Border Wars: One Arizonan’s Observations

 

The border between Arizona and Mexico as it is drawn on the map today dates back to the Gadsden Purchase, finalized in 1854. The established border on the map has always been a contentious area.

Apaches, rustlers, and raiders have crossed back and forth across that border before the purchase and long after. The shootout at the OK Corral involved Democrat versus Republican politics, as well as border cattle rustling, horse thieving, robberies of American mine payrolls, and Mexican bank robberies by Americans and Mexicans.

That border was meaningless with the exception of using it as a means to escape the authorities on one side of the border or the other.

Today, the border is just as contentious and two political parties in the United States are just as divided as they were when Arizona was a Territory. Personal ambition, mistaken good intentions, and ego in the Republican and Democratic Party has stalled any legislation to clarify immigration issues for decades. The House and Senate have abandoned any attempt to legislate any coherent immigration policy.

As an aside, I’m a bit bemused when some suggest that we need to increase the number of members of the House of Representatives. It’s like saying coyotes have been more difficult to find in your neighborhood. We need to import some more so they’re easier to find and later eradicate to protect our pets.

Living in the Sonoran Desert, I believe that a wall is necessary around ports of entry, and those towns that border the ports of entry. I believe that electronic surveillance would be just as efficient as a wall in the uninhabited areas of the Sonoran Desert. To make the trek in uninhabited areas requires consuming a liter to a gallon of water for every hour you are outdoors during the summer months. The winter months still require water consumption, but temps drop into the teens at night.

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  1. James Gawron Inactive
    James Gawron
    @JamesGawron

    Doug,

    I found both news stories interesting. However, the two different styles tell us a great deal about the problem we are having with the news. The first story is all about people and how they feel about things. How do they feel about the wall, how do they feel about Trump? The second story is done in the classical style that most news reporting used to be done. In half the time we get more relevant facts. We get a real feel for what is going on at the border every day. Migrants are only part of the story and the illegal activities are much more dangerous. Those trackers are likely to have saved a lot of lives of the people who get lost in the desert. Reality isn’t about identifying with people. It’s about understanding the real issues involved.

    We have become obsessed with emotionalism. Emotionalism is a great way to win elections but an idiotic way to govern a country.

    Regards,

    Jim

    • #1
  2. Doug Watt Member
    Doug Watt
    @DougWatt

    James Gawron (View Comment):

    Doug,

    I found both news stories interesting. However, the two different styles tell us a great deal about the problem we are having with the news. The first story is all about people and how they feel about things. How do they feel about the wall, how do they feel about Trump? The second story is done in the classical style that most news reporting used to be done. In half the time we get more relevant facts. We get a real feel for what is going on at the border every day. Migrants are only part of the story and the illegal activities are much more dangerous. Those trackers are likely to have saved a lot of lives of the people who get lost in the desert. Reality isn’t about identifying with people. It’s about understanding the real issues involved.

    We have become obsessed with emotionalism. Emotionalism is a great way to win elections but an idiotic way to govern a country.

    Regards,

    Jim

    The two ranchers in the first video will probably vote for President Trump again in 2020. They may disagree on what they would prefer in the method of border control, but they understand that Democrats could care less about their border concerns.

    The Pima County Sheriff’s Department cooperates and works collaboratively with all our federal law enforcement partners. We value these relationships. We recognize ICE Detainers and cooperate with them. We are required by State Law to verify the immigration status of persons housed in our Adult Detention Center prior to their release. A relatively small portion of persons crosschecked through ICE result in an Immigration Detainer request. An ICE Detainer, as currently drafted, does not provide a legal basis for detaining a person. Therefore, we cannot engage an extension of detention based solely on the existence of an ICE Detainer. When we no longer have a legal basis to hold an inmate, and are aware of an ICE Detainer, we notify ICE that we are beginning out-processing of the inmate. This generally takes approximately two (2) hours to complete. This provides sufficient time for ICE to take custody of the person. During calendar year 2016, the Pima County Sheriff’s Department processed approximately 35,000 persons into jail. Only 420 inmates had ICE Detainers. We acknowledged 100% of them and through collaboration/cooperation with ICE ensured that no person with an ICE Detainer was released into our community.

    Arizona is not a sanctuary state, and the above statement probably explains why the first caravan headed for the California Port of Entry rather than the Arizona Port of Entry at Nogales, or Yuma, Arizona.

