Heads Explode on Command: POTUS Takes HCQ

 

Trump thumbs upWell, the week certainly started off with a bang. President Trump held two televised meetings, one with the new White House Opportunity and Revitalization Council and the other with restaurant industry leaders. In the second forum, he took “questions” from the usual suspects, who naturally asked about everything except restaurant workers and all the workers in the supply chains that are harmed by governments ordering restaurants to go out of business or go far deeper in debt. The honking gaggle gave President Trump a chance to reveal something I had suspected ever since Vice President Pence visited a hospital, on camera, without wearing a mask. President Trump, and likely Vice President Pence, are taking hydroxychloroquine as preventive medicine.*

This matters for several reasons. First, it matters that President Trump, and likely Vice President Pence, are doing all they can to keep healthy during the pandemic. They come in contact with an extraordinary number of people, who themselves have had contact with an unknown number of people. No screening test is perfect. Second, it matters that President Trump is opposing Dr. Fauci’s pet positions with the positions of many other real medical doctors. This should help push the FDA to stop the #resistance on this drug that their associates in universities and industry cannot turn to money or career profit. It should provide a stronger signal to patients and doctors who wish to use it to prevent or treat early stage COVID-19. Finally, it annoyed all the right people, including at Faux News, so that was a joy bonus to start the week.

But wait! There’s more! Later Monday evening, President Trump tweeted out a copy of the letter he sent to the World Health Organization, which Dr. Fauci had to work with throughout his career, and reflexively defended even as the COVID-19 disaster unfolded. Now we have a letter from the president of the United States challenging the medical authority of the WHO, while news resurfaced that the Department of Justice, working with states attorneys general, was drafting an antitrust lawsuit against Google, which takes down any YouTube content that dares question the WHO.


* Here is the relevant exchange during a roundtable with restaurant executives and industry leaders:

Q    Sir, you tweeted recently that this whole whistleblower racket needs to be looked at very closely —

THE PRESIDENT:  Sure.

Q    — and it is causing a great injustice —

THE PRESIDENT:  Sure.  I had a fake whistleblower.

Q    — and harm.

THE PRESIDENT:  Sure.

Q    Who should look —

THE PRESIDENT:  I had a fake whistleblower originally.  He was a faker.  Because when he looked at my — he wrote down a conversation that was totally different from the conversation I actually had with the President of Ukraine.  It was a fake whistleblower.  And, by the way, everybody knows who he is.  He’s a political operative.  You know that.  Jon knows who he is.  You know him better than anybody, Jon.  Right?  He’s a faker, and he was a fake whistleblower, and it was a phony, disgraceful period of time.  And we came out well.  You know why we came out well?  Because everyone recognized it for what it was: just a political witch hunt.

But he was a fake whistleblower.  He wrote a story that bore no resemblance to the conversation that I had with the President of Uk- — Ukraine.  Nothing whatsoever.  And by the way, the inspector general, he went by the whistleblower.  He didn’t want to see the conversation that I had.  When he saw the conversation that I had, he said, “Well, that bears no resemblance to what the whistleblower said.”  Why didn’t he look first before he ran to Congress?  He ran to Congress like he couldn’t get there fast enough with a whistleblower report

[. . .]

So, you know, that’s the way it goes.  So you had a phony whistleblower.  And this other guy with the hydroxychloroquine — okay? — well, he — he went out and he’s the one that approved the hydroxychloroquine.  He’s the one that signed the application.  He also happens to be — if you look — see whether or not — I won’t put it on me; I’ll put it on you.  See whether or not he was a big contributor to the Democrats.  See whether or not he wanted the Democrats to win.  No, there’s a lot of bad things coming out about him, but you people don’t want to write the — the news.

You know, but — if you look — but he’s the one that signed the application.  The very important form, he signed it.  Now, if he doesn’t believe in it, why would he sign it?  And a lot of good things have come out about the hydroxy.  A lot of good things have come out.  You’d be surprised at how many people are taking it, especially the frontline workers — before you catch it.

The frontline workers — many, many are taking it.  I happen to be taking it.  I happen to be taking it.

Q    You’re taking hydroxychloroquine?

