McSally vs. Sinema vs. Election Officials: Sunday Edition

 

With today’s vote dump in the Arizona US Senate race, Martha McSally’s chances are fading fast. Democrat Kyrsten Sinema has again extended her lead, now by 32,640 votes, or 1.51%. At the end of Saturday’s count, she led by about 29,832 votes, or 1.41%.

The theory from McSally’s camp is that the votes counted on Sunday would help the Republican, but as we’ve seen, they most certainly did not.

There are still at least 200,000 votes to be counted, but McSally would have to utterly dominate them in order to take the lead.

In more bad news for the GOP, Democrat Secretary of State candidate Katie Hobbs has eked ahead of Republican Steve Gaynor by 150 votes.

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  1. Gumby Mark Coolidge
    Gumby Mark
    @GumbyMark

    Assuming Sinema wins, the interesting thing will be whether she sheds the moderate skin she wore in the House, now that she is a Senator.

    It was easier for Kristen Gillibrand in New York to make the transition.  She came from a conservative upstate House district where she had to pretend to support the NRA and oppose Open Borders.  Once she became Senator she had an entire liberal state as her playpen and felt free to tell those in her old district they were chumps.

    In contrast, Sinema will represent a state that is closely contested, and still leans conservative, though not as much as in the past.

    • #1
  2. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years.  Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona.  A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes.  The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008. 

    • #2
  3. Gumby Mark Coolidge
    Gumby Mark
    @GumbyMark

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Gary, there are no moderate Democrats left.  The last passed away early this century.

    • #3
  4. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Gary, there are no moderate Democrats left. The last passed away early this century.

    Moderate compared to Spartaus, and most of the Democrats running for President. 

    • #4
  5. Front Seat Cat Member
    Front Seat Cat
    @FrontSeatCat

    It ain’t over til it’s over….or how is this possible that all these votes are materializing after Election Day is in our rear view mirror?  Florida seems to be pulling votes off orange trees…

    • #5
  6. Gumby Mark Coolidge
    Gumby Mark
    @GumbyMark

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):

    It ain’t over til it’s over….or how is this possible that all these votes are materializing after Election Day is in our rear view mirror? Florida seems to be pulling votes off orange trees…

    As far as I can tell, the AZ votes are different than the situation in Florida, specifically Broward and Palm Beach counties where they will keep producing new votes until they get the result right.  In AZ these are mail ballots received by the end of election day.

    • #6
  7. Clifford A. Brown Member
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Front Seat Cat (View Comment):

    It ain’t over til it’s over….or how is this possible that all these votes are materializing after Election Day is in our rear view mirror? Florida seems to be pulling votes off orange trees…

    As far as I can tell, the AZ votes are different than the situation in Florida, specifically Broward and Palm Beach counties where they will keep producing new votes until they get the result right. In AZ these are mail ballots received by the end of election day.

    Bingo.

    • #7
  8. RightAngles Member
    RightAngles
    @RightAngles

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    • #8
  9. WI Con Member
    WI Con
    @WICon

    Well at least it’s “non-binary” eh? All those goo, goo, good government types/let’s lose like gentlemen  – well, here you go. All those suburban moms and GOPe types too embarrassed, wanting to send message. Well congrats girls – here’s a glimpse of the future. Recounts, outright thefts, missing ballots/’every vote’ (illegal, felon, 16 year old kids). What are you gonna do girls? File a lawsuit? Tweet, then get blocked? 

    Welcome to the future gang – get ready to pay. For sins real but mostly imagined.

    • #9
  10. Clifford A. Brown Member
    Clifford A. Brown
    @CliffordBrown

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    • #10
  11. EJGorman Coolidge
    EJGorman
    @EJGorman

    If Mr. Gabriel is suggesting no foul play, I guess the depths of damage done by the President, coupled with the apparent fruition of Mr. Judis’s  and Tugwell’s prediction from the early 2000s about the oncoming Democratic majority, show Arizona to be going the way of Nevada, and perhaps soon, Texas.  Ugh.

    • #11
  12. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    Not to Sinema.  I sent money to Martha McSally.

    • #12
  13. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey.  Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate.  For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.  

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    • #13
  14. Gumby Mark Coolidge
    Gumby Mark
    @GumbyMark

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey. Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate. For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    The only problem is Rubio would not have won in 2016.

