Trump, in My Opinion

 

I think it would help everybody if, we just acknowledged a few things.

1. Trump is an [redacted]. It’s fine, we have a proud American tradition of [redacted] presidents including LBJ and Harry Truman. Sometimes it also allows people to be necessary change agents. Just say it. “Trump is an [redacted].” It’s not a problem.

2. Trump isn’t a conservative. He is a center-left moderate who cut a deal. He gets to try some new foreign policy stuff and we get judges. There isn’t a single thing he ran on, outside of judges, that wasn’t the bipartisan consensus position before the left exited the American political spectrum, and the right collapsed into a grifter-led minarchist purity spiral. We have to honest with ourselves to be honest with others.

Thank you. That is all.

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  1. Guruforhire Inactive
    Guruforhire
    @Guruforhire

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Guruforhire:

    I think it would help everybody if, we just acknowledged a few things.

     

    I don’t get it. What would it help?

    You spend less time worrying about supposedly bad tweets and feeling the need to defend e-drama.  It just becomes a non thing and then you can laugh at the people who can’t separate themselves from the inconsequential.

    I think at least half of our national inability to understand each other goes back to our probably lets call it over-enthusiastic rally around Bush.  Over-enthusiastic rally around trump is likewise unhelpful.  But then I have been a long time member of Orange-man-meh.

    • #31
  2. Jon1979 Inactive
    Jon1979
    @Jon1979

    Guruforhire (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Guruforhire:

    I think it would help everybody if, we just acknowledged a few things.

     

    I don’t get it. What would it help?

    You spend less time worrying about supposedly bad tweets and feeling the need to defend e-drama. It just becomes a non thing and then you can laugh at the people who can’t separate themselves from the inconsequential.

    I think at least half of our national inability to understand each other goes back to our probably lets call it over-enthusiastic rally around Bush. Over-enthusiastic rally around trump is likewise unhelpful. But then I have been a long time member of Orange-man-meh.

    Media swooning over Clinton playing the sax on Arsenio, let alone the Obama deity worship, wasn’t a big plus either in terms of creating conditions that eventually made Trump possible (though I suppose if you want to take it all the way back in the TV era, you’d go to the media’s orgasm over JFK in 1960, which produced the first blowback on the right from the Goldwater people against press bias, at the ’64 RNC Convention at the Cow Palace in San Francisco)

    • #32
  3. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):
    Trump also believes in America as founded.

    I do not know what Trump believes in. He believes in a one way loyalty, that is certain.

    He believes in loyalty, perhaps to a fault. I doubt we have any real way of knowing the degree to which it’s “one way.” So, no, it isn’t certain.

    Not one way? He attacks former members of the administration, and current.

    He only attacks when betrayed.

    Refusal to do this is why Republicans always lose. 

    If there is no cost for people who attack you they will attack you frequently. 

    Punching back is the original Second Amendment. 

    • #33
  4. iWe Coolidge
    iWe
    @iWe

    I disagree with the post. Trump is not an ideological conservative. And his instincts are clearly in favor of power.

    But.

     

    His governance has been superbly conservative. With almost no exceptions, Trump has governed much more conservatively than Reagan.

    • #34
  5. Jason Obermeyer Member
    Jason Obermeyer
    @JasonObermeyer

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):
    Trump also believes in America as founded.

    The founders, mostly, feared a strong executive.

    This is wrong, which both Bill Barr (I his federalist society remarks) and John Yoo (in this recent book) have pointed out.

     

    • #35
  6. Jason Obermeyer Member
    Jason Obermeyer
    @JasonObermeyer

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):
    Trump also believes in America as founded.

    So try a comparison between Trump and Madison or Adams.

    Adams appointed John Marshall after he had lost the election to Thomas Jefferson (so he actually one up’ed Trump). Madison used – arguably abused – his power as Secretary of State to refused to issue Marbury’s commission as judge even though he was validly appointed (another one of Adam’s eleventh hour appointments). Marbury v. Madison is literal about that, holding that Marbury’s appointment was valid but the Court had no authority to compel the issuance of the commission.

