Recommended by Ricochet Members Created with Sketch. What Does One Do When the Pope Is Woke?

 

One of the more bizarre (and potentially very destructive) events of the Francis pontificate will take place October 6-27 in Rome. It is a Special Assembly of the Synod of Bishops for the Pan-Amazon Region, entitled Amazonia: New Paths for the Church and for an Integral Ecology. The lead-up to this synod consisted of talk about the lack of priests in the Pan-Amazon region and that, without priests, the Sacraments were not available on a regular basis. This is a serious concern for a Church given the mission by Jesus Christ to “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” (Mt 28:19).

A story like this, wherein the Institute of the Consolata for Foreign Missions – a Catholic mission, mind you – has had priests and laypeople working among the Yanomamis in Brazil but have failed to baptize one single soul, gives a face to this serious concern.

One might think that a Jesuit pope would look to the Society of Jesus to find a good missionary priest or two cut from the mold of St. Francis Xavier or Matteo Ricci or St. Isaac Jogues or St. Jean de Brebeuf to go to the Amazon region and preach the Gospel. Or one might think that this special gathering of bishops in Rome to (allegedly) deal with a priest shortage might be about evangelization and an increase in missionary activity.

But no.

With the first woke pope, we get a synod on New Age mumbo-jumbo. To define the mission of this synod, the Church has issued a laborious Instrumentum Laboris (IL). This working document focuses more on integral ecology (a vacuous term used 22 times in the text) than Jesus Christ or evangelization (21 and 19 mentions, respectively).

It really is an odd document to be issued from the Vatican. It is almost as if the case of the Institute of the Consolata for Foreign Missions is the model for evangelization that Francis and his sycophants want. Mind you, this was written by so-called theologians and priests – with the approval of bishops – and all endorsed by the pope. The document has not only been called heretical and apostasy, it has also been labeled as having a demonic tone.

Cardinal Raymond Burke and Bishop Athanasius Schneider are so concerned that they have jointly issued a document calling for a crusade of prayer and fasting to implore God that error and heresy do not pervert the Synod. In the document, they list six principal errors that are pervasive in the IL:

  1. Implicit pantheism.
  2. Pagan superstitions as sources of Divine Revelation and alternative pathways for salvation.
  3. Intercultural dialogue instead of evangelization.
  4. An erroneous conception of sacramental ordination, postulating worship ministers of either sex to perform even shamanic rituals.
  5. An “integral ecology” that downgrades human dignity.
  6. A tribal collectivism that undermines personal uniqueness and freedom.

Suffice to say that there is not much talk of the salvation of souls – which, apart from worshiping God, is the primary mission of the Church. The IL is mostly climate-change hogwash, New Age dumb-jumbo, and neo-Marxist drivel. Unsurprisingly, the working document and lead-up to the synod has been dominated by the Germans. For, you see, the Germans – even the so-called Catholics like Cardinals Kasper and Marx – are almost as pagan as the poor people of the Amazon. The progressive version of Catholicism that the Germans preach is leading to the death of the Church in Germany. They are losing their beloved Kirchensteuer (a church tax that is imposed on members of churches) because the faithful have lost their faith and no longer produce vocations or Catholics.

So what do the leaders of the German Church want to do? They double-down on stupid, embrace the world, and push for more progressive ideas like eliminating the rule of celibacy in the Latin-Rite Church, approving women deacons and priests, and promoting blessings for sodomitical unions – the same things many of their Protestant brethren have tried and also failed at.

It isn’t only the crazy Germans who will be at the synod but also non-Catholics like Jeffrey Sachs and Ban Ki Moon. It is a wonder that Greta Thunberg and Bernie “let’s promote abortion in the Third World to combat climate change” Sanders haven’t been invited to participate (perhaps the pope doesn’t want to be out-woked).

This is the long game that Jorge Mario Bergoglio has been playing. We faithful Catholics have been like the proverbial frog in the pot of water. We have been fed so much drivel from this man (Laudato Si, Amoris Laetitia) and have had to put up with the never-ending promotion of heretical and pro-sodomite priests that we have almost become numb to the confusion and weaponized ambiguity that spills forth from the Vatican.

