First Principles: Why Are You Okay With This?

 

In another thread, the subject of John Edwards’ affair with Rielle Hunter came up. I said (I’ll admit, rather snarkily), that I suppose Edwards’ big mistake was having an affair with a staffer instead of a pornstar and not paying her hush money. If he had done that, then he would’ve gotten a pass from everybody.

But it does mystify me as to why the revelation of Donald Trump’s affair with a porn star, and then him paying her six figures in hush money a month before the election, is met with shrugs from conservatives.

Let me clarify something, I don’t care about “the media.” That progressives scream about such and such is of no interest to me. What is said on MSNBC is irrelevant to me.  

I’ve spent 20 years listening to conservatives talk about Bill Clinton’s womanizing and what it said about his character and him as a man. I heard John Edwards excoriated for his affair with Rielle Hunter for the same reason. I thought they had a point.

What makes Donald Trump different? Why is this met with shrugs from his supporters?

I’ll admit I’m mystified. So I pose this question to the Trump supporters here on Ricochet, many of whom I know to be good and decent people:  

State your general principle: What made what John Edwards did wrong but makes Donald Trump only shrug-worthy?

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  1. Mike H Inactive
    Mike H
    @MikeH

    This should lead to a productive discussion…

    • #1
  2. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    Fred Cole: State your general principle: What made what John Edwards did wrong but makes Donald Trump only shrug-worthy?

    It wasn’t Edwards’ money. It came from a supporter in such a way as to not show up as a campaign contribution or a gift.

    Though I’m probably disqualified from answering, as I make no apologies for the Donald. He is what he is.

    • #2
  3. Mark Wilson Inactive
    Mark Wilson
    @MarkWilson

    Fred Cole:I’ve spent 20 years listening to conservatives talk about Bill Clinton’s womanizing and what it said about his character and him as a man. I heard John Edwards excoriated for his affair with Rielle Hunter for the same reason. I thought they had a point.

    What makes Donald Trump different? Why is this met with shrugs from his supporters?

     

    Sadly it only reveals that principles follow politics, not the other way around, for may public conservatives like Hannity.

    For others, I would guess it’s a result of weighing the pros and cons of President Trump overall, and deciding that he comes out slightly pro.

    • #3
  4. Mike H Inactive
    Mike H
    @MikeH

    Here’s the deal. Principles are well and good and necessary in normal circumstances, all else being equal.

    All else is not equal. If liberals were to win they would destroy the livelihood of conservatives. Also, liberals have benefited from generations of exploiting the double standard and conservatives have been decimated by holding to their principles.

    Trump has an awful personal life, but he’s doing incredible things for the conservative movement and could do much more, but if we turn on him it becomes much less likely we’ll get those wins.

    So we have to suck it up and deal with the fact that he’s done some off color things but nothing compared to what the liberals have been able to get away with over the years… chappaquiddick.

    #IdeologicalTuringTest

    • #4
  5. rico Inactive
    rico
    @rico

    Why are we okay with this?

    I don’t know. Maybe, some of us are okay with this for the same reason you’re okay with this.

    • #5
  6. Kozak Member
    Kozak
    @Kozak

    Fred Cole: State your general principle: What made what John Edwards did wrong but makes Donald Trump only shrug-worthy?

    John Edwards had a long time affair with a staffer, fathered an illegitimate child with her denying his paternity, cheating on his dying wife, while simultaneously parading her around on the campaign trail.

     

    How’s that for starters?

    • #6
  7. E. Kent Golding Moderator
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    I guess because Trump has the right enemies,  and Edwards was our enemy?

    Honestly,  I think Trump is beneath contempt on this, but no one voted for him because he was a sterling character.   Just a tad less tarnished than Hillary.   Jim Webb could have taken him in 2016,  could take him in 2020, and the democrats will never turn to Jim Webb.

    • #7
  8. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    Fred Cole: What made what John Edwards did wrong but makes Donald Trump only shrug-worthy?

    Edwards was a Democrat.

    • #8
  9. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    Mike H (View Comment):
    Here’s the deal. Principles are well and good and necessary in normal circumstances, all else being equal.

    All else is not equal. If liberals were to win they would destroy the livelihood of conservatives. Also, liberals have benefited from generations of exploiting the double standard and conservatives have been decimated by holding to their principles.

    Trump has an awful personal life, but he’s doing incredible things for the conservative movement and could do much more, but if we turn on him it becomes much less likely we’ll get those wins.

    So we have to suck it up and deal with the fact that he’s done some off color things but nothing compared to what the liberals have been able to get away with over the years… chappaquiddick.

