Promoted from the Ricochet Member Feed by Editors Created with Sketch. The Irrational Reaction to Trump’s Press Conference Is About Class and White Guilt

 

President Trump, August 15, 2017 (Photo credit: White House Youtube Channel)

The only way to describe the media’s reaction to Trump’s press conference and statements about the events in Charlottesville yesterday is irrational. To understand how irrational the reaction was, just imagine if instead of involving white nationalists and antifa counter protestors the events of last weekend had been a conflict between two rival biker gangs.

Do not change a single event from this weekend but imagine the events being the result of violence at a biker rally. One biker club has its national rally and a rival biker club shows up to protest and disrupt it. During the course of the weekend, a lot of shouting and violence take place. Fights break out on Friday. For reasons yet to be known the local police do nothing to separate the rival gangs and violence and conflict spills over into Saturday. Finally, on Saturday afternoon a member of the first gang runs a car into a crowd of its rival gang injuring nineteen and killing one.

Now ask yourself, would anyone in their right mind claim that only the first biker gang was to blame and everyone is obligated to condemn it? Of course, no one would. There would be national outrage about the problem of biker gangs. The local police would be called to the carpet for not maintaining order. Law enforcement would crack down hard on both gangs and biker rallies in general.

The only reason the media and the nation at large are not having the same reaction it would if Charlottesville involved a fight between biker gangs is because it involved white nationalists. And the media and political class are incapable of having a rational conversation about anything involving white nationalism or white supremacy. The reason for this is that to do so would be to call into question the entire concept of white guilt.

White guilt, like all racial collectivist beliefs, is completely irrational. White guilt is doubly irrational because it embraces the very sort of racial collectivism it claims to reject. It is irrational to say that one person is responsible for the actions of another person just because they share the same color of skin. It is irrational to say that anyone living today is in any way accountable or responsible or has any reason to feel guilty about events that occurred before they were born. The entire concept of collective guilt–be it based on race, class, sex or anything else–is utterly irrational. It represents the worst sort of tribalism, which civilization and rationality seek to end.

White guilt, like all irrational belief systems, is completely antithetical to any form of rational discourse about any of the areas it concerns. Once a believer in an irrational ideology is forced to have a rational discussion about one area of the ideology the entire ideology comes into question. This is why the integration of professional sports did so much toward ending the idea of white racial supremacy. When blacks and whites were not allowed to compete on the same field, whites could hold the irrational belief that whites were inherently superior athletes to blacks. Once Jackie Robinson became a star in the major leagues and Jim Brown became the best football player in the world, whites could no longer hold that belief. They were forced to have a rational conversation based on facts about the relative athletic ability of the two races. And once they did that, they could no longer refuse to question or discuss rationally their views on racial superiority in every other area of life. The entire ideology fell like a house of cards. Within a few decades, white supremacy went from a societal given to a fringe belief.

One of the primary tenants of white guilt is that white nationalism is a unique evil. White guilt necessitates that white nationalism not just be wrong but a unique wrong in the world, worse than communism or any of the sins of other races. If white nationalism isn’t worse than other isms, then whites have no more or less to answer for than any other race or creed and the whole edifice of white guilt collapses. This is of course irrational. White nationalism and belief in white supremacy is evil but no more or less evil than any other form of nationalism or religious or racial supremacy. So no believer in white guilt can have a rational discussion about white nationalism without calling the entire concept of white guilt into question.

Statue of Robert E. Lee (Photo credit: Katherine Welles / Shutterstock.com)

When Donald Trump spoke yesterday, he attempted to force the nation to have an honest and rational conversation about white nationalism and its involvement in the events last weekend. He said two undeniably truthful and rational things about the events this weekend. First, he said that not everyone at the march in Charlottesville was a white nationalist. This is true. The march was a protest against the tearing down of a Robert E. Lee statue. It was organized by white nationalists but 200 or so people attended. It is perfectly rational and truthful to say that not all of them were white nationalists. Some of them, albeit perhaps a small minority, no doubt were there because they wanted to save the statue.

Second, he said that the counter protesters deserve a significant share of the blame for the resulting violence and death. This is also true. The counter-protesters were active willing participants in the violence that occurred. The proof of that is in the photos and accounts of the weekend given in the Virginia ACLU Twitter feed. And as I explained above, had the events in Charlottesville involved any other group but white nationalists everyone involved would be assessed their share of the blame.

