Water Flows Downhill

 

Years ago, I interviewed a brilliant high school student who asked me a simple question: Why should I go to Princeton when a third of the student body are athletes?

I admitted that he had a point: a third of my class at Princeton was not very bright because of preferential policies for one reason or another. And it was a damn shame. What I did not realize was that I was part of the problem, looking for “intangibles” as part of the admissions process.

A diploma from a prestigious school is valuable, both economically and socially. The admissions process is highly subjective and not transparent. There are carve-outs for athletes, minorities, legacies, and those deemed more desirable for other, non-objective reasons. These carve-outs can constitute as much as 50 to 70 percent of an entering class.

There is certainty that there will be corruption. There has been corruption since the first donation to Ug’s Cave-Academy. To me, the only surprising feature about this latest “scandal” is that the schools themselves were bypassed and did not directly reap the winnings. Oh, the horror!

The best we can and should do is to point out that without transparent and clear criteria, corruption is a certainty.

Edit: There are schools that admit every candidate above a certain cutoff point, basically defined by those likely to be able to do the work. Included in this category are some state schools. That would be much better — but for the Ivy League to do the same, they would need to make the school much more academically difficult than it is.

Published in General
This post was promoted to the Main Feed by a Ricochet Editor at the recommendation of Ricochet members. Like this post? Want to comment? Join Ricochet’s growing community of conservatives and be part of the conversation. Get your first month free.

There are 63 comments.

  1. 1
  2. 2
  3. 3
  1. Member

    There are carve-outs for athletes, minorities, legacies, and those deemed more desirable for other, non-objective reasons. These carve-outs can constitute as much as 50-70% of an entering class!

    I am not an expert, but this seems on the high side to me, especially since there are likely some overlaps in the categories. I suppose non-objective reasons covers quite a bit of ground. 

    • #1
    • March 13, 2019, at 6:40 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  2. Member

    I have known some brilliant athletes. It is possible to be both.

    • #2
    • March 13, 2019, at 6:57 AM PDT
    • 10 likes
  3. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    There are carve-outs for athletes, minorities, legacies, and those deemed more desirable for other, non-objective reasons. These carve-outs can constitute as much as 50-70% of an entering class!

    I am not an expert, but this seems on the high side to me, especially since there are likely some overlaps in the categories. I suppose non-objective reasons covers quite a bit of ground.

    1/3rd are athletes.

    “Of the freshmen students admitted to Harvard this year, 50.8 percent are from minority groups, including African-Americans, Hispanics, Asian-Americans, Native Americans, and Native Hawaiians.” [22% were Asian, suggesting probably 20% of the class were there because they were minorities, and they were not qualified by reasons of merit]

    “Forty-two percent of private institutions and 6 percent of public institutions consider legacy status as a factor in admissions, according to a 2018 survey of admissions directors by Inside Higher Ed.”… An analysis commissioned by Students For Fair Admissions found legacy applicants were accepted at a rate of nearly 34 percent from 2009 to 2015. According to the report, that’s more than five times higher than the rate for non-legacies over the same six-year period: just 5.9 percent.

    And then there are kids selected because they are deemed to be victims/disadvantaged in some way or another. Identity Politics are a big deal.

    • #3
    • March 13, 2019, at 7:05 AM PDT
    • 11 likes
  4. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    I have known some brilliant athletes. It is possible to be both.

    It is. But those who are admitted because they are athletes are not likely to be among them.

    The Ivy League plays a game with something called a “Likely Letter” – it means that you are a recruited athlete, and you are certain to be admitted as long as you still have a pulse come March. Likely Letter kids are almost never scholars.

    • #4
    • March 13, 2019, at 7:06 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  5. Member

    iWe (View Comment):

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    I have known some brilliant athletes. It is possible to be both.

    It is. But those who are admitted because they are athletes are not likely to be among them.

    The Ivy League plays a game with something called a “Likely Letter” – it means that you are a recruited athlete, and you are certain to be admitted as long as you still have a pulse come March. Likely Letter kids are almost never scholars.

    They are, however, “likely” to be minorities, illustrating the overlap at work here.

