Vatican Honors Pro-Abortion Activist?

 

Did the pope honor a vehemently pro-abortion activist, Netherlands minister Lilianne Ploumen, with the title of Commander in the Pontifical Equestrian Order of St. Gregory the Great? Reports on various blogs, including a short video clip, flabbergastingly suggest just that. If any Ricochetti speak Dutch, can you verify whether these blogs’ translations of this video are accurate? The medal itself looks strikingly similar to the genuine article if it is not real.

In this era of legitimately fraudulent “news” (as distinguished from frequent media misrepresentations, a la President Trump’s “fake news”), it is hard to immediately believe this report. Then again, Francis’s pontificate has been anything but believable.

The Order of St. Gregory is not reserved for saints or even Catholics (Roy Disney received it, as did Jimmy Savile, though before news broke of his horrible crimes), but it is nominally given to those who are “deemed worthy to be honored by a public expression of esteem on the part of a Holy See.” G.K. Chesterton and Alice von Hildebrand are members of this Order.

It is difficult to see how Ms. Ploumen — whose organization raised over $300 million for contraception and abortion programs in 2017 in response to President Trump’s admirable reinstatement of the Mexico City Policy — could ever be in the esteem of any pope. She did, however, meet with Francis at a “climate change” conference at the Vatican in 2015.

If true, as it seems to be, this is yet another kick in the stomach for many of us who have been horrified by the dark clouds gathering over Rome during the Francis pontificate. This pope seems most devoted to rewarding causes that subvert the Catholic Church itself.

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There are 23 comments.

  1. contrarian Member

    I found 3 other sites with the story, but no news sites so far.

    • #1
    • January 13, 2018, at 2:43 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  2. Western Chauvinist Member

    This sort of news makes me hope Pope Francis is spectacularly, maliciously ill-informed by his advisers…

    Mother Mary, ora pro nobis.

    • #2
    • January 13, 2018, at 2:48 PM PDT
    • 4 likes
  3. Old Bathos Member

    The Church suffered badly but survived the political ambitions of Julius II and the overt corruption of Borgia popes and anti-popes.

    The current pope has installed wall-to-wall ideologues who will happily surrender Christendom to leftist proclivities du jour. Francis is a disgrace and the damage will be lasting.

    For example, his rambling, sophomoric environmentalist encyclical reflected the fact that for technical guidance he and his idiot advisors turned to figures associated with the Potsdam Institute, the last refuge for members of the “population bomb” cult, rabid haters of human reproduction and extreme Climate Doomsters.

    It’s bad.

    • #3
    • January 13, 2018, at 4:52 PM PDT
    • 5 likes
  4. ConnorDadoo Inactive

    He is not my pope. I believe we may be one scandal away from some great reform from the laity, because it does not seem possible for it to come from the clergy.

    • #4
    • January 13, 2018, at 5:17 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  5. Scott Wilmot Member

    Her alleged quote, “My parents were Catholic. I am also a Catholic, but differently”, seems to fit well with the Francis papacy.

    This is totally believable. He seems to love these lefties. His interviews with the atheist Scalfari are legendary. And Pope Francis has praised Emma Bonino, an Italian leftist who boasts of having performed over 10,000 illegal abortions as one of the greats on the political scene.

    But this is all part of the “new paradigm” of Amoris Laetitia that Vatican Secretary of State Cardinal Parolin speaks of. We need a new spirit, a new approach don’t ya know.

    The paradigm is so new and so spirit filled that the Holy Father’s most recent appointment to the Pontifical Academy for Life (only Francis can turn this academy into an oxymoron), Fr. Maurizio Chiodi has said that there are “circumstances — I refer to Amoris Laetitia, Chapter 8 — that precisely for the sake of responsibility, require contraception.” (Would you be surprised that this occurred at a talk at the Pontifical Gregorian University in Rome. Those tricksy Jesuits just love discernment.) Good job Father, you have undermined Humanae Vitae, Familiaris Consortio, and Veritatis Splendor all at once.

