Elizabeth Warren’s DNA Test Contradicts Her Previous Stories About Native American Ancestry

 

Elizabeth Warren recently released the results of a DNA test which she claims proves that she is of Native American descent.

The claim in the report is that it is likely that Elizabeth Warren has a Native American ancestor from 8 generations ago. If we assume that a generation is 25 years, and given that Warren was born in 1949, that would this Native American ancestor was born sometime around 1749, well before the founding.

Let’s assume for a moment that this analysis is correct. How does this square with previous claims about Warren’s heritage? Her brother said in 2012 “[Our] grandfather is part Delaware, a little bitty bit, way back, and [our] grandmother is part Cherokee.”

If that’s the case, wouldn’t wouldn’t we expect to see a lot more Indian DNA, and much more recently?  It implies that there should be Indian DNA as late as 4 generations back, which is significantly outside the range (between 6 and 10 generations) estimated by the DNA analysis as to when she had a Native American ancestor.

How does she explain this contradiction? I mean, either brother is wrong about whether his grandmother is Cherokee, or the conclusion of the analysis of the DNA test is wrong about when her Native American ancestor lived. If the test actually demonstrates that her brother is wrong about what she said, then wasn’t she still wrong when she claimed to be a Native American, since she used that story as the basis for her claim?

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  1. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    I also wanted to say that even though I’m 100% native American, I’m also 1/1024 Thracian, so I may be more Spartacus than Senator Booker.

    No one is more Spartacus than Booker not even Kirk Douglas (and he was Spartacus). Man, at this point Booker either runs with this thing or he gets destroyed by it. I think he needs to just dress up for Halloween as Spartacus and put this to rest. 

    • #61
  2. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Kozak (View Comment):

    Valiuth (View Comment):
    Well I don’t think black people though would view having some white ancestry as relevant to their blackness either.

    I still chuckle at Obama and his being the first African American president.

    His mom was white, and his dad was African. So he had zero % of the “African American” experience in his ancestry.

    On the other hand maybe he is the most literal African American that there can be. So chalk one up for technically correct. The best kind of correct. 

    • #62
  3. Freeven Inactive
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    I’ve never had a problem with Warren’s claim that she is part American Indian. I have no way of knowing whether she is or isn’t, and those who have called the claim a lie don’t either. Further, I simply don’t care. Whether she is or isn’t won’t change anyone’s mind about her. There’s plenty enough to object to in her politics and other public statements without chasing our tails on foolish non-issues.

    • #63
  4. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Hang On (View Comment):

    What would be funny is if Trump took the DNA test and wound up more Indian that Warren is.

    Oddly enough he has really decent odds of it happening. Turns out many Europeans have something like 1/512th native american markers. None of their ancestors though are Native American but rather they must be carriers of the markers from before the split in populations. But, since these things are boiled down to easily digestible percentages of known groups you can certainly spin it that way. Heck if she wins the nomination faking the test to show he is more Native American than her would just be good for a prank at least. That would be the Trumpiest of Trumping that ever Trumped. Then she can start calling him Geronimo. 

    • #64
  5. Valiuth Inactive
    Valiuth
    @Valiuth

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I’ve never had a problem with Warren’s claim that she is part American Indian. I have no way of knowing whether she is or isn’t, and those who have called the claim a lie don’t either. Further, I simply don’t care. Whether she is or isn’t won’t change anyone’s mind about her. There’s plenty enough to object to in her politics and other public statements without chasing our tails on foolish non-issues.

    Well, I agree ultimately it doesn’t matter. But there is a way to objectively check her claim it is the DNA test. This isn’t voodoo, or anything. Its fairly good. The biggest problem probably might be lack of samples from Native Americans to really pin it down accurately. But, for the sake of proving Trump wrong if 1000 native Americans agree to to have their genomes sequences we can make quite a good data set. And the extra benefit is that human geneticists will have some nice data to comb over. Everybody wins. So I’m putting it out there. We need to spend millions of dollars on solving this pointless argument. For Science People! For Science!

     

    • #65
  6. Stad Coolidge
    Stad
    @Stad

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):
    The fact that my ancestors came from Germany 4 generations ago has exactly zero to do with how I live my life.

    And this is the big point.  If my French ancestor (I’m one quarter) was originally from China eight generations ago, it makes no difference.  Genetics is separate from culture, and I would say a British black man is more British than his Watusi ancestor from four generations ago.

    • #66
  7. OldPhil Coolidge
    OldPhil
    @OldPhil

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Hang On (View Comment):

    What would be funny is if Trump took the DNA test and wound up more Indian that Warren is.