To say those things and to try and have a rational and truthful conversation about last weekend is to admit that it is possible for white nationalists, no matter how bad they are, to have been the victims of a wrong–or at least not totally responsible for the events of this weekend. And to do that is to necessarily admit the reality that white nationalists are not uniquely evil or worse than other violent or supremacist groups. Donald Trump’s statements were a direct challenge to the entire concept of collective white guilt.

One of the interesting things about Charlottesville, that no one seems to have noticed, is that an event that was supposed to be about white nationalism and white supremacy was not a race riot. I have not, in any of the pictures and video I have seen of the weekend, seen a single black person. Charlottesville was a conflict almost entirely or maybe entirely between white people. There is a good reason for this. The debate and conflict over white guilt is almost always a conflict between upper class and middle and lower class whites. Black people are nearly always bystanders or props in that conflict.

To understand why you have to understand how white guilt works. You would think the belief in collective white guilt would be an expression of self-loathing, but it is not. When a white person believes in white guilt they are engaging in one of the purest forms of virtue signaling. Since the belief is irrational and has nothing to do with their actions, they are not accepting any real moral responsibility. What they are doing is asserting their moral superiority over other white people who refuse to accept the belief. When a black person asserts collective white guilt, they are doing it to attack white people. When a white person does it, the white person is saying they understand their burden and the horrible sins of their race. In doing that, the white person is showing their moral superiority over other white people who refuse to accept their guilt and responsibility.

Embracing some level of white guilt is one of the primary ways upper class and gentry whites assert their moral superiority over middle and lower class whites. Middle and lower class whites don’t believe in white guilt. As a result, they often have more rational views about race. Middle and lower class whites can say and think rational things about race that upper-class whites cannot do without losing their class status. Lower and middle-class whites can believe that black people are sometimes just as racist as whites. They can believe that black supremacist groups can be just as bad as the KKK. They can believe that the Civil War was a complex event that wasn’t just about slavery and white supremacy, or that just because South Carolina or Mississippi were slave states and have a bad racial history doesn’t mean there are no good parts of those places or that people from there can’t be proud of their state.

Upper-class whites cannot believe any of that. No upper-class white would ever wave a Confederate flag. No upper-class white would ever say that the Black Panthers are as bad as the KKK. If they are conservative, they might say the KKK is insignificant but they would never say that a black group is qualitatively just as bad. To do any of that would necessarily call into question the idea of white guilt and mean being kicked out of the class.

So when Trump tried to force a rational conversation about white nationalism Washington, D.C., that most white and upper class of cities, lost its collective mind. It was all hands on deck — Left and Right — to save and assert the white guilt moral privilege. The responses to Trump were predictably irrational and counterfactual. For the crime of saying not every incident is entirely one sided, Trump was accused of being a white supremacist. In other words, the president everyone feared he would be. Some of the reaction was so counterfactual it can fairly be called insane. Mitt Romney and John McCain described the counter-protesters as fighters for justice and equality against the forces of prejudice and racism. People who showed up waving Communist flags and carrying pepper spray and bags of feces and urine are now fighters against evil and prejudice. Really? The entire response boiled down to a giant guttural groan of “How Dare You!” by the white upper class. Trump had attacked their most sacred moral privileges and they were not going to take it lying down.

What will be the fall out of all this? Like most things involving Trump, a lot less than people think. First, I don’t think it is going to make a bit of difference politically. The people who voted for Trump are almost to the person people who reject the concept of white guilt. So, they won’t see it the way the media and the Washington Establishment has. They will see it as Trump saying entirely fair and rational things. I don’t see Trump’s support dropping one bit. Trump’s enemies will just have a new reason to feel aggrieved.

Second, I don’t think we are going to see much white nationalist vs. antifa violence. Trump tried to force a conversation the left doesn’t want to have. For the left, white guilt is not just about class it is also how it enforces identity politics. The left needs white guilt. Trump also tried to force the left to talk about its role in this violence. And that is also not a conversation anyone on the left wants to have. The left has condoned and enabled antifa violence for years and gotten away with it. They do not want to have to answer for that.