    Louis Beckett: This pope seems most devoted to rewarding causes that subvert the Catholic Church itself.

    Indeed.

    • #5
    • January 14, 2018, at 4:14 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  6. Louis Beckett Contributor
    Louis Beckett Post author

    @scottwilmot, @connordadoo, @oldbathos — what’s the sense of this among your pastors or bishops?

    • #6
    • January 14, 2018, at 3:35 PM PDT
    • Like
  7. Scott Wilmot Member

    Louis Beckett (View Comment):
    what’s the sense of this among your pastors or bishops?

    I am new to a small parish here in Buffalo, TX, in the diocese of Tyler. My priest is a dynamic, young, orthodox priest. He has not preached on AL or any of the other nonsense of this pontificate, but I am 99% sure that he would side with the Kazak bishops in their profession of the immutable truths about sacramental marriage. He does not put up with scandalous behavior. As for my bishop, I have never met him and only see the usual pablum about how we are to read AL in light of previous magisterial documents. As far as I know, and as I wrote here, he is one of those bishops who remain mute on these scandalous issues.

    • #7
    • January 14, 2018, at 4:24 PM PDT
    • Like
  8. Old Bathos Member

    Louis Beckett (View Comment):
    @scottwilmot, @connordadoo, @oldbathos — what’s the sense of this among your pastors or bishops?

    Silence or mental gymnastics to pretend there are no issues.

    • #8
    • January 14, 2018, at 5:29 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  9. contrarian Member
    Too long to fit in one comment. Part 1 of 2

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    Louis Beckett (View Comment):
    what’s the sense of this among your pastors or bishops?

    My priest is a dynamic, young, orthodox priest. He has not preached on AL or any of the other nonsense of this pontificate, but I am 99% sure that he would side with the Kazak bishops in their profession of the immutable truths about sacramental marriage.

    Did anyone ask their pastor to look into this story- find out if it’s true?

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):
    Her alleged quote, “My parents were Catholic. I am also a Catholic, but differently”, seems to fit well with the Francis papacy.

    This is totally believable. He seems to love these lefties. His interviews with the atheist Scalfari are legendary.

    Hey now, the fact that someone is an atheist is no reason not to be friendly with them. I’m an atheist.

    And Pope Francis has praised Emma Bonino, an Italian leftist who boasts of having performed over 10,000 illegal abortions as one of the greats on the political scene.

    Okay, that is completely different. It’s disgusting like calling Stalin a great humanitarian. Was there backlash over his saying this?

    But this is all part of the “new paradigm” of Amoris Laetitia that Vatican Secretary of State Cardinal Parolin speaks of. We need a new spirit, a new approach don’t ya know.

    I’ve never heard of this AL before. My only Latin is from a course in the etymology of English – Love of Happiness? Is it an encyclical?

    “Proponents of such a change refer to Amoris Laetitia‘s stress on the objective relevance of extenuating circumstances, the subjective conscience and discernment to allow some divorced and civilly remarried Catholics to receive Holy Communion and apply it to allowing use of artificial contraception in some cases.” excerpt of ‘Cardinal Parolin: Amoris Laetitia Represents New Paradigm, Spirit and Approach’ by Edward Pentin @ NCR

    That doesn’t sound so bad to me. I’m coming at this from a different perspective. The church’s positions on contraception, gay marriage, divorce, etc. are an internal matter. You guys work that out amongst yourselves.

    I don’t hold with those atheists who say a church’s views on such things demand confrontation. As long as people aren’t being compelled to belong to a church, it’s none of my business. Of course, there are parts of the world where belonging to a particular religion isn’t optional. I believe every right-thinking person should oppose that.

    I just think that when the Mahers of the world say that this shows religion to be problematic that they’re being stupid: it just shows that governments shouldn’t be in the business of trying to control belief. Government definitely has a role to fulfill in terms of limiting our behavior for the good of society. It has no similar role (IMHO anyway) in terms of our beliefs.