     

    • #5
    • March 13, 2019, at 7:26 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  6. Member

    iWe:

    I admitted that he had a point: 1/3rd of my class at Princeton were not very bright, because of preferential policies for one reason or another. And it was a damn shame. What I did not realize was that I was part of the problem, looking for “intangibles” as part of the admissions process.

     

    But I don’t see how any process can avoid that “problem.” Even if the admissions (or hiring) process uses only objectively measurable criteria, intangibles still enter the process in the weights assigned to each of those measurable criteria. What relative weight do you assign to the SAT score relative to the GPA? Do you assign different GPA weight to “honors” or “AP” classes than to “regular” classes? 

    • #6
    • March 13, 2019, at 7:45 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  7. Member

    Full Size Tabby (View Comment):

    iWe:

    I admitted that he had a point: 1/3rd of my class at Princeton were not very bright, because of preferential policies for one reason or another. And it was a damn shame. What I did not realize was that I was part of the problem, looking for “intangibles” as part of the admissions process.

    But I don’t see how any process can avoid that “problem.” Even if the admissions (or hiring) process uses only objectively measurable criteria, intangibles still enter the process in the weights assigned to each of those measurable criteria. What relative weight do you assign to the SAT score relative to the GPA? Do you assign different GPA weight to “honors” or “AP” classes than to “regular” classes?

    And, is there necessarily anything wrong with intangibles, or at least some of them. Even in my day we were encouraged (well, ordered) to be “well-rounded” on our applications because schools “like that stuff.” So . . . join the debate team when you could spend the time studying geometry, volunteer at a food bank when you also could be memorizing French verbs. I really don’t fault the schools for that.

    • #7
    • March 13, 2019, at 7:57 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  8. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Hoyacon (View Comment):

    iWe (View Comment):

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    I have known some brilliant athletes. It is possible to be both.

    It is. But those who are admitted because they are athletes are not likely to be among them.

    The Ivy League plays a game with something called a “Likely Letter” – it means that you are a recruited athlete, and you are certain to be admitted as long as you still have a pulse come March. Likely Letter kids are almost never scholars.

    They are, however, “likely” to be minorities, illustrating the overlap at work here.

    Not necessarily. Few minorities play lacrosse or crew.

    • #8
    • March 13, 2019, at 8:09 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  9. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Full Size Tabby (View Comment):

    iWe:

    I admitted that he had a point: 1/3rd of my class at Princeton were not very bright, because of preferential policies for one reason or another. And it was a damn shame. What I did not realize was that I was part of the problem, looking for “intangibles” as part of the admissions process.

     

    But I don’t see how any process can avoid that “problem.” Even if the admissions (or hiring) process uses only objectively measurable criteria, intangibles still enter the process in the weights assigned to each of those measurable criteria. What relative weight do you assign to the SAT score relative to the GPA? Do you assign different GPA weight to “honors” or “AP” classes than to “regular” classes?

    There are systems that do this. They are not perfect. But they relegate the subjectivity to some pretty narrow gray areas.

    Most applicants with perfect GPAs and perfect SAT scores do NOT get into a school like Princeton. That is whacked. And frankly, because those applicants tend to be Asians, it is also racist.

    • #9
    • March 13, 2019, at 8:11 AM PDT
    • 11 likes
  10. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Hoyacon (View Comment):
    And, is there necessarily anything wrong with intangibles, or at least some of them. Even if my day we were encouraged (well, ordered) to be “well-rounded” on our applications because schools “like that stuff.” So . . . join the debate team when you could spend the time studying geometry, volunteer at a food bank when you also could be memorizing French verbs. I really don’t fault the schools for that.

    This opens the door – and the result is the mess we are in now.

    KISS: admit all who can do the work. Make the school hard enough to keep hunting that equilibrium. Students sink or swim.

    • #10
    • March 13, 2019, at 8:24 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  11. Member

    iWe (View Comment):

    PHCheese (View Comment):

    I have known some brilliant athletes. It is possible to be both.

    It is. But those who are admitted because they are athletes are not likely to be among them.

    The Ivy League plays a game with something called a “Likely Letter” – it means that you are a recruited athlete, and you are certain to be admitted as long as you still have a pulse come March. Likely Letter kids are almost never scholars.

