Contributor Post Created with Sketch. Recommended by Ricochet Members Created with Sketch. We Need a Label

 

I generally don’t like political labels. I think they often do more to impair communication than to enhance it. However, the “woke” label is now widely used, and it would be nice to have a counter-label that means, basically, “I am not ‘woke’ and I reject the ideas and values ‘woke’ implies.” I described myself in a conversation today as a “traditionalist/Burkean conservative,” but that’s not a tagline that trips off the tongue, and it will never become popular.

James Delingpole or one of his guests mentioned “sound” as a term gaining currency, and as having approximately the meaning I seek. I’ve never heard it used and so I’m a little skeptical, but I nonetheless agree that some label for those of the deliberate and considered ‘not-woke’ crowd would be useful. I don’t much care for “sound,” but I’m open to suggestion. Whatever it is should be something vaguely positive, difficult to pun into a pejorative, ideally evocative of measured and solid — yes, “sound” — consideration, and unburdened with potentially troubling associations.

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  1. RushBabe49 Thatcher

    Resistant?

    • #1
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:14 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  2. tigerlily Member

    Sane or normal work pretty good for me.

    • #2
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:18 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  3. philo Member

    Adult

    Rational

    Sane

    • #3
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:18 AM PDT
    • 8 likes
  4. Henry Racette Contributor
    Henry Racette

    RushBabe49 (View Comment):

    Resistant?

    Maybe a little too close to “resist,” which is already out there?

    Also, and this may be asking too much, it would be nice if the word was focused on the positive aspect of conservatism, rather than the negative aspect of progressivism. It needn’t imply the conflict, but rather the inherent strength of conservative sensibility.

    Sound, solid. Founded. Bedrock. Things like that.

    • #4
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:18 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  5. Henry Racette Contributor
    Henry Racette

    philo (View Comment):

    Adult

    Rational

    Sane

    It should be something that is not in and of itself a pejorative. Implicitly declaring that those with whom you disagree are abnormal, irrational, or insane isn’t a productive basis for further communication.

    • #5
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:20 AM PDT
    • Like
  6. namlliT noD Member
    namlliT noDJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    We already have “based” from centipedes and nimble navigators at The Donald.

    As in “reality-based”.

    Ya gotta get with the hep jive.

    • #6
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:22 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  7. Richard Fulmer Member

    Steady
    Balanced
    Stable
    Sensible
    Unbiased
    Evenhanded
    Reasonable
    Impartial

    • #7
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:24 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
    • This comment has been edited.
  8. Jim McConnell Member
    Jim McConnellJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Reasoned. It makes a good contrast for many of the Left’s “arguments;” those seem to be mostly based upon feelings instead of rational thought.

    • #8
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:26 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  9. RushBabe49 Thatcher

    You used it yourself. Solid. 

    Rock-ribbed. 

    • #9
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:29 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  10. Joshua Bissey Coolidge

    Pro-American

    • #10
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:29 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  11. philo Member

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    philo (View Comment):

    Adult

    Rational

    Sane

    It should be something that is not in and of itself a pejorative. Implicitly declaring that those with whom you disagree are abnormal, irrational, or insane isn’t a productive basis for further communication.

    In that case: Whigs?

    • #11
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:36 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  12. Richard Fulmer Member

    Jim McConnell (View Comment):

    Reasoned. It makes a good contrast for many of the Left’s “arguments;” those seem to be mostly based upon feelings instead of rational thought.

    I like “reasoned” as well. Beliefs informed by reason rather than emotions. Here’s a quote from historian, Will Durant:

    To the [ancient] Greeks, a barbarian was man content to believe without reason and to live without liberty.

    That definition of “barbarian” applies to many on the left today, who scorn reason as something foisted on us by “dead white men,” and who want to give up their liberty in favor of government control.