I think that police departments in Democratic cities are going to start doing their jobs. Instead of standing down at these marches and counter-protests, the police will start keeping the two sides apart, arresting people who show up with weapons and bags of urine, and cracking down hard on any fights that break out, and maintaining order. Deprived of the ability to riot with impunity, antifa will find better things to do. They don’t want to go to jail any more than anyone else and protests get pretty boring if you no longer have free reign to attack people. Deprived of any violence to use to slander the Right, the media will lose interest as well. Over the next few months, these marches are going to return to being the small events of paper-hanging losers they have always been. So, I wouldn’t stock up on ammunition for the coming civil war just yet.

Lastly, I think that the drive to tear down Confederate monuments will likely fizzle as well. They will tear a few more down in Democratic cities but the issue will fade away as well. Trump did another thing yesterday: he laid down the mark that if this stuff didn’t stop they would be calling for tearing down George Washington statues. Of course, all right thinking people are today dismissing this. They, however, know that it is true. There are already calls to tear down the statues of Theodore Roosevelt in museums in New York City. You can tear down Confederate statues and largely avoid a rational conversation. Most people really don’t know who the people were and you can always use the “but it’s racist” charge to keep the average observer from objecting. George Washington or Teddy Roosevelt are different. People do know who they are and can’t be scared off by the racist charge. And the Left doesn’t want a rational conversation about that any more than they want a rational conversation about last weekend.

The statue controversy, like all leftist causes, is entirely manufactured. We had a century-long struggle for black civil rights in this country. During that time not a single person to my knowledge — not Martin Luther King, not W.E.B Dubois, not Booker T. Washington, not Malcolm X — ever cared or said a single word about those monuments. Yet, suddenly, in 2017 they are a threat to all that is right and good. Give me a break. Once the left decides tearing them down is no longer to their advantage, and they will if they haven’t already, no more will be heard about the subject.

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  1. Joe P Member

    John Kluge: a rational discussion about white nationalism

    This phrase is one you use frequently in this post.

    Could you please describe what exactly that would look like? Maybe provide an example of what you think would be said during such a discussion that isn’t already being said now?

    • #1
    • August 16, 2017, at 7:57 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  2. Quake Voter Inactive

    Brilliant analysis. And somewhat hopeful. Thank you.

    White guilt in its liberal virtue signalling hysterics also helps hide the ugly truth: the present state of African American communities in the north and the central role liberal culture and policies have played in creating the crime rates, illegitimacy, pop cultural filth, and cratering educational performance in communities from Chicago to Newark which are hundreds of miles from any CSA statuary.

    Why do black students in California receive a 450 point bonus on the SAT over Asian students whose parents escaped gulags in Vietnam?

    Answer: Tear down that statue in Mississippi!!!!!

    • #2
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:06 AM PDT
    • 16 likes
  3. Joe P Member

    Quake Voter (View Comment):
    Why do black students in California receive a 450 point bonus on the SAT over Asian students whose parents escaped gulags in Vietnam?

    What does that have to do with the validity of white supremacy?

    • #3
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:08 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  4. The_Admin() Admin

    Joe P (View Comment):

    John Kluge: a rational discussion about white nationalism

    This phrase is one you use frequently in this post.

    Could you please describe what exactly that would look like? Maybe provide an example of what you think would be said during such a discussion that isn’t already being said now?

    Joe, I thought John’s post did exactly that.

    • #4
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:12 AM PDT
    • 13 likes
  5. Joe P Member

    Max Ledoux (View Comment):

    Joe P (View Comment):

    John Kluge: a rational discussion about white nationalism

    This phrase is one you use frequently in this post.

    Could you please describe what exactly that would look like? Maybe provide an example of what you think would be said during such a discussion that isn’t already being said now?

    Joe, I thought John’s post did exactly that.

    Maybe I need to read it again, but I guess I missed it.

    I mean, I think John is pretty clear that we’re not having a rational conversation about it and why. He very clearly describes what he thinks is broken. What’s less clear is what different conclusions would be drawn about white nationalism during or after such a conversation.

    Not conclusions about Donald Trump; it’s obvious what the difference there would be. I mean the difference about the moral status of white nationalism. It wouldn’t be the most evil thing ever; so what would it be?