    It would help if Never Trumper’s views of past presidents was based on history rather than hagiography. 

    Here’s a video of how the founders actually saw each other:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_zTN4BXvYI

    • #36
  7. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Guruforhire (View Comment):
    I think at least half of our national inability to understand each other goes back to our probably lets call it over-enthusiastic rally around Bush.

    I was against Bush, so I resent the “our”.

    But I’m not sure why we would want to understand each other. There’s enough hostility and rancor as it as. 

    • #37
  8. David Carroll Thatcher
    David Carroll
    @DavidCarroll

    So, you think Trump is a center left moderate.  Can you name even one [other] anti-abortion center-left moderate?

    • #38
  9. Sisyphus Member
    Sisyphus
    @Sisyphus

    David Carroll (View Comment):

    So, you think Trump is a center left moderate. Can you name even one [other] anti-abortion center-left moderate?

    They were led by Bart Stupak and effectively purged from the Democratic Party when they were bludgeoned into accepting a transparently bad faith promise by Obama in connection with the passage of ObamaCare. The polarization and purges of the parties has left a wide variety of policy intersections unrepresented.

    • #39
  10. OmegaPaladin Moderator
    OmegaPaladin
    @OmegaPaladin

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    We can argue about what he is all day, but I’d say his suspicion of foreign entanglements, and attempts to curtail both the regulatory state and illegal immigration (successful or not) mark him as something different than a “center left moderate.”

    He has his own, often mystifying, foreign entanglements: Putin, Kim, Xi. And seems to want to detangle from relationships with allies.

    There is no left or right there, just mystifying.

    Ask Bibi Netanyahu about Trump’s support for our allies, or ask Boris Johnson.  Trump is more pro-Israel than either Bush or any elected democrat.

    Trump wanted to try and triangulate with Putin against China (reverse Nixon), but Putin was not interested.  Please consider that Putin is being kept afloat by gas money.   If Trump was actually working for Putin, he’d have worked to reduce US gas production.  We also killed several hundred Russian mercenaries.  What action has Trump taken (action, not words) that serves Putin’s interest?  I honestly have not seen it.

    Do you think Xi wanted a trade war?  Stop focusing on Trump’s tweets for a moment and consider what he actually did.  Same with Kim – he wanted to cut a deal that got Kim separated from Nukes, not preach a lecture.

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):
    Trump also believes in America as founded.

    I do not know what Trump believes in. He believes in a one way loyalty, that is certain.

    He believes in loyalty, perhaps to a fault. I doubt we have any real way of knowing the degree to which it’s “one way.” So, no, it isn’t certain.

    Not one way? He attacks former members of the administration, and current.

    Trump seems quite cordial with people who did not turn around and trash him.  I don’t recall attacks on Spicer or Sarah Sanders.  Nikki Haley kept her disagreement professional and he has remained on good terms with her to the best of my knowledge.  Trump generally is nice to people who have not actively moved against him.

    • #40
  11. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):
    Trump wanted to try and triangulate with Putin against China (reverse Nixon), but Putin was not interested. Please consider that Putin is being kept afloat by gas money. If Trump was actually working for Putin, he’d have worked to reduce US gas production. We also killed several hundred Russian mercenaries. What action has Trump taken (action, not words) that serves Putin’s interest? I honestly have not seen it.

    Don’t forget that Trump has leaned on Germany to get out of Nord Stream 2, and has transferred troops from Germany to Poland. Anyone who says Trump is serving Putin’s interests is fake.

    • #41
  12. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    iWe (View Comment):
    And his instincts are clearly in favor of power.

    I disagree.  It’s hard to read people’s minds, but it is just as hard to see a lust for power in Trump or his choices.

