Men and Women

 

It is pathetic how some on the left and the right want to think sexual attraction is wrong. On one hand, they’ve oversexualized everything to the point of thinking men and women can’t be just friends. On the other hand, that every man thinks about raping women and how they can get away with it. This is not just pathetic, but evil.

They think that men are incapable of controlling their hormones and urges. They think that every man would be a rapist if he could. They act surprised that a man could remain a virgin through high school and college. They are surprised by the idea of self-control. They want to have their cake and eat it too. They say that we are all sexual beings, but act surprised and mortified by the dance of flirtation between the sexes.

The sexual revolution has destroyed much of the natural tension that exists between the two sexes. Of course, the left is now of the opinion that there is an infinite number of sexes. There once existed the idea of courtship. The answer to the question of sex before marriage used to be a default “no.” Clearly, sex happened before marriage, but women held the power. The default was “no” and they had to be convinced to change that to “yes.”

Today, the answer to the question of sex before marriage is a default “yes” — not only the default but the expectation. With that happening, the civilizing power of women on men has been greatly diminished. With the default being “yes,” men don’t have to try anymore.

If a woman says no; a man can go to the next one and the next one and the next one. He can just keep on swiping right. He never has to court a woman. He never has to show that he is worthy of her. In their attempt to erase any and all differences between the two sexes, the sexual revolution and the left has taken this power of being a civilizing force away from women.

They think it’s wrong for men to look at women. Guess what, men like to look at women. Men are highly visual. Women like to be looked at; I didn’t say leered at, but they like men to notice. Why else would women wear clothes that accentuate their figure? Just because a man notices the beauty of a woman does not mean that he wants to assault her. He noticed her beauty, that’s it. He may have a thought or two about her, but those thoughts are not about raping her.

The left wants to destroy the differences between men and women. They want to destroy male-female friendships. They want to strip power from women and they want to destroy men.

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  1. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Johnnie Alum 13:

    They want to destroy men.

    Destroy? Nah. They want to fix us…one way or another. 

    • #1
  2. Johnnie Alum 13 Inactive
    Johnnie Alum 13
    @JohnnieAlum13

    TBA (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13:

    They want to destroy men.

    Destroy? Nah. They want to fix us…one way or another.

    Have a society of men without chests.

    And nothing but eunuchs.

    • #2
  3. Ed G. Member
    Ed G.
    @EdG

    I mostly agree with all of the OP. However, I’m not so sure about men and women being able to be just friends. I think it’s more complicated than that exactly because of the sexual tension. I would look askance at my wife going out to a bar with one of her male friends, just as she would look askance at me going out with a female friend. Is it a matter of trust? Is it a matter of being no better than animals? No, but things happen. I don’t mean that we have no agency and that we’re just victims of nature, but yet things do happen even with the best of intentions. Not just cheating either. But pursuit of being noticed and pursuit of being wanted. Pursuit of getting right up to the edge of illicit because it’s thrilling and satisfying to do so. That alone has consequences and effects beyond just being friends.

    Nor do I mean that people would have attraction for any member of the opposite sex simply because they’re the opposite sex. I’m not attracted to grandma, either my own or anyone else’s. There are exceptions, but that doesn’t completely invalidate the rule. Of course, men and women can be friendly while respecting boundaries, but the fact that there are additional and needed boundaries says something about the ability to be just friends.

    I agree that sexual attraction is not wrong, and that attraction does not equal desire at any cost (e.g. rape). I also agree that modern progressives have pretty much all facets of intersex relations wrong. We can be in tension while still working together and respecting one another and even having genuine friendly affection for one another.

    • #3
  4. Johnnie Alum 13 Inactive
    Johnnie Alum 13
    @JohnnieAlum13

    Ed G. (View Comment):

    We can be in tension while still working together and respecting one another and even having genuine friendly affection for one another.

    Exactly!

    We have these friendly pursuits because we are more than just sex.  We put in place boundaries.  We enjoy the tension that may exist.  We practice self discipline. 

    • #4
  5. Nanda Panjandrum Member
    Nanda Panjandrum
    @

    Johnnie, P.St. JP II’s “Love & Responsibility”, written for college students while he taught at the University of Lublin, gets at this whole arc of relationship beautifully.  May I recommend it?

    • #5
  6. Johnnie Alum 13 Inactive
    Johnnie Alum 13
    @JohnnieAlum13

    Nanda Panjandrum (View Comment):

    Johnnie, P.St. JP II’s “Love & Responsibility”, written for college students while he taught at the University of Lublin, gets at this whole arc of relationship beautifully. May I recommend it?

    Absolutely. Thank you, Nanda.

    • #6
  7. Randy Webster Member
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Johnnie Alum 13: He can just keep on swiping righ

    Swiping right?