    • #9
    • January 15, 2018, at 11:32 AM PDT
    • Like
  10. contrarian Member
    Too long to fit in one comment. Part 2 of 2

    I am not concerned about AL, but I am worried about Francis portraying pro-choice politicians as morally acceptable or even laudable! He seems to be prioritizing quality of life issues over issues that are life and death. I don’t understand the theology involved, but from the point of view of secular moral philosophy, I don’t think it’s that complicated: that’s just wrong.

    As a secular pro-lifer, we’ve been trying to focus on making common cause (sometimes uneasily) with people whom we disagree on myriad issues. The institution of the Catholic church has always been a dependable ally. I’m sad to think those days are numbered.

    Francis seems to be emulating ‘pro-life Democrats’ (who were great in the era of Gov. Casey, but have been mostly useless in the era Sen. Casey) who say that abortion is something that we should teach is immoral and try to win hearts and minds as individuals, but they’re not going to pursue government action to prohibit it. There was a chance for a historic victory in Spain. Francis chose not to get involved. He seems uninterested in the Eighth Amendment referendum as well. Yet he’s not doing this because he’s apolitical. He’s inserting himself into the three issues he thinks deserve it.

    Things aren’t moving in a positive direction. I don’t want to rub people the wrong way here. You’re clearly devout if you’re following this AL thing (my 1st thought: Alabama?), but maybe we should all agree to try to do more disentangle the pro-life movement from religious institutions. There’s an organizational benefit to the status quo, but I’ve long thought that how closely the movement is identified with religion is a net negative if you look at how it affects public opinion.

    The left hates the label ‘pro-life.’ It’s banned in all the media style books. NPR was the last to fall, after the Obamacare debates. I’ve been arguing for a rebranding to ‘prenatal human rights’ for years. It’s getting some traction in the secular pro-life community. There are a few major exceptions, but the left often makes better use of language- effectively reframing a debate to give them a major advantage in public opinion. ‘Pro-life’ was powerful once, but it’s taken a real beating and isn’t as effective as it once was.

    • “Shouldn’t we all be pro-life?” – Was clever framing and frustrated the opposition in the past, but the label faces a virtual blackout in the MSM and the opposition has confused the issue by talking about capital punishment, pacifism etc. and tarnished it by associating it in the public mind with child sex scandals and the bigotry of Westboro-types.
    • “Why are you opposed to prenatal human rights?” – I think that packs more of a punch today.
    • #10
    • January 15, 2018, at 12:28 PM PDT
    • Like
  11. Western Chauvinist Member

    contrarian (View Comment):
    As a secular pro-lifer, we’ve been trying to focus on making common cause (sometimes uneasily) with people whom we disagree on myriad issues. The institution of the Catholic church has always been a dependable ally. I’m sad to think those days are numbered.

    Nah, Catholics will always be pro-life (pre-natal human rights if you prefer). It’s Pope Francis’s days that are numbered.

    • #11
    • January 15, 2018, at 1:12 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  12. Scott Wilmot Member

    contrarian (View Comment):
    Did anyone ask their pastor to look into this story- find out if it’s true?

    Most pastors are too busy to research this. And anyways, it is the job of the lay faithful to report on this and I haven’t seen any refutation of the story.

    contrarian (View Comment):
    Hey now, the fact that someone is an atheist is no reason not to be friendly with them. I’m an atheist.

    I have no problem with their friendship, I just wish Pope Francis would be an orthodox Catholic in his presence.

    contrarian (View Comment):
    I’ve never heard of this AL before. My only Latin is from a course in the etymology of English – Love of Happiness? Is it an encyclical?

