and issuing unreasonable, unbearable demands in the name of risk avoidance. Instead, they need to promote harm reduction messages, communicating with people as they are, not as someone wishes them to be.

The percentage of Angelenos staying home except for essential activities has remained unchanged since mid-June — around 55% — despite pleas from health officials in recent weeks for people to cut down on their activities, according to a survey conducted by USC….

“It’s not because the public is irresponsible; it’s because they are losing trust in public health officials who put out arbitrary restrictions,” said Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious-disease specialist at UC San Francisco. “We are failing in our public health messaging.”…

When it comes to the COVID-19 pandemic, a harm-reduction approach would encourage masking and social distancing instead of demanding that people have no contact at all with friends or family they don’t live with. In other words, even during a pandemic, abstinence-only isn’t effective.

Eric Ting, writing for SFGATE, illustrates the problem of trus- destroying behavior at the very top of the Peoples Democratic State of California: “Gavin Newsom once again declines to show evidence newly closed businesses contribute to virus spread.”

For the second time in five days, California Gov. Gavin Newsom did not provide evidence that businesses ordered to close during the state’s new stay-at-home order are actively contributing to the spread of the coronavirus.

Under the new stay-at-home framework, activities previously thought to be low-risk such as outdoor dining and indoor personal care services that can ensure masking at all times must cease all operations. Many business owners have asked for state and local officials to show evidence their businesses are contributing to the spread, but Newsom did not provide such evidence during his press conference last Thursday.

On Monday, Newsom held another press conference and was once again asked to explain himself to small businesses that must now close….

“One of the most frustrating parts is you listen to any state or county press conference where they present reams and reams of data, and hear about how they’re data driven, how many people tested positive, how many people are in the hospital, and that they’re contact tracing,” said Julian Skinner, owner of The Style Bar, a hair salon in Greenbrae. “But when you ask why some sectors are closed and others open, we get general answers back and not data answers.”

Astrid Casimire, writing for the Bay City News Service, reported on the same day that a county health official is insisting on real science and real public health measures. I have extensively excerpted Dr. Scott Morrow’s latest public health statement at the bottom of this post. We need two or three thousand more Dr. Morrows in our country, in both Democrat and Republican areas. We would be far better off as a country if we had Dr. Morrow in the shoes of Fauci, Redford, and the two fake public health admirals, starting this past February.

‘Poorly understood metrics’: San Mateo health officer says county won’t join stay-at-home order

San Mateo County Health Officer Dr. Scott Morrow on Monday reinforced the county’s stance in not adopting a new COVID-19 stay-at-home order, saying that increased restrictions might not be effective, hospital capacity remains adequate and people have an individual responsibility to practice safe behaviors.**

On Friday, several Bay Area counties and cities — including Santa Clara, Alameda, Contra Costa, and San Francisco counties — announced a new stay home order that is now in effect Monday despite intensive care unit capacity being above the state’s 15 percent threshold for such an order….

“Basing such extreme decisions on non-standardized and poorly understood metrics seems fraught to me,” he said….

To prevent the spread of COVID-19, people should wear a face covering when around people outside of their household, practice social distancing, avoid gatherings and only travel for essential purposes.

“The power and authority to control this pandemic lies primarily in your hands, not mine,” Morrow said.

In a separate article, Eric Ting gave voice to Californians seeing grossly unequal treatment by the Democrat governor [emphasis added]:

‘They’re ripping us apart’: Bay Area small business owners talk new lockdown

SFGATE heard from many small business owners impacted by the shutdown, and several common themes emerged. Here’s what small businesses are thinking as they prepare to close once again, and for too many of them, for good.

People want evidence their businesses are actually contributing to the spread of the virus….

The lack of data and transparency is infuriating for so many….

With no federal help on the way just before the holidays, people are scared they may close for good

“Many restaurants are in a similar if not worse position,” wrote Denica Freitas, owner of the four Denica’s Real Food Kitchen locations across the East Bay. “Forced to reduce staff at the worst time. Forced to shift to takeout only at a time when we were counting on the holiday increase to help us get through the rest of the year. Leaving so many people unemployed right at the holidays, it is truly heartbreaking.”…

To say that people are incensed with California’s leaders would be an understatement

Gilmour’s business is on the ropes, and he had a lot to say about Newsom, whose now-infamous rule-breaking visit to the French Laundry has made him a villain in the eyes of many.