    • #14
  15. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    Not to Sinema. I sent money to Martha McSally.

    But didn’t you vote for Hobbs, who will be first in line of succession to Governor?

    • #15
  16. RightAngles Member
    RightAngles
    @RightAngles

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    Not to Sinema. I sent money to Martha McSally.

    You commented elsewhere that you had sent money to the Democrats to cause a check on Trump. To me, helping the Democrats is helping them all.

    • #16
  17. The Cloaked Gaijin Member
    The Cloaked Gaijin
    @TheCloakedGaijin

    Jon Gabriel, Ed.:

    In more bad news for the GOP, Democrat Secretary of State candidate Katie Hobbs has eked ahead of Republican Steve Gaynor by 150 votes.

    Well, that might be the tipping point for turning Arizona into another Colorado, which was turned into another Oregon, Washington, and California.

    The Republican Party isn’t perfect, but you don’t want the party of voter fraud counting the ballots.

    While Washington has not elected a Republican governor since Jimmy Carter was president, Washington hasn’t elected a Democrat secretary of state since John Kennedy was president.  Until this most recent election,  I think that Colorado had also not elected a Democrat secretary of state since John Kennedy was president.  Even Oregon has a Republican secretary of state.  Democrat-dominated California has had two Republican secretaries of states in the 21st Century.  Since the Bush v. Gore recount, Florida’s secretary of state has apparently been appointed by Florida’s governor and mostly been held by Republicans who are former Democrats.  I remember here in Missouri in the year 2000, that the secretary of state’s office was one of only about seven statewide offices to go to the Republican in the same year that Bush won the electoral votes and a dead person was elected U.S. senator.  In that year, future governor Matt Blunt was elected the first Republican secretary of state since his father and the second Republican secretary of state since FDR, Harding, TR, or Lincoln was president as wikipedia’s detailed information does not go back that far.

    “I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this — who will count the votes, and how.” — Joseph Stalin

    • #17
  18. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey. Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate. For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    The only problem is Rubio would not have won in 2016.

    Almost any Republican would have won in 2016.  Only once after the 22nd Amendment was ratified in 1951 has any party stayed in power for three terms, and that was in 1988, when Bush I was elected to Reagan’s third term.  

    • #18
  19. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

     

    Bob Thompson (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    Not to Sinema. I sent money to Martha McSally.

    But didn’t you vote for Hobbs, who will be first in line of succession to Governor?

    I did.  Gaynor has disqualified himself by running as a “Trump” Republican.

     

    • #19
  20. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    Not to Sinema. I sent money to Martha McSally.

    You commented elsewhere that you had sent money to the Democrats to cause a check on Trump. To me, helping the Democrats is helping them all.

    Haven’t you ever voted s split ticket?  To quote JFK, “Sometimes party loyalty asks too much.”

    • #20
  21. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    “One man, one vote, one time.”

    • #21
  22. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Being a principled conservative is a waste of time.

     

    • #22
  23. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    “One man, one vote, one time.”

    True in Africa and some developing countries.  But America is a creedal country, based upon an idea of freedom.  We have been having free elections for 230 years.

    Germany has Germans who were born there, France has Frenchmen who were born there, Japan has Japanese who were born there.  But to be an American, you join the country whose crede you embraced.

    • #23
  24. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    “One man, one vote, one time.”

    True in Africa and some developing countries. But America is a creedal country, based upon an idea of freedom. We have been having free elections for 230 years.

    Germany has Germans who were born there, France has Frenchmen who were born there, Japan has Japanese who were born there. But to be an American, you join the country who creed you embraced.

    I know, but that’s what the left is aiming for. They like change. lol

    • #24
  25. Gumby Mark Coolidge
    Gumby Mark
    @GumbyMark

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey. Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate. For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    The only problem is Rubio would not have won in 2016.

    Almost any Republican would have won in 2016. Only once after the 22nd Amendment was ratified in 1951 has any party stayed in power for three terms, and that was in 1988, when Bush I was elected to Reagan’s third term.