    “The Joy of Love”. It is a post-synodal apostolic exhortation. It followed from an extraordinary and ordinary synod on the family. The controversy stems from its apparent rejection of absolute moral truths and how it deals with Holy Communion for adulterers (who are commonly called “divorced and remarried – an impossibility in the Church). You can search my blog for info if you are curious – I have written many posts on AL.

    contrarian (View Comment):
    The church’s positions on contraception, gay marriage, divorce, etc. are an internal matter.

    I disagree strongly with this statement. The Church is an expert in humanity and Her positions are based in truth. They are not true because they are Catholic, they are Catholic because they are true.

    • #12
    • January 15, 2018, at 4:35 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  13. Scott Wilmot Member

    contrarian (View Comment):
    I don’t want to rub people the wrong way here.

    You are not. You bring up some interesting points. And I am happy to join you as a pro-lifer, even if you think that label has lost it’s clout.

    • #13
    • January 15, 2018, at 4:52 PM PDT
    • Like
  14. Western Chauvinist Member

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    contrarian (View Comment):
    I don’t want to rub people the wrong way here.

    You are not. You bring up some interesting points. And I am happy to join you as a pro-lifer, even if you think that label has lost it’s clout.

    Agreed. I would only caution that you don’t understand much about Catholicism, @contrarian, and therefore might try to avoid pronouncements about losing the Church as a pro-life ally, for example. Outsiders tend to get wrong the role of the pope and credit him with way more influence (over doctrine) than he actually has. He’s mostly supposed to referee in the case of disputes — not cause them. Pope Francis may be a lovely man, but he is bad at his job. We need a (future) saint with the courage to tell him, a la Saint Catherine of Siena.

    • #14
    • January 15, 2018, at 5:10 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  15. Scott Wilmot Member

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):
    We need a (future) saint with the courage to tell him, a la Saint Catherine of Siena.

    I nominate you.

    • #15
    • January 16, 2018, at 3:43 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  16. Scott Wilmot Member

    Vatican: Papal Honor for Pro-Abortion Politician Not a Sign of Support

    The Holy See Press Office says Dutch militant pro-abortion politician Lilianne Ploumen was given the ancient papal honor as ‘diplomatic practice’ for a visiting official head of state delegation to the Vatican.

    In response to a question on whether the Vatican could confirm the honor and, if so, why Ploumen received it, Garcia said:

    “The honor of the Pontifical Order of St. Gregory the Great received by Mrs. Lilianne Ploumen, former Minister of Development, in June 2017 during the visit of the Dutch Royals to the Holy Father, responds to the diplomatic practice of the exchange of honors between delegations on the occasion of official visits by Heads of State or Government in the Vatican.

    Therefore, it is not in the slightest a placet [an expression of assent] to the politics in favor of abortion and of birth control that Mrs Ploumen promotes.”

    Sheesh, maybe so, but it took them a while to come up with this story.

    Memo to Vatican: Wouldn’t it be better to hand out rosaries blessed by the Pope?

    • #16
    • January 16, 2018, at 3:48 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  17. Scott Wilmot Member

    Fr. Z asked me to share his take on this scandal.

    Two seriously ugly signs of the times involving papal honors and the silencing of bells

    The press office statement says that this award was part of a routine exchange of honors for diplomatic purposes during a state visit. Therefore, it has nothing to do with Ploumen’s advocacy of abortion.

    Huh?

    Yes, I’m afraid that it does!

    I know that the Pope himself is not bothered with most of these awards. This is handled in the Secretariat of State. But you’d think that someone in SecState, who knows the situation in Holland, would have said something like, “Ummm.. guys? Maybe we should pick someone who isn’t famous for being pro-abortion? I’m jus’ sayin’.”

    I keep circling back to that video….

    Does this not fit the definition of scandal?

    • #17
    • January 16, 2018, at 5:14 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  18. Western Chauvinist Member

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):
    We need a (future) saint with the courage to tell him, a la Saint Catherine of Siena.

    I nominate you.