THE PRESIDENT:  I’m taking it — hydroxychloroquine.

Q    Right now?

Q    When —

THE PRESIDENT:  Right now.  Yeah.  A couple of weeks ago, I started taking it.

Q    Why, sir?

THE PRESIDENT:  Because I think it’s good.  I’ve heard a lot of good stories.  And if it’s not good, I’ll tell you right — you know, I’m not going to get hurt by it.  It’s been around for 40 years for malaria, for lupus, for other things.

I take it.  Frontline workers take it.  A lot of doctors take it.

Q    (Inaudible.)

THE PRESIDENT:  Excuse me.  A lot of doctors take it.  I take it.  Now, I hope to not be able to take it soon because, you know, I hope they come up with some answer, but I think people should be allowed to.

I got a letter from a doctor the other day from Westchester, New York — around the area.  He didn’t want anything.  He just said, “Sir, I have hundreds of patients and I give them hydroxychloroquine; I give them the Z-Pak, which is azithromycin; and I give them zinc.  And out of the hundreds of patients — many hundreds, over 300 patients — I haven’t lost one.”  He said, “Please keep pressing that, sir.”

And if you look at that phony report that was put in, that report on the hydroxyl — was given to people that were in extraordinarily bad condition — extraordinarily bad, people that were dying.  No, I — I think, for whatever it’s worth, I take it.  I was — I — I would’ve told you that three, four days ago, but we never had a chance because you never asked me the question.

Q    Did the White House doctor recommend that you take that?  Is that why you’re taking it?

THE PRESIDENT:  Yeah.  A White House doctor — didn’t recommend — no, I asked him, “What do you think?”  He said, “Well, if you’d like it.”  I said, “Yeah, I’d like it.  I’d like to take it.”

A lot of people are taking it.  A lot of frontline workers are taking hydroxychloroquine.  A lot of front- — I don’t take it because — hey, people said, “Oh, maybe he owns the company.”  No, I don’t own the company.  You know what?  I want the people of this nation to feel good.  I don’t want them being sick.  And there’s a very good chance that this has an impact, especially early on.

But you look at frontline workers.  You look at doctors and nurses.  A lot of them are taking it as a preventative, and they’re taking — totally unrelated, but they take the Z-Pak or the azithromycin for possible infection.

Now, I haven’t taken that, other than an original dose because the ori- — all you need.  You don’t have to take it simultaneously, but the zinc you do take.  So I’m taking the two: the zinc and the hydroxy.  And all I can tell you is, so far, I seem to be okay.

Q    Can you explain, sir, though, why you started taking it?  Have you been exposed?

THE PRESIDENT:  Yeah, because — no.  No, not at all.  I just said that — I’ve had so many letters from people, like the one I told you about.  I got it last week.  I’ll give you — would you like a copy of it?  I’d love to give you — if you ask Molly, she’ll give you a copy of it.

But this is a doctor — he doesn’t want anything.  I don’t know him, never heard of him, but he treats people that are — that we’re talking about.  And he said, out of hundreds of people that he’s treated, he hasn’t lost one.  And he just wanted me to know about it.  That’s all.  It wasn’t — he wasn’t saying, “Gee, could I have dinner with you, Mr. President?  I’d like to come to the White House.”

Q    (Inaudible.)

THE PRESIDENT:  But I’ve received many such letters.  I’ve received a lot of positive letters and it seems to have an impact.  And maybe it does; maybe it doesn’t.  But if it doesn’t, you’re not going to get sick or die.  This is a — a pill that’s been used for a long time — for 30, 40 years on the malaria and on lupus too, and even on arthritis, I guess, from what I understand.

So it’s been heavily tested, in terms of — I was just waiting to see your eyes light up when I said this, but — you know, when I announced this.  But, yeah, I have taken it for about a week and a half now, and I’m still here.  I’m still here.

Q    Can you explain, sir, though, you — what is the evidence that it has a preventative effect?

THE PRESIDENT:  Here we go.  Are you ready?  Here’s my evidence.  I get a lot of positive calls about it.  The only negative I’ve heard was the study where they gave it — was it the VA?  With, you know, people that aren’t big Trump fans gave it — and we’ve done the greatest job maybe of anything in the VA, because I got VA Choice and VA Accountability both approved.  Accountability, Tilman, is where you can fire bad people that work in the VA that you couldn’t fire them.

