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If this
Wait wait wait…
You mean this is unethical and not normal ???
Can we just go over all the times Democrats make these exact assumptions with people they work with, for, or care for?
What is wrong with this exactly?
So let me understand, @cm. If they act unethically, we should do the same? I hope you’re not serious.
Some are uncomfortable by it (I’m more insulted by the assumption), but I never thought THIS was unethical.
I have a problem with the authority of godly men making political statements in the pulpit. But a priests duty in the pulpit is dispensing God’s word. That’s a big difference from small talk with your doctor. My priest isn’t asking me how my weekend was from the pulpit, either.
This guy’s words (and most other professions) just don’t feature the same way.
Again, when dems have done this to me, I was more insulted by their assumptions because it underlined their belief no one could be a Republican. This guy did exactly what you have been trying to do – dispel the illusion that kind, decent people can’t be Republicans, too, and that there is nothing strange about it.
A bit lacking in boundaries and appropriateness, but I can understand that’s not very clear with social rules for different classes.
He’s a doctor talking to a patient in a very vulnerable position! This isn’t just small talk; this is indoctrination! What is a patient, who is at the mercy of the doctor, supposed to do–tell him to shut up? Walk out of the office in the middle of a treatment? I totally disagree, but we can agree to disagree.
Do what we do and ignore?
Like literally, this has happened to me. Same position (except it was my kid…).
But the purpose of going to church is to hear the teachings. To ignore is incredibly anti-thetical to my purpose of being there.
When my doctor provides me information on my health, I’ll listen. But small talk? Meh.
If he had more time, I’m sure he’d be canvassing his neighborhoods. He just wants to get information out the only way he knows how. I’m not going to fault him for that when liberals literally do the exact same thing and I’m told to get over it.
I am not sure about the ethics. (But then, I have never seen the professional-client relationship in quite the same way as is now common. To me there is a lot of infantilization in the modern paternalism of the professions. Instead, I see a professional relationship as a relationship between two adults, where one has agreed to care for the interests of the other in some area. I am pre-Foucauld on these matters. Grown ups stay grown ups in my world.)
I like to chat with my doctors and over the years have gotten friendly with them. We do not talk politics, though. And I would probably not do what that doctor did on the theory that my patient might be uncomfortable, as so many are, with the old American idea of the cracker barrel where everyone has a say. Still, the patient can attack Republicans without much fear that the doctor will therefore commit malpractice. Now THAT would be unethical for sure. (Justs as teachers who in any way denigrate students for political views or treat their own views as givens are unethical.)
All these “ethics boards” make me very nervous. Socrates long ago showed, proved, demonstrated that those who claim to know what justice is don’t. It is still so.
As a matter of prudence, though, the doctor should not risk looking like a nut job and keep it “professional,” at least until he knows the patients better and knows which ones it is ok to be human with. And it is very important for the doctor to attack only ideas he finds wrong and not the people who hold them.
Recalling those white coats and stethoscopes massed on the White House lawn not so long ago, SQ. It’s part of the landscape now…
As a therapist, I don’t talk about my politics with clients (when I had them). As a CEO I did not talk politics with clients or most staff. As a Consultant I don’t talk politics at all.
Bad for business.
I am also not particularly outraged.
@gfhandle, I agree with you. Not sure about unethical, but I’d say the exam room isn’t the time or place for this discussion unless you are “palzy” outside the doctor’s office. I cringe when my patients and/or their families want to talk politics for 2 reasons. If they lean liberal I have to just nod my head politely, bite my tongue and get out of the room as fast as I can. If they lean conservative, I end up spending too much time in there and have to find an excuse to get out. Haha! I never bring it up.
Hmm, put into context with teachers and professors from K thru grad school all indoctrinating children in leftist propaganda, I am not so enraged by this doctor’s behavior.
Is it ok for a doctor to express to a patient the doctor’s views of the effects of government policy and laws on the practice of medical care?
I think it is inappropriate.
So if your doctor does something you find inappropriate, why is he still your doctor?
If a doctor chooses to run his practice as a political entity, that is his practice and his choice. If you don’t like it, or think it inappropriate or unethical, you should find a better doctor.