“We have a governor, a state and local government that is doing everything possible to put us out of business,” Gilmour wrote. “We employ people who depend on us for an income and at least some sort of security and we in turn depend on them to do their jobs and help us stay in business. We have governors and local officials that espouse rules that they don’t follow. None of them are dependent on a paycheck from a small business and none of them live paycheck to paycheck but a vast majority of California does and it’s that vast majority of California that pays income taxes, sales taxes and votes.”

“The only businesses that win in these close downs are the big ones. Amazon, Safeway, Taco Bell, etc,” wrote Granieri. “Seems like maybe they’re trying to squeeze the little guys out.”


* About SFGATE:

SFGATE began in 1994 as one of the first major news websites in history, ushering in a new era in information and interaction with digital news, and even winning a Pulitzer Prize. SFGATE reaches 30 million unique readers each month, ranking it among the top local news websites nationally.

** San Mateo County, DECEMBER 7, 2020 HEALTH OFFICER STATEMENT excerpt [emphasis added]:

What are some reasons that San Mateo County hasn’t decided, so far, to advance the implementation of the State’s SAH order like some other Bay Area counties have?

1. I may have a different view of the power and authority I have, as a function of my position, than some of my colleagues. During the first Shelter in Place order, which I wholeheartedly endorsed, the virus was brand new and had the capability of spreading exponentially due to zero immunity and people’s complete lack of awareness. It was very much consistent with my long-held views about the judicious use of power. I felt that this was the time for our great power to be maximally applied. And that our power and authority was designed to be broad for situations just like this. However, I very quickly rescinded my initial orders shuttering society and focused my new orders on the personal behaviors that are driving the pandemic, mainly limiting gatherings, using masks, social distancing, and adopting the State’s framework on business capacity restrictions. Just because one has the legal authority to do something, doesn’t mean one has to use it, or that using it is the best course of action. What I believed back in May, and what I believe now, is the power and authority to control this pandemic lies primarily in your hands, not mine.

2. I’m not sure we know what we’re doing. (Please don’t misinterpret this sentence. The science and public health principles around disease transmission interruption – no gathering, mask wearing, social distancing, etc. – are clear. I’m referring to how to get you, the community, to change your behavior). I look at surrounding counties who have been much more restrictive than I have been, and wonder what it’s bought them. Now, some of them, are in a worse spot than we are. Does an unbalanced approach on restrictions make things worse? Maybe, maybe not. But I think there is a more likely explanation. When I look at the trend data, the Bay Area seems to mostly move as a region, and it seems to me to be pretty independent of individual Health Officers’ actions.

3. Surely a hard, enforced, SAH order will certainly drive down transmission rates. But what we have before us is a symbolic gesture, it appears to be style over substance, without any hint of enforcement, and I simply don’t believe it will do much good. I think people should stay at home, avoid all non-essential activities, wear masks, and not gather with anyone outside their households. I’ve been saying this for about 10 months now. If you didn’t listen to my (and many others) entreaties before, I don’t think you’ll likely change your behavior based on a new order. I appreciate that some of you think I (or the government) have magical abilities to change everyone’s behavior, but I assure you, I (we) do not.

4. Being in the purple tier, the State has already put significant restrictions on businesses and the public space in San Mateo County. I am aware of no data that some of the business activities on which even greater restrictions are being put into place with this new order are the major drivers of transmission. In fact, I think these greater restrictions are likely to drive more activity indoors, a much riskier endeavor. While I don’t have scientific evidence to support this, I also believe these greater restrictions will result in more job loss, more hunger, more despair and desperation (the structure of our economy is, for the most part, if you don’t work, you don’t eat or have a roof over your head), and more death from causes other than COVID. And I wonder, are these premature deaths any less worrisome than COVID deaths?

5. I don’t see us (governmental public health) looking at data other than case rates and positivity rates and hospital rates in order to make balanced decisions. When you only look at one thing, you only see one thing.

6. I look closely and frequently at our data to try to divine what they mean. Remember, our data are just a proxy of reality, not reality in and of itself. Our cases are certainly going up. But it appears to be a linear increase, with higher increases in 20-40 year olds, but the increases are across all demographics. Our hospitalizations are going up, linearly, and our hospitals feel equipped to deal with a surge, as of today.

7. There is not a good or standard method for understanding ICU capacity on a county level, much less on a regional level. Basing such extreme decisions on non-standardized and poorly understood metrics seems fraught to me.

8. Many hospitals have not yet made the basic internal policy decision of canceling elective procedures. And granted, personnel who provide services for elective procedures may not directly increase ICU capacity when they are freed up, repurposing the services these personnel provide will be required in a surge.