    • #7
  8. Nanda Panjandrum Member
    Nanda Panjandrum
    @

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13: He can just keep on swiping righ

    Swiping right?

    Moving on…In the way one keeps changing views/pages on an iDevice, maybe?

    • #8
  9. Randy Webster Member
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Nanda Panjandrum (View Comment):

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13: He can just keep on swiping righ

    Swiping right?

    Moving on…In the way one keeps changing views/pages on an iDevice, maybe?

    Ah.  I don’t have such a device.

    • #9
  10. Johnnie Alum 13 Inactive
    Johnnie Alum 13
    @JohnnieAlum13

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13: He can just keep on swiping righ

    Swiping right?

    A reference to the various “dating” apps. I believe that swiping right is a way to show your interest.

    • #10
  11. Boss Mongo Member
    Boss Mongo
    @BossMongo

    Here’s the thing: I’m probably the SJW poster boy for toxic masculinity.  I like drinking.  I have a quite amazing alcohol tolerance.  I like guns, and spend as much time on the range as I can.  I like fighting (after a certain point, I just had to stop bar brawling; training had brought me to where I’d probably kill somebody Ain’t nothing that happens in a bar worth killing or maiming someone). I like women.  I women in all shapes, sizes, ages, and appearances. 

    So I don’t (at the high school football games or social gatherings or running into friends at the grocery store) hug, kiss or get familiar with members of the fairer sex.  First, because it’s inappropriate for a married man to do so (IMHO).  Also, because if I’m hugging a female, I’m pretty much automatically thinking about bumping uglies with her.  Inappropriate.

    This has led to hilarity and hijinks, as friends of my daughters, their moms, etc. try to ambush me with hugs.  I respond appropriately.

    But, tho I hit every check mark of toxic masculinity (I was surprised and disappointed that the “Pence rule” was “a thing”), I cannot even imagine forcing myself on a woman.

    I don’t think the hydraulics would even work.

    • #11
  12. Mike “Lash” LaRoche Inactive
    Mike “Lash” LaRoche
    @MikeLaRoche

    Ed G. (View Comment):

    I mostly agree with all of the OP. However, I’m not so sure about men and women being able to be just friends. I think it’s more complicated than that exactly because of the sexual tension.

    That is very true. And if she’s being unusually friendly and is married, that makes the situation potentially volatile.

    • #12
  13. CB Toder aka Mama Toad Member
    CB Toder aka Mama Toad
    @CBToderakaMamaToad

    Johnnie Alum 13: They want to destroy men.

    They also want to destroy women.

    Good women and good men need each other.

    We are complementary!

    I love and need men. I love to rely on men. I love to trust men. Men need women. Men need to rely on women. Men need to trust women.

    When men and women think that the other sex is the enemy, both are destroyed.

    There is no natural state of enmity when it comes to men and women, that is the great lie that they want you to believe. We need each other.

    • #13
  14. Randy Webster Member
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Johnnie Alum 13 (View Comment):
    A reference to the various “dating” apps. I believe that swiping right is a way to show your interest.

    I tried that on my flip phone.  Nothing happened.

    • #14
  15. Randy Webster Member
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13 (View Comment):
    A reference to the various “dating” apps. I believe that swiping right is a way to show your interest.

    I tried that on my flip phone. Nothing happened.

    Of course, I could be doing it wrong.

    • #15
  16. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Ed G. (View Comment):

    I mostly agree with all of the OP. However, I’m not so sure about men and women being able to be just friends. I think it’s more complicated than that exactly because of the sexual tension. I would look askance at my wife going out to a bar with one of her male friends, just as she would look askance at me going out with a female friend. Is it a matter of trust? Is it a matter of being no better than animals? No, but things happen. I don’t mean that we have no agency and that we’re just victims of nature, but yet things do happen even with the best of intentions. Not just cheating either. But pursuit of being noticed and pursuit of being wanted. Pursuit of getting right up to the edge of illicit because it’s thrilling and satisfying to do so. That alone has consequences and effects beyond just being friends.

    Nor do I mean that people would have attraction for any member of the opposite sex simply because they’re the opposite sex. I’m not attracted to grandma, either my own or anyone else’s. There are exceptions, but that doesn’t completely invalidate the rule. Of course, men and women can be friendly while respecting boundaries, but the fact that there are additional and needed boundaries says something about the ability to be just friends.

    I agree that sexual attraction is not wrong, and that attraction does not equal desire at any cost (e.g. rape). I also agree that modern progressives have pretty much all facets of intersex relations wrong. We can be in tension while still working together and respecting one another and even having genuine friendly affection for one another.

    I like this so much. 

    Traditions based on men and women being different not only had to be destroyed, but now we mustn’t believe that men and women are different in any way (except that men are evil and women are good). 

    • #16
  17. TBA Coolidge
    TBA
    @RobtGilsdorf

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13: He can just keep on swiping righ

    Swiping right?