    • #2
  3. James Gawron Inactive
    James Gawron
    @JamesGawron

    Doug Watt (View Comment):
    Arizona is not a sanctuary state, and the above statement probably explains why the first caravan headed for the California Port of Entry rather than the Arizona Port of Entry at Nogales, or Yuma, Arizona.

    Doug,

    I think the average Arizonan has their head screwed on straight. I think your population is about 7 million, so not that small a state. However, it is the behemoth next door that is completely out of its mind. California has close to 40 million people. That’s a lot of stupid congresspeople to be run by the Wicked Witch of the West herself.

    It is positively painful to read VDH’s reports from California. So many good people are being damaged by incredibly bad government.

    Wealth, Poverty, and Flight: The Same Old State of California

    Insulated coastal elites, impoverished immigrants, and a fleeing middle class

    California ranks first among the states in the percentage of residents over 25 who have never finished the ninth grade— 9.7 percent of California residents, or about 4 million Californians. It also rates 49th in the number of state residents who never graduated from high school — or about 18 percent of the current population.

    In other words, about 7 million Californians do not possess a high-school diploma, about equal to the size of the nine counties of California’s Bay Area, roughly from Napa to Silicon Valley. In some sense, inside California, there is a shadow state consisting of high-school dropouts that’s larger than 38 other U.S. states.

    The state of California is the state of chaos. No wonder it has sent Nancy Pelosi back to the House over and over again. They choose insanity.

    Regards,

    Jim

     

    • #3
  4. EODmom Coolidge
    EODmom
    @EODmom

    James Gawron (View Comment):

    Doug Watt (View Comment):
    Arizona is not a sanctuary state, and the above statement probably explains why the first caravan headed for the California Port of Entry rather than the Arizona Port of Entry at Nogales, or Yuma, Arizona.

    Doug,

    I think the average Arizonan has their head screwed on straight. I think your population is about 7 million, so not that small a state. However, it is the behemoth next door that is completely out of its mind. California has close to 40 million people. That’s a lot of stupid congresspeople to be run by the Wicked Witch of the West herself.

    It is positively painful to read VDH’s reports from California. So many good people are being damaged by incredibly bad government.

    Wealth, Poverty, and Flight: The Same Old State of California

    Insulated coastal elites, impoverished immigrants, and a fleeing middle class

    California ranks first among the states in the percentage of residents over 25 who have never finished the ninth grade— 9.7 percent of California residents, or about 4 million Californians. It also rates 49th in the number of state residents who never graduated from high school — or about 18 percent of the current population.

    In other words, about 7 million Californians do not possess a high-school diploma, about equal to the size of the nine counties of California’s Bay Area, roughly from Napa to Silicon Valley. In some sense, inside California, there is a shadow state consisting of high-school dropouts that’s larger than 38 other U.S. states.

    The state of California is the state of chaos. No wonder it has sent Nancy Pelosi back to the House over and over again. They choose insanity.

    Regards,

    Jim

     

    @jamesgawron the VDH essays are anguished and indeed painful to read. The state of California is an exemplar of what happens when policy makers are immune from the effects of their policies.  I wish policy makers would accept the information and guidance from people like @dougwatt who live under the conditions policies are meant to address. But I can’t understand how Arizona chose its newest US Senator. They apparently knowingly elected someone who advocates both socialism and he abolition of the state she represents. I don’t get it. On a lighter note – she seems to have taken a look from the Lady Gaga style book for her swearing in. But she didn’t swear while she did so there’s that. 

    • #4
  5. Doug Watt Member
    Doug Watt
    @DougWatt

    I forgot to mention the air assets of the Tucson Sector Border Patrol:

    Helicopters; 14 A Stars. Five are B3s and nine are B2s. We also have five UH-60 Blackhawk A models and 3 UH–1H Hueys.

    Used for surveillance, directing ground assets, as well as rescue for both American citizens, and border crossers. All based at Davis-Monthan AFB in Tucson. Davis-Monthan actually provides air support for a lot of interesting missions.

    • #5
  6. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    Doug Watt (View Comment):

    I forgot to mention the air assets of the Tucson Sector Border Patrol:

    Helicopters; 14 A Stars. Five are B3s and nine are B2s. We also have five UH-60 Blackhawk A models and 3 UH–1H Hueys.

    Used for surveillance, directing ground assets, as well as rescue for both American citizens, and border crossers. All based at Davis-Monthan AFB in Tucson. Davis Monthan actually provides air support for a lot of interesting missions.