9. Efforts to creatively maximize regional hospital capacity have not yet begun.

10. Regulatory constraints that limit hospital capacity have yet to be addressed.

11. I have grave concerns about the unintended consequences of reducing our grocery store capacity to 20%.

12. The SAH order will make it more difficult for schools to open or to stay open. It is a very hard needle to thread to message that everyone must stay at home by strict order, but it’s ok for kids to go to school. I continue to strongly believe our schools need to be open. The adverse effects for some of our kids will likely last for generations. Schools have procedures to open safely even during a surge as evidenced by data. My earlier stated positions from June remain the same.

13. That the State considers pro sports a critical infrastructure (essential) activity undermines this whole rubric in my mind. Pro sports is very nice to have and is probably a pleasant distraction. It is not essential. (Granted, I could be very wrong on this point. Maybe keeping millions of people home watching sports on TV without mixing households is exactly what we should do more of. Of course, if folks stay home watching TV and gather with other households, it could be much worse.)

14. The new State framework is rife with inexplicable inconsistencies of logic.

15. Beyond the basic human needs for air, water, food, shelter, and safety, it has, to date, been impossible for me to define what is “essential” to the 800,000 people who live here.

There are additional reasons, but these were enough to give me pause.

Published in Domestic Policy
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  1. Jack Shepherd Coolidge
    Jack Shepherd
    @dnewlander

    This whole insistence on “stay at home” is beyond stupid.

    There is zero evidence of asymptomatic spread, and even the WHO and CDC admitted that last week.

    In other words, just like with every other illness in the entirety of human history…

    If you feel sick, isolate yourself.

    Otherwise, you should live a normal life.

    And Democrats plutocrats should slither back under the rocks from whence they came.

    • #1
  2. Jack Shepherd Coolidge
    Jack Shepherd
    @dnewlander

    EDIT: Wrong thread, sorry.

    • #2
  3. CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker
    @CarolJoy

    Okay pandemic –scamdemic. It was supposed to involve 3.4% of all cases ending up pushing up daisies. It was supposed to be about the public giving up three weeks of their lives until we lowered the curve. Except those three weeks ended 7 months ago, and we are still under restrictions

    Apparently as of last Thursday in  Calif, an individual  could get COVID from a restaurant whose staff would defy the law and let you  go sit and eat inside where it was warm, but you would not get COVID from being in the enclosed space (formerly known as “the outdoors”) where a teensy heater barely kept you from being chilled to the bones.

    My heart has been breaking for the economic damage these restrictions have caused. Last week, articles came out detailing the half million to one million people who have died since March 13th 2020 across the entire globe. These deaths came about  due to what happens in third world nations when industrialized nations shut down.

    Another 500 million to one billion people are expected to descend into the worst kind of poverty. Of course, this type of descent by so many people means that dozens of serious diseases are likely to become more common place as they again raise their ugly heads, including more cholera, more pneumonia, more  typhus, more TB etc.

    My heart breaks for the restaurant owners and their staffs. Because Newsom said we could open up as long as certain situations were altered, so the restaurant owners have invested serious monies in putting up tents, and having various types of outdoor heaters available. Now those monies were misspent, as restaurants are now supposed to be carry out only.

    Then I heard of a recent Cornell Univ study being released, that is letting us all know that by hugging some friend or family member, we are destroying the  world as we know it.

    Give me a break. Release the damn HCQ protocol, and sit back and watch the  deaths by COVID evaporate overnight.

    Japan has 1/250th the deaths we have from this infection – because the Japanese med personnel  – Oh my Gawd this upsets Fauci so much – actually go ahead and prescribe the medicine the infection indicates is needed.

     

    • #3
  4. Rodin Member
    Rodin
    @Rodin

    Thank for the Dr. Morrow quotes. I didn’t know there was anyone in the health authority in the Bay Area that had any sense. 

    • #4
  5. EODmom Coolidge
    EODmom
    @EODmom

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):

    Okay pandemic –scamdemic. It was supposed to involve 3.4% of all cases ending up pushing up daisies. It was supposed to be about the public giving up three weeks of their lives until we lowered the curve. Except those three weeks ended 7 months ago, and we are still under restrictions

    Apparently as of last Thursday in Calif, an individual could get COVID from a restaurant whose staff would defy the law and let you go sit and eat inside where it was warm, but you would not get COVID from being in the enclosed space (formerly known as “the outdoors”) where a teensy heater barely kept you from being chilled to the bones.

    My heart has been breaking for the economic damage these restrictions have caused. Last week, articles came out detailing the half million to one million people who have died since March 13th 2020 across the entire globe. These deaths came about due to what happens in third world nations when industrialized nations shut down.