    • #12
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:40 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
    • This comment has been edited.
  13. Marjorie Reynolds Coolidge

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

     

     

    • #13
    • June 28, 2020, at 11:41 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  14. Henry Racette Contributor
    Henry Racette

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    • #14
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:13 PM PDT
    • 6 likes
  15. The Reticulator Member

    Henry Racette: Whatever it is should be something vaguely positive, difficult to pun into a pejorative, ideally evocative of measured and solid — yes, “sound” — consideration, and unburdened with potentially troubling associations.

    Playing the prevent defense is for losers. 

    I prefer terms like “extreme right-wing wacko conservative.” Or just plain “kook” for short.

    They can learn to deal with it.

     

    • #15
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:26 PM PDT
    • 4 likes
  16. The Reticulator Member

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    Henry RacettePost author

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    I have nothing against warm beer (so long as it’s good) but I’ve never had a warm beer in Ireland.

    • #16
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:28 PM PDT
    • Like
  17. Henry Racette Contributor
    Henry Racette

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    PS I’ve lived in a lot of places in the U.S., a dozen states or more, and I’ve traveled pretty broadly. The first place I ever visited for which I felt a strong yearning to return was Ireland. I’ve often thought how nice it would be to live in some remote location along the coast, on the rolling green hills above the ocean.

    (The second such place was Vietnam. I guess I just enjoy lushness.)

    • #17
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:29 PM PDT
    • 4 likes
  18. Marjorie Reynolds Coolidge

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    Nothing wrong with a nice warm beer😀

    • #18
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:34 PM PDT
    • 3 likes
  19. Jim McConnell Member
    Jim McConnellJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    Actually, warm beer is not so bad; it just takes a lot of intensive practice to acquire the taste for it.

    • #19
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:34 PM PDT
    • 5 likes
  20. Henry Racette Contributor
    Henry Racette

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Racette: Whatever it is should be something vaguely positive, difficult to pun into a pejorative, ideally evocative of measured and solid — yes, “sound” — consideration, and unburdened with potentially troubling associations.

    Playing the prevent defense is for losers.

    I prefer terms like “extreme right-wing wacko conservative.” Or just plain “kook” for short.

    They can learn to deal with it.

    Chuckle.

    But seriously:

    I grow weary of it being suggested that I’m some kind of squish for wanting to be an effective communicator, rather than simply a man wearing my disagreement on my sleave.

    I think true progressives are at best fools, ignorant of reality and usually deficient in their sense of proportion and their critical thinking skills. However, I also think that almost everyone I meet who can’t imagine voting Republican is not a true progressive, but rather someone who has heard only the left’s perspective for so long that they don’t realize there are thoughtful people on the right. So, while I understand the perspective of those who don’t want to pussyfoot around, I also wish, above all else, to win. And so I want to persuade more than I want to slap people upside the head with my opinions.

    You can’t persuade people unless you can talk to them. You can’t talk to them if your approach shuts them down.

    • #20
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:34 PM PDT
    • 4 likes
  21. The Reticulator Member

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Racette: Whatever it is should be something vaguely positive, difficult to pun into a pejorative, ideally evocative of measured and solid — yes, “sound” — consideration, and unburdened with potentially troubling associations.

    Playing the prevent defense is for losers.

    I prefer terms like “extreme right-wing wacko conservative.” Or just plain “kook” for short.

    They can learn to deal with it.

    Chuckle.

    But seriously:

    I grow weary of it being suggested that I’m some kind of squish for wanting to be an effective communicator, rather than simply a man wearing my disagreement on my sleave.

    I think true progressives are at best fools, ignorant of reality and usually deficient in their sense of proportion and their critical thinking skills. However, I also think that almost everyone I meet who can’t imagine voting Republican is not a true progressive, but rather someone who has heard only the left’s perspective for so long that they don’t realize there are thoughtful people on the right. So, while I understand the perspective of those who don’t want to pussyfoot around, I also wish, above all else, to win. And so I want to persuade more than I want to slap people upside the head with my opinions.

    You can’t persuade people unless you can talk to them. You can’t talk to them if your approach shuts them down.

    If you are going to run away from terms that can be turned into pejoratives, you are not going to be able to communicate.

    One additional point: The label you choose has to be one showing you’re having more fun than they are. Some of those that have been suggested are no fun at all.