We had thousands of people that were sadists, that were stealing, that were robbers, that were horrible people.  They’d beat up our veterans.  They couldn’t do it in primetime, but they did it when they were sick.

And we got Accountability.  Nobody thought you could get it because of the unions and civil service.  I got it passed so that now you fire bad people in the VA.  We got rid of tremendously bad people that should have never been there.  But I also got — probably, even more importantly, if you can say that; maybe not — VA Choice.

So if you have to wait on line for a doctor, you go outside, you have a private doctor, we pay the bill.  We work out deals with doctors.  We have pricing.  So you go out, you pay the bill.  And it was a great thing that we did, so we’ve done a great job with the VA.

But they had a report come out and the results of the report — it was a very unscientific report, by the way.  But I get a lot of tremendously positive news on the hydroxy.  And I say, “Hey.”  You know the expression I’ve used, Jon?  “What do you have to lose?”  Okay?  “What do you have to lose?”

Q    Is that a reason to take medicine?

Q    So are you taking this every day?

THE PRESIDENT:  I have been taking for about a week —

Q    For a week and a half?

THE PRESIDENT:  — for about a week and a half.

Q    Every day?

THE PRESIDENT:  At some point — every day.  I take a pill every day.  At some point, I’ll stop.  What I’d like to do is I’d like to have the cure and/or the vaccine, and that’ll happen, I think, very soon.

Q    So you’ve had no symptoms, sir?

THE PRESIDENT:  Zero symptoms.  No, I haven’t had any symp- — no, I tested — we — I test — every couple of days, they want to test me, you know, for obvious reasons.  I mean, I am the President, alright?  So they want to test me.  I don’t want to be tested, but they want to test me.  So every couple of days I get tested, and I’ve been — I’ve shown always negative.  Right?  Negative.  Is that the term you use for this?  Right?  Negative.  Totally negative.  No symptoms.  No nothing.

But, no, I take it because I think — I hear very good things.  Again, you have to go to frontline workers.  Many frontline workers take it and they seem to be doing very well.

Q    Sir, have any other members of your administration, Vice President Pence, or your family members taken this?

THE PRESIDENT:  No, but I wouldn’t be surprised.  I — I don’t want to ask them because that’s a personal decision as to whether or not you want to say.  I just want to be open with the American public because, you know, I happen to think it’s good.

I do want the letter given because this letter made — not in terms of my taking it, but I thought it was a very well-crafted letter by a man who’s a respected doctor up in Westchester, maybe a little beyond Westchester — a little up higher and — in New York.  And he just — he didn’t want anything.  He just wanted me to know the results of what he’s doing as a doctor.  And he was so happy with the fact that I — I fight for this stuff.

And then we have this crazy whistleblower, this fake whistleblower get out and try and, you know, knock it, who is — who signed the application.  He — he did all the — he did the signing.  He was a believer at one point, I assume.  Otherwise, he shouldn’t have signed it.  No matter who told him to, he shouldn’t have signed it.

Okay.  One more question.  That’s it?  Thank you all very much.

END

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  1. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    I’m going to guess that what he (or she?) meant by “slander” wasn’t criticism based on an absence of clinical data to support its efficacy, but rather knee-jerk criticism that is specifically in response to the President’s endorsement of the drug — criticism that started immediately after the President first mentioned it and long before any clinical data was available.

    Why was our ignorant President hawking HCQ like Billy Maize selling Oxiclean when its efficacy was unproven? How is that responsible or even honest? But the press throwing cold water on Trump’s unfounded assertions is a knee jerk criticism of the drug?  I’m sorry I thought it would be the responsibility of the most powerful man in the world to not be speaking out of his rear end especially during a pandemic when accurate information about the disease is paramount. But no, of course we can’t expect that from Trump or hold him to any kind of basic standard. 

    HCQ hasn’t been slandered by the press it has been ignorantly hyped by Trump as a miracle drug when all objective data says it isn’t. And now the entire apparatus of right wing media is dedicated to maintaining the hype to preserve Trump’s ego on this issue. And for what? 