    Another 500 million to one billion people are expected to descend into the worst kind of poverty. Of course, this type of descent by so many people means that dozens of serious diseases are likely to become more common place as they again raise their ugly heads, including more cholera, more pneumonia, more typhus, more TB etc.

    My heart breaks for the restaurant owners and their staffs. Because Newsom said we could open up as long as certain situations were altered, so the restaurant owners have invested serious monies in putting up tents, and having various types of outdoor heaters available. Now those monies were misspent, as restaurants are now supposed to be carry out only.

    Then I heard of a recent Cornell Univ study being released, that is letting us all know that by hugging some friend or family member, we are destroying the world as we know it.

    Give me a break. Release the damn HCQ protocol, and sit back and watch the deaths by COVID evaporate overnight.

    Japan has 1/250th the deaths we have from this infection – because the Japanese med personnel – Oh my Gawd this upsets Fauci so much – actually go ahead and prescribe the medicine the infection indicates is needed.

     

    Just remember those in power do not care about facts. They care about power. Better than sex. 

    • #5
  6. EODmom Coolidge
    EODmom
    @EODmom

    Rodin (View Comment):

    Thank for the Dr. Morrow quotes. I didn’t know there was anyone in the health authority in the Bay Area that had any sense.

    Me too. We have family there – at this point I’m not sure anyone listens. Many, many of the otherwise (apparently, heretofore) intelligent people we know still believe they are going to die if they contract this virus. They also ignore the millions of those who have NOT died. 

    • #6
  7. Dr. Bastiat Member
    Dr. Bastiat
    @drbastiat

    Jack Shepherd (View Comment):
    There is zero evidence of asymptomatic spread, and even the WHO and CDC admitted that last week.

    @jackshepherd

    That is my understanding as well, and the WHO has been consistent on this point.  

    But I saw a CDC article, I think last week, that stated that up to 50% of our COVID cases may be due to asymptomatic spread.  That’s an incredible claim, and I don’t know where they got that.

    Could you provide a link to the CDC paper that acknowledged no asymptomatic spread last week?  Thanks.

    • #7
  8. EODmom Coolidge
    EODmom
    @EODmom

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    Jack Shepherd (View Comment):
    There is zero evidence of asymptomatic spread, and even the WHO and CDC admitted that last week.

    @jackshepherd

    That is my understanding as well, and the WHO has been consistent on this point.

    But I saw a CDC article, I think last week, that stated that up to 50% of our COVID cases may be due to asymptomatic spread. That’s an incredible claim, and I don’t know where they got that.

    Could you provide a link to the CDC paper that acknowledged no asymptomatic spread last week? Thanks.

    They lie. And they don’t care. 

    • #8
  9. CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker
    @CarolJoy

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    Jack Shepherd (View Comment):
    There is zero evidence of asymptomatic spread, and even the WHO and CDC admitted that last week.

    @jackshepherd

    That is my understanding as well, and the WHO has been consistent on this point.

    But I saw a CDC article, I think last week, that stated that up to 50% of our COVID cases may be due to asymptomatic spread. That’s an incredible claim, and I don’t know where they got that.

    Could you provide a link to the CDC paper that acknowledged no asymptomatic spread last week? Thanks.

    I know I saw an actual video about lawst week’s CDC paper somewhere on my social media, and I’ll look for it and bring it here.

    This is something that was stated by the WHO over the summer about lack of asymptomatic people to spread the infection. It was reported by CNBC. I think it makes sense given we are six feet apart and all the rest of it:

    Coronavirus patients without symptoms aren’t driving the spread of the virus, World Health Organization officials said Monday, casting doubt on concerns by some researchers that the disease could be difficult to contain due to asymptomatic infections.

    Preliminary evidence from the earliest outbreaks indicated that the virus could spread from person-to-person contact, even if the carrier never develops symptoms. But WHO officials now say that while asymptomatic spread can occur, it is not the main way it’s being transmitted. “From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, head of WHO’s emerging diseases and zoonosis unit, said at a news briefing from the United Nations agency’s Geneva headquarters. “It’s very rare.”

    • #9
  10. Dr. Bastiat Member
    Dr. Bastiat
    @drbastiat

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):
    This is something that was stated by the WHO over the summer about lack of asymptomatic people to spread the infection. It was reported by CNBC. I think it makes sense given we are six feet apart and all the rest of it:

    It’s not social distancing or masks. 