As Burke and Schneider write in answer to the title of my post:

The theological errors and heresies, implicit and explicit in the Instrumentum Laboris of the imminent Special Assembly of the Synod of Bishops for the Pan-Amazon, are an alarming manifestation of the confusion, error and division which beset the Church in our day. No one can excuse himself from being informed about the gravity of the situation and from taking appropriate action for love of Christ and of His life with us in the Church. Above all, all the members of Christ’s Mystical Body, before such a threat to her integrity, must pray and fast for the eternal good of her members who risk being scandalized, that is led into confusion, error and division by this text for the Synod of Bishops. Moreover, every Catholic, as a true soldier of Christ, is called to safeguard and promote the truths of the faith and the discipline by which those truths are honored in practice, lest the solemn assembly of the Bishops in Synod betray the mission of the Synod, which is “to assist the Roman Pontiff with their counsel in the preservation and growth of faith and morals and in the observance and strengthening of ecclesiastical discipline” (can. 342).

[snip]

May God, through the intercession of the many truly Catholic missionaries who evangelized the indigenous American people, among whom are Saint Turibius of Mogrovejo and Saint José de Anchieta, and through the intercession of the saints whom indigenous American people have given to the Church, among whom are Saint Juan Diego and Saint Kateri Tekakwitha, and especially through the intercession of the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Queen of the Holy Rosary, who vanquishes all heresy, grant that the members of the coming Special Assembly of the Synod of Bishops for the Pan-Amazon and the Holy Father be protected from the danger of approving doctrinal errors and ambiguities, and of undermining the Apostolic rule of priestly celibacy.

In other words, know your faith, live your faith, and defend your faith.

Published in Religion & Philosophy
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There are 70 comments.

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  1. DonG Coolidge

    Sadly, Francis has put in place many like-minded cardinals that will choose his replacement. He is, indeed, playing the long game.

    • #1
    • September 30, 2019, at 2:25 PM PST
    • 9 likes
  2. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher

    I think all Catholics are allowed to do is pray. They don’t get to have any say in the system. Devil at work indeed.

    • #2
    • September 30, 2019, at 2:41 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  3. Misthiocracy grudgingly Member

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    I think all Catholics are allowed to do is pray. They don’t get to have any say in the system.

    By my inexpert understanding, they’re allowed to express a contrary opinion about anything that doesn’t fall under Papal Infallibility, and way less stuff falls under Papal Infallibility than most people realize.

    http://catholicplanet.com/TSM/limits-magisterium.htm

    • #3
    • September 30, 2019, at 2:45 PM PST
    • 4 likes
  4. Kozak Member

    This is an Antipope.

    • #4
    • September 30, 2019, at 2:49 PM PST
    • 9 likes
  5. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher

    Misthiocracy grudgingly (View Comment):

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    I think all Catholics are allowed to do is pray. They don’t get to have any say in the system.

    By my inexpert understanding, they’re allowed to express a contrary opinion about anything that doesn’t fall under Papal Infallibility, and way less stuff falls under Papal Infallibility than most people realize.

    http://catholicplanet.com/TSM/limits-magisterium.htm

    Oh sure, but they have no say, do they? 

    In my church, the laity goes to the big council and has some say in the direction of the church. In some churches the congregation gets to say very directly. That is not, as I understand it, how the Catholic Church works.

    • #5
    • September 30, 2019, at 2:53 PM PST
    • 1 like
  6. Misthiocracy grudgingly Member

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    Misthiocracy grudgingly (View Comment):

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    I think all Catholics are allowed to do is pray. They don’t get to have any say in the system.

    By my inexpert understanding, they’re allowed to express a contrary opinion about anything that doesn’t fall under Papal Infallibility, and way less stuff falls under Papal Infallibility than most people realize.

    http://catholicplanet.com/TSM/limits-magisterium.htm

    Oh sure, but they have no say, do they?

    In my church, the laity goes to the big council and has some say in the direction of the church. In some churches the congregation gets to say very directly. That is not, as I understand it, how the Catholic Church works.

    It all depends on their relationship with their local priest, bishop, etc. If they can convince their local priest, bishop, etc. to quietly ignore Vatican dispatches that don’t fall under Papal Infallibility, there’s no harm/no foul.

    Again, by my inexpert understanding.

    • #6
    • September 30, 2019, at 3:00 PM PST
    • 1 like
  7. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    I think all Catholics are allowed to do is pray. They don’t get to have any say in the system. Devil at work indeed.

    This is incredibly ignorant Bryan. It would be better if you asked a question about what we Catholics can do than to give your erroneous opinion on something you don’t understand.

    You ought to read about St. Catherine of Sienna – a laywoman – and the influence she had on the pope.

    We have parish councils that influence many things in the parish.