    Brilliant and a scholar are two different adjectives . An example was my father. His IQ was measured in the 160’s. He was the starting tailback on his high school for 4 years for which they were undefeated. He dropped out of high school for 4 months his senior year only to come back and graduate first in his class. He had a scholarship to Notre Dame but never went to college. He was 10 and 1 as a professional boxer but brilliant enough to realize boxing would destroy his brain. His most brilliant achievement was marriage to my mother who he cherished until the day he died.

    • #11
    • March 13, 2019, at 9:47 AM PDT
    • 10 likes
  12. Member

    iWe (View Comment):
    KISS: admit all who can do the work. Make the school hard enough to keep hunting that equilibrium. Students sink or swim.

    One of the criteria used to rank schools is graduation rate. We would like to think that a high graduation rate is the result of the admissions folks doing their jobs well, but that isn’t always the case. The other way to have a high graduation rate is to make the course load easier. With affirmative-action, etc., it seems that, while it may still be hard to get into college, it is pretty easy to get through it once you are there.

    • #12
    • March 13, 2019, at 9:49 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  13. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Vance Richards (View Comment):

    iWe (View Comment):
    KISS: admit all who can do the work. Make the school hard enough to keep hunting that equilibrium. Students sink or swim.

    One of the criteria used to rank schools is graduation rate. We would like to think that a high graduation rate is the result of the admissions folks doing their jobs well, but that isn’t always the case. The other way to have a high graduation rate is to make the course load easier. With affirmative-action, etc., it seems that, while it may still be hard to get into college, it is pretty easy to get through it once you are there.

    I went to Princeton. If you got in, they took care of you. That includes classes that earned monikers like:

    Clapping for Credit

    Math for Plants

    Physics for Poets

    Rocks for Jocks

     

    • #13
    • March 13, 2019, at 9:58 AM PDT
    • 13 likes
  14. Member

    iWe: Years ago I interviewed a brilliant high school student who asked me a simple question: why should I go to Princeton when 1/3rd of the student body are athletes?

    It depends entirely on what the student wants to do with their life. If they’re truly brilliant, it doesn’t really matter which school they go to, all other factors remaining equal. True brilliance will almost always result in a successful life.

    However, if they want to stand atop the commanding heights of American government and/or business, then “brilliance” is not strictly-speaking a necessity, but it’s much harder to achieve without an Ivy League diploma.

    So, the response to this hypothetical student should be, “what do you want to achieve with your life?” Indeed, Princeton might be a poor fit if the student’s interests don’t align with the Princetonian ethos.

    The Ivy League has always been more about shaping its students culturally than about academic achievement. If this hypothetical kid’s emphasis is on academic scholarship for its own sake then they should look around for a school that best exemplifies that ethos in their chosen field of study.

    After all, lots of schools that are “less prestigious” in general have fantastic levels of prestige in certain departments. For example, if you want to be a forensic scientist then the University of Tennessee in Knoxville is reportedly the place to study.

    • #14
    • March 13, 2019, at 10:49 AM PDT
    • 10 likes
  15. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Misthiocracy secretly (View Comment):

    iWe: Years ago I interviewed a brilliant high school student who asked me a simple question: why should I go to Princeton when 1/3rd of the student body are athletes?

    It depends entirely on what the student wants to do with their life. If they’re truly brilliant, it doesn’t really matter which school they go to, all other factors remaining equal. True brilliance will almost always result in a successful life.

    Even within the category of “successful” there are many layers. This particular student was being courted by Math professors at Princeton, Chicago, Harvard, etc. “Success” for him would surely be quite different than success for most students. And the right environment might lead to breakthroughs that would not happen in a different environment. The people who form our peer group often matter (see Chet:Rico).

    So, the response to this hypothetical student should be, “what do you want to achieve with your life?” Indeed, Princeton might be a poor fit if their interests don’t align with the Princetonian ethos.

    Even within Princeton there are quite a few different cultures. Math geeks and athletes are only vaguely aware that the other even exists.

    After all, lots of schools that are “less prestigious” in general have fantastic levels of prestige in certain departments. For example, if you want to be a forensic scientist then the University of Tennessee in Knoxville is the place to study.