    • #21
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:41 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  22. Henry Racette Contributor
    Henry Racette

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    If you are going to run away from terms that can be turned into pejoratives, you are not going to be able to communicate.

    It doesn’t make sense to pick a word that can easily and amusingly be turned into a joke. That would just be silly. That’s what that “difficult to pun into a pejorative” bit meant. 

    But I do agree with you that it should be a little bit fun. It’s got to be something that normal people are willing to use as a label for themselves, and that people unfamiliar with the term won’t immediately find off-putting and contentious. That way a conversation can ensue.

    • #22
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:52 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  23. Marjorie Reynolds Coolidge

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    PS I’ve lived in a lot of places in the U.S., a dozen states or more, and I’ve traveled pretty broadly. The first place I ever visited for which I felt a strong yearning to return was Ireland. I’ve often thought how nice it would be to live in some remote location along the coast, on the rolling green hills above the ocean.

     

    I’m not very proud of Ireland at the moment but it’s home and there’s still a lot of good in it. I’ll have to do a top 10 things for conservatives to do in Ireland 😀

    • #23
    • June 28, 2020, at 12:55 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  24. Chuck Thatcher

    So, Henry, what kind of response do you get from the woke folk when you describe yourself as “Burkean”?

    • #24
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:07 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  25. Richard Fulmer Member

    I’m going to put in another plug for @jimmcconnell‘s “reasoned” label. It has a positive connotation, and draws a clear distinction from the post-modern left that explicitly rejects reason. It’s time to bring reason back into fashion. 

    • #25
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:08 PM PDT
    • 3 likes
  26. John H. Member
    John H.Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Something that pairs with “woke.” “Witty”? No, that rhymes with a too-handy pejorative. Uhh…”wry”? I like wry, indeed strive to be it constantly, but…nope. Few people would get it, and no one would be stung by an accusation that he wasn’t it. Well, that’s politics for you: a 3-letter word can be too complicated.

    • #26
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:13 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  27. Chuck Thatcher

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    Nothing wrong with a nice warm beer😀

    Once upon a time I worked at a drive-in in Corpus Christi. We served LOTS of beer. One fellow would come in every few days and drink one beer we kept in the window for him. Warm Millers. I don’t know what label to put on him but I really don’t think he was Irish.

    • #27
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:15 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  28. RushBabe49 Thatcher

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    PS I’ve lived in a lot of places in the U.S., a dozen states or more, and I’ve traveled pretty broadly. The first place I ever visited for which I felt a strong yearning to return was Ireland. I’ve often thought how nice it would be to live in some remote location along the coast, on the rolling green hills above the ocean.

     

    I’m not very proud of Ireland at the moment but it’s home and there’s still a lot of good in it. I’ll have to do a top 10 things for conservatives to do in Ireland 😀

    Please do! I am trying to get Ray to agree to take a vacation in Ireland next fall. Our 18th anniversary is in October. 

    • #28
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:19 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  29. Marjorie Reynolds Coolidge

    RushBabe49 (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Marjorie Reynolds (View Comment):

    We use sound a lot in Ireland to describe a decent person or a satisfactory arrangement.

    Yes, but you also serve your beer warm. So, you know.

    PS I’ve lived in a lot of places in the U.S., a dozen states or more, and I’ve traveled pretty broadly. The first place I ever visited for which I felt a strong yearning to return was Ireland. I’ve often thought how nice it would be to live in some remote location along the coast, on the rolling green hills above the ocean.

     

    I’m not very proud of Ireland at the moment but it’s home and there’s still a lot of good in it. I’ll have to do a top 10 things for conservatives to do in Ireland 😀

    Please do! I am trying to get Ray to agree to take a vacation in Ireland next fall. Our 18th anniversary is in October.

    I’ll get on it! Is that 2021? Or this fall?

    • #29
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:21 PM PDT
    • Like
  30. RushBabe49 Thatcher

    2021

    • #30
    • June 28, 2020, at 1:22 PM PDT
    • 1 like