    The Blackhawks and Hueys are for rescuing the AStar crews.

    • #6
  7. Rōnin Coolidge
    Rōnin
    @Ronin

    The small Texas border towns are either dying or dead, not that they were ever doing that well to begin with.  It’s pretty much a no-mans-land 25 miles either side of the border.  I love the country out there, but It’s fast becoming the Wild-Wild West.

    • #7
  8. Basil Fawlty Member
    Basil Fawlty
    @BasilFawlty

    You do Huachucan do.

    • #8
  9. Neil Hansen (Klaatu) Inactive
    Neil Hansen (Klaatu)
    @Klaatu

    Customs and Border Protection also flies MQ-9 Predator unmanned aerial vehicles out of Fort Huachuca.  There are also a series of aerostats but I’m not sure if the USAF is controlling those now.

    I do miss it there!

    • #9
  10. Doug Watt Member
    Doug Watt
    @DougWatt

    Neil Hansen (Klaatu) (View Comment):

    Customs and Border Protection also flies MQ-9 Predator unmanned aerial vehicles out of Fort Huachuca. There are also a series of aerostats but I’m not sure if the USAF is controlling those now.

    I do miss it there!

    Fort Huachuca is located in Sierra Vista, Arizona.

    Ft. Huachuca has two museums located in three buildings on Post. The Ft. Huachuca Museum takes up two buildings on old Post, its main museum and giftshop (Bldg. 41401) & a nearby spillover gallery called the Museum Annex (Bidg. 41305).

    It tells the story of Ft Huachuca and the US Army in the American Southwest, with special emphasis on the Buffalo Soldiers and the Apache War. The museum is located in a historic building over a hundred years old, with numerous rooms and corridors. Several displays illustrate life on the post during frontier days. Some room dioramas have automatic voice narratives.

    The gift shop is well-stocked with memorabilia, books, and souvenirs. The Annex bldg across the street (old Theater) also has outdoor displays, walkways, sitting areas, and historical statues.

    All visitors, military or civilian, are welcome at the Ft. Huachuca Museum free of charge. Civilian visitors without a DOD ID card must pass a criminal background check before being allowed to pass the gate. The main gate guard will furnish directions and a post map.

    The second museum is The US Army Intelligence Museum, located next to the MI Library on the MI school campus (Hatfield Str – bldg 52723). The Museum has a collection of unusual historical artifacts including agent radio communication gear, aerial cameras, cryptographic equipment, an Enigma Code machine, two small drones and a section of the Berlin Wall.

    The Museum’s emphasis is on U.S. Army (not civilian or other agency) military intelligence history and includes displays of the organizational development of the Army intelligence specialty. There is no military intelligence gift shop.

    The last four White Mountain Apache Scouts retired from Fort Huachuca in 1947.

    In 1947, the War Department ordered the retirement of the last four Scouts; one was Sgt. Sinew L. Riley. In his book, Fort Huachuca: Story of a Frontier Post, historian Cornelius Smith recorded Sgt. Riley’s moving words:

    We were recruited from the warriors of many famous nations. We are the last of the Army’s Indian scouts. In a few years we shall be gone to join our comrades in the great hunting grounds beyond the sunset, for our need here is no more. There we shall always remain very proud of our Indian people and of the United States Army, for we were truly the first Americans and you in the Army are now our warriors. To you who will keep the Army’s campfires bright, we extend our hands, and to you we will our fighting hearts.

    • #10
  11. CarolJoy, Above Top Secret Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Above Top Secret
    @CarolJoy

    Doug Watt (View Comment):

    James Gawron (View Comment):

    Doug,

    I found both news stories interesting. However, the two different styles tell us a great deal about the problem we are having with the news. The first story is all about people and how they feel about things. SNIP Reality isn’t about identifying with people. It’s about understanding the real issues involved.

    We have become obsessed with emotionalism. Emotionalism is a great way to win elections but an idiotic way to govern a country.

    Regards,

    Jim

    The two ranchers in the first video will probably vote for President Trump again in 2020. They may disagree on what they would prefer in the method of border control, but they understand that Democrats could care less about their border concerns.