    Thanks. I did not know this!

     

    • #15
    • March 13, 2019, at 11:08 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  16. Member

    iWe (View Comment):
    Even within the category of “successful” there are many layers. This particular student was being courted by Math professors at Princeton, Chicago, Harvard, etc. “Success” for him would surely be quite different than success for most students. And the right environment might lead to breakthroughs that would not happen in a different environment. The people who form our peer group often matter (see Chet:Rico).

    Presumably, the bottom 1/3 of Princeton students aren’t math majors, let alone math students who were actively courted by the math department. One could surmise that the math department of Princeton University isn’t representative of Princeton University as a whole.

    This student should look into the work currently being done by the various universities’ math departments and choose the school whose current work is of greatest interest to the student. The quality of the bottom third of the schools’ student populations doesn’t strike me as being particularly relevant. What’s relevant is the quality of the schools’ math departments.

    Also, if the kid is being promised lucrative scholarships then he/she should keep in mind that those scholarships have to be paid for by somebody. The tuition-paying students who are less academically-inclined help to pay for those scholarships.

    • #16
    • March 13, 2019, at 11:24 AM PDT
    • Like
  17. Member

    Misthiocracy secretly (View Comment):
    The Ivy League has always been more about shaping its students culturally than about academic achievement. If this hypothetical kid’s emphasis is on academic scholarship for its own sake then they should look around for a school that best exemplifies that ethos in their chosen field of study.

    I agree with your larger point. However, I would quibble with this. One contribution that the Ivies make to western civilization is that they can support the study of some subjects that no one thinks is needed at the moment. For students interested in small specialty subjects, the Ivies are often a really good choice. Their endowments give them some budget breathing room. 

    • #17
    • March 13, 2019, at 11:27 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  18. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Misthiocracy secretly (View Comment):

    This student should look into the work currently being done by the various universities’ math departments and choose the school whose current work is of greatest interest to the student.

    He did this. He chose his school based on which mathematician he wished to choose as his mentor. That was my advice.

    The quality of the bottom third of the schools’ student populations doesn’t strike me as being particularly relevant. What’s relevant is the quality of the schools’ math departments.

    Not exactly. There is a reason cities make more money than the countryside, why bigger lawfirms typically make more money per capita than smaller firms… having a large cohort DOES lead to innovation and intellectual productivity.

    In other words: being surrounded by smart students even outside the math department is both relevant and important.

     

    • #18
    • March 13, 2019, at 11:29 AM PDT
    • 7 likes
  19. Member

    Vance Richards (View Comment):

    iWe (View Comment):
    KISS: admit all who can do the work. Make the school hard enough to keep hunting that equilibrium. Students sink or swim.

    One of the criteria used to rank schools is graduation rate. We would like to think that a high graduation rate is the result of the admissions folks doing their jobs well, but that isn’t always the case. The other way to have a high graduation rate is to make the course load easier. With affirmative-action, etc., it seems that, while it may still be hard to get into college, it is pretty easy to get through it once you are there.

    I am currently studying in McGill, which, in most ratings, is in the top 50 universities worldwide. We also have a 56% admissions rate, and a laughably low tuition rate, comparable to a good in-state school, even for international students. While many schools are proud of their 98% graduation rate, McGill doesn’t publish their four year graduation rate. Based on the number of people I knew who left early, the number would be depressing. McGill has some easy classes, but it is nigh on impossible to graduate with a real degree without learning to do good work, and a McGill degree, while not as prestigious as Harvard or Stamford, still has significant weight around the world. 
    Trying to bring this format into the US college market wouldn’t work because American Elites don’t want to pay American college prices and have their prized child fail. Imho, this format is actually merit based, where a degree is given after years of acceptable work, rather than a pipeline assuming the children who get in initially have all the merits required to earn the degree by merit of an admissions crapshoot. 

    • #19
    • March 13, 2019, at 11:31 AM PDT
    • 11 likes
  20. Member

    MarciN (View Comment):

    Misthiocracy secretly (View Comment):
    The Ivy League has always been more about shaping its students culturally than about academic achievement. If this hypothetical kid’s emphasis is on academic scholarship for its own sake then they should look around for a school that best exemplifies that ethos in their chosen field of study.