    We have canon law that stipulates that we can make our concerns known:

    §3 They have the right, indeed at times the duty, in keeping with their knowledge, competence and position, to manifest to the sacred Pastors their views on matters which concern the good of the Church. They have the right also to make their views known to others of Christ’s faithful, but in doing so they must always respect the integrity of faith and morals, show due reverence to the Pastors and take into account both the common good and the dignity of individuals. (canon 212)

    We have lay theologians who advise (both good and bad) bishops on many topics.

    To say that all we can do is pray is ludicrous, even though perhaps it is the most important of our duties in times such as these.

    As for revelation – it ended with the death of John the Evangelist. Doctrine can evolve, but it must be in continuity with Scripture, Tradition, and the teaching of the Magisterium.

    It is prophetic that John Henry Cardinal Newman will be canonized during this synod. He is the former Anglican cleric who is famous for saying that to be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant. Cardinal Newman on theological errors:

    “Never did Holy Church need champions against [the spirit of Liberalism in religion] more sorely than now, when, alas! it is an error overspreading, as a snare, the whole earth; … Liberalism in religion is the doctrine that there is no positive truth in religion, but that one creed is as good as another, and this is the teaching which is gaining substance and force daily. It is inconsistent with any recognition of any religion, as true. It teaches that all are to be tolerated, for all are matters of opinion. Revealed religion is not a truth, but a sentiment and a taste; not an objective fact; not miraculous: and it is the right of each individual to make it say just what strikes his fancy. Devotion is not necessarily founded on faith. Men may go to Protestant Churches and to Catholic, may get good from both and belong to neither. They may fraternize together in spiritual thoughts and feelings, without having any views at all of doctrines in common, or seeing the need of them” (Biglietto Speech, May 12, 1879).

    Many lay Catholics are these champions today.

    • #7
    • September 30, 2019, at 3:25 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  8. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Kozak (View Comment):

    This is an Antipope.

    What is your evidence for this? 

    • #8
    • September 30, 2019, at 3:27 PM PST
    • Like
  9. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… Member

    Scott, this situation sounds dreadful, but unsurprising, given your prior reports.

    As a non-Catholic, I don’t have much to add. You’re in a very difficult position. I do appreciate your reporting on these developments.

    • #9
    • September 30, 2019, at 6:00 PM PST
    • 3 likes
  10. Dr. Bastiat Member

    As a Protestant, this saddens me. Any of my fellow Protestant Christians who think that this affects only the Catholic Church are mistaken, in my view. To many around the world, the Catholic Church represents Christianity as a whole. To a certain extent, I share that view myself. The troubles of the Catholic Church hurt all Christians.

    I feel like I’m watching my best friend Francis drink too much at a bar, and embarrass himself publicly. I’m embarrassed for him. And it reflects poorly on me, as his best friend.

    I wish I could put my arm around Pope Francis, and say, “It’s late. You’re drunk. Let’s get you to bed.” I want to help my friend.

    Forgive the coarse analogy.

    But since I can’t step in, I just remind myself that God is not an uninterested observer in this matter, and that it may turn out well, regardless of how it appears to me at the time.

    But this is hard to watch.

    I pray for my Catholic brothers and sisters. And for all of us. 

    • #10
    • September 30, 2019, at 6:03 PM PST
    • 13 likes
  11. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):

    I think all Catholics are allowed to do is pray. They don’t get to have any say in the system. Devil at work indeed.

    This is incredibly ignorant Bryan. It would be better if you asked a question about what we Catholics can do than to give your erroneous opinion on something you don’t understand.

    You ought to read about St. Catherine of Sienna – a laywoman – and the influence she had on the pope.

    We have parish councils that influence many things in the parish.

    We have canon law that stipulates that we can make our concerns known:

    §3 They have the right, indeed at times the duty, in keeping with their knowledge, competence and position, to manifest to the sacred Pastors their views on matters which concern the good of the Church. They have the right also to make their views known to others of Christ’s faithful, but in doing so they must always respect the integrity of faith and morals, show due reverence to the Pastors and take into account both the common good and the dignity of individuals. (canon 212)

    We have lay theologians who advise (both good and bad) bishops on many topics.

    To say that all we can do is pray is ludicrous, even though perhaps it is the most important of our duties in times such as these.

    As for revelation – it ended with the death of John the Evangelist. Doctrine can evolve, but it must be in continuity with Scripture, Tradition, and the teaching of the Magisterium.