    • #31
  2. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Unsk (View Comment):

    Henry: “I’m going to guess that what he (or she?) meant by “slander” wasn’t criticism based on an absence of clinical data to support its efficacy,”

    Henry, you need to review the VA HCQ study the NIH released.

    I will remain agnostic until there is a substantial body of high quality evidence demonstrating either efficacy or a lack of efficacy. We’re not there yet, so I’m quite happy to remain undecided.

    Absent clear evidence of inefficacy, and given the safety of the drug and the extraordinary quality of medical attention which the President receives, I’m perfectly comfortable with him taking it as a precautionary measure.

    • #32
  3. Unsk Member
    Unsk
    @Unsk

    “Experience with hydroxychloroquine that has been accumulating indicates that there is little benefit in treatment of COVID-19, though.”

    A total crock.  Please cite some thing other than these general notions. Experiences in other countries says you are completely wrong. 

    “Remdesivir is being distributed for treatment of COVID-19 now, There is evidence that it reduces recovery time in COVID-19.”

    Remdesivir has not been shown to reduce mortality rates at all. The study used by Dr Fauci to grant it emergency use was modified midstream because mortality rates were not being shown to go down and therefore only recovery time but not mortality was looked at.  It was a total fraud, again by Dr. Fauci. 

    Roderick, People are dying in droves because of the nonsense you are spouting.  Aren’t you ashamed of yourself?

    • #33
  4. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Valiuth (View Comment):
    HCQ hasn’t been slandered by the press it has been ignorantly hyped by Trump as a miracle drug when all objective data says it isn’t.

    Embrace the power of and. Yes, President Trump did what he does: he spoke hopefully and enthusiastically about something that quite possibly didn’t warrant the praise. He does that a lot, it’s his signature style. People who get their noses bent out of shape over it have noses that are too easily bent out of shape.

    The press immediately went on the attack, with no more basis in “science” than the President had. Because the press is obsessed with placing itself in opposition to the President and reflexively opposing whatever he endorses.

    It reminds me of the conflict between Young Earth Creationists and strident scientific atheists, guys like Richard Dawkins. Both groups are attempting to apply the laws of the physical sciences to something that is explicitly beyond the scope of the physical sciences. Both groups are, in my opinion, acting foolishly. But it is the scientific atheists who are acting most foolishly, because they’re the ones who should understand their domain well enough to know that it has precisely nothing to offer in a discussion of faith.

    Trump is one man. The press is an institution full of smart people. It’s easier to excuse the peccadilloes of one man than the pathetic raving of a press that insists on continuously redefining itself in opposition to whatever that one man thinks, says, or does.

    • #34
  5. DrewInWisconsin is done with t… Member
    DrewInWisconsin is done with t…
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    I’m going to guess that what he (or she?) meant by “slander” wasn’t criticism based on an absence of clinical data to support its efficacy, but rather knee-jerk criticism that is specifically in response to the President’s endorsement of the drug — criticism that started immediately after the President first mentioned it and long before any clinical data was available.

    Why was our ignorant President hawking HCQ like Billy Maize selling Oxiclean when its efficacy was unproven? How is that responsible or even honest? But the press throwing cold water on Trump’s unfounded assertions is a knee jerk criticism of the drug? I’m sorry I thought it would be the responsibility of the most powerful man in the world to not be speaking out of his rear end especially during a pandemic when accurate information about the disease is paramount. But no, of course we can’t expect that from Trump or hold him to any kind of basic standard.

    HCQ hasn’t been slandered by the press it has been ignorantly hyped by Trump as a miracle drug when all objective data says it isn’t. And now the entire apparatus of right wing media is dedicated to maintaining the hype to preserve Trump’s ego on this issue. And for what?

    If you followed another thread on this, you likely saw all the links to reports from doctors in New York, in Texas, in L.A. and across the globe about how effective HCQ has been when used with Zinc. The only reason you are repeating the slander of the mainstream media is because you have a severe case of TDS, and for that no cure has been discovered.