    • #5
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:17 AM PDT
    • 2 likes
  6. Quake Voter Inactive

    Joe P (View Comment):

    Quake Voter (View Comment):
    Why do black students in California receive a 450 point bonus on the SAT over Asian students whose parents escaped gulags in Vietnam?

    What does that have to do with the validity of white supremacy?

    The relentless focus on the the fringe of the fringe that is white supremacist politics allows many, perhaps you too Joe, from focusing on the real issues, which is why you didn’t include the following line in the quote.

    The KKK, skinheads and neo-Nazis have nothing to do with the present state of African American communities or with conservative politics.

    Black Lives Matter, campus Marxist domination, leftist economics and race-based gerrymandering is central to those problems and the radicalized Democratic party.

    But back to those statues in Mississippi!!!!

    • #6
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:19 AM PDT
    • 7 likes
  7. Victor Tango Kilo Member

    People have been so conditioned to loathe racism (which should properly be loathed) that they cannot concede that those who claim to oppose racism may also have hatred in their hearts. They canoe concede that the leftists showed up at the rally looking for violence, armed with soda cans filled with cement to use as projectiles and clubs to be used as truncheons. Yes, it is possible to oppose racism and still be a hateful, violent person.

    • #7
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:19 AM PDT
    • 23 likes
  8. Spin Inactive
    Spin Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Their reaction to Trump is based solely in their desire to see him, the Republicans, and Conservatism destroyed. That’s it. They want to use this to ensure that the next President, and every President from now until doomsday, is a liberal. That’s all there is to it.

    • #8
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:28 AM PDT
    • 25 likes
  9. John Kluge Inactive
    John Kluge

    Joe P (View Comment):

    John Kluge: a rational discussion about white nationalism

    This phrase is one you use frequently in this post.

    Could you please describe what exactly that would look like? Maybe provide an example of what you think would be said during such a discussion that isn’t already being said now?

    It involves telling the facts as they are and seeing white nationalism the same way other forms of supremacist and collectivist ideologies are seen and not as something better or worse.

    • #9
    • August 16, 2017, at 8:35 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  10. DocJay Inactive

    I am not so sure the violent protesters are going to fade but rather change tactics. They have their desired result now but temporary wins fade and the blood god needs more sacrifices.

    • #10
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:04 AM PDT
    • 12 likes
  11. WI Con Member
    WI Con Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    DocJay (View Comment):
    I am not so sure the violent protesters are going to fade but rather change tactics. They have their desired result now but temporary wins fade and the blood god needs more sacrifices.

    And the tactic is proving to be brutally effective. They’ve got the GOP politicos, GOP voters (us), the general Conservative media falling over each other to apologize and prostrate ourselves so as not to be tainted with the “R-Word” (and it isn’t Republican).

    Every tax proposal, every judge/administration appointee, any Obamacare ‘Reforms’ will be equivalent to carrying a torch and putting up a statue of Stonewall Jackson on Maxine Waters front yard.

    • #11
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:19 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  12. The_Admin() Admin

    I have promoted this post to the main feed.

    • #12
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:31 AM PDT
    • 14 likes
  13. Basil Fawlty Member
    Basil Fawlty Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Excellent post.

    • #13
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:38 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  14. Ed G. Member
    Ed G. Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Spin (View Comment):
    Their reaction to Trump is based solely in their desire to see him, the Republicans, and Conservatism destroyed. That’s it. They want to use this to ensure that the next President, and every President from now until doomsday, is a liberal. That’s all there is to it.

    Agreed. President Trump’s words aren’t the problem. First problem is as you describe it Spin – same as it ever was. The second problem is that some simply believe that Trump is a racist trying to coddle other racists, and they will fit whatever he says into that paradigm no matter what kind of twisting justification is required to do it.

    • #14
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:46 AM PDT
    • 7 likes
  15. Profile Photo Member

    Maybe NYC will remove the TR statue, but hey, maybe they will commission an Ethel Rosenberg statue. She’s already been honored by the City Council.