    If you’re asymptomatic, you’re not shedding viral particles.  At least, that’s how other coronaviruses work.  One might presume that it works the same way with COVID, although it’s very new and very political, so the research is difficult to assess.  But WHO is correct, to the best of my knowledge – if you’re not sick, you’re not contagious.  Just like other viruses.

    Imagine the political push back on that concept, though:  You mean we’ve been doing all this for nothing?  What idiot politician forced me to wear a mask to a grocery store when I wasn’t sick?  

    So politicians, understandably, will not be thrilled to hear this.

    • #10
  11. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):
    This is something that was stated by the WHO over the summer about lack of asymptomatic people to spread the infection. It was reported by CNBC. I think it makes sense given we are six feet apart and all the rest of it:

    It’s not social distancing or masks.

    If you’re asymptomatic, you’re not shedding viral particles. At least, that’s how other coronaviruses work. One might presume that it works the same way with COVID, although it’s very new and very political, so the research is difficult to assess. But WHO is correct, to the best of my knowledge – if you’re not sick, you’re not contagious. Just like other viruses.

    Imagine the political push back on that concept, though: You mean we’ve been doing all this for nothing? What idiot politician forced me to wear a mask to a grocery store when I wasn’t sick?

    So politicians, understandably, will not be thrilled to hear this.

    The CDC’s own study discovered that 90 percent of the positive PCR tests they retested revealed that 90 percent of people who tested “positive” were actually not infectious because the tests were picking up only the DNA remains of dead virus. In other words, 90 percent of the positive PCR tests revealed that 90 percent of people exposed to this virus were able to mount an effective defense, leaving only dead bodies of the virus on the battlefield. The article says it would be like finding a strand of hair left behind by someone who had been in a room but was no longer there.

    Meanwhile, somewhere between 30 and 40 million people are vulnerable to being evicted from their apartments January 1. Why does the CDC care about those people? Because they might spread the disease when they move in with other people. Good grief.

     

    • #11
  12. MichaelKennedy Inactive
    MichaelKennedy
    @MichaelKennedy

    The politics of the Wuhan Flu have dominated the response, not to mention the election.  We are planning to drive to my son’s for Christmas in OC.  Since gruesome has shut down hotels, we decided to stay in my other son’s condo.  Now, I am concerned about Gruesom blocking entry to CA by cars with out of state license plates. There are Border Patrol check points on I-10 and I -8 at the border.  The I -8 checkpoint is almost all the way to SanDiego but the I-10 station is right across the river.  Maybe I’m too paranoid but this year it is hard to tell.

    • #12
  13. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):
    This is something that was stated by the WHO over the summer about lack of asymptomatic people to spread the infection. It was reported by CNBC. I think it makes sense given we are six feet apart and all the rest of it:

    It’s not social distancing or masks.

    If you’re asymptomatic, you’re not shedding viral particles. At least, that’s how other coronaviruses work. One might presume that it works the same way with COVID, although it’s very new and very political, so the research is difficult to assess. But WHO is correct, to the best of my knowledge – if you’re not sick, you’re not contagious. Just like other viruses.

    Imagine the political push back on that concept, though: You mean we’ve been doing all this for nothing? What idiot politician forced me to wear a mask to a grocery store when I wasn’t sick?

    So politicians, understandably, will not be thrilled to hear this.

    The problem more likely is MINIMALLY symptomatic people- ie those who think they have a garden variety cold or allergies. Lets face it- when most people have such symptoms they carry on their lives as usual-because the risks of spreading a cold are minimal. In the late fall &  winter this is a significant percentage of the population. My daughter in law was exposed to COVID by such a case-fortunately she remained negative-she was in a court case where social distancing was enforced. We really have a poor handle on the dynamics of the spread but that doesn’t mean we should ignore low cost measures to limit spread (ie masks & hygiene measures, social distancing).  We need to take low cost steps to minimize the spread to a) safeguard the vulnerable and b)keep the Newsomes, Cuomos, & Whitmers from taking more aggressive & stupid steps.

    • #13
  14. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):

    Okay pandemic –scamdemic. It was supposed to involve 3.4% of all cases ending up pushing up daisies. It was supposed to be about the public giving up three weeks of their lives until we lowered the curve. Except those three weeks ended 7 months ago, and we are still under restrictions

    Apparently as of last Thursday in Calif, an individual could get COVID from a restaurant whose staff would defy the law and let you go sit and eat inside where it was warm, but you would not get COVID from being in the enclosed space (formerly known as “the outdoors”) where a teensy heater barely kept you from being chilled to the bones.