    • #35
  6. DrewInWisconsin is done with t… Member
    DrewInWisconsin is done with t…
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Fauci is now doing a study on HCQ without using the accompanying Zinc. It is a study designed to fail. Or to put it another way, he is using human guinea pigs who might die because he is not administering HCQ properly, all because he wants to promote Remdesivir for which he has a financial stake. Patients will die so that Fauci can get rich.

     

    • #36
  7. Unsk Member
    Unsk
    @Unsk

    Drew:

    ‘”Fauci is now doing a study on HCQ without using the accompanying Zinc. It is a study designed to fail. Or to put it another way, he is using human guinea pigs who might die because he is not administering HCQ properly, all because he wants to promote Remdesivir for which he has a financial stake. Patients will die so that Fauci can get rich.”

    All so very true. Dr Fauci’s behavior and conduct are outrageous and criminal. 

    • #37
  8. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    Trump is one man. The press is an institution full of smart people. It’s easier to excuse the peccadilloes of one man than the pathetic raving of a press that insists on continuously redefining itself in opposition to whatever that one man thinks, says, or does.

    No it’s not. He is one man with far greater responsibility than any journalist has and far larger reach. You maybe pick out a handful of journalists whose criticism of HCQ could be seen at the time as overly negative given then the lack of further observations about it and ascribe that to all of the institution. Yet those journalists make up a smaller fraction of their institution than Trump does of the one he represents The US Federal Government. I don’t see why you so blithely wave off his irresponsibility in such a manner. He isn’t just one guy on Twitter like you or I or Dr. Oz. He is the freaking President. Are the Pope or Queen of England just some guys/gals? You don’t see them spouting off this kind of nonsense, and if they did it would be equally right to chastise them for it. This is who Trump is I get that, what I don’t get is why that excuses anything? 

    If Trump just wants to be a guy he should resign, but if he is to be president he should be held responsible as he is made responsible by the very institution he occupies and to which he was elected. And that greater responsibility demands that he be more and better than what he is, and as long as he keeps living far far short of the mark he remains unworthy and unsuited for his office. 

    And what bends my nose isn’t that he is so irresponsible it is how easily and blithely people excuse his behavior. 

    • #38
  9. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    Trump is one man. The press is an institution full of smart people. It’s easier to excuse the peccadilloes of one man than the pathetic raving of a press that insists on continuously redefining itself in opposition to whatever that one man thinks, says, or does.

    No it’s not. He is one man with far greater responsibility than any journalist has and far larger reach. You maybe pick out a handful of journalists whose criticism of HCQ could be seen at the time as overly negative given then the lack of further observations about it and ascribe that to all of the institution. Yet those journalists make up a smaller fraction of their institution than Trump does of the one he represents The US Federal Government. I don’t see why you so blithely wave off his irresponsibility in such a manner. He isn’t just one guy on Twitter like you or I or Dr. Oz. He is the freaking President. Are the Pope or Queen of England just some guys/gals? You don’t see them spouting off this kind of nonsense, and if they did it would be equally right to chastise them for it. This is who Trump is I get that, what I don’t get is why that excuses anything?

    If Trump just wants to be a guy he should resign, but if he is to be president he should be held responsible as he is made responsible by the very institution he occupies and to which he was elected. And that greater responsibility demands that he be more and better than what he is, and as long as he keeps living far far short of the mark he remains unworthy and unsuited for his office.

    And what bends my nose isn’t that he is so irresponsible it is how easily and blithely people excuse his behavior.

    Yes, he’s the President.  So who’s dumb enough to take medical advice from him?

    Don’t take political advice from your Doctor either.

    • #39
  10. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    Trump is one man. The press is an institution full of smart people. It’s easier to excuse the peccadilloes of one man than the pathetic raving of a press that insists on continuously redefining itself in opposition to whatever that one man thinks, says, or does.

    No it’s not. He is one man with far greater responsibility than any journalist has and far larger reach. You maybe pick out a handful of journalists whose criticism of HCQ could be seen at the time as overly negative given then the lack of further observations about it and ascribe that to all of the institution. Yet those journalists make up a smaller fraction of their institution than Trump does of the one he represents The US Federal Government. I don’t see why you so blithely wave off his irresponsibility in such a manner. He isn’t just one guy on Twitter like you or I or Dr. Oz. He is the freaking President. Are the Pope or Queen of England just some guys/gals? You don’t see them spouting off this kind of nonsense, and if they did it would be equally right to chastise them for it. This is who Trump is I get that, what I don’t get is why that excuses anything?