    #IdeologicalTuringTest

    He’s got ya there, Fred.

    • #9
  10. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    Kozak (View Comment):

    Fred Cole: State your general principle: What made what John Edwards did wrong but makes Donald Trump only shrug-worthy?

    John Edwards had a long time affair with a staffer, fathered an illegitimate child with her denying his paternity, cheating on his dying wife, while simultaneously parading her around on the campaign trail.

    How’s that for starters?

    He’s got ya there, Fred!

    • #10
  11. RightAngles Member
    RightAngles
    @RightAngles

    The best thing to do is to stop trying to make this matter with regard to Trump. It doesn’t matter. He isn’t a regular politician. He wasn’t one when he did any of the things people are so furiously trying to dig up. Get it through your heads that nothing that is ever dug up about Trump will ever matter. He’s the Dems’ worst nightmare: a Republican who can’t be blackmailed. Because I’m quite sure they have something on every single Republican in Congress. It’s what they do. And now for the first time, it isn’t working.

    And I’m sure nobody is “ok with this.” We just try to see the big picture. My advice is to relax and enjoy the show and try to remember who the real enemy is.

    • #11
  12. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    For my part, my default position on politicians is that they are liars and cheats.  When I find out there is evidence for my pre-conceived notion, well, that’s a nice “I told ya so” moment, and we keep on movin’.

    The problem with your assertion here, Fred, is that it assumes that someone would have voted for Edwards if he hadn’t had the affair and covered it up and whatever, we’d have voted for him over the Old Man.  As if someone how the affairs of Edwards and the Old Man were part of the equation.  As Mike says above, they aren’t.  We are voting based on ideology.

    Now, if you find someone that says Edwards is immoral and Trump is not, then we have a conversation.  But my sense is most Trump supporters are saying “Yeah, so” because at this point, they realize that most politicians are liars and cheats, and looking for the Boy Scout is an exercise in futility.

    • #12
  13. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    RightAngles (View Comment):
    who the real enemy is.

    Ze Germans?

    • #13
  14. drlorentz Member
    drlorentz
    @drlorentz

    Fred Cole: the subject of John Edwards’ affair with Rielle Hunter

    When it comes to such matters, I prefer the Donna Rice/Gary Hart affair of an earlier age because it resulted in better jokes:

    Q: What’s the difference between Donna Rice and Barbara Bush?
    A: Barbara has Bush in her heart; Donna has Hart in her bush.

    Good times, good times.

    • #14
  15. RightAngles Member
    RightAngles
    @RightAngles

    Spin (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):
    who the real enemy is.

    Ze Germans?

    Among others I mean ozzers.

    • #15
  16. Scott Wilmot Member
    Scott Wilmot
    @ScottWilmot

    They both acted immorally and will be judged by God for their trespasses.

    Yet with President Trump, we knew what we were getting, he bragged about this kind of stuff.

    Edwards tried to hide behind a mask.

    Trump didn’t show hypocrisy, Edwards did.

    This is politics, an ugly, dirty business. I don’t condone the behavior of either man, but, with DJT, I know what I’m getting. Well, I guess I know what we are getting from Democrats too – and there is almost nothing that they and I hold in agreement.

    I didn’t vote for a saint, but I must admit that President Trump has surprised me. I will never see a Democrat President address the March for Life.

    • #16
  17. Stina Inactive
    Stina
    @CM

    Spin (View Comment):

    RightAngles (View Comment):
    who the real enemy is.

    Ze Germans?

    That’s so 1940s. Its the Russians, mmm-kay? Slightly less vintage.

    • #17
  18. A-Squared Inactive
    A-Squared
    @ASquared

    Mike H (View Comment):
    Here’s the deal. Principles are well and good and necessary in normal circumstances, all else being equal.

    All else is not equal. If liberals were to win they would destroy the livelihood of conservatives. Also, liberals have benefited from generations of exploiting the double standard and conservatives have been decimated by holding to their principles.

    Trump has an awful personal life, but he’s doing incredible things for the conservative movement and could do much more, but if we turn on him it becomes much less likely we’ll get those wins.

    So we have to suck it up and deal with the fact that he’s done some off color things but nothing compared to what the liberals have been able to get away with over the years… chappaquiddick.

    #IdeologicalTuringTest

    Or, said more succinctly,

    Spin (View Comment):

    Edwards was a Democrat.

     

    FWIW,  Republicans can never again criticize a Democrat for personal moral failures. I think all in, that is a good thing, private lives don’t really impact political performance, I didn’t think they did during Clinton’s Presidency and they don’t now.