    It is prophetic that John Henry Cardinal Newman will be canonized during this synod. He is the former Anglican cleric who is famous for saying that to be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant. Cardinal Newman on theological errors:

    “Never did Holy Church need champions against [the spirit of Liberalism in religion] more sorely than now, when, alas! it is an error overspreading, as a snare, the whole earth; … Liberalism in religion is the doctrine that there is no positive truth in religion, but that one creed is as good as another, and this is the teaching which is gaining substance and force daily. It is inconsistent with any recognition of any religion, as true. It teaches that all are to be tolerated, for all are matters of opinion. Revealed religion is not a truth, but a sentiment and a taste; not an objective fact; not miraculous: and it is the right of each individual to make it say just what strikes his fancy. Devotion is not necessarily founded on faith. Men may go to Protestant Churches and to Catholic, may get good from both and belong to neither. They may fraternize together in spiritual thoughts and feelings, without having any views at all of doctrines in common, or seeing the need of them” (Biglietto Speech, May 12, 1879).

    Many lay Catholics are these champions today.

     

    My intent was not to offend. It was to clarify. 

    You have no say at all in who the Pope is. None. You have no power over the Pope. The You have no say in how your church is run or its doctrine. That is all done in Rome, by the trained experts. The Catholic Church is one of the most illiberal organizations in history (using the old fashion meaning of the term). That is a feature, not a bug (as your quote points out). It is a feature, as a Protestant, I don’t happen to agree with. But that feature is a positive for many Catholics, and I am OK with that. I don’t need to tell you how to believe or what to follow. But God, God can have power over the Pope and others. 

    For my sake, I thank God that I have a choice in churches. As a conservative I believe that competition is a good thing, even in religion. My heart breaks for my Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ. I do not know what those like you can do, but live your faith and pray. You cannot change the Cardinals and you cannot change the Pope. It sucks. All I can do is pray. 

    • #11
    • September 30, 2019, at 6:26 PM PST
    • 2 likes
  12. Rodin Member

    Is the pope going to move the church’s headquarters to Avignon?

    • #12
    • September 30, 2019, at 7:23 PM PST
    • 7 likes
  13. Steve C. Member

    Rodin (View Comment):

    Is the pope going to move the church’s headquarters to Avignon?

    Too soon.

    • #13
    • September 30, 2019, at 9:08 PM PST
    • 6 likes
  14. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    I feel like I’m watching my best friend Francis drink too much at a bar, and embarrass himself publicly. I’m embarrassed for him. And it reflects poorly on me, as his best friend.

    I wish I could put my arm around Pope Francis, and say, “It’s late. You’re drunk. Let’s get you to bed.” I want to help my friend.

    This is a very good analogy. It is what the Cardinals – as the pope’s closest advisors – are called to do. I pray they do.

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    But since I can’t step in, I just remind myself that God is not an uninterested observer in this matter, and that it may turn out well, regardless of how it appears to me at the time.

    But this is hard to watch.

    I pray for my Catholic brothers and sisters. And for all of us.

    Thank you for this also. We still believe it is Christ’s Church and the Holy Spirit guides Her. Perhaps the pontificate of Francis is meant to hammer this point home. Many (I include myself in this) became overly enamored of JP2 and B16 and they (both rightly and wrongly IMO) became the face of the Church, instead of Jesus Christ. As I’ve said before, this pontificate has actually strengthened my faith in the Church. One man can cause a lot of damage but one man can’t break the Church – no matter how hard he tries.

    • #14
    • October 1, 2019, at 4:28 AM PST
    • 3 likes
  15. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):
    My intent was not to offend.

    OK, thanks – no offense taken.

    Bryan G. Stephens (View Comment):
    You have no say at all in who the Pope is. None. You have no power over the Pope. The You have no say in how your church is run or its doctrine.

    The dogmas and doctrines of the Church are revealed truths – it is a good thing that we have no say in these (although laymen do influence development of doctrine). Take contraception for instance. A Pontifical Commission on Birth Control voted overwhelmingly (64-5) to declare that artificial birth control was not intrinsically evil and that Catholic couples should decide for themselves about methods to deploy. But Pope Paul VI, as defender of the faith, published Humanae Vitae, upholding the consistent teaching of the Church. Had this issue been left to the house vote, contraception would have been approved.

    As Cardinal Newman said about liberalism in religion (2nd quote above): “It is inconsistent with any recognition of any religion, as true. It teaches that all are to be tolerated, for all are matters of opinion. Revealed religion is not a truth, but a sentiment and a taste; not an objective fact; not miraculous: and it is the right of each individual to make it say just what strikes his fancy.” This has led to schisms and splits too numerous to count.

    Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit guide the Church (and I am not saying that the Holy Spirit “picks” the pope as so many falsely believe). We’ve been given this pope and we have to deal with him. Many think Francis is the greatest pope ever, and many think he is the worst. We make our voices heard and pray the bishops and cardinals listen.

    • #15
    • October 1, 2019, at 4:53 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  16. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    This should have been released as the IL for the synod – short and directly to the point.

    • #16
    • October 1, 2019, at 5:03 AM PST
    • Like
  17. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    The Poles get it.

    • #17
    • October 1, 2019, at 5:04 AM PST
    • 1 like
  18. Kozak Member

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    Kozak (View Comment):

    This is an Antipope.

    What is your evidence for this?

    His behavior towards Christianity and the Catholic Faith.

    • #18
    • October 1, 2019, at 5:14 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  19. Doug Watt Member

    I’m sure that the indigenous pagans of Great Britain feel hard done by the Amazon Synod. The Amazon Synod is a product of the Enlightenment-the Noble Savage. It is much easier to admire the Noble Savage who is infected with parasites when one is not infected with parasites themselves. As one Brazilian anthropologist who lived with Amazonian tribes stated when a member of the tribe no longer contributes due to old age they are no longer fed. The Noble Savage is indeed admired by the modern pagans of the Western World.

    There are traditional Catholics, orthodox Catholics, that are speaking out against the schismatics, and the heresies that are being encouraged with this kind of nonsense. Pope Francis will pass away like all human beings do. One good thing that might come out of this is that he will be the last Jesuit to be called Pope.

    • #19
    • October 1, 2019, at 5:24 AM PST
    • 5 likes
  20. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    • #20
    • October 1, 2019, at 5:26 AM PST
    • Like
  21. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Kozak (View Comment):
    His behavior towards Christianity and the Catholic Faith.

    That doesn’t address the question of antipope. An antipope is one who makes a false claim to the papacy or who was not canonically elected. A scoundrel, heretic, or apostate does not make an antipope. Give us evidence that B16’s resignation was not valid or that Francis’s election was not canonically valid. He is recognized as the pope by 99% of the universal Church – even by Burke and Schneider.

    • #21
    • October 1, 2019, at 6:04 AM PST
    • Like
  22. Aaron Miller Member

    I chuckled when I saw that every third Sunday will be devoted to the Word. Next they will tell me every second Sunday will be dedicated to Christ.

    Pope Francis is as he has always been, a thorn in the Church’s side, by the will of God.

    I used to pay attention to the ongoing messages of Mary’s apparition at Medjugorje. But it was just the same message over and over again: fast and pray. The nature of each particular trial hardly matters. Fast and pray.

    One of the most difficult things for Christians anywhere is to trust in prayer. Christ presents prayer not as a last resort but as a first resort; not as a passive consolation but as an active battle. We are all tempted to think, “Yeah, pray… but what can we really do?”

    That is the way of the world. That is what makes Christians seem to pagans like anybody else.

    • #22
    • October 1, 2019, at 7:16 AM PST
    • 6 likes
  23. danok1 Member

    I join @arizonapatriot and @drbastiat in prayer for our Catholic brothers and sisters.

    Today (October 1) the Orthodox observe the Feast of the Holy Protection of the Theotokos. Seems an appropriate day to ask Her to extend the protection of Her prayers to our Roman brothers.

    • #23
    • October 1, 2019, at 8:26 AM PST
    • 6 likes
  24. RyanFalcone Member

    It seems that this Pope is creating the same enlightenment among Catholics that similar false teachers have created among Protestants. The water has slowly been getting warmer for decades and now bubbles are starting to appear. Many discerning types are finally starting to scream “we’re being boiled!”

    • #24
    • October 1, 2019, at 8:42 AM PST
    • 4 likes
  25. Old Bathos Member

    This is a novel situation. Openly corrupt Popes (and there are some real winners on that list) invariably did not work to change doctrine or the substance of the Faith. They contented themselves with power, sex and money and left the faithful to carry on. Theologians don’t cite encyclicals from Medici or Borgia popes because they did not write any.

    The putatively corrupt nature of the current pope appears to be about reconciling Marx and Christianity through the metaphor of victimization. There is also a spectacular lack of depth and gravitas in his formal documents. Despite the wealth of scholarly talent available to him, he is not using the sharpest knives in the drawer which itself also reeks of politics and PC PR rather than legacy and continuity.