    If Trump just wants to be a guy he should resign, but if he is to be president he should be held responsible as he is made responsible by the very institution he occupies and to which he was elected. And that greater responsibility demands that he be more and better than what he is, and as long as he keeps living far far short of the mark he remains unworthy and unsuited for his office.

    And what bends my nose isn’t that he is so irresponsible it is how easily and blithely people excuse his behavior.

    What your response implicitly rejects is the idea that people are smart enough to recognize the kind of person Trump is and to factor that into their interpretation of the man.

    By now, everyone who is paying attention and has a modicum of common sense should recognize that our President often speaks loosely, inaccurately, and outside of his area of expertise. People who don’t understand that are, I think, also duped by the press and popular media, which represent a more consistent and pervasive force for bias and misinformation than is the President.

    I don’t excuse his comments, but I don’t hyperventilate about the either. And, since I think he’s doing quite a good job at most of what he does, I find much more to approve of than to condemn in his conduct.

    • #40
  11. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    MiMac (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    I’m agnostic about the drug, but one would think the press would be interested in whether or not “many front-line workers” are actually taking it as a prophylactic and, if so, why. (I’ve read that, in fact, they are.)

    I don’t expect the press to query medical people as aggressively as they do the President. Because they respect medical people, and there are no points to be scored by going after them.

    Reportedly, at least some of the reports of medical personal taking HCQ prophylactically are due to an ongoing study to determine if it works-which makes sense b/c healthcare providers are likely to be exposed and can be closely followed. Hopefully we will get some meaningful data, so far the HCQ studies are, at best, conflicting.

    Hopefully so. I understand this is part of the large double blind random study that South Dakota and neighbor states agreed to host, naturally opposed by the usual suspects. “SCIENCE!” over science.

    One study of healthcare workers is trying to enroll 30000 providers-that should be enough to show any significant effect

    • #41
  12. Clifford A. Brown Contributor
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Unsk (View Comment):

    Henry: “I’m going to guess that what he (or she?) meant by “slander” wasn’t criticism based on an absence of clinical data to support its efficacy,”

    Henry, you need to review the VA HCQ study the NIH released.

    I will remain agnostic until there is a substantial body of high quality evidence demonstrating either efficacy or a lack of efficacy. We’re not there yet, so I’m quite happy to remain undecided.

    Absent clear evidence of inefficacy, and given the safety of the drug and the extraordinary quality of medical attention which the President receives, I’m perfectly comfortable with him taking it as a precautionary measure.

    From Tuesday’s cabinet meeting:

    SECRETARY WILKIE:  Thank you, Mr. President.  I — and I want to clear up something that the media has not reported accurately.  That was not a VA study.

    THE PRESIDENT:  Can you hear him?  Because I think it’s important.  You asked the question.

    SECRETARY WILKIE:  Yeah.  That was not —

    Q    Yes.  Yes, I can hear him.

    THE PRESIDENT:  Do you want to listen?  Because I don’t even think you’re listening.

    Q    I can hear him.

    THE PRESIDENT:  Go ahead, why don’t you listen to him?

    Q    I am listening.

    SECRETARY WILKIE:  That was — that was not a VA study.  Researchers took VA numbers and they did not clinically review them.  They were not peer-reviewed.  They did not even look at what the President just mentioned — the various comorbidities that the patients who were referenced in that study had.

    I also want to echo what the Secretary of HHS said.  The instructions I received from the President were very clear, and that was to preserve and protect life.  Those of us who’ve had a military life — some of us around this table — we’ve been taking this drug for years.  As the President mentioned, the Department of Defense and VA have been using it for 65 years.  On every — any given day, VA uses 42,000 doses of this drug.  And what we did, when this virus first hit us, was to use every means necessary to help preserve life.

    We believed that the Congress was right, and the President signed legislation to protect life: the Right to Try.  And we did this in consultation, not only with the families of those veterans, but we did this in consultation with our doctors, under FDA guidelines.