    I’m more concerned about the thieving left. 

    • #17
  18. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Thanks for writing this excellent post, @johnniealum13! You saved me the trouble!

    • #18
  19. Nanda Panjandrum Member
    Nanda Panjandrum
    @

    CB Toder aka Mama Toad (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13: They want to destroy men.

    They also want to destroy women.

    Good women and good men need each other.

    We are complementary!

    I love and need men. I love to rely on men. I love to trust men. Men need women. Men need to rely on women. Men need to trust women.

    When men and women think that the other sex is the enemy, both are destroyed.

    There is no natural state of enmity when it comes to men and women, that is the great lie that they want you to believe. We need each other.

    In a word: complementarity

    • #19
  20. Fritz Coolidge
    Fritz
    @Fritz

    @CB Toder aka Mama Toad (View Comment):

    Johnnie Alum 13: They want to destroy men.

    They also want to destroy women.

    Good women and good men need each other.

    We are complementary!

    I love and need men. I love to rely on men. I love to trust men. Men need women. Men need to rely on women. Men need to trust women.

    When men and women think that the other sex is the enemy, both are destroyed.

    There is no natural state of enmity when it comes to men and women, that is the great lie that they want you to believe. We need each other.

    Re the bolded: All part of the Left’s vision of “everything for the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state.”

    • #20
  21. Ed G. Member
    Ed G.
    @EdG

    Boss Mongo (View Comment):

    I like women. I women in all shapes, sizes, ages, and appearances.

    So I don’t (at the high school football games or social gatherings or running into friends at the grocery store) hug, kiss or get familiar with members of the fairer sex. First, because it’s inappropriate for a married man to do so (IMHO). Also, because if I’m hugging a female, I’m pretty much automatically thinking about bumping uglies with her. Inappropriate.

    I knew I wasn’t the only one, but sometimes it feels that way. I don’t want to be rude or aloof, but it’s just better and more appropriate for all involved this way. All shapes, ages, sizes and appearances? Yes sir! And contrary what some might say, that isn’t due to low standards or uncontrolled libido. I dig chicks, and there is something to dig in just about everybody unless they’re determined to make themselves into an exception. Pretty face, nice ankles, undefinable magnetism, shapely hips, open personality, motherhood, etc. Perfection is rare to non-existent (except for my wife) and unnecessary. It’s funny how women don’t realize that so often.

    • #21
  22. Randy Webster Member
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Fritz (View Comment):
    Re the bolded: All part of the Left’s vision of “everything for the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state.”

    I think that was Mussolini’s philosophy.

    • #22
  23. Boss Mongo Member
    Boss Mongo
    @BossMongo

    Ed G. (View Comment):
    Perfection is rare to non-existent (except for my wife)

    Well done, sir.

    • #23
  24. Ontheleftcoast Member
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Ed G. (View Comment):
    All shapes, ages, sizes and appearances?

    Anorexic, no. The upper end of Rubensesque, sure. Morbidly obese, not so much. Steroid using female body builders? No.

    But otherwise? As I’ve gotten older, the ceiling for what looks attractive has gone up much faster than the floor, to the point where I winced when I read some guy’s account of being at the beach with his family and enjoying looking at the bodies on a group of females in the distance… until he realized it was his daughter and her friends. I don’t have daughters, but I have friends who do.

    Custody of the eyes, as our Catholic friends put it, is a useful discipline.

    But I still love what Heinlein wrote:

    Anybody can look at a pretty girl and see a pretty girl. An artist can look at a pretty girl and see the old woman she will become. A better artist can look at an old woman and see the pretty girl that she used to be. But a great artist – a master – and that is what Auguste Rodin was – can look at an old woman, portray her exactly as she is…and force the viewer to see the pretty girl she used to be…and more than that, he can make anyone with the sensitivity of an armadillo, or even you, see that this lovely young girl is still alive, not old and ugly at all, but simply imprisoned inside her ruined body. He can make you feel the quiet, endless tragedy that there was never a girl born who ever grew older than eighteen in her heart…no matter what the merciless hours have done to her.

    • #24
  25. GrannyDude Member
    GrannyDude
    @GrannyDude

    TBA (View Comment):
    I’m not attracted to grandma, either my own or anyone else’s

    exactly the reason Im going for the granny vibe-gray hair, plump, apple cheeks and pie, a slight scent of ben gay and vanilla…

    • #25
  26. CB Toder aka Mama Toad Member
    CB Toder aka Mama Toad
    @CBToderakaMamaToad

    Jean Nate’ was my nana’s smell…

    • #26
  27. The (apathetic) King Prawn Inactive
    The (apathetic) King Prawn
    @TheKingPrawn

    Ed G. (View Comment):

    Boss Mongo (View Comment):

    I like women. I women in all shapes, sizes, ages, and appearances.

