Trusting the Braintrust

 

What have they been thinking? Given the latest revelations about Peter Strzok, his lover Lisa Page, Andrew McCabe, Bruce Ohr and his wife — how is it possible that Comey and then Mueller weren’t aware of their attitudes and agenda? Either these characters were so skilled at pulling the wool over their supervisors’ eyes, or their supervisors were incredibly naive, or their supervisors knew exactly what they were doing. Any of those scenarios is alarming. The House Intelligence and Judiciary Committees need answers and they need to hold the DoJ and the FBI in contempt if they don’t get them. The spotlight on corruption, collusion and obstruction of justice is pointed in the wrong direction and that was the original intent of the embedded Clinton operatives involved.

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There are 26 comments.

  1. Rodin Member

    I try to restrain my paranoia, but the DC scene is making it difficult. There really needs to be a concerted effort if not to shrink government to at least disperse it. “Critical mass” is just that.

    • #1
    • December 15, 2017, at 1:27 PM PDT
    • 11 likes
  2. EJHill Podcaster

    As I said in my main feed post, I don’t want to come across like some conspiracy nut, but that one text about the “insurance policy” bothers me.

    Jimmy Carter’s pollster, Pat Cadell, has been saying for some time that he believes we are in a “pre-revolutionary” period. Many have scoffed but I’m starting to believe he’s on to something.

    • #2
    • December 15, 2017, at 2:08 PM PDT
    • 9 likes
  3. Brian Watt Member
    Brian Watt Post author

    EJHill (View Comment):
    As I said in my main feed post, I don’t want to come across like some conspiracy nut, but that one text about the “insurance policy” bothers me.

    Jimmy Carter’s pollster, Pat Cadell, has been saying for some time that he believes we are in a “pre-revolutionary” period. Many have scoffed but I’m starting to believe he’s on to something.

    Yeah, the “insurance policy” remark is highly troubling and (very, very) strongly suggests that McCabe, Strzok and Page (and possibly others…more than likely the happy Ohr couple) were, dare I use the word, colluding to do whatever they could to prevent Trump from being elected.

    • #3
    • December 15, 2017, at 2:37 PM PDT
    • 6 likes
  4. Doug Watt Member

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    EJHill (View Comment):
    As I said in my main feed post, I don’t want to come across like some conspiracy nut, but that one text about the “insurance policy” bothers me.

    Jimmy Carter’s pollster, Pat Cadell, has been saying for some time that he believes we are in a “pre-revolutionary” period. Many have scoffed but I’m starting to believe he’s on to something.

    Yeah, the “insurance policy” remark is highly troubling and (very, very) strongly suggests that McCabe, Strzok and Page (and possibly others…more than likely the happy Ohr couple) were, dare I use the word, colluding to do whatever they could to prevent Trump from being elected.

    Ohr stay in office.

    • #4
    • December 15, 2017, at 2:49 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  5. Boss Mongo Member

    Brian Watt: The spotlight on corruption, collusion and obstruction of justice is pointed in the wrong direction and that was the original intent of the embedded Clinton operatives involved.

    Concur.

    • #5
    • December 15, 2017, at 3:33 PM PDT
    • 3 likes
  6. Larry3435 Member

    If you’re pulling together a team to prosecute the Salem Witch Trials, isn’t Cotton Mather the first guy you hire?

    • #6
    • December 15, 2017, at 4:59 PM PDT
    • 2 likes
  7. Rodin Member

    Larry3435 (View Comment):
    If you’re pulling together a team to prosecute the Salem Witch Trials, isn’t Cotton Mather the first guy you hire?

    • #7
    • December 15, 2017, at 5:20 PM PDT
    • 3 likes
  8. Brian Watt Member
    Brian Watt Post author

    Gregg Jarrett’s take on all this fishiness:

    Such a plot would show that partisans within the FBI and the Justice Department, driven by personal animus and a sense of political righteousness, surreptitiously conspired to subvert electoral democracy itself in our country.

    As of now, we have no proof beyond a reasonable doubt of such a plot. But we have very strong circumstantial evidence.

    And as the philosopher and writer Henry David Thoreau wrote in his journal in 1850: “Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.”

    Newly revealed text messages about the apparent anti-Trump plot are the equivalent of a trout in the milk. It smells fishy.

    • #8
    • December 15, 2017, at 6:59 PM PDT
    • 7 likes
  9. Stad Thatcher

    Brian Watt: . . . their supervisors knew exactly what they were doing.

    This is my bet.