    So I want to knock down the phony story that this is somehow the VA going back on what the President told us to do, which was to use every means possible to protect and preserve the lives — the lives of our veterans.  And I think, as the President mentioned, we’ve seen in many cases across this country — in fact, I was on the news the day that the Governor of New York was asking you for tens of thousands of doses.

    • #42
  13. Weeping Inactive
    Weeping
    @Weeping

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):
    Those of us who’ve had a military life — some of us around this table — we’ve been taking this drug for years. As the President mentioned, the Department of Defense and VA have been using it for 65 years. On every — any given day, VA uses 42,000 doses of this drug.

    I think this is what makes me roll my eyes the most over the kerfuffle. So what if studies prove that the drug winds up not being the cure/preventive that Trump has touted it as? It’s a drug that’s been in use for decades; it’s possible side effects are well known, and it’s only available with a doctor’s prescription. I don’t get why anyone should care how Trump presents it under those circumstances. Doctors aren’t going to prescribe it if they think it’s going to hurt their patients; and if it winds up not being anymore effective than a placebo, at least something was tried.

    • #43
  14. EDISONPARKS Member
    EDISONPARKS
    @user_54742

    Weeping (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):
    Those of us who’ve had a military life — some of us around this table — we’ve been taking this drug for years. As the President mentioned, the Department of Defense and VA have been using it for 65 years. On every — any given day, VA uses 42,000 doses of this drug.

    I think this is what makes me roll my eyes the most over the kerfuffle. So what if studies prove that the drug winds up not being the cure/preventive that Trump has touted it as? It’s a drug that’s been in use for decades; it’s possible side effects are well known, and it’s only available with a doctor’s prescription. I don’t get why anyone should care how Trump presents it under those circumstances. Doctors aren’t going to prescribe it if they think it’s going to hurt their patients; and if it winds up not being anymore effective than a placebo, at least something was tried.

    Because Trump is bad!

    Why can’t you Trumpy people understand ….

    You’re going to make my head ….

    • #44
  15. DrewInWisconsin is done with t… Member
    DrewInWisconsin is done with t…
    @DrewInWisconsin

    I see the WHO (a most trustworthy organization) is now telling people not to use HCQ — never mind that they’re on record calling it one of the world’s most essential drugs. They’ve suddenly declared it dangerous.

    Sorry, but why are we listening to these China Puppets?

     

    • #45
  16. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    I don’t excuse his comments, but I don’t hyperventilate about the either. And, since I think he’s doing quite a good job at most of what he does, I find much more to approve of than to condemn in his conduct.

    Really? Cause I don’t see him doing much of anything other than his performative nonesequitors before the public. What can it be said Presidents actually do for themselves to be judged on? About the only policies he seems actively engaged in are his hamfisted trade policies that over all are weakening our trade position, his immigration policies that I for one think are stupid, and that’s about it. Most everything else is left unattended (which given that he is an idiot is probably for the best) though sadly every once in a while his attention falls on some aspect of government which is then thrown into chaos by his ignorant attempts as intervening and managing. He spends most of his day watching Cable News and griping about how unfair reporters are to him. And this is what you think he does well? I guess in a certain sense he is a master of self pity, and therefore does a good job being aggrieved. But in the larger sense he seems utterly superfluous to most things and in the particulars is more a hindrance to effective action and consistent messaging. He is a man who claims no responsibility and so acts as if he is in charge of nothing. The man isn’t doing a good job as president, he isn’t even acting as president. He is a man playing a talk radio pundit in the office of president around whom things occur that he ignorantly complains and comments on. He is essentially acting randomly from the stand point of management and organization. And sometimes things workout okay, and other times they don’t but there is no plan or goal to which he is striving other than the further production of his entertainment product. 

    I agree with you that most people realize he is a fool. But why accept such a person to be in charge, unless you yourself are also a fool? I am unimpressed by his so called “accomplishments” and I believe that effective presidents are good organizers and communicators, and he is neither. At best he is an entertainer for a very selective subset of people, which now make up the bulk of the Republican party. 

     

    • #46
  17. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Valiuth (View Comment):
    Cause I don’t see him doing much of anything other than his performative nonesequitors before the public.