    My heart has been breaking for the economic damage these restrictions have caused. Last week, articles came out detailing the half million to one million people who have died since March 13th 2020 across the entire globe. These deaths came about due to what happens in third world nations when industrialized nations shut down.

    Another 500 million to one billion people are expected to descend into the worst kind of poverty. Of course, this type of descent by so many people means that dozens of serious diseases are likely to become more common place as they again raise their ugly heads, including more cholera, more pneumonia, more typhus, more TB etc.

    My heart breaks for the restaurant owners and their staffs. Because Newsom said we could open up as long as certain situations were altered, so the restaurant owners have invested serious monies in putting up tents, and having various types of outdoor heaters available. Now those monies were misspent, as restaurants are now supposed to be carry out only.

    Then I heard of a recent Cornell Univ study being released, that is letting us all know that by hugging some friend or family member, we are destroying the world as we know it.

    Give me a break. Release the damn HCQ protocol, and sit back and watch the deaths by COVID evaporate overnight.

    Japan has 1/250th the deaths we have from this infection – because the Japanese med personnel – Oh my Gawd this upsets Fauci so much – actually go ahead and prescribe the medicine the infection indicates is needed.

     

    The data on HCQ isn’t there- but Japan is a BIG user of masks….

    • #14
  15. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    MiMac (View Comment):
    but Japan is a BIG user of masks

    True. They keep them handy because of the cherry blossom pollen storms. :-) It is so sad that something so beautiful can make people so sick. :-) 

    • #15
  16. kedavis Member
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    MichaelKennedy (View Comment):

    The politics of the Wuhan Flu have dominated the response, not to mention the election. We are planning to drive to my son’s for Christmas in OC. Since gruesome has shut down hotels, we decided to stay in my other son’s condo. Now, I am concerned about Gruesom blocking entry to CA by cars with out of state license plates. There are Border Patrol check points on I-10 and I -8 at the border. The I -8 checkpoint is almost all the way to SanDiego but the I-10 station is right across the river. Maybe I’m too paranoid but this year it is hard to tell.

    Maybe you could rent a car with California plates?

    • #16
  17. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    kedavis (View Comment):

    MichaelKennedy (View Comment):

    The politics of the Wuhan Flu have dominated the response, not to mention the election. We are planning to drive to my son’s for Christmas in OC. Since gruesome has shut down hotels, we decided to stay in my other son’s condo. Now, I am concerned about Gruesom blocking entry to CA by cars with out of state license plates. There are Border Patrol check points on I-10 and I -8 at the border. The I -8 checkpoint is almost all the way to SanDiego but the I-10 station is right across the river. Maybe I’m too paranoid but this year it is hard to tell.

    Maybe you could rent a car with California plates?

    Put a BLM sticker on your car & if stopped say you are going to a protest

    • #17
  18. Aaron Miller Member
    Aaron Miller
    @AaronMiller

    They don’t have the authority. 

    Emergency powers are fleeting. They are for threats which allow no deliberation, not a persistent but predictable problem. Governors and judges still issuing edicts regarding a year-long disease are now over-stepping their authorities. 

    Thank the Lord some sheriffs have been willing to acknowledge limits of executive authority. The problem of overreach is growing well beyond COVID scares. 

    • #18
  19. Clifford A. Brown Contributor
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    MichaelKennedy (View Comment):

    The politics of the Wuhan Flu have dominated the response, not to mention the election. We are planning to drive to my son’s for Christmas in OC. Since gruesome has shut down hotels, we decided to stay in my other son’s condo. Now, I am concerned about Gruesom blocking entry to CA by cars with out of state license plates. There are Border Patrol check points on I-10 and I -8 at the border. The I -8 checkpoint is almost all the way to SanDiego but the I-10 station is right across the river. Maybe I’m too paranoid but this year it is hard to tell.

    It is unlikely that a governor has any power to bar interstate travel, or to pose significant restrictions. This is lawless behavior under the false flag of a permanent emergency.

    • #19
  20. Eustace C. Scrubb Member
    Eustace C. Scrubb
    @EustaceCScrubb

    Fortunately, the restaurants have battled in court and beat the state’s arbitrary orders.

    • #20
  21. Clifford A. Brown Contributor
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    Aaron Miller (View Comment):

    They don’t have the authority.

    Emergency powers are fleeting. They are for threats which allow no deliberation, not a persistent but predictable problem. Governors and judges still issuing edicts regarding a year-long disease are now over-stepping their authorities.

    Thank the Lord some sheriffs have been willing to acknowledge limits of executive authority. The problem of overreach is growing well beyond COVID scares.