    Oddly enough he has really decent odds of it happening. Turns out many Europeans have something like 1/512th native american markers. None of their ancestors though are Native American but rather they must be carriers of the markers from before the split in populations. But, since these things are boiled down to easily digestible percentages of known groups you can certainly spin it that way. Heck if she wins the nomination faking the test to show he is more Native American than her would just be good for a prank at least. That would be the Trumpiest of Trumping that ever Trumped. Then she can start calling him Geronimo.

    I always thought I was pretty much half Scot (Mom’s side) and half Irish (Dad’s). Both good whiskeys, but I digress. Then doing genealogical research, I found a great grand-mother on my Mom’s side who had direct ancestors all the way back to 1640’s Isle of Wight, VA, established shortly after Jamestown. So you know I’ve got some Indian DNA rattling around there somewhere.

    • #67
  8. Miffed White Male Member
    Miffed White Male
    @MiffedWhiteMale

    OldPhil (View Comment):

    Valiuth (View Comment):

    Hang On (View Comment):

    What would be funny is if Trump took the DNA test and wound up more Indian that Warren is.

    Oddly enough he has really decent odds of it happening. Turns out many Europeans have something like 1/512th native american markers. None of their ancestors though are Native American but rather they must be carriers of the markers from before the split in populations. But, since these things are boiled down to easily digestible percentages of known groups you can certainly spin it that way. Heck if she wins the nomination faking the test to show he is more Native American than her would just be good for a prank at least. That would be the Trumpiest of Trumping that ever Trumped. Then she can start calling him Geronimo.

    I always thought I was pretty much half Scot (Mom’s side) and half Irish (Dad’s). Both good whiskeys, but I digress. Then doing genealogical research, I found a great grand-mother on my Mom’s side who had direct ancestors all the way back to 1640’s Isle of Wight, VA, established shortly after Jamestown. So you know I’ve got some Indian DNA rattling around there somewhere.

    I dated a girl in Madison who’s last name was Zygarowicz.  She was french.  Well, her parents were.  Her fathers parents were on a ship leaving Poland during WWI that got torpedoed off the coast of France.  They settled there, and then her parents emmigrated to the US after WWII.  Her mom told me a story about getting strafed during the German invasion in 1940.

     

    • #68
  9. Tex929rr Coolidge
    Tex929rr
    @Tex929rr

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I’ve never had a problem with Warren’s claim that she is part American Indian. I have no way of knowing whether she is or isn’t, and those who have called the claim a lie don’t either. Further, I simply don’t care. Whether she is or isn’t won’t change anyone’s mind about her. There’s plenty enough to object to in her politics and other public statements without chasing our tails on foolish non-issues.

    It represents one of the most odious practices of modern progressives – constant self victimization, and the desperate attempt to always be more of a victim than the next person.   She pretty clearly misrepresented herself for decades for personal gain.  Politicians are self promoting enough that we don’t need the extra prevarications about one’s own family.  Lying about one’s ancestors for personal in and of itself is pretty disgusting.  

    Can I dislike her for her policy beliefs and nasty behavior?  Sure.  But I can certainly add this to the mix.

    • #69
  10. I Walton Member
    I Walton
    @IWalton

    Valiuth (View Comment):
    Like I said I don’t even think you she used it fraudulently. Why would you doubt your mothers story?

    I’d call that dishonest, perhaps fraud is too much a legal term, but sleazy, yes.  Did she get advantage by saying it?  Well the schools say no, but of course she did because the whole approach is corrupt and corrupting and to use that system in anyway is sleazy.  But she gets elected because she panders to every pander-able false narrative, and every left wing interest group which is also the reason we dislike Pocahontas so. 

    • #70
  11. Doctor Robert Member
    Doctor Robert
    @DoctorRobert

    Elizabeth Warren has 1/64 to 1/1024 Amerind DNA.  The DNA involved is apparently Peruvian.

    1/64 is 1.6% and 1/1024 is 0.098% (I did those in my head).  The mind reels.

    1/64 is a single ancestor 6 generations ago (assuming no consanguinuity) and 1/1024 is a single ancestor 10 generations ago.

    The average white American has 0.2% Amerind DNA.

    So my senior senator has shown that she is half as much an American Indian as an average American.  She has proven herself to be a Fake Indian.

    This is effing laughable.

    • #71
  12. AchillesLastand Member
    AchillesLastand
    @

    With all this talk of high cheekbones, I guess Heidi Klum is Cherokee, too…

    Just sayin’

    • #72
  13. Freeven Inactive
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    Tex929rr (View Comment):

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I’ve never had a problem with Warren’s claim that she is part American Indian. I have no way of knowing whether she is or isn’t, and those who have called the claim a lie don’t either. Further, I simply don’t care. Whether she is or isn’t won’t change anyone’s mind about her. There’s plenty enough to object to in her politics and other public statements without chasing our tails on foolish non-issues.