    Having said that, you have to laugh at people who spent years being outraged at sex scandals only discover they never really cared about the sex scandals, just the party affiliation of the accused.

    • #18
  19. Sash Member
    Sash
    @Sash

    We are adultery weary.  There is so much, I guess we didn’t know that before.  And if it is everybody then what makes Trump different?

    I assume it was consensual, if it even happened… didn’t Pence say it didn’t happen?

    He saw a woman who gets paid for sex… that is not the same as what Clinton did, or that other guy who I never cared about in the first place…

    I guess we are past believing the President is the moral guide in our personal lives.  We hire them to do a job.

    Obama seemed to be a good family guy, his politics hurt my life… the country hired Trump who is a creep, but he is doing the job fairly well…

     

    • #19
  20. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    A-Squared (View Comment):
    FWIW, Republicans can never again criticize a Democrat for personal moral failures.

    I can.  I didn’t vote for Trump, and I’ve been pretty consistent in my criticism of his character.

    But, your general point is correct.  And why does it matter at this point?  Maybe it is time to get past the notion that the President is some how our moral leader?  And recognize that, yes, character matters, but DC is a cesspool of lies and deceit.

    • #20
  21. Boss Mongo Member
    Boss Mongo
    @BossMongo

    Fred Cole: First Principles: Why Are You Okay With This?

    Because we’re all like a bunch of little Fonzies.  We cool…

    • #21
  22. Spin Inactive
    Spin
    @Spin

    Sash (View Comment):
    Obama seemed to be a good family guy,

    By all accounts Obama is a decent human being in his personal life.  But you are right, his politics were bad.  Well…except for that stopping the seas from rising thing.  You have to admit that was a pretty darned good trick!

    • #22
  23. A-Squared Inactive
    A-Squared
    @ASquared

    Spin (View Comment):

    A-Squared (View Comment):
    FWIW, Republicans can never again criticize a Democrat for personal moral failures.

    I can. I didn’t vote for Trump, and I’ve been pretty consistent in my criticism of his character.

    But, your general point is correct. And why does it matter at this point? Maybe it is time to get past the notion that the President is some how our moral leader? And recognize that, yes, character matters, but DC is a cesspool of lies and deceit.

    FWIW, that’s why I used the word “Republican”and not “conservative”

    Of course several self-described “conservatives” have told me on here that there is no room for me in Republican party because I was not sufficiently enthusiastic about whatever social conservative topic they were focused on that day; and as best I recall, every one of those members was an enthusiastic Trump supporter.

    • #23
  24. Rodin Member
    Rodin
    @Rodin

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    • #24
  25. drlorentz Member
    drlorentz
    @drlorentz

    A-Squared (View Comment):
    Having said that, you have to laugh at people who spent years being outraged at sex scandals only discover they never really cared about the sex scandals, just the party affiliation of the accused.

    Times change. Jack Kennedy used to chase skirt around the White House. Ike had a long-term affair with his aide. The press kept those quiet. Those were also the days that Rob and Laura Petrie slept in separate twin beds.

    Flash forward to the 1990s. Bill Clinton is putting his cigars into wherever and oral sex is being discussed on the nightly news. Marion Berry is re-elected as mayor of D.C. after his hookers and blow conviction. And that was almost a quarter of a century ago.

    It’s time to get over it and move on to the issue that’s captivating America today. I refer, of course, to legalized weed.

    • #25
  26. DocJay Inactive
    DocJay
    @DocJay

    All the winning.  So much of it.

    • #26
  27. Bigfoot Inactive
    Bigfoot
    @Bigfoot

    Has the Trump affair and payment of hush money been verified?

    (Serious question)

    • #27
  28. DocJay Inactive
    DocJay
    @DocJay

    Past issue by 10 yr. in Don plus his own cash vs Johnny boy active during campaign and other’s money plus his dying wife.

    No excuse for Don.  He doesn’t live rent free in my head

    Except all this winning   My God the winning

     

    • #28
  29. rico Inactive
    rico
    @rico

    Bigfoot (View Comment):
    Has the Trump affair and payment of hush money been verified?

    (Serious question)

    I must say, you certainly look sincere.

    • #29
  30. FightinInPhilly Coolidge
    FightinInPhilly
    @FightinInPhilly

    My response is- who said I’m ok with it? Does anyone say it’s a good thing? I’d frankly be surprised if Trump hadn’t paid hush money to a porn star. He’s not a good guy.

    But having said that, what would you have me do? If everyone marches in the streets and we hobble Trump, lose the house, lose the Senate, do we get points ? Doover election? Do we get to advance our ideals? If not, I think I’ll simply make no comment and move on.

    • #30
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