I would. In fact, a while back when my doctor chose to discuss the ‘health aspects of guns in my home’, I respectfully declined to discuss it and found a new doctor.
Yes, it’s unprofessional — though pretty benign, as unprofessional behavior goes: I’m sure a lot of physicians have a lot of bad habits that would upset me more. Let’s face it, doctors are a peculiar lot. (No offense intended to the handful of peculiar doctors here.)
In a better, vanished time, the family doctor was a cranky, tired, opinionated man who probably smoked and wasn’t afraid to speak his mind. He couldn’t type, didn’t operate a computer, knew his patients well, and made house calls. He spent more time doctoring and less time complying with meaningful use and quality of care mandates in order to avoid being dinged by one or another government payment scheme. A lot has changed.
But they’ve always been peculiar.
Agreed. I’m about as cantankerous and politically incorrect as a fellow gets, but I don’t talk politics with clients — except for the handful whom I know share my views.
For some reason, I expect Ms. Fisher is A-OK with doctors asking patients if they have firearms in the house.
In both cases, the patient’s reply should be, “That’s none of your business!”
If the doctor persists, the next thing the patient should say is, “I think I’m going to find another doctor. This appointment is over.”
My dentist talks politics with me a lot. He’s kind of libertarian and we agree on a lot of things, so he probably gets more into it with me than with others. But sometimes he talks loudly with me when there are other patients around, too. When I’m in a position where I can’t talk because of equipment in my mouth he expresses his opinions to his assistant. He doesn’t seem to care.
Susan,
I like the first word of your post.
I know my hairdresser’s politics are 180 degrees different from mine, so I don’t ever bring up political subjects, lest I leave with a shaved head or purple hair.
I never mention politics with patients, never ever.
This because politics divides people. I work to help people.
The Doc in the story is probably pissed off up to here with how medicine has been ruined by the left. I understand this (O-care bankrupted my private practice) but I do not condone his advocacy.
Thanks all for comments so far. I must say I’m surprised. I wonder what would make a doctor’s action unethical? There are some obvious actions–like inappropriately touching a patient. But what things could a doctor say that would be unethical?
Also, I think this makes Republicans look bad. I think he acts like a jerk, quite frankly. And yes, I have had doctors with whom I’ve spoken politics after knowing them a while. But I’ve never had one speak this kind of propaganda.
Finally, do you all disagree with the description of the ethicist?
Thanks, @doctorrobert. I think we agree.
I’ve had a couple really good discussions with several physicians about the ACA from the time it was as still being debate till just a couple years ago. I appreciated it but I was the one asking. I think it would have been off putting the other way but must also note that some of the questions asked by the kid’s pediatrician (though I’m sure required by law), are rather assuming and offensive (guns, sex, abuse).
Huh.
The first time it happened to me I was at the gynecologist; no further details required I hope. It was a story I told because I found it funny – never even dawned on me to complain to someone.
Not sure. But I file it under “first world problems”.
The only time my doctor ever said anything political to me was after Obamacare was passed. He said, “The average person has no idea what’s coming.” And he meant it in a highly negative sense.
I can guess what he’d say about “Medicare For All” . . .
I’m guessing he supports “drill baby drill?”
For a doctor to increase a patient’s anxiety goes against everything I know about alleviating pain. I cannot imagine a doctor making a patient more anxious in course of having to give her painful injections.
I read a wonderful book a few years ago on innovation at the Mayo Clinic: Think Big, Start Small, Move Fast. The book is written for all types of organizations that are seeking lasting and productive change, but the stories about the lengths that the Mayo Clinic has gone to in trying to grasp how it feels to be a patient so they could improve the patient’s experience are inspiring. It is a simple fact of life for the Mayo Clinic that their patients need to feel at ease in the hospital setting for healing to come about.
I think doctors should feel free to discuss politics with their patients. But could they wait until we are all dressed and sitting up, please? :-)
Regarding dentists: there are a handful of people you don’t want to antagonize, and dentists are among them. Waiters, barbers, and wives are in that group as well.
Especially when they have their CWP . . .