    It represents one of the most odious practices of modern progressives – constant self victimization, and the desperate attempt to always be more of a victim than the next person. She pretty clearly misrepresented herself for decades for personal gain. Politicians are self promoting enough that we don’t need the extra prevarications about one’s own family. Lying about one’s ancestors for personal in and of itself is pretty disgusting.

    Can I dislike her for her policy beliefs and nasty behavior? Sure. But I can certainly add this to the mix.

    So go after the victimization tactics. That’s a noble fight. Just don’t pretend to know the truth of her claim if you don’t.  That’s not noble.

    • #73
  14. Freeven Inactive
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    Doctor Robert (View Comment):

    Elizabeth Warren has 1/64 to 1/1024 Amerind DNA. The DNA involved is apparently Peruvian.

    1/64 is 1.6% and 1/1024 is 0.098% (I did those in my head). The mind reels.

    1/64 is a single ancestor 6 generations ago (assuming no consanguinuity) and 1/1024 is a single ancestor 10 generations ago.

    The average white American has 0.2% Amerind DNA.

    So my senior senator has shown that she is half as much an American Indian as an average American. She has proven herself to be a Fake Indian.

    This is effing laughable.

    See, this is what I think is silly. You walk through the proof of why she is, in fact, what she claimed: part American Indian, then dismiss her as a “Fake Indian.” This is another data point in my continuing realization that the Right can’t be taken seriously either. 

    If the “rules” say you get “extra credit” for being part American Indian, I don’t begrudge someone for taking advantage of a quirk in their lineage to get ahead. Of all the things politicians do and say, this is extremely small potatoes, and it’s not going to change anyone’s opinion of Elizabeth Warren. The problem is that there is such a “rule” to begin with. That’s actually important, and so worth trying to persuade people of.

    • #74
  15. Brian Watt Member
    Brian Watt
    @BrianWatt

    With all the women’s versions of popular films (Oceans 8, Overboard, Ghostbusters, etc.) now waiting for the “women’s version” of Zelig…starring the Senator of Massachusetts.

    • #75
  16. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Freeven (View Comment):

    I’ve never had a problem with Warren’s claim that she is part American Indian. I have no way of knowing whether she is or isn’t, and those who have called the claim a lie don’t either. Further, I simply don’t care. Whether she is or isn’t won’t change anyone’s mind about her. There’s plenty enough to object to in her politics and other public statements without chasing our tails on foolish non-issues.

    LOL. Look at how it put her on the defensive.  I can’t believe she actually ended up taking a test.  And spin it as she may it proves she was either lying or greatly exaggerating.

     I don’t have any problem holding a politicians feet to the fire who lied about her ancestry for 1. Academic and professional gain, and 2. Pandering for votes.   

    • #76
  17. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Freeven (View Comment):
    See, this is what I think is silly. You walk through the proof of why she is, in fact, what she claimed: part American Indian, then dismiss her as a “Fake Indian.”

    LOL. Again if one has to go back 6 to 10 generations that means they aren’t Native American, or if she is we all are and it becomes a distinction without a difference.

    At best she is 1.5% Native American.  At worst she is ).09%.  

    If that makes me Native American I want my casino check.  

    • #77
  18. DonG Coolidge
    DonG
    @DonG

    https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/neanderthal/

    Everyone living outside of Africa today has a small amount of Neanderthal in them, carried as a living relic of these ancient encounters. A team of scientists comparing the full genomes of the two species concluded that most Europeans and Asians have approximately 2 percent Neanderthal DNA. Indigenous sub-Saharan Africans have none, or very little Neanderthal DNA because their ancestors did not migrate through Eurasia.

    • #78
  19. Columbo Member
    Columbo
    @Columbo

    Kozak (View Comment):

    Freeven (View Comment):
    See, this is what I think is silly. You walk through the proof of why she is, in fact, what she claimed: part American Indian, then dismiss her as a “Fake Indian.”

    LOL. Again if one has to go back 6 to 10 generations that means they aren’t Native American, or if she is we all are and it becomes a distinction without a difference.

    At best she is 1.5% Native American. At worst she is ).09%.

    If that makes me Native American I want my casino check.

    That makes me think of this South Park video posted in Funny Political Memes …

     

    • #79
  20. Freeven Inactive
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    Kozak (View Comment):
    I don’t have any problem holding a politicians feet to the fire who lied about her ancestry for 1. Academic and professional gain, and 2. Pandering for votes.

    As I understand it, her claim was that she was part American Indian, which appears to be true. The “rules” of the game are that that quirk of lineage, however much exaggerated, confers advantages. The “rules” are stupid. That’s a fight worth having, and I’ll gladly join you in it.