    • #9
    • December 16, 2017, at 6:03 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  10. cdor Member

    This I do not understand. President Trump has complete authority to order the FBI to turn over any documents needed. Jeff Sessions, Trumps AG, also has total authority to do the same. President Trump can walk right over to the FISA court and demand the judge(s) produce the request for warrants and the evidence used to support those requests. In two days we could have all the answers. Why isn’t this being done?

    • #10
    • December 16, 2017, at 6:52 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  11. Bob Thompson Member

    Rodin (View Comment):
    I try to restrain my paranoia, but the DC scene is making it difficult. There really needs to be a concerted effort if not to shrink government to at least disperse it. “Critical mass” is just that.

    For those of us who use the term ‘paranoia’ outside its medical mental state usage, it can simply mean that we see danger in places others don’t. You’re okay.

    • #11
    • December 16, 2017, at 6:53 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  12. cdor Member

    Andrew McCarthy agrees with me…maybe he read this thread???

    From his article in NRO,

    We need to know the answer. President Trump ought to direct his Justice Department and FBI to provide the House Intelligence Committee with the FISA warrant application — any FISA warrant application — in which they relied on information from the Steele dossier in seeking court permission to spy on the Trump campaign. It may well be that they did not rely on the dossier. It is ridiculous, though, that we are still in the dark about this.

    Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/454709/steele-dossier-source-fisa-warrant-against-trump-campaign

    • #12
    • December 16, 2017, at 8:06 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  13. Brian Watt Member
    Brian Watt Post author

    cdor (View Comment):
    This I do not understand. President Trump has complete authority to order the FBI to turn over any documents needed. Jeff Sessions, Trumps AG, also has total authority to do the same. President Trump can walk right over to the FISA court and demand the judge(s) produce the request for warrants and the evidence used to support those requests. In two days we could have all the answers. Why isn’t this being done?

    Well, Andy McCarthy over at NRO suggested last week that Trump may not be ordering the release of the FISA submission because if the Steele dossier was included there may be parts of it that haven’t been discredited and could still be embarrassing to the president, even if they’re not necessarily unlawful. Mr. McCarthy’s piece this morning at NRO is more layered and seems to be backing off of his earlier theory a tad, as it follows the activities of Carter Page who at one time was affiliated with the Trump campaign and suggests that Steele, in his assertions about Page in the dossier, are trumped up…uh…as it were. To quote McCarthy’s article:

    So, when Steele brought this information to the FBI, was he pushing on an open door? Was this then-fresh information the rationale for the decision to seek the warrant? Were its allegations about Page incorporated in the warrant application? These questions are pressing because it appears that Steele’s information about Page is not merely unverified but almost certainly false.

    In addition to relying on his experience in DOJ and FBI investigations and protocols, Mr. McCarthy may or may not also be getting inside information from friends at the agencies (that, of course, would be a teeny conspiracy theory in itself), which as we’ve all come to learn, have been rather leaky vessels in the past few years (just ask James Comey).

    It does become challenging to juggle a plethora of conspiracy theories suffice to say that many of the players involved may have different degrees of pungent fishy stench about them.

    McCarthy’s earlier notion that President Trump may not want certain aspects of the dossier or possible corroborating FBI intelligence reports about him made public still doesn’t doesn’t explain away (or absolve) the very troubling texts, emails and behavior of Strzok, Page, McCabe, the Ohrs, Comey, and others that have come to light.

    FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe will be in a closed door session with the House Intelligence Committee on Tuesday perhaps to explain the discussion he had in the closed door session in his own office at the FBI with agents Strzok and Lisa Page about the ‘insurance policy’. So, we either have to wait for more leaks about what happened in the House Intelligence session and/or see if the IG releases even more damning information about this cast of characters. My guess is that tempers may flare in the closed door session because frustrated Republicans may feel less restrained from venting their outrage at being jerked around by the current senior leadership of the FBI and DOJ.

    • #13
    • December 16, 2017, at 8:24 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  14. Rodin Member

    I wish I knew more about the tactical thinking of Flynn’s lawyers. Evidence is being exposed of unlawfulness on the part of government agents that are foundational to whatever evidence the government possesses of Flynn’s crime. If Flynn were an ordinary (and practiced) criminal he would likely have already had that evidence suppressed and case dismissed. Instead, he has pled guilty and, presumably, is awaiting sentencing.

    What leverage does Mueller have on Flynn that, at least for now, deters him from seeking to have his plea withdrawn? And is that leverage itself lawful? And will that leverage induce honest evidence against others being suspected of crimes? This thing is truly FUBAR.