    I agree with your larger point. However, I would quibble with this. One contribution that the Ivies make to western civilization is that they can support the study of some subjects that no one thinks is needed at the moment. For students interested in small specialty subjects, the Ivies are often a really good choice. Their endowments give them some budget breathing room.

    Agreed, and this plays to my point about students basing their decision on the comparative merits of individual departments within various schools rather than the “general prestige” of those schools.

    I chose my school because I really liked what I saw about its Communications Studies department, even though the school is generally considered lower in prestige. Other, higher prestige schools also had Communications Studies departments but I didn’t like what I saw about those departments (e.g. too much focus on classroom theory, insufficient production facilities, etc.).

    Presumably, if I had been a “brilliant” math student then I would have chosen a school that I thought had the best math department, regardless of the “prestige” enjoyed by the school in general.

    • #20
    • March 13, 2019, at 11:47 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  21. Member

    iWe:

    That would be much better – but in order for the Ivy League to do the same, they would need to make the school much more academically difficult than it is.

    That would require actual work on the part of the faculty. Yeah, like that’s going to happen.

    • #21
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:03 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  22. Member

    Blessed Blacksmith (View Comment):

    Vance Richards (View Comment):

    iWe (View Comment):
    KISS: admit all who can do the work. Make the school hard enough to keep hunting that equilibrium. Students sink or swim.

    One of the criteria used to rank schools is graduation rate. We would like to think that a high graduation rate is the result of the admissions folks doing their jobs well, but that isn’t always the case. The other way to have a high graduation rate is to make the course load easier. With affirmative-action, etc., it seems that, while it may still be hard to get into college, it is pretty easy to get through it once you are there.

    I am currently studying in McGill, which, in most ratings, is in the top 50 universities worldwide. We also have a 56% admissions rate, and a laughably low tuition rate, comparable to a good in-state school, even for international students. While many schools are proud of their 98% graduation rate, McGill doesn’t publish their four year graduation rate. Based on the number of people I knew who left early, the number would be depressing. McGill has some easy classes, but it is nigh on impossible to graduate with a real degree without learning to do good work, and a McGill degree, while not as prestigious as Harvard or Stamford, still has significant weight around the world.
    Trying to bring this format into the US college market wouldn’t work because American Elites don’t want to pay American college prices and have their prized child fail. Imho, this format is actually merit based, where a degree is given after years of acceptable work, rather than a pipeline assuming the children who get in initially have all the merits required to earn the degree by merit of an admissions crapshoot.

    One might note that in Canada the federal government has very little jurisdiction over education. Education is almost entirely a provincial responsibility. As such, McGill only needs to satisfy the requirements of the Quebec government, and the Quebec government seems to place a higher priority on generating economic and/or academic value for the province than they do on “diversity”. If McGill had to pander to the whims of the federal government in Ottawa (which has been much more likely to drink the progressive Flavor-Aid) one might imagine that it would become a very different sort of school.

    Aside: As the son of a Queen’s U alumnus, I am legally required to scream “Kill McGill!” at every opportunity, but that’s mostly just a sports thing. ;-)

    • #22
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:13 PM PDT
    • 8 likes
  23. Thatcher

    Blessed Blacksmith (View Comment):
    McGill has some easy classes, but it is nigh on impossible to graduate with a real degree without learning to do good work, and a McGill degree, while not as prestigious as Harvard or Stamford, still has significant weight around the world. 

    When our company in Texas was recruiting, they found the best candidates at the University of Missouri at Rolla, now called Missouri University of Science and Technology. We also hired good engineers from the University of Texas (known somewhat as a party school) and Texas A&M, but the Rolla graduates had the best work habits.

    • #23
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:13 PM PDT
    • 4 likes
  24. Member

    Vectorman (View Comment):

    Blessed Blacksmith (View Comment):
    McGill has some easy classes, but it is nigh on impossible to graduate with a real degree without learning to do good work, and a McGill degree, while not as prestigious as Harvard or Stamford, still has significant weight around the world.