    No, that is not true in the peculiar Electoral College math of 2016.  If, for instance, Trump lost Florida, I might agree with you about Rubio, but Trump won Florida.  If, for instance, Trump lost Ohio, I might agree with you about Cranky John Kasich, but Trump won Ohio.  Looking in detail at the results it is difficult to see a state that Trump lost that another Republican would have won, and Trump narrowly won three states (WI, MI, and PA) by flipping enough former non-suburban Obama voters, a feat difficult to see any other R accomplishing.

    Moreover, those suburban districts that just switched from R to D?   They all elected R representatives in 2016 when Trump headed the ticket and, as far as I can see, Trump was just as obnoxious, abnormal, and repellent as he is now.

    • #25
  26. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey. Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate. For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    The only problem is Rubio would not have won in 2016.

    Almost any Republican would have won in 2016. Only once after the 22nd Amendment was ratified in 1951 has any party stayed in power for three terms, and that was in 1988, when Bush I was elected to Reagan’s third term.

    No, that is not true in the peculiar Electoral College math of 2016. If, for instance, Trump lost Florida, I might agree with you about Rubio, but Trump won Florida. If, for instance, Trump lost Ohio, I might agree with you about Cranky John Kasich, but Trump won Ohio. Looking in detail at the results it is difficult to see a state that Trump lost that another Republican would have won, and Trump narrowly won three states (WI, MI, and PA) by flipping enough former non-suburban Obama voters, a feat difficult to see any other R accomplishing.

    Moreover, those suburban districts that just switched from R to D? They all elected R representatives in 2016 when Trump headed the ticket and, as far as I can see, Trump was just as obnoxious, abnormal, and repellent as he is now.

    I would like to have a Republican nominee who is not obnoxious, abnormal or repellant.  Is that too much to as for?

    Given our losses in 2018, I doubt that we will win WI, MI or PA in 2020, and are in the danger of losing AZ, GA and NC.

    • #26
  27. Gumby Mark Coolidge
    Gumby Mark
    @GumbyMark

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey. Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate. For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    The only problem is Rubio would not have won in 2016.

    Almost any Republican would have won in 2016. Only once after the 22nd Amendment was ratified in 1951 has any party stayed in power for three terms, and that was in 1988, when Bush I was elected to Reagan’s third term.

    No, that is not true in the peculiar Electoral College math of 2016. If, for instance, Trump lost Florida, I might agree with you about Rubio, but Trump won Florida. If, for instance, Trump lost Ohio, I might agree with you about Cranky John Kasich, but Trump won Ohio. Looking in detail at the results it is difficult to see a state that Trump lost that another Republican would have won, and Trump narrowly won three states (WI, MI, and PA) by flipping enough former non-suburban Obama voters, a feat difficult to see any other R accomplishing.

    Moreover, those suburban districts that just switched from R to D? They all elected R representatives in 2016 when Trump headed the ticket and, as far as I can see, Trump was just as obnoxious, abnormal, and repellent as he is now.

    I would like to have a Republican nominee who is not obnoxious, abnormal or repellant. Is that too much to as for?

    Given our losses in 2018, I doubt that we will win WI, MI or PA in 2020, and are in the danger of losing AZ, GA and NC.

    That may be true in 2020, but the facts say differently about 2016. 

    As to a nominee that is not obnoxious, abnormal, and repellent I would prefer that also.  I wish there were a halfway house between the pathetic passivity of GW Bush, McCain,Romney, and most of the GOP Congressional leadership versus the behavior of Trump.  There is not as of now, so I’m going with Trump.

    • #27
  28. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Gumby Mark (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    Clifford A. Brown (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    It appears that Arizona will be electing a Democrat to the U.S. Senate for the first time in 24 years. Damn.

    There is a barn-burner as to Secretary of State in Arizona. A relatively moderate Democrat, Katie Hobbs, is beating a self-proclaimed “Trump Republican” by 150 votes. The Secretary of State is the second highest state-wide office; in each of the last 4 decades, a Secretary of State has become governor.

    Democrats could win up to 4 statewide races; the last time they won a statewide race was in 2008.

    “Damn”? You sent them MONEY.

    If Jeff Flake had run, Republicans would have been wiped out, the governor would be in McSally’s vote situation, and the U.S. House members who won would have barely scraped by.