    • #15
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:47 AM PDT
    • 6 likes
  16. Rightfromthestart Coolidge

    Spin (View Comment):
    Their reaction to Trump is based solely in their desire to see him, the Republicans, and Conservatism destroyed. That’s it. They want to use this to ensure that the next President, and every President from now until doomsday, is a liberal. That’s all there is to it.

    I agree, the press thinks they’ve found the Katrina they’ve been looking for to destroy Trump the way they did Bush , basically nothing he did would have been right or enough. Like Katrina, this is a riot on the part of the press. My question is , is it working? Or is the public fed up and reacting the way we are, that this is all press created nonsense, that anything Trump did was going to be condemned. All the Trump supporters I know are angry at what they rightly see as an unprecedented all out artillery barrage on Trump for 7 months non stop. Are the uncommitted people in the middle who see this getting angry at Trump or at the press? The author says no, I hope he’s right.

    • #16
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:47 AM PDT
    • 11 likes
  17. James Gawron Thatcher
    James Gawron Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    John,

    Anyone, media or otherwise, that sat back while Obama slow walked his reaction to Jihadist violent murders and BLM police assassinations but now wants to posture endlessly because of this incident is a complete hypocrite. They wouldn’t recognize justice if they bumped their head directly into it while walking with their nose in their I-phone.

    Trump needs to improve his reflexes when responding to this kind of event. That isn’t news that should be endlessly chewed over for days and days. Six million Jews were murdered by those who wore the swastika. The sight of someone so stupid as to put one on today, disgusts and enrages me. However, when the government turns a blind eye to alt-left violence, sooner or later the alt-right will surface. By ignoring the one you are guaranteeing the re-emergence of the other.

    Regards,

    Jim

    • #17
    • August 16, 2017, at 9:50 AM PDT
    • 21 likes
  18. John Kluge Inactive
    John Kluge

    James Gawron (View Comment):
    John,

    Anyone, media or otherwise, that sat back while Obama slow walked his reaction to Jihadist violent murders and BLM police assassinations but now wants to posture endlessly because of this incident is a complete hypocrite. They wouldn’t recognize justice if they bumped their head directly into it while walking with their nose in their I-phone.

    Trump needs to improve his reflexes when responding to this kind of event. That isn’t news that should be endlessly chewed over for days and days. Six million Jews were murdered by those who wore the swastika. The sight of someone so stupid as to put one on today, disgusts and enrages me. However, when the government turns a blind eye to alt-left violence, sooner or later the alt-right will surface. By ignoring the one you are guaranteeing the re-emergence of the other.

    Regards,

    Jim

    I completely agree. But saying that means admitting that white nationalism is not a unique evil worse than other forms of collective evil. Once you do that, then the concept of white collective guilt become untenable. And that is why so many people refuse to say the obvious and rational points you make. It means giving up their white guilt privilege.

    • #18
    • August 16, 2017, at 10:02 AM PDT
    • 6 likes
  19. James Gawron Thatcher
    James Gawron Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    John Kluge (View Comment):

    James Gawron (View Comment):
    John,

    Anyone, media or otherwise, that sat back while Obama slow walked his reaction to Jihadist violent murders and BLM police assassinations but now wants to posture endlessly because of this incident is a complete hypocrite. They wouldn’t recognize justice if they bumped their head directly into it while walking with their nose in their I-phone.

    Trump needs to improve his reflexes when responding to this kind of event. That isn’t news that should be endlessly chewed over for days and days. Six million Jews were murdered by those who wore the swastika. The sight of someone so stupid as to put one on today, disgusts and enrages me. However, when the government turns a blind eye to alt-left violence, sooner or later the alt-right will surface. By ignoring the one you are guaranteeing the re-emergence of the other.

    Regards,

    Jim

    I completely agree. But saying that means admitting that white nationalism is not a unique evil worse than other forms of collective evil. Once you do that, then the concept of white collective guilt become untenable. And that is why so many people refuse to say the obvious and rational points you make. It means giving up their white guilt privilege.

    John,

    It means more than that. Marxist implicit racism, classism, sexism,…etc. ends with Maduro and Kim Jong Un. Starvation, torture, and murder. The disease is no worse than the supposed cure. I agree with Ayn Rand that Fascism is the lowest form of collective evil and thus does require special vigilance. However, historically Fascism didn’t appear until full-scale Bolshevik Marxism was purging and starving people. They both appear as some sort of brother and sister act of collective evil.

