Recommended by Ricochet Members Created with Sketch. Quote of the Day: Honesty and Deceit

 

“It’s discouraging to think how many people are shocked by honesty and how few by deceit.” — Noël Coward

That is the reason American politics is so toxic today. You cannot tell the truth without shocking people, but no one thinks twice when a politician lies. They expect it. (How can you tell a politician is lying? His lips are moving.)

Or consider the famous Kinsley Gaffe — when a politician tells some obvious truth he isn’t supposed to say. Those “gaffes” are shocking.

We have been subject to a several-months gaslighting campaign around the proposition that Trump committed an impeachable offense in his conversation with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. It is a lie, but a large fraction of the population accepts it as a truth. (Please, show me the quid pro quo in the transcript. Or the abuse of power. Point to the specific words and explain how they constitute a quid pro quo or an abuse of power. You cannot. They are not there.)

Yet people — even the majority of those who do not see an impeachable offense — are not shocked by the deceit underlying the impeachment. It is shrugged off as business as usual. And try and be honest about things — as J. K. Rowling is just discovering — and you will shock millions who should know enough to recognize the truth, but simply cannot.

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There are 12 comments.

  1. RandR Member

    Add to that those who know but as an act of will, ignore the truth or call it a lie.

    • #1
    • December 21, 2019, at 11:44 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  2. PHCheese Member

    I think it’s a tribal thing. As long as they are part of their tribe they get a pass no how many knots they need to twist their minds into.

    • #2
    • December 21, 2019, at 11:52 AM PST
    • 6 likes
  3. Vectorman Thatcher

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    I think it’s a tribal thing. As long as they are part of their tribe they get a pass no how many knots they need to twist their minds into.

    It also reminds me of people who follow fashion designs. Instead of 16″ tires on a full size car, everyone has to have 19″ and 20″ rims, which cost more per tire, ride harsher, and break the rims easier when going over a pot hole.


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    • #3
    • December 21, 2019, at 12:30 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  4. Vectorman Thatcher

    Seawriter: And try and be honest about things – as J. K. Rowlings is just discovering – and you will shock millions who should know enough to recognize the truth, but simply cannot.

    The Emperor’s New Clothes.

    • #4
    • December 21, 2019, at 12:31 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  5. Bob Thompson Member

    Seawriter:

    We have been subject to a several-months gaslighting campaign around the proposition that Trump committed an impeachable offense in his conversation with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. It is a lie, but a large fraction of the population accepts it as a truth. (Please, show me the quid pro quo in the transcript. Or the abuse of power. Point to the specific words and explain how they constitute a quid pro quo or an abuse of power. You cannot. They are not there.)

     

    When the Democrats were working to prepare Articles of Impeachment, the impeachable act was, as they described it, the POTUS bribing or extorting the Ukraine President to interfere in the U.S. 2020 election. The transcript of the conversation does not show Trump asking that no matter what you do to the words. The only way to possibly get there would be if one is a mind and emotion reader but none of the House members were even near when the conversation took place. OTOH, there is ample documentary evidence of Joe Biden’s son Hunter Biden receiving large sums of money from a seat on Burisma’s Board of Directors as well as an admission by Joe Biden that when he was VP and responsible for dealing with Ukraine he required the dismissal of the then Prosecutor General who was investigating Burisma.

    I am shocked by the dishonesty of the entire House Democrat Caucus (subtract 3 members) who say they see Trump committing an impeachable offense and their total deceit in failing to raise a serious issue of concern about the Biden clear conflict of interest.

    • #5
    • December 21, 2019, at 3:07 PM PST
    • 4 likes
  6. Arahant Member

    But the lies never become the truth in the end.

    • #6
    • December 21, 2019, at 5:37 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  7. Seawriter Member
    Seawriter

    Arahant (View Comment):

    But the lies never become the truth in the end.

    Shocking!

    • #7
    • December 21, 2019, at 6:16 PM PST
    • 1 like
  8. Arahant Member

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Arahant (View Comment):

    But the lies never become the truth in the end.

    Shocking!

    On the other hand, they can last for centuries.

    • #8
    • December 21, 2019, at 6:24 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  9. Nohaaj Coolidge

    Arahant (View Comment):

    But the lies never become the truth in the end.

    No, they can not ever become the truth, but if exclaimed frequently and consistently enough, will be perceived as truth. 

     

    • #9
    • December 21, 2019, at 6:26 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  10. Randy Weivoda Moderator
    Randy Weivoda Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    I think it’s a tribal thing. As long as they are part of their tribe they get a pass no how many knots they need to twist their minds into.

    Agreed. Many people on both sides find things said by opposition party politicians to be outrageous, while brushing off as inconsequential lies and exaggerations by the politicians of their own party. 

    Vectorman (View Comment):
    It also reminds me of people who follow fashion designs. Instead of 16″ tires on a full size car, everyone has to have 19″ and 20″ rims, which cost more per tire, ride harsher, and break the rims easier when going over a pot hole.

    It depends on the vehicle and it’s purpose. Let’s say you bought a Corvette or Miata because you want very sharp, precise handling. You’re going to sacrifice ride comfort and spend more money by getting large wheels and low-profile tires, but the trade-off is more precision (at least to a point, there are diminishing returns). But when you see some luxury barge or SUV with very low-profile tires, it just makes no sense. Your Nissan Armada is not going to handle like a sports car regardless of your wheels and tires, so you’re just ruining your ride quality for nothing.

    • #10
    • December 22, 2019, at 3:47 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  11. Songwriter Member
    Songwriter Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Randy Weivoda (View Comment):

    Vectorman (View Comment):
    It also reminds me of people who follow fashion designs. Instead of 16″ tires on a full size car, everyone has to have 19″ and 20″ rims, which cost more per tire, ride harsher, and break the rims easier when going over a pot hole.

    It depends on the vehicle and it’s purpose. Let’s say you bought a Corvette or Miata because you want very sharp, precise handling. You’re going to sacrifice ride comfort and spend more money by getting large wheels and low-profile tires, but the trade-off is more precision (at least to a point, there are diminishing returns). But when you see some luxury barge or SUV with very low-profile tires, it just makes no sense. Your Nissan Armada is not going to handle like a sports car regardless of your wheels and tires, so you’re just ruining your ride quality for nothing.

    But as Fernando (Billy Crystal) told us years ago on SNL, “It’s better to look marvelous than to feel marvelous.”

    • #11
    • December 23, 2019, at 5:03 AM PST
    • 1 like
  12. Arahant Member

    Songwriter (View Comment):
    But as Fernando (Billy Crystal) told us years ago on SNL, “It’s better to look marvelous than to feel marvelous.”

    Good thing I’m so good looking.

    • #12
    • December 23, 2019, at 5:39 AM PST
    • 1 like