    This is at the heart of Dr. Morrow’s position. See the early paragraphs of his latest letter to his county.

    • #21
  22. Jack Shepherd Coolidge
    Jack Shepherd
    @dnewlander

    Eustace C. Scrubb (View Comment):

    Fortunately, the restaurants have battled in court and beat the state’s arbitrary orders.

    That they even had to go to court is the issue.

    And there’s no guarantee this won’t be overturned in the state supreme court.

    • #22
  23. Jon1979 Lincoln
    Jon1979
    @Jon1979

    MichaelKennedy (View Comment):

    The politics of the Wuhan Flu have dominated the response, not to mention the election. We are planning to drive to my son’s for Christmas in OC. Since gruesome has shut down hotels, we decided to stay in my other son’s condo. Now, I am concerned about Gruesom blocking entry to CA by cars with out of state license plates. There are Border Patrol check points on I-10 and I -8 at the border. The I -8 checkpoint is almost all the way to SanDiego but the I-10 station is right across the river. Maybe I’m too paranoid but this year it is hard to tell.

    California has their ag inspection stations right at or near the state lines. That would be the more likely place to try and deter out-of-state drivers, though I believe Newsom would have to supply the State Police himself if he even thought about doing this, because none of the sheriffs in counties on the state’s eastern border seem to have any plan to enforce the more totalitarian parts of the governor’s shutdown orders.

    • #23
  24. Jon1979 Lincoln
    Jon1979
    @Jon1979

    Clifford A. Brown: When it comes to the COVID-19 pandemic, a harm-reduction approach would encourage masking and social distancing instead of demanding that people have no contact at all with friends or family they don’t live with. In other words, even during a pandemic, abstinence-only isn’t effective.

    Politicians in one-party states tend to get more autocratic than elsewhere, because they’re secure in the knowledge that as much as some of the people protesting might complain, they’re still going to pull the ‘D’ level in the next election. That changes only if and when they fear a ballot box backlash for their draconian actions, and since the next elections are 23 months away unless a recall petition is successful, the people pushing these lockdowns are confident the public will be back to normal by then, and somehow blaming the state’s problems on Mitch McConnell, or whoever the highest-ranking Republican is in power that they hear about on CNN.

    (Pineapple Hill Saloon owner Angela Marsden will be a good barometer or that — she was on Fox Tuesday talking about the general “sucks to be you” attitude of Democrats to her outdoor dining being shut down, and said she planned to join the recall against Newsom and also continue to protest Shelia Kuehl, who voted in the L.A. ban. But Marsden then also said she had voted for Kuehl in the past, and Shelia’s pretty much been a far left anti-business woke progressive in Los Angeles city or California state government for the better part of 30 years. So has Marsden and others like her been Red Pilled by the city and state actions? Or if the current rules are relaxed just a little, will they return to their normal voting patterns?)

    • #24
  25. CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker
    @CarolJoy

    MiMac (View Comment):

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):

    Okay pandemic –scamdemic. It was supposed to involve 3.4% of all cases ending up pushing up daisies. It was supposed to be about the public giving up three weeks of their lives until we lowered the curve. Except those three weeks ended 7 months ago, and we are still under restrictions

    Apparently as of last Thursday in Calif, an individual could get COVID from a restaurant whose staff would defy the law and let you go sit and eat inside where it was warm, but you would not get COVID from being in the enclosed space (formerly known as “the outdoors”) where a teensy heater barely kept you from being chilled to the bones.

    My heart has been breaking for the economic damage these restrictions have caused. Last week, articles came out detailing the half million to one million people who have died since March 13th 2020 across the entire globe. These deaths came about due to what happens in third world nations when industrialized nations shut down.

    Another 500 million to one billion people are expected to descend into the worst kind of poverty. Of course, this type of descent by so many people means that dozens of serious diseases are likely to become more common place as they again raise their ugly heads, including more cholera, more pneumonia, more typhus, more TB etc.

    My heart breaks for the restaurant owners and their staffs. Because Newsom said we could open up as long as certain situations were altered, so the restaurant owners have invested serious monies in putting up tents, and having various types of outdoor heaters available. Now those monies were misspent, as restaurants are now supposed to be carry out only.

    Then I heard of a recent Cornell Univ study being released, that is letting us all know that by hugging some friend or family member, we are destroying the world as we know it.

    Give me a break. Release the damn HCQ protocol, and sit back and watch the deaths by COVID evaporate overnight.

    Japan has 1/250th the deaths we have from this infection – because the Japanese med personnel – Oh my Gawd this upsets Fauci so much – actually go ahead and prescribe the medicine the infection indicates is needed.