    The Pima County Sheriff’s Department cooperates and works collaboratively with all our federal law enforcement partners. We value these relationships. We recognize ICE Detainers and cooperate with them. We are required by State Law to verify the immigration status of persons housed in our Adult Detention Center prior to their release. A relatively small portion of persons crosschecked through ICE result in an Immigration Detainer request. An ICE Detainer, as currently drafted, does not provide a legal basis for detaining a person. Therefore, we cannot engage an extension of detention based solely on the existence of an ICE Detainer. SNIP This provides sufficient time for ICE to take custody of the person. During calendar year 2016, the Pima County Sheriff’s Department processed approximately 35,000 persons into jail. Only 420 inmates had ICE Detainers. We acknowledged 100% of them and through collaboration/cooperation with ICE ensured that no person with an ICE Detainer was released into our community.

    Arizona is not a sanctuary state, and the above statement probably explains why the first caravan headed for the California Port of Entry rather than the Arizona Port of Entry at Nogales, or Yuma, Arizona.

    Yes exactly. The people in the caravan were bused and/or walked past the routes that would have taken them a  much shorter distance to the borders of Texas, New Mexico or Arizona, all to get them all  to California. Here we are run by officials who view any thing less than a red carpet welcome  for immigrants as being equivalent to the Holocaust. Our state Supreme Court has ruled that once in Calif, they or their families are immediately eligible for food stamps, housing vouchers,  AFDC checks, and MediCaid.  (Though the later is called MediCal.)

    If the newly arrived have no ID whatsoever, that’s fine. The only real requirements are that One: they show up to be interviewed by sympathetic social workers. Also Two: they must be willing  to state they are penniless.

    Our state’s benefits dwarf those of any other states by at least 40%. And please don’t get worried about  any of this. After all,  you and I don’t pay for any of it, our taxes do! (!!??!?!!)

    • #11
  12. Clifford A. Brown Member
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    Doug Watt:

    Personal ambition, mistaken good intentions, and ego in the Republican and Democratic Party has stalled any legislation to clarify immigration issues for decades. The House and Senate have abandoned any attempt to legislate any coherent immigration policy.

    As an aside, I’m a bit bemused when some suggest that we need to increase the number of members of the House of Representatives. It’s like saying coyotes have been more difficult to find in your neighborhood. We need to import some more so they’re easier to find and later eradicate to protect our pets.

    Exactly on point. The Congressional GOP, the House Republicans and National Republican Senate Committee, has engaged in deliberate Failure Theater (to quote Ace) on both immigration and healthcare, with Potemkin village “oversight” of the metastasizing, illegitimate, fourth branch of government.

     

    .

     

    • #12
  13. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    Doug Watt:

    Personal ambition, mistaken good intentions, and ego in the Republican and Democratic Party has stalled any legislation to clarify immigration issues for decades. The House and Senate have abandoned any attempt to legislate any coherent immigration policy.

    As an aside, I’m a bit bemused when some suggest that we need to increase the number of members of the House of Representatives. It’s like saying coyotes have been more difficult to find in your neighborhood. We need to import some more so they’re easier to find and later eradicate to protect our pets.

    Exactly on point. The Congressional GOP, the House Republicans and National Republican Senate Committee, has engaged in deliberate Failure Theater (to quote Ace) on both immigration and healthcare, with Potemkin village “oversight” of the metastasizing, illegitimate, fourth branch of government.

    How can you argue with this? It’s so frustrating.

    I really wonder if it isn’t smarter to just hunker down and try to take as many countermeasures on a personal level as you can instead of worrying about this stuff. It’s like it’s on autopilot. They have got to get creative, but it’s just not happening.

    .

    • #13
  14. SeanDMcG Inactive
    SeanDMcG
    @SeanDMcG

    Doug Watt: Living in the Sonoran Desert, I believe that a wall is necessary around ports of entry, and those towns that border the ports of entry. I believe that electronic surveillance would be just as efficient as a wall in the uninhabited areas of the Sonoran Desert. To make the trek in uninhabited areas requires consuming a liter to a gallon of water for every hour you are outdoors during the summer months. The winter months still require water consumption, but temps drop into the teens at night.

    I take your point about the terrain, but humans have been finding ways to traverse deserts for millennia. Depending on electronic surveillance reminds me of the commercials “I’m not a security guard, I’m a security monitor.” By the time you get boots on the ground, they’re already in the country. Physical barriers, whether constructed or natural, provide a deterrence that slows down, and possibly concentrates would-be border crossers, even if that is tunnels.

    Rōnin (View Comment):
    It’s fast becoming the Wild-Wild West.