    When our company in Texas was recruiting, they found the best candidates at the University of Missouri at Rolla, now called Missouri University of Science and Technology. We also hired good engineers from the University of Texas (known somewhat as a party school) and Texas A&M, but the Rolla graduates had the best work habits.

    I generally get the impression that people don’t go to Ivy League schools in order to become mere employees like some commoner. They go to Ivy League schools to become Leaders™!

    • #24
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:18 PM PDT
    • 5 likes
  25. Reagan
    iWe Post author

    Hang On (View Comment):

    iWe:

    That would be much better – but in order for the Ivy League to do the same, they would need to make the school much more academically difficult than it is.

    That would require actual work on the part of the faculty. Yeah, like that’s going to happen.

    Making things harder is often easier. That is why I am a fascist parent – it is easiest, and yields good results.

    Consider how hard it is to be sensitive and woke. Very, very hard indeed.

    • #25
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:29 PM PDT
    • 7 likes
  26. Member

    iWe (View Comment):

    Hang On (View Comment):

    iWe:

    That would be much better – but in order for the Ivy League to do the same, they would need to make the school much more academically difficult than it is.

    That would require actual work on the part of the faculty. Yeah, like that’s going to happen.

    Making things harder is often easier. That is why I am a fascist parent – it is easiest, and yields good results.

    Consider how hard it is to be sensitive and woke. Very, very hard indeed.

    The problem from an individual faculty member’s point of view with making things harder would be the student ratings – which students pay a great deal of attention to. If the faculty member makes it both harder and deflates grades, it will be reflected in those ratings and presumably in the number of students attending the class. If tenure has not yet been attained, it will be a black mark when tenure comes up and those courses will be the first to face the ax when the inevitable budget crunch occurs because of lack of enrollment. Even if this is a system-wide change, the incentives are all in the direction towards making courses easier and grade inflation within the bounds administration will allow.

    • #26
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:46 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  27. Member

    iWe (View Comment):

    Hang On (View Comment):

    iWe:

    That would be much better – but in order for the Ivy League to do the same, they would need to make the school much more academically difficult than it is.

    That would require actual work on the part of the faculty. Yeah, like that’s going to happen.

    Making things harder is often easier. That is why I am a fascist parent – it is easiest, and yields good results.

    Consider how hard it is to be sensitive and woke. Very, very hard indeed.

    Everybody’s a conservative when it comes to the things for which they are held personally accountable.

    • #27
    • March 13, 2019, at 12:50 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  28. Member

    iWe (View Comment):

    Misthiocracy secretly (View Comment):

    This student should look into the work currently being done by the various universities’ math departments and choose the school whose current work is of greatest interest to the student.

    He did this. He chose his school based on which mathematician he wished to choose as his mentor. That was my advice.

    The quality of the bottom third of the schools’ student populations doesn’t strike me as being particularly relevant. What’s relevant is the quality of the schools’ math departments.

    Not exactly. There is a reason cities make more money than the countryside, why bigger lawfirms typically make more money per capita than smaller firms… having a large cohort DOES lead to innovation and intellectual productivity.

    In other words: being surrounded by smart students even outside the math department is both relevant and important.

    It’s true that if I’d gone to one of those other schools it could have been a pipeline to a lifelong job at the CBC.

    • #28
    • March 13, 2019, at 1:06 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  29. Thatcher

    iWe (View Comment):
    KISS: admit all who can do the work. Make the school hard enough to keep hunting that equilibrium. Students sink or swim.

    Simply put, “That’s racist!”

     

    • #29
    • March 13, 2019, at 3:27 PM PDT
    • Like
  30. Member

    iWe: To me, the only surprising feature about this latest “scandal” is that the schools themselves were bypassed and did not directly reap the winnings.

    I’ll bet they did. Not sure what you mean by “directly,” but this couldn’t have happened without the schools knowing about it, and they couldn’t have known about it without putting their own hands in the cookie jar.

    The real “scandal” here is that the authorities (Is it the DOJ? The news reports I’ve seen are unclear on that.) are going after the parents rather than the schools. That’s like prosecuting the fruit stand operator for paying off the mafia goons who run the protection racket.

    • #30
    • March 13, 2019, at 4:16 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  1. 1
  2. 2
  3. 3