     

    The data on HCQ isn’t there- but Japan is a BIG user of masks….

    There are news articles written about the Japanese use of HCQ and favipirvar on my other HD. I can list them for you tomorrow.

    • #25
  26. CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker
    @CarolJoy

    Two seaprate twitter comments:

    # 1

    Judge presiding over  restaurant lawsuit against LA County just said, “The average healthy American is not seriously at risk of dying” that the county has “seized on a straw”…

    *************************************************

    # 2

    Another note I received today, “I’ve been a nurse for 25 years and worked in two local hospitals. ICUs running full capacity is something that happens quite routinely, every year.”

    My comment: I see testimony to that every day on FB and gab and twitter. Newsom wants us to get below 85% capacity in ICU’s – something that never happens this time of year

    *************************************************

    Also, a very naughty lady on Twitter made this suggestion, which I hope no good people at Ricochet would consider following: Vicki

    · 4h
    I just called Gavin Newsom’s winery.
    They’re open 4 outdoor dining.
    I made a reservation for 9 people tomorrow at 4 PM.
    I won’t be showing up.
    Make a fake reservation.
    The number is (707) 945-1220. It’s called Plumpjack Winery.

     

     

    • #26
  27. Gazpacho Grande' Coolidge
    Gazpacho Grande'
    @ChrisCampion

    Eustace C. Scrubb (View Comment):

    Fortunately, the restaurants have battled in court and beat the state’s arbitrary orders.

    I think this is the case that Mark Geragos was arguing, he’s been talking about it on the Adam Carolla podcasts, primarily Reasonable Doubt.

    • #27
  28. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):

    Two seaprate twitter comments:

    # 1

    Judge presiding over restaurant lawsuit against LA County just said, “The average healthy American is not seriously at risk of dying” that the county has “seized on a straw”…

    *************************************************

    # 2

    Another note I received today, “I’ve been a nurse for 25 years and worked in two local hospitals. ICUs running full capacity is something that happens quite routinely, every year.”

    My comment: I see testimony to that every day on FB and gab and twitter. Newsom wants us to get below 85% capacity in ICU’s – something that never happens this time of year

    *************************************************

    Also, a very naughty lady on Twitter made this suggestion, which I hope no good people at Ricochet would consider following: Vicki

    · 4h
    I just called Gavin Newsom’s winery.
    They’re open 4 outdoor dining.
    I made a reservation for 9 people tomorrow at 4 PM.
    I won’t be showing up.
    Make a fake reservation.
    The number is (707) 945-1220. It’s called Plumpjack Winery.

     

     

    Hospitals in some areas often do run near capacity during the flu season (not as often the ICUs). But you have to remember that many hospitals have made considerable efforts to increase their capacity this year. Additionally, when hospitals are at near capacity they often have to cancel nonemergent procedures-which hurts their operating margin. Many hospitals are already financially stressed due to COVID and do not need further cash flow problems.

    • #28
  29. Old Bathos Moderator
    Old Bathos
    @OldBathos

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    CarolJoy, Thread Hijacker (View Comment):
    This is something that was stated by the WHO over the summer about lack of asymptomatic people to spread the infection. It was reported by CNBC. I think it makes sense given we are six feet apart and all the rest of it:

    It’s not social distancing or masks.

    If you’re asymptomatic, you’re not shedding viral particles. At least, that’s how other coronaviruses work. One might presume that it works the same way with COVID, although it’s very new and very political, so the research is difficult to assess. But WHO is correct, to the best of my knowledge – if you’re not sick, you’re not contagious. Just like other viruses.

     

    Not sure about that.  I think I saw something about asymptomatic spreaders being infectious for a max of 2-4 days max as opposed to rally sick COVID infected shedded for as long as 10 days (not the magic 14 built into the narrative).

    Clearly this bug spreads despite doing all the stuff that should have worked.  Instead of recognizing that the public control measures did not work and never will and instead doubling down on Granny-protection, we doubled down on stupid.

    • #29
  30. Old Bathos Moderator
    Old Bathos
    @OldBathos

    “It’s not because the public is irresponsible; it’s because they are losing trust in public health officials who put out arbitrary restrictions,” said Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious-disease specialist at UC San Francisco. “We are failing in our public health messaging.”…

    This is ClintonThink.  When a policy fails or an action backfires, the solution is to revise the “messaging” not the policy.  The “message” from direct observation by the public is that the experts know squat, they do not have a handle on transmission and following their guidance caused widespread major harm and accomplished nothing.

    • #30