    How odd but considering the real history Trump’s speech is exactly what should be said.

    Regards,

    Jim

    • #19
    • August 16, 2017, at 10:15 AM PDT
    • 7 likes
  20. John Kluge Inactive
    John Kluge

    James Gawron (View Comment):

    John Kluge (View Comment):

    James Gawron (View Comment):
    John,

    Anyone, media or otherwise, that sat back while Obama slow walked his reaction to Jihadist violent murders and BLM police assassinations but now wants to posture endlessly because of this incident is a complete hypocrite. They wouldn’t recognize justice if they bumped their head directly into it while walking with their nose in their I-phone.

    Trump needs to improve his reflexes when responding to this kind of event. That isn’t news that should be endlessly chewed over for days and days. Six million Jews were murdered by those who wore the swastika. The sight of someone so stupid as to put one on today, disgusts and enrages me. However, when the government turns a blind eye to alt-left violence, sooner or later the alt-right will surface. By ignoring the one you are guaranteeing the re-emergence of the other.

    Regards,

    Jim

    I completely agree. But saying that means admitting that white nationalism is not a unique evil worse than other forms of collective evil. Once you do that, then the concept of white collective guilt become untenable. And that is why so many people refuse to say the obvious and rational points you make. It means giving up their white guilt privilege.

    John,

    It means more than that. Marxist implicit racism, classism, sexism,…etc. ends with Maduro and Kim Jong Un. Starvation, torture, and murder. The disease is no worse than the supposed cure. I agree with Ayn Rand that Fascism is the lowest form of collective evil and thus does require special vigilance. However, historically Fascism didn’t appear until full-scale Bolshevik Marxism was purging and starving people. They both appear as some sort of brother and sister act of collective evil.

    How odd but considering the real history Trump’s speech is exactly what should be said.

    Regards,

    Jim

    We will never settle a debate over whether fascism or communism is worse. It is too subjective to lend itself to one settled answer. Even having it, makes white guilt untenable.

    • #20
    • August 16, 2017, at 10:18 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  21. FloppyDisk90 Member

    I think there’s a simpler explanation for the media reaction, at least initally. Trump has a history of tacitly excepting his alt-right support (Steve Bannon did so more or less unequivocally) and incoherency on matters of race (cf. Mexican judge and Obama birther comments). In that context, Trump’s initial statement, as bland and “even handed” as it was, fed into the left’s narrative. They got to say, “See, I told you so.” Trump made this bed and if he wants to avoid further feeding frenzies he can’t afford to be anything other than crystal clear in the future. He has nobody to blame other than himself for that.

    • #21
    • August 16, 2017, at 10:54 AM PDT
    • 4 likes
  22. Ed G. Member
    Ed G. Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):
    I think there’s a simpler explanation for the media reaction, at least initally. Trump has a history of tacitly excepting his alt-right support (Steve Bannon did so more or less unequivocally) and incoherency on matters of race (cf. Mexican judge and Obama birther comments). In that context, Trump’s initial statement, as bland and “even handed” as it was, fed into the left’s narrative. They got to say, “See, I told you so.” Trump made this bed and if he wants to avoid further feeding frenzies he can’t afford to be anything other than crystal clear in the future. He has nobody to blame other than himself for that.

    I dispute that history. I also dispute that his words fed into that narrative. No, the words didn’t matter; they were going to be shoehorned into the narrative no matter what.

    • #22
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:01 AM PDT
    • 12 likes
  23. Basil Fawlty Member
    Basil Fawlty Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):
    Trump made this bed and if he wants to avoid further feeding frenzies he can’t afford to be anything other than crystal clear in the future. He has nobody to blame other than himself for that.

    Crystal clear about what? That the left never shares responsibility for violent confrontations with the right? This appears to be what is being demanded of him by the press.

    • #23
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:09 AM PDT
    • 7 likes
  24. FloppyDisk90 Member

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):

    FloppyDisk90 (View Comment):
    Trump made this bed and if he wants to avoid further feeding frenzies he can’t afford to be anything other than crystal clear in the future. He has nobody to blame other than himself for that.