    Becoming?.. 

    • #14
  15. Doug Watt Member
    Doug Watt
    @DougWatt

    SeanDMcG (View Comment):

    Doug Watt: Living in the Sonoran Desert, I believe that a wall is necessary around ports of entry, and those towns that border the ports of entry. I believe that electronic surveillance would be just as efficient as a wall in the uninhabited areas of the Sonoran Desert. To make the trek in uninhabited areas requires consuming a liter to a gallon of water for every hour you are outdoors during the summer months. The winter months still require water consumption, but temps drop into the teens at night.

    I take your point about the terrain, but humans have been finding ways to traverse deserts for millennia. Depending on electronic surveillance reminds me of the commercials “I’m not a security guard, I’m a security monitor.” By the time you get boots on the ground, they’re already in the country. Physical barriers, whether constructed or natural, provide a deterrence that slows down, and possibly concentrates would-be border crossers, even if that is tunnels.

    Rōnin (View Comment):
    It’s fast becoming the Wild-Wild West.

    Becoming?..

    The one rancher in the WSJ video that is seeing the wall extended to 18 feet in height on his land is still seeing 35 to 50 illegal immigrants crossing his land on a weekly basis. A vast improvement of the figure of 200 crossers to be sure.

    I’ll provide two links from a law firm that represents individuals trying to avoid deportation. Even though the firm would be considered adversarial in trying stop deportations the info is pretty good.

    Deportation

    Immigration Law

    In Arizona secondary border checkpoints are set up about 20 to 30 miles away from the border on state roads, and on I-19. All vehicles must stop, and everyone I stopped at your vehicle is photographed, like a red light camera set-up. The drug dog walks down the line of vehicles, and you are waved through, unless of course your vehicle is carrying drugs, or human beings in the trunk.

    Immediate deportation was possible based on the 100 mile rule. If you were within 100 miles of the border without paper work expedited deportation without a hearing was an option. Sometimes the Border Patrol will set up check points in the Tucson area which is about 70 miles from the border.

    I don’t mind the check points, but a secondary benefit is they drive some libertarians crazy. (Sarcasm). 

     

    • #15
  16. Neil Hansen (Klaatu) Inactive
    Neil Hansen (Klaatu)
    @Klaatu

    Doug Watt (View Comment):
    I don’t mind the check points, but a secondary benefit is they drive some libertarians crazy. (Sarcasm). 

    “Am I being detained?”

    • #16
  17. Doug Watt Member
    Doug Watt
    @DougWatt

    Neil Hansen (Klaatu) (View Comment):

    Doug Watt (View Comment):
    I don’t mind the check points, but a secondary benefit is they drive some libertarians crazy. (Sarcasm).

    “Am I being detained?”

    Why yes you are. Now tell me again that the 20 kilos of pot is for personal use.

     

    • #17
  18. Neil Hansen (Klaatu) Inactive
    Neil Hansen (Klaatu)
    @Klaatu

    Doug Watt (View Comment):

    Why yes you are. Now tell me again that the 20 kilos of pot is for personal use.

     

    Kilos?  You globalist!

    I buy my pot by the pound like an American!

    • #18
  19. SeanDMcG Inactive
    SeanDMcG
    @SeanDMcG

    Doug Watt (View Comment):

    The one rancher in the WSJ video that is seeing the wall extended to 18 feet in height on his land is still seeing 35 to 50 illegal immigrants crossing his land on a weekly basis. A vast improvement of the figure of 200 crossers to be sure.

    Immediate deportation was possible based on the 100 mile rule. If you were within 100 miles of the border without paper work expedited deportation without a hearing was an option. Sometimes the Border Patrol will set up check points in the Tucson area which is about 70 miles from the border.

    (Thanks for the links)

    I’d consider a 75% drop to be a win in the big picture, but I know that doesn’t mean much to people like that rancher. I did not know about the 100-mile rule. Even so, when multiplied by the length of the border, even one mile is a LOT of land to disappear into, let alone 20 or 100. The links you provided indicated that the time limit on expedited deportation was raised from 14 days to 2 years. That gives the government more time to catch and deport anyone who made it past the 100 mile line. 

    I’m not naive enough to think that illegal immigration is going to be stopped with a physical barrier (whatever the politicians want to call it), but the likes of Pelosi and Schumer cannot convince me that such an impediment is ineffective.

     

    • #19
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