    • #42
  13. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):
    Trump seems quite cordial with people who did not turn around and trash him. I don’t recall attacks on Spicer or Sarah Sanders. Nikki Haley kept her disagreement professional and he has remained on good terms with her to the best of my knowledge. Trump generally is nice to people who have not actively moved against him.

    And Trump is on good terms with Cruz and even Christie.

    • #43
  14. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):
    Trump wanted to try and triangulate with Putin against China (reverse Nixon), but Putin was not interested. Please consider that Putin is being kept afloat by gas money. If Trump was actually working for Putin, he’d have worked to reduce US gas production. We also killed several hundred Russian mercenaries. What action has Trump taken (action, not words) that serves Putin’s interest? I honestly have not seen it.

    Don’t forget that Trump has leaned on Germany to get out of Nord Stream 2, and has transferred troops from Germany to Poland. Anyone who says Trump is serving Putin’s interests is fake.

    Trump is in the tank for the US. And not in a Mike Dukakis kind of way. 

    • #44
  15. Joshua Bissey Inactive
    Joshua Bissey
    @TheSockMonkey

    Jason Obermeyer (View Comment):

    Here’s a video of how the founders actually saw each other:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_zTN4BXvYI

    A rabbit trail, sure, but why do people want to make Jefferson sound British? Even the Brits didn’t talk that way in 1800.

    • #45
  16. The Cynthonian Inactive
    The Cynthonian
    @TheCynthonian

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    We can argue about what he is all day, but I’d say his suspicion of foreign entanglements, and attempts to curtail both the regulatory state and illegal immigration (successful or not) mark him as something different than a “center left moderate.”

    He has his own, often mystifying, foreign entanglements: Putin, Kim, Xi. And seems to want to detangle from relationships with allies.

    There is no left or right there, just mystifying.

    Ask Bibi Netanyahu about Trump’s support for our allies, or ask Boris Johnson. Trump is more pro-Israel than either Bush or any elected democrat.

    Trump wanted to try and triangulate with Putin against China (reverse Nixon), but Putin was not interested. Please consider that Putin is being kept afloat by gas money. If Trump was actually working for Putin, he’d have worked to reduce US gas production. We also killed several hundred Russian mercenaries. What action has Trump taken (action, not words) that serves Putin’s interest? I honestly have not seen it.

    Do you think Xi wanted a trade war? Stop focusing on Trump’s tweets for a moment and consider what he actually did. Same with Kim – he wanted to cut a deal that got Kim separated from Nukes, not preach a lecture.

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):
    Trump also believes in America as founded.

    I do not know what Trump believes in. He believes in a one way loyalty, that is certain.

    He believes in loyalty, perhaps to a fault. I doubt we have any real way of knowing the degree to which it’s “one way.” So, no, it isn’t certain.

    Not one way? He attacks former members of the administration, and current.

    Trump seems quite cordial with people who did not turn around and trash him. I don’t recall attacks on Spicer or Sarah Sanders. Nikki Haley kept her disagreement professional and he has remained on good terms with her to the best of my knowledge. Trump generally is nice to people who have not actively moved against him.

    What was Haley’s disagreement with Trump?  She’s currently appearing around the country on behalf of Republican candidates….which is what you do when you’re gearing up to run for President at the next opportunity.

    • #46
  17. Jon1979 Inactive
    Jon1979
    @Jon1979

    The Cynthonian (View Comment):

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):

     

    Trump seems quite cordial with people who did not turn around and trash him. I don’t recall attacks on Spicer or Sarah Sanders. Nikki Haley kept her disagreement professional and he has remained on good terms with her to the best of my knowledge. Trump generally is nice to people who have not actively moved against him.

    What was Haley’s disagreement with Trump? She’s currently appearing around the country on behalf of Republican candidates….which is what you do when you’re gearing up to run for President at the next opportunity.

    It was Trump’s tweet last year, mocking Rep. Elijah Cummings after his Baltimore home was burglarized. Nothing all that bad, and I don’t know if Haley knew Cummings was dying (apparently some people did) when she sent out the reply:

    • #47
  18. MWD B612 "Dawg" Member
    MWD B612 "Dawg"
    @danok1

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):
    Trump generally is nice to people who have not actively moved against him.