    Crystal clear about what? That the left never shares responsibility for violent confrontations with the right? This appears to be what is being demanded of him by the press.

    I think his second round of comments later in the day were what should have been said in the first place. I think if he had done so you would have had the expected amount of racial carping by the Rachel Maddow’s of the commentariat but no more. I suspect we will disagree on that point.

    • #24
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:15 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  25. Hypatia Inactive

    This is the best piece I have read about the issue. Thanks so much for it, @johnkluge

    White folks are SO SCARED!!! From Congress on down , they’re stumbling over themselves to pretend,

    even though we all saw the film of this melée,

    that this was a buncha Nazis beating up unarmed peaceniks. You are exactly right: Trump pierced the Third Wall: he’s calling out collective white guilt. About time!

    My only complaint is, he hasn’t mentioned James Hogdkimson.

    He is the bravest, most honest man ever to enter American politics. E.V.E.R. Back in the campaign, I said, and it’s even truer today

    if he goes down for any of these rational, meme-busting pronouncements

    then, to paraphrase Byron’s line about Napoleon:

    He wears the shattered links of his country’s broken chain!

    • #25
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:19 AM PDT
    • 3 likes
  26. Kay of MT Member

    John Kluge: Embracing some level of white guilt is one of the primary ways upper class and gentry whites assert their moral superiority over middle and lower class whites. Middle and lower class whites don’t believe in white guilt.

    Thank you John Kluge for describing exactly what I am, a middle-lower class white who has no white guilt. I had no choice in my birth nor can I change it now. I had no decision regarding what happened in this country or the world for thousands of years that is still happening in other countries now. There is no point of feeling guilt over something you have no part of.

    • #26
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:22 AM PDT
    • 11 likes
  27. Lash LaRoche Inactive

    I harbor no white guilt, either. President Trump’s statements have been on-point and accurate. He has nothing to apologize for.

    • #27
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:31 AM PDT
    • 14 likes
  28. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Basil Fawlty (View Comment):
    Excellent post.

    Yes it is.

    • #28
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:34 AM PDT
    • 5 likes
  29. Joseph Stanko Coolidge
    Joseph Stanko Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    John Kluge: No upper-class white would ever say that the Black Panthers are as bad as the KKK.

    I don’t need to subscribe to white guilt to reject this equation. Groups of people have enslaved and oppressed each other since the dawn of history, whites are in no way unique in this respect.

    However, in the specific context of American history, the KKK was one such group that protected the privileges of a majority group by terrorizing, lynching, and murdering members of a specific racial minority. In stark contrast, the Black Panthers arose among that very minority group that had been on the receiving end of oppression and police brutality for centuries, and while I certainly won’t endorse everything they did or said, their original purpose was to arm themselves to defend themselves and their rights.

    This is precisely what conservatives say the 2nd Amendment is for: it’s not just to protect our right to hunt and sport shoot, it’s also so people can take up arms against an oppressive government. Isn’t that what the Panthers were doing?

    • #29
    • August 16, 2017, at 11:55 AM PDT
    • 1 like
  30. John Kluge Inactive
    John Kluge

    Joseph Stanko (View Comment):

    John Kluge: No upper-class white would ever say that the Black Panthers are as bad as the KKK.

    I don’t need to subscribe to white guilt to reject this equation. Groups of people have enslaved and oppressed each other since the dawn of history, whites are in no way unique in this respect.

    However, in the specific context of American history, the KKK was one such group that protected the privileges of a majority group by terrorizing, lynching, and murdering members of a specific racial minority. In stark contrast, the Black Panthers arose among that very minority group that had been on the receiving end of oppression and police brutality for centuries, and while I certainly won’t endorse everything they did or said, their original purpose was to arm themselves to defend themselves and their rights.

    This is precisely what conservatives say the 2nd Amendment is for: it’s not just to protect our right to hunt and sport shoot, it’s also so people can take up arms against an oppressive government. Isn’t that what the Panthers were doing?

    No that is not what the Panthers were doing. The Panthers were and are a Marxist black supremacist group. Their claim to represent an oppressed people doesn’t change what they are. They are just as bad as the KKK and Neo Nazis.

    • #30
    • August 16, 2017, at 12:15 PM PDT
    • 10 likes

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