    • #14
    • December 16, 2017, at 8:25 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  15. Bob Thompson Member

    Were McCabe, Page and Strzok conspiring to use the FBI to go after and remove the duly elected POTUS? Is it treason to conspire to overthrow the elected government?

    • #15
    • December 16, 2017, at 8:39 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  16. Bob Thompson Member

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    EJHill (View Comment):
    As I said in my main feed post, I don’t want to come across like some conspiracy nut, but that one text about the “insurance policy” bothers me.

    Jimmy Carter’s pollster, Pat Cadell, has been saying for some time that he believes we are in a “pre-revolutionary” period. Many have scoffed but I’m starting to believe he’s on to something.

    Yeah, the “insurance policy” remark is highly troubling and (very, very) strongly suggests that McCabe, Strzok and Page (and possibly others…more than likely the happy Ohr couple) were, dare I use the word, colluding to do whatever they could to prevent Trump from being elected.

    I think the ‘insurance policy’ discussion within our top law enforcement agency should get at least as much official attention as a baker discriminating in refusing to bake a wedding cake for a gay couple.

    • #16
    • December 16, 2017, at 8:57 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  17. EJHill Podcaster

    Have we heard from Peter Strzok’s boss, FBI Counterintelligence head Bill Priestap? If not, why not?

    • #17
    • December 16, 2017, at 9:01 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  18. Bob Thompson Member

    EJHill (View Comment):
    Have we heard from Peter Strzok’s boss, FBI Counterintelligence head Bill Priestap? If not, why not?

    I was wondering who this person is since we’ve heard no mention of him. Seems he would possibly be an important Congressional witness.

    • #18
    • December 16, 2017, at 9:14 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  19. DocJay Inactive

    Brian, I see a few reasons for Trump not to follow McCarthy’s path about the FISA disclosure. Although I do want to know asap.

    1. The president doesn’t want to be seen as interfering
    2. Perhaps there’s data damaging to him
    3. The longer the FBI and DOJ have to stew about this with officials breathing down their neck the funnier it gets.
    4. The longer the conspiracy hangs over Mueller’s head the financial dealing attacks of the kids and son-in-law seem silly by comparison.
    • #19
    • December 16, 2017, at 9:20 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  20. DocJay Inactive

    Bobby three sticks can choke on this garbage as far as I’m concerned. His selections for his team have been abhorrent.

    • #20
    • December 16, 2017, at 9:46 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  21. Bob Thompson Member

    I think the weaponization by the FBI of the legal provision making it a felony to lie to the FBI is really dangerous for the people at this stage of our political development, given what is being revealed regarding the willing political statements of those agents working actively on cases involving individuals about whom the agents are making political statements.

    • #21
    • December 16, 2017, at 9:48 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  22. Rodin Member

    DocJay (View Comment):
    Brian, I see a few reasons for Trump not to follow McCarthy’s path about the FISA disclosure. Although I do want to know asap.

    1. The president doesn’t want to be seen as interfering
    2. Perhaps there’s data damaging to him
    3. The longer the FBI and DOJ have to stew about this with officials breathing down their neck the funnier it gets.
    4. The longer the conspiracy hangs over Mueller’s head the financial dealing attacks of the kids and son-in-law seem silly by comparison.

    I am guessing all but #2.

    • #22
    • December 16, 2017, at 10:15 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  23. cdor Member

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    cdor (View Comment):

    Well, Andy McCarthy over at NRO suggested last week that Trump may not be ordering the release of the FISA submission because if the Steele dossier was included there may be parts of it that haven’t been discredited and could still be embarrassing to the president, even if they’re not necessarily unlawful. Mr. McCarthy’s piece this morning at NRO is more layered and seems to be backing off of his earlier theory a tad, as it follows the activities of Carter Page who at one time was affiliated with the Trump campaign and suggests that Steele, in his assertions about Page in the dossier, are trumped up…uh…as it were. To quote McCarthy’s article:

    So, when Steele brought this information to the FBI, was he pushing on an open door? Was this then-fresh information the rationale for the decision to seek the warrant? Were its allegations about Page incorporated in the warrant application? These questions are pressing because it appears that Steele’s information about Page is not merely unverified but almost certainly false.

    In addition to relying on his experience in DOJ and FBI investigations and protocols, Mr. McCarthy may or may not also be getting inside information from friends at the agencies (that, of course, would be a teeny conspiracy theory in itself), which as we’ve all come to learn, have been rather leaky vessels in the past few years (just ask James Comey).