    Just like most people.

    • #48
  19. I Walton Member
    I Walton
    @IWalton

    Insight into why the term conservative isn’t right to describe what we used to call liberal, and sometimes now call neoclassical liberal.  The only term that has come back into correct use is progressive.  The progressives are where they were in the 20’s when that wing of the Democrats abandoned the term because its first cousins, fascism and communism,  attacked the mother country. 

    • #49
  20. Kevin Creighton Contributor
    Kevin Creighton
    @KevinCreighton

    Trump is Andrew Jackson 2.o. 

    • #50
  21. Jailer Inactive
    Jailer
    @Jailer

    On the foreign policy front, I suspect I may be the only one here who has served in Embassies, including during the Trump era. This is what I will say about that.

    1. I’m sure I won’t break any news when I say that most of the foreign policy establishment leans left, and is distressed when any Republican is elected, but was especially so in 2016. This is not only true of our State Department friends, but across the entire trans-national community of foreign policy elites.
    2. Continuing on as Captain Obvious, DJT is a norm-breaker, and the foreign policy community does love it some norms and resents it when they are broken.
    3. Of course, some norms badly needed to be broken. In particular, the national and international foreign policy consensus on China urgently needed to move, and this administration succeeded in catalyzing that movement. The 2017 National Security Strategy and National Defense Strategy were masterfully done, and met a critical need to generate a global awakening about the failure of the previous consensus on Beijing, probably best summarized by Robert Zoellick’s 2005 “Responsible Stakeholder” speech. Someone had to end the charade, and it’s worth wondering if a more conventional administration of either party could have overcome the entrenched consensus to have boldly introduced major power competition as the new normal, so that even the professionals now agree that we can’t go back to the status quo ante.
    4. Israel and the Middle East is the other major area where the foreign policy consensus simply had to be sidelined. I recently spoke to a State Department official who–in the context of a discussion about normalization with the UAE and Bahrain seethed angrily about how this Administration had trashed 70 years of foreign policy consensus on Palestine. Without irony. Sometimes the conventional wisdom must be firmly rejected.
    5. Getting our allies to invest in their own defense is also a plus. 
    6. Having said that, we are paying a price for appearing capricious and unnecessarily dismissive of our allies. Sure, they can be difficult, but they remain our allies and we do need them on side. Those same national security documents make it clear that major power competition is a team sport, and we do need to bring the team along if we’re going to win. 
    7. Also, the incessantly revolving door of senior officials (especially SecDefs and National Security Advisors) was extremely disruptive to getting important work done in the international space. 
    8. Finally, there’s been a dearth of consistently strong and vocal leadership on our American principles (democracy, rule of law, human rights, etc.), particularly since Nikki Haley stepped down as U.N. Ambassador. Foreign policy requires salesmanship, and ours would benefit from some steadiness and consistency on these themes.

    Bottom line, this administration has served as a necessary corrective to some badly flawed policy. Disruption was absolutely necessary, but at some point should give way to stability and focused team-building. My humble opinion only.

    • #51
  22. MichaelKennedy Inactive
    MichaelKennedy
    @MichaelKennedy

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    We can argue about what he is all day, but I’d say his suspicion of foreign entanglements, and attempts to curtail both the regulatory state and illegal immigration (successful or not) mark him as something different than a “center left moderate.”

    He has his own, often mystifying, foreign entanglements: Putin, Kim, Xi. And seems to want to detangle from relationships with allies.

    There is no left or right there, just mystifying.

    You are easily mystified if you still buy the Putin hoax.

    • #52
  23. MichaelKennedy Inactive
    MichaelKennedy
    @MichaelKennedy

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    Bill Nelson (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):
    Trump also believes in America as founded.

    I do not know what Trump believes in. He believes in a one way loyalty, that is certain.