    The impending disaster is that as with the shrinking Anglican Church no one needs ecclesiastical or sacramental support to believe in socialism, sodomy and climate change. Those beliefs and their attendant support communities are available without encumbrance outside religion. Vocations will not surge if the mission is to be anti-capitalist anti-heteronormative social workers.

    • #25
    • October 1, 2019, at 8:54 AM PST
    • 8 likes
  26. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… Member

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    Kozak (View Comment):
    His behavior towards Christianity and the Catholic Faith.

    That doesn’t address the question of antipope. An antipope is one who makes a false claim to the papacy or who was not canonically elected. A scoundrel, heretic, or apostate does not make an antipope. Give us evidence that B16’s resignation was not valid or that Francis’s election was not canonically valid. He is recognized as the pope by 99% of the universal Church – even by Burke and Schneider.

    This appears to be a misunderstanding based on terminology, with Scott having a precise, technical definition of “antipope,” while Kozak uses the same term to mean something like a “heretical pope.”

    Scott, I’m not sure if you’ve concluded that the current Pope is a heretic, and it’s not my place to say. Is there a specific term that would apply to a heretical Pope?

    • #26
    • October 1, 2019, at 9:17 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  27. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… Member

    danok1 (View Comment):

    I join @arizonapatriot and @drbastiat in prayer for our Catholic brothers and sisters.

    Today (October 1) the Orthodox observe the Feast of the Holy Protection of the Theotokos. Seems an appropriate day to ask Her to extend the protection of Her prayers to our Roman brothers.

    I very hesitant to open a can of worms, here. I did not actually say anything about praying for the situation. I did extend sympathy to Scott.

    I have significant theological disagreements with both the Catholic and Orthodox churches. I’m not sure how to handle them. As an example, Danok1, I’m not at all comfortable with the idea of praying to the Virgin Mary, or to any of the saints. It does appear that those of the Catholic and Orthodox persuasion view such prayer in a different way than I.

    I am willing to pray for God’s wisdom, grace, mercy, and guidance in the situation, and that His will be done (actually, I just did, before writing this sentence). I don’t know His will in these circumstances, but I do believe that it is in His hands.

    • #27
    • October 1, 2019, at 9:24 AM PST
    • Like
  28. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… (View Comment):
    Scott, I’m not sure if you’ve concluded that the current Pope is a heretic, and it’s not my place to say. Is there a specific term that would apply to a heretical Pope?

    If we had a heretical pope the See of Peter would be vacant. The doctrine of infallibility is a negative protection, i.e., it protects the pope from teaching error. Should a pope teach heresy, he would essentially remove himself from office and would no longer be pope – because a pope cannot teach heresy.

    As for Francis, I do not think he is a formal heretic, but I am disappointed in the confusion that he has sown – what one priest calls weaponized ambiguity – a phrase that I find very apt.

    • #28
    • October 1, 2019, at 10:22 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  29. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot Post author

    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… (View Comment):
    I have significant theological disagreements with both the Catholic and Orthodox churches. I’m not sure how to handle them.

    Well, to start, I’ll offer you this good article on why we Catholics pray to the saints for intercession. Perhaps you have read something like this before, but since you brought it up I link to it so others that might have the same concerns can at least know where we stand.

    • #29
    • October 1, 2019, at 10:32 AM PST
    • 2 likes
  30. Aaron Miller Member

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… (View Comment):
    Scott, I’m not sure if you’ve concluded that the current Pope is a heretic, and it’s not my place to say. Is there a specific term that would apply to a heretical Pope?

    If we had a heretical pope the See of Peter would be vacant. The doctrine of infallibility is a negative protection, i.e., it protects the pope from teaching error. Should a pope teach heresy, he would essentially remove himself from office and would no longer be pope – because a pope cannot teach heresy.

    As for Francis, I do not think he is a formal heretic, but I am disappointed in the confusion that he has sown – what one priest calls weaponized ambiguity – a phrase that I find very apt.

    To clarify, heresy is not defined merely by majority rule or by the presiding pope. In Catholic tradition, no theological or moral teachings can be contradicted. Only methods of application, such as particular expressions of the liturgy or ethical practices based on moral teachings, may be changed. 

    No necessary belief of Christians may be undone, even by a pope.

    Christ’s life is “the end of revelation.” From there, study of God and His relationship with humanity continues. But the Church exists to administer the sacraments and to guard “the deposit of faith”, rather than to host theories of each new age and to redirect human relations like a government.

    • #30
    • October 1, 2019, at 11:04 AM PST
    • 1 like
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