    But if she is, in fact, part American Indian, at worst she used a technicality to gain a personal advantage. Calling her a liar isn’t apt to change anyone’s opinion of her. But pulling our hair out over something politicians routinely do — I seem to recall Trump swearing up and down that he’d never declared bankruptcy (technically only his several businesses had) — looks like hysteria to the very people we need to be appealing to.

    • #80
  21. Seawriter Contributor
    Seawriter
    @Seawriter

    Freeven (View Comment):
    As I understand it, her claim was that she was part American Indian, which appears to be true.

    Nope. Less than one-tenth of one-percent of her DNA has markers indicating possible Indian ancestry. At that low a percentage she could have gotten those markers from Europe as easily as from the Americas. (They could come from Siberian peoples that moved west into Europe rather than east into the Americas.) Indeed that is the most likely place they could have come from since they seem to come from her tenth generation – which would be the 1500s or 1600s. Unless she belongs to the FFV or came over on the Mayflower, her “Indian” ancestor was born in Europe (or possibly Asia).

    The average non-Indian inhabitant of the US has about 0.2% Indian markers, so she is less Indian than most people without Indian ancestry. 

    • #81
  22. Freeven Inactive
    Freeven
    @Freeven

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Freeven (View Comment):
    As I understand it, her claim was that she was part American Indian, which appears to be true.

    Nope. Less than one-tenth of one-percent of her DNA has markers indicating possible Indian ancestry. At that low a percentage she could have gotten those markers from Europe as easily as from the Americas. (They could come from Siberian peoples that moved west into Europe rather than east into the Americas.) Indeed that is the most likely place they could have come from since they seem to come from her tenth generation – which would be the 1500s or 1600s. Unless she belongs to the FFV or came over on the Mayflower, her “Indian” ancestor was born in Europe (or possibly Asia).

    The average non-Indian inhabitant of the US has about 0.2% Indian markers, so she is less Indian than most people without Indian ancestry.

    All of which misses my point, which is that none of this is going to change anyone’s opinion of Elizabeth Warren. Like the Birther stuff, it just makes it look like the Right has lost its collective mind. Go after her on something that actually matters to people.

    • #82
  23. Seawriter Contributor
    Seawriter
    @Seawriter

    Freeven (View Comment):
    Like the Birther stuff, it just makes it look like the Right has lost its collective mind. Go after her on something that actually matters to people.

    You will have to tell the Cherokee Nation they are one with the birthers because they seem to think it matters.

    • #83
  24. Kay of MT Inactive
    Kay of MT
    @KayofMT

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    I just want to declare that I am 100% native American. I was born in California many moons after it became a state in the Union. So, there.

    Me too!

    • #84
  25. Kay of MT Inactive
    Kay of MT
    @KayofMT

    OldPhil (View Comment):
    Then doing genealogical research, I found a great grand-mother on my Mom’s side who had direct ancestors all the way back to 1640’s Isle of Wight, VA, established shortly after Jamestown. So you know I’ve got some Indian DNA rattling around there somewhere.

    I have an ancestor who was in Jamestown Colony. There were no women in the Colony at that time, but he left a son, so his mom had to be a Native.

    • #85
  26. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Freeven (View Comment):
    Like the Birther stuff, it just makes it look like the Right has lost its collective mind. Go after her on something that actually matters to people.

    You will have to tell the Cherokee Nation they are one with the birthers because they seem to think it matters.

    LOL.  Liberals now scolding actual Native Americans for daring to contradict 

    Fauxcahontas…

     

    • #86
  27. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    • #87
  28. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    DrewInWisconsin (View Comment):

    Miffed White Male (View Comment):

    The fact that my ancestors came from Germany 4 generations ago has exactly zero to do with how I live my life.

    Ancestry is not destiny, but I’m convinced that our ancestors have a greater effect on us than we might know. I just need Time Travel to prove some of my theses. But you guys know I’ve been working hard on that.

    You weren’t at the meeting next Thursday …

    • #88
  29. Sash Member
    Sash
    @Sash

    The number of people who can put themselves down as Native American and therefore get consideration of being a minority just expanded.  In fact, my husband has twice the Native American DNA as Warren, and it’s so small that’s laughable.

    Almost any white person in America who has ancestors before 1750 in America probably has double the amount of native that Warren claimed.

    It’s really sad that anyone is still supporting her, since she refuses to give it up, and just apologize for lying.  She is such a disgrace.

    She destroys any claim that affirmative action is a good thing.  I have always had mixed feelings about it, but if this is how the left thinks affirmative action should be used, it’s worthless.

    • #89
  30. Sash Member
    Sash
    @Sash

    Freeven (View Comment):I’ve never had a problem with Warren’s claim that she is part American Indian.

    She got her start because she took the place of an actual minority by claiming to be Native American, that’s as dishonest as it gets.  And it is relevant.

    • #90
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