    He believes in loyalty, perhaps to a fault. I doubt we have any real way of knowing the degree to which it’s “one way.” So, no, it isn’t certain.

    Not one way? He attacks former members of the administration, and current.

    After they have attacked him.  I would appreciate an example of someone Trump attacked without provocation.

    • #53
  24. The Cynthonian Inactive
    The Cynthonian
    @TheCynthonian

    Jon1979 (View Comment):

    The Cynthonian (View Comment):

    OmegaPaladin (View Comment):

     

    Trump seems quite cordial with people who did not turn around and trash him. I don’t recall attacks on Spicer or Sarah Sanders. Nikki Haley kept her disagreement professional and he has remained on good terms with her to the best of my knowledge. Trump generally is nice to people who have not actively moved against him.

    What was Haley’s disagreement with Trump? She’s currently appearing around the country on behalf of Republican candidates….which is what you do when you’re gearing up to run for President at the next opportunity.

    It was Trump’s tweet last year, mocking Rep. Elijah Cummings after his Baltimore home was burglarized. Nothing all that bad, and I don’t know if Haley knew Cummings was dying (apparently some people did) when she sent out the reply:

    Pretty small potatoes, in the scheme of things.  I doubt either of them stayed mad about it.

    • #54
  25. MichaelKennedy Inactive
    MichaelKennedy
    @MichaelKennedy

    Jailer (View Comment):
    Also, the incessantly revolving door of senior officials (especially SecDefs and National Security Advisors) was extremely disruptive to getting important work done in the international space. 

    Trump was new to Washington and was willing to trust people who stabbed him in the back or whose motives were obscure. It is very tempting to consider a number of generals who opposed withdrawal from Afghanistan as Career limitation of favorite underlings.  It took him a while to find people who would not stab him in the back.

    • #55
  26. The Cynthonian Inactive
    The Cynthonian
    @TheCynthonian

    MichaelKennedy (View Comment):

    Jailer (View Comment):
    Also, the incessantly revolving door of senior officials (especially SecDefs and National Security Advisors) was extremely disruptive to getting important work done in the international space.

    Trump was new to Washington and was willing to trust people who stabbed him in the back or whose motives were obscure. It is very tempting to consider a number of generals who opposed withdrawal from Afghanistan as Career limitation of favorite underlings. It took him a while to find people who would not stab him in the back.

    Yes, and a lot of the experienced GOP people were Bush family loyalists who had worked in the administrations of Bush 41, Bush 43, or both.  They refused to work for Trump.  He had to select from a lot of second and third tier people, at least initially.

    • #56
  27. Sisyphus Member
    Sisyphus
    @Sisyphus

    The Cynthonian (View Comment):
    Yes, and a lot of the experienced GOP people were Bush family loyalists who had worked in the administrations of Bush 41, Bush 43, or both. They refused to work for Trump. He had to select from a lot of second and third tier people, at least initially.

    W was weak on insisting on loyalty, so there were many bad apples in that barrel in any event.

    • #57
  28. Bill Nelson Inactive
    Bill Nelson
    @BillNelson

    Sisyphus (View Comment):

    The Cynthonian (View Comment):
    Yes, and a lot of the experienced GOP people were Bush family loyalists who had worked in the administrations of Bush 41, Bush 43, or both. They refused to work for Trump. He had to select from a lot of second and third tier people, at least initially.

    W was weak on insisting on loyalty, so there were many bad apples in that barrel in any event.

    Loyalty is to the nation and the constitution.

    • #58
  29. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Kevin Creighton (View Comment):

    Trump is Andrew Jackson 2.o.

    Except that Jackson was re-elected, and Trump is headed to the most devastating defeat of an incumbent president in 100 years.

     

    • #59
  30. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    I was attracted to the Republican Party due to its emphasis on character, the Rule of Law, the Constitution, limited government, reduced government spending, national defense and free trade.  I saw that in Reagan.  I don’t see any of that in Trump.

    • #60
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