    I think it is your faction’s turn to politely smile and pull the lever for our faction within the big ol’ Republican tent — whose membership you don’t get to determine anymore than we did through the Bushes, McCain, and Romney. Live under Democrats, until Arizona becomes California without the beach, or find a way to compromise towards us.

    AND yes, we have serious, long and short term strategic problems.

    Yes, we must find ways to break through the 24/7 90% negative propaganda, magnified by social media moguls who mean us ill, or who see themselves as responsible for reforming our hearts and minds into what they consider correct thinking.

    Yes, we must deliver immediately palpable results, as well as credible signs of future greater promise for all Americans, especially those who the Democrats have kept down as permanently aggrieved.

    I’ll address the issues in one or more posts on Tuesday and later in the week. Back to Veterans’ Day postings through tomorrow.

    I think that Jeff Flake would have won, as well as Ducey. Under a President Rubio, we would not have lost the House, and would have been aiming at a filibuster-proof Senate. For better or worse, it is hard to prove these assertions.

    What we do know if that suburban Republicans got beaten, and beaten badly.

    The only problem is Rubio would not have won in 2016.

    Almost any Republican would have won in 2016. Only once after the 22nd Amendment was ratified in 1951 has any party stayed in power for three terms, and that was in 1988, when Bush I was elected to Reagan’s third term.

    No, that is not true in the peculiar Electoral College math of 2016. If, for instance, Trump lost Florida, I might agree with you about Rubio, but Trump won Florida. If, for instance, Trump lost Ohio, I might agree with you about Cranky John Kasich, but Trump won Ohio. Looking in detail at the results it is difficult to see a state that Trump lost that another Republican would have won, and Trump narrowly won three states (WI, MI, and PA) by flipping enough former non-suburban Obama voters, a feat difficult to see any other R accomplishing.

    Moreover, those suburban districts that just switched from R to D? They all elected R representatives in 2016 when Trump headed the ticket and, as far as I can see, Trump was just as obnoxious, abnormal, and repellent as he is now.

    I would like to have a Republican nominee who is not obnoxious, abnormal or repellant. Is that too much to as for?

    Given our losses in 2018, I doubt that we will win WI, MI or PA in 2020, and are in the danger of losing AZ, GA and NC.

    That may be true in 2020, but the facts say differently about 2016.

    As to a nominee that is not obnoxious, abnormal, and repellent I would prefer that also. I wish there were a halfway house between the pathetic passivity of GW Bush, McCain,Romney, and most of the GOP Congressional leadership versus the behavior of Trump. There is not as of now, so I’m going with Trump.

    Trump is bouncing around at 46% during a time of full employment, and low inflation.  Imagine what he will be at once the business cycle or inflation wake up.

    I wonder what Trump’s reaction will be should his son be indicted for perjury.  That reaction will not help his approval rating.

    • #28
  29. Bob Thompson Member
    Bob Thompson
    @BobThompson

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    I would like to have a Republican nominee who is not obnoxious, abnormal or repellant. Is that too much to as for?

    Given our losses in 2018, I doubt that we will win WI, MI or PA in 2020, and are in the danger of losing AZ, GA and NC.

    You did not support your argument and rebut @gumbymark‘s assertion regarding the fact, with evidence, that no Republican other than Donald Trump could have won in 2016. 

    • #29
  30. Gary Robbins Member
    Gary Robbins
    @GaryRobbins

    Bob Thompson (View Comment):

    Gary Robbins (View Comment):

    I would like to have a Republican nominee who is not obnoxious, abnormal or repellant. Is that too much to as for?

    Given our losses in 2018, I doubt that we will win WI, MI or PA in 2020, and are in the danger of losing AZ, GA and NC.

    You did not support your argument and rebut @gumbymark‘s assertion regarding the fact, with evidence, that no Republican other than Donald Trump could have won in 2016.

    I sure would have had Kasich campaign in WI, MI and PA.

    Rubio did well in the primaries in VA, and won the MN primary.  I would have frequently sent him to Nevada, Colorado and New Mexico, whic W won in 2004.

    I would have loved Walker on the ticket, which would have helped in the Upper Midwest.

    A young Rubio or Cruz, or fairly young Kasich would have done well against an old Hillary in the debates.

    Cocaine Mitch set up the Supreme Court as an issue.  Cruz, Rubio or Kasich would have won with that issue.

    • #30
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