    Ha! I’m just at the beginning of my 30 days of Consoling the Heart of Jesus. Give me a month. ;-)

    • #18
    • January 16, 2018, at 5:39 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  19. Scott Wilmot Member

    When can we have a Vatican run by grown-ups?

    • #19
    • January 17, 2018, at 10:37 AM PDT
    • Like
  20. contrarian Member

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    It is a post-synodal apostolic exhortation.

    That would have been my next guess – LOL

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    contrarian (View Comment):
    The church’s positions on contraception, gay marriage, divorce, etc. are an internal matter.

    I disagree strongly with this statement. The Church is an expert in humanity and Her positions are based in truth. They are not true because they are Catholic, they are Catholic because they are true.

    Let me try phrasing my point differently. What positions the church espouses are a matter of concern for those who belong to the church, but I see no reason why it should concern those who aren’t members. It’s none of their business.

    If you believe that the positions which the church takes reflect universal truths, and on that basis you want to alter laws & affect policy, then that’s a whole other matter. That automatically makes it everyone’s business. It seems to me though, that if one sincerely believes that a proposition is a universal truth, then we ought to be able to debate the proposition and whether it justifies state action without religion ever entering the conversation.

    Whether one believes in the teachings of Christ or of the Buddha or just enlightenment philosophy, surely we can all equally well recognize something that is a genuine unversal truth.

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):

    contrarian (View Comment):
    I don’t want to rub people the wrong way here.

    You are not. You bring up some interesting points. And I am happy to join you as a pro-lifer, even if you think that label has lost it’s clout.

    Agreed.

    Yay!

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    I would only caution that you don’t understand much about Catholicism, @contrarian, and therefore might try to avoid pronouncements about losing the Church as a pro-life ally, for example.

    You may be right. Altough, I was refering just to the church as an institution and not the mrmbers of the church. Perhaps I’m wrong but I thought that the Pope had a lot of power over what priests, nuns, and bishops are allowed to write & publish and that he could prevent them taking part in public contrpversies if he saw fit to do so. Is that not so?

    Scott Wilmot (View Comment):
    Memo to Vatican: Wouldn’t it be better to hand out rosaries blessed by the Pope?

    Or a poster of the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel from the gift shop. Unlike the rosary, she might actually use the poster for its intended purpose.

    • #20
    • January 20, 2018, at 2:17 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  21. contrarian Member

    PS: Here’s buddy of mine at the march yesterday reading a poem she wrote.

    • #21
    • January 20, 2018, at 2:18 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  22. Western Chauvinist Member

    contrarian (View Comment):
    Perhaps I’m wrong but I thought that the Pope had a lot of power over what priests, nuns, and bishops are allowed to write & publish and that he could prevent them taking part in public contrpversies if he saw fit to do so. Is that not so?

    Read more @scottwilmot at Ricochet.com.

    Not so. Paul corrected Peter back in the early Church. That wasn’t the last time clergy and religious took on the pope. The Church, as an institution, is committed to the Truth as revealed in Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition — not as controversially (and sometimes falsely, in this case) pronounced by the pope. He us under the obligation to adhere to the Deposit of Faith.

    • #22
    • January 20, 2018, at 8:56 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  23. Western Chauvinist Member

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    contrarian (View Comment):
    Perhaps I’m wrong but I thought that the Pope had a lot of power over what priests, nuns, and bishops are allowed to write & publish and that he could prevent them taking part in public contrpversies if he saw fit to do so. Is that not so?

    Read more @scottwilmot at Ricochet.com.

    Not so. Paul corrected Peter back in the early Church. That wasn’t the last time clergy and religious took on the pope. The Church, as an institution, is committed to the Truth as revealed in Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition — not as controversially (and sometimes falsely, in this case) pronounced by the pope. He us under the obligation to adhere to the Deposit of Faith.

    Further, think about it. If the Church’s teachings were at the whim of the pope, would it have lasted 2,000 years? Unlikely.

    • #23
    • January 20, 2018, at 8:57 AM PDT
    • 1 like