    So I don’t (at the high school football games or social gatherings or running into friends at the grocery store) hug, kiss or get familiar with members of the fairer sex. First, because it’s inappropriate for a married man to do so (IMHO). Also, because if I’m hugging a female, I’m pretty much automatically thinking about bumping uglies with her. Inappropriate.

    I knew I wasn’t the only one, but sometimes it feels that way. I don’t want to be rude or aloof, but it’s just better and more appropriate for all involved this way. All shapes, ages, sizes and appearances? Yes sir! And contrary what some might say, that isn’t due to low standards or uncontrolled libido. I dig chicks, and there is something to dig in just about everybody unless they’re determined to make themselves into an exception. Pretty face, nice ankles, undefinable magnetism, shapely hips, open personality, motherhood, etc. Perfection is rare to non-existent (except for my wife) and unnecessary. It’s funny how women don’t realize that so often.

    100% agree. I get weird looks when I say that every woman is beautiful in her own way. I suppose it would make more sense if I put in the caveat about those who determine to except themselves from beauty. 

    • #27
  28. The (apathetic) King Prawn Inactive
    The (apathetic) King Prawn
    @TheKingPrawn

    This is a great spot for my conspiracy theory understanding of the left. More than anything else the left wants abortion to be the sine qua non of the sexual revolution. I think this is because with abortion it gives women absolute agency over the results of sex. They desire this above all other things because they believe (even without knowing they believe it) that women have absolutely zero agency in the act of sex. They do not understand either men or women. They think men are slaves to their passions and women become slaves to the men enslaved to their passions, hence all sex is essentially rape. If women have no choice to have sex then they at least deserve the choice over the outcomes of sex. They’d never say these things, but if one were to dig and question deeply enough he might find this to be true (or very close to true.)

    • #28
  29. CB Toder aka Mama Toad Member
    CB Toder aka Mama Toad
    @CBToderakaMamaToad

    The (apathetic) King Prawn (View Comment):
    I suppose it would make more sense if I put in the caveat about those who determine to except themselves from beauty. 

    I think you should keep it as it is, even if it is a hidden beauty which only the Lord can see.

    I love the short story “Franny and Zooey,” in which a brother tells his sister, who may be succumbing to despair over the suffering in the world:

    “I remember about the fifth time I ever went on ‘Wise Child’ [a radio quiz show]. I subbed for Walt [a brother] a few times when he was in a cast–remember when he was in that cast? Anyway, I started bitching one night before the broadcast. Seymour [their oldest brother]’d told me to shine my shoes just as I was going out the door with Walker [Walt’s twin]. I was furious. The studio audience were all morons, the announcer was a moron, the sponsors were morons, and just damn well wasn’t going to shine my shoes for them, I told Seymour. I said they couldn’t see them anyway, where we sat. He said to shine them anyway. He said to shine them for the Fat Lady. I didn’t know what the hell he was talking about, but he had a very Seymour look on his face, and so I did it. He never did tell me who the Fat Lady was, but I shined my shoes for the Fat Lady every time I went on the air again–all the years you and I were on the program together, if you remember. I don’t think I missed more than just a couple of times. This terribly clear, clear picture of the Fat Lady formed in my mind. I had her sitting on this porch all day, swatting flies, with her radio going full-blast from morning till night. I figured the heat was terrible, and she probably had cancer, and–I don’t know. Anyway, it seemed goddam clear why Seymour wanted me to shine my shoes when I went on the air. It made sense.

    Franny was standing. She had taken her hand away from her face to hold the phone with her two hands. “He told me, too,” she said into the phone. “He told me to be funny for the Fat Lady, once.”….

    “….Let me tell you something now, buddy. . . . Are you listening?… There isn’t anyone anywhere who isn’t Seymour’s Fat Lady. Don’t you know that? Don’t you know that? Don’t you know that goddam secret yet? And don’t you know–listen to me now–don’t you know who that Fat Lady really is?. . . . Ah, buddy. Ah, buddy. It’s Christ Himself. Christ Himself, buddy.”

    For joy, apparently, it was all Franny could do to hold the phone, even with both hands.

    from the last eight paragraphs of “Franny and Zooey” by JD Salinger

    • #29
  30. CB Toder aka Mama Toad Member
    CB Toder aka Mama Toad
    @CBToderakaMamaToad

    The (apathetic) King Prawn (View Comment):
    I think this is because with abortion it gives women absolute agency over the results of sex.

    It may seem that way, but that is not really true.

    In many abortions, the woman is pressured to abort for the man.

    Abortion destroys love and trust between a man and a woman, and the love and trust their offspring should have in their parents.

    It is one of the ultimate evils, and its worst fruit is the distrust and hatred sown between men and women who have shared the act of love.

    Edit: Here’s stats from Guttmacher on reasons for abortion

    • #30

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