    It does become challenging to juggle a plethora of conspiracy theories suffice to say that many of the players involved may have different degrees of pungent fishy stench about them.

    McCarthy’s earlier notion that President Trump may not want certain aspects of the dossier or possible corroborating FBI intelligence reports about him made public still doesn’t doesn’t explain away (or absolve) the very troubling texts, emails and behavior of Strzok, Page, McCabe, the Ohrs, Comey, and others that have come to light.

    FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe will be in a closed door session with the House Intelligence Committee on Tuesday perhaps to explain the discussion he had in the closed door session in his own office at the FBI with agents Strzok and Lisa Page about the ‘insurance policy’. So, we either have to wait for more leaks about what happened in the House Intelligence session and/or see if the IG releases even more damning information about this cast of characters. My guess is that tempers may flare in the closed door session because frustrated Republicans may feel less restrained from venting their outrage at being jerked around by the current senior leadership of the FBI and DOJ.

    I thought the dossier was already public. This is a simple Google search of Buzzfeed. Are these not the complete dossier?

    • #23
    • December 16, 2017, at 10:43 AM PDT
    • Like
  24. Brian Watt Member
    Brian Watt Post author

    cdor (View Comment):

    Brian Watt (View Comment):

    cdor (View Comment):

    Well, Andy McCarthy over at NRO suggested last week that Trump may not be ordering the release of the FISA submission because if the Steele dossier was included there may be parts of it that haven’t been discredited and could still be embarrassing to the president, even if they’re not necessarily unlawful. Mr. McCarthy’s piece this morning at NRO is more layered and seems to be backing off of his earlier theory a tad, as it follows the activities of Carter Page who at one time was affiliated with the Trump campaign and suggests that Steele, in his assertions about Page in the dossier, are trumped up…uh…as it were. To quote McCarthy’s article:

    So, when Steele brought this information to the FBI, was he pushing on an open door? Was this then-fresh information the rationale for the decision to seek the warrant? Were its allegations about Page incorporated in the warrant application? These questions are pressing because it appears that Steele’s information about Page is not merely unverified but almost certainly false.

    In addition to relying on his experience in DOJ and FBI investigations and protocols, Mr. McCarthy may or may not also be getting inside information from friends at the agencies (that, of course, would be a teeny conspiracy theory in itself), which as we’ve all come to learn, have been rather leaky vessels in the past few years (just ask James Comey).

    It does become challenging to juggle a plethora of conspiracy theories suffice to say that many of the players involved may have different degrees of pungent fishy stench about them.

    McCarthy’s earlier notion that President Trump may not want certain aspects of the dossier or possible corroborating FBI intelligence reports about him made public still doesn’t doesn’t explain away (or absolve) the very troubling texts, emails and behavior of Strzok, Page, McCabe, the Ohrs, Comey, and others that have come to light.

    FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe will be in a closed door session with the House Intelligence Committee on Tuesday perhaps to explain the discussion he had in the closed door session in his own office at the FBI with agents Strzok and Lisa Page about the ‘insurance policy’. So, we either have to wait for more leaks about what happened in the House Intelligence session and/or see if the IG releases even more damning information about this cast of characters. My guess is that tempers may flare in the closed door session because frustrated Republicans may feel less restrained from venting their outrage at being jerked around by the current senior leadership of the FBI and DOJ.

    I thought the dossier was already public. This is a simple Google search of Buzzfeed. Are these not the complete dossier?

    I think McCarthy’s original thesis was that the FBI may have corroborated some portions of the dossier as being accurate and submitted their findings as supplemental information in the FISA submission to surveil (at the time) current or former members of the Trump campaign. This was his speculation that might be preventing President Trump from ordering the release of the FISA submission.

    • #24
    • December 16, 2017, at 11:13 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  25. DocJay Inactive

    I’m trying to find out what day Steele met with Ohr? I know that was during 2016 campaign and that Simpson was met after the election by Ohr.

    • #25
    • December 16, 2017, at 12:30 PM PDT
    • 1 like
  26. Boss Mongo Member

    cdor (View Comment):
    This I do not understand. President Trump has complete authority to order the FBI to turn over any documents needed. Jeff Sessions, Trumps AG, also has total authority to do the same. President Trump can walk right over to the FISA court and demand the judge(s) produce the request for warrants and the evidence used to support those requests. In two days we could have all the answers. Why isn’t this being done?

    Don’t disagree with any previous reasons, but…

    I think there may well be a “keep your powder dry” thing going on, here.

    • #26
    • December 16, 2017, at 4:47 PM PDT
    • Like