    Perhaps we’re looking at different things. I don’t pay much attention to his performance before the public.

    He has appointed a large number of judges who are likely to be strong constitutional originalists. That should pay dividends for decades to come.

    He has deregulated a lot, and is apparently in the process of deregulating quite a bit more. I know that, absent congressional action, these efforts could be reversed by a subsequent administration, but while we have them they’re good, and at least the next administration will have to be on record as reinstating them if it chooses to do so.

    He has restored our relationship with Israel, which is important to me. He has also ended our antagonistic relationship with the UK, which is also important to me.

    His administration is overseeing an attempt to clean house at the Department of Justice. On my short list of things I wanted from this administration was a cleaning out of the Obama-era corruption that had taken root there. I think AG Barr is a welcome change from the kind of people we had during the Obama era, and I hope he has time to make significant progress restoring integrity at the DoJ.

    He has focused popular attention on press corruption and bias. He hasn’t done it the way I’d like, but he’s done it better than any recent president has done it, and I think the very low popular opinion of the press is an indicator of that. We’ve been living with a deeply partisan and unbalanced press for decades, and it’s good to finally have someone pushing back against it.

    He exited the Paris accord, approved the Keystone pipeline, has resisted launching big green initiatives, scoffs at global warming alarmism, and creates no barriers to the fossil fuel industries. In fact, he speaks favorably of industry in general, and that also is a welcome change from the last administration, which mired the economy in fear and uncertainty by constantly badmouthing business and threatening new regulatory expansion.

    He has resisted dramatic expansions of executive authority, and most critically in the past couple of months when he had every opportunity to arrogate to his office new powers, yet resisted the temptation. In fact, I’m pretty happy with the way he has continued to color within the Constitutional lines: as far as I know he hasn’t spied on political opponents, treated the law like a political tool to be turned on and off at will, promised “more flexibility” to our adversaries after the next election, accused law enforcement of inherent racism, or sanctioned identity politics.

    I’m sure there are other things I like. That deregulation thing is a big deal to me.

    • #47
  18. DrewInWisconsin is done with t… Member
    DrewInWisconsin is done with t…
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Valiuth (View Comment):
    Really? Cause I don’t see him doing much of anything other than his performative nonesequitors before the public.

    “There are none so blind as those who will not see.”

    • #48
  19. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    I don’t recall Obama being antagonistic to the UK he seemed to get on Okay with Cameron. Who are the Israelis going to be friends with if not us? Though on that note I don’t see Trump doing much to relieve the growing partisan split on Israel and because he is himself such a divisive person the more he draws up to them the worse they’ll be viewed in the US by the left. Which I don’t know how good it will be for them in the long term. But Israel isn’t a big concern to me. I’m all for supporting a fellow liberal democracy against illiberal foes but if one wants to be all realist about it they don’t really seem to offer us much strategically. 

    Appointment of judges is basically out of Trump’s hands that is all McConnell and the Federalist Society, and the deregulation like you said is temporary, but so are the judges too in the end. Dems will appoint other ones and the process for doing it is now beyond the ability of any compromise or consensus (though that is more McConnell’s and Congresses fault). I guess if I also believed constitutional originalists were anything other than just a will to power philosophy like the living connstitution I’d be more impressed. Ones arbitrary philosophy used to justify their prefered outcomes is as random as the next man’s philosophical construct.

    Your view of his handling and limiting of executive power is not just wrong but absurdly wrong. His lawyers have argued that the president is beyond all legal investigation, and even beyond congressional oversight. He has expanded the abuse of emergency powers, and continued the further politicization of the Justice Department. All the things Trump has done as president have laid the ground work for future Democratic presidents to take action you will have no leg to stand on to object. I doubt I’ll like any of their policies but I certainly will enjoy watching them hoist you all on your own petard. 

     

    • #49
  20. DrewInWisconsin, Ham-Fisted Bu… Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Ham-Fisted Bu…
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Valiuth (View Comment):
    I doubt I’ll like any of their policies but I certainly will enjoy watching them hoist you all on your own petard. 

    May the bridges you burn behind you light your way.

    • #50
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