Ricochet is the best place on the internet to discuss the issues of the day, either through commenting on posts or writing your own for our active and dynamic community in a fully moderated environment. In addition, the Ricochet Audio Network offers over 50 original podcasts with new episodes released every day.
The Democratic Process at Work
Since the election the Democrats, through their irresponsible and disrespectful colleague in the Senate, Chuck Schumer, have insulted Republicans on countless fronts. They demonize us, misrepresent our goals, exaggerate consequences of potential legislation, and have no interest in treating their counterparts in the Republican Party with simple courtesy. They repeatedly state their disdain for Donald Trump and his administration, criticize every statement that is issued and find nothing to affirm about the other side.
In one way, that’s not surprising. Polarization has risen to a new high. Recalcitrance is practiced like a way of life, and any sign of cooperating is condemned. But I’d hoped that at least a modicum of respect would be shown, however insincere and resented it might be, on the House and Senate floors. I’ve thrown that hope out the window.
Today the Democrats in the House, after the vote to repeal and replace Obamacare, chided the Republicans with a childish display. This demonstration of rude and unprofessional behavior is pathetic. From my point of view, all bets are off.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VvbP0QNmF0
Published in Politics
The Democrats think they have a winning issue for 2018.
They also thought that Hillary Clinton was going to win.
Really, you were harboring hope for civility and respect? Welcome to the real world, Susan. These nihilists have no agenda that helps us citizens.
No, I wasn’t, Trinity. But acting like petulant children? Unfortunately they get to participate in governance, too.
At this point I don’t know who I hate more: Dems or the traitor Republicans. We gave our party total control–for this? a bare squeak-by win?
It’s time for a third party.
I’m trying to figure out why this particular action so appalls me. As I said, their bad behavior is not new. I think, though, that the halls of the House and Senate are due a certain level of respect, as are holding the offices of Senator and Representative. How many times have you heard a person say about a president, “You may not like the person, but the Office of the President is due a certain level of decorum.” I feel the same way about the Senate and House. All the Democrats who joined in the singing have desecrated those halls and they should be ashamed. But I suspect they are too narcissistic and immature to realize the damage they’ve done.
I knew the Senate and House Dems were dumb and hateful but this childish behavior is even worse than I thought they were capable of. I hope Manchin is embarrassed enough to switch.
You’re right Susan. It seems hopeless. Like you, I was incredulous as I listened to their rants. And I always wonder: How can they stand to look at themselves in the mirror after they’ve blatantly slandered, lied and twisted truth and facts into mangled rubbish.
Respect for offices was a thing for as long as there were significant numbers of Progressive Republicans. Since the number of Progressive Republicans is now down to single digits, you are seeing the New Democrats for who they are.
These are Leftists. They are the ones who led the purges of conservatives out of the Democrat Party, which is what ended bipartisanship. They are fighting hard now to purge the few remaining Democrats For Life. They have no respect for anything but their own.
It would be interesting to know who joined in. I would love to see Manchin get disgusted enough to say enough is enough.
I think you’re right, MJ. Except I question whether they even respect their own.
“At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child – miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
Perfect. And terribly disheartening. His description is much more accurate than mine. Thanks, drlorentz.
The Dems are about as mature as the 10th graders in the HS student council.
Embarrassing.
Rude and professional indeed. But Democrats have long memories and turnabout is fair play.
Fred, what are you talking about ?
That’s what the Republicans sang to Democrats in 1993 when Bill Clinton’s tax increase passed the House.
Do you think that this vote is going to be electorally costly to the GOP ?
Yes, now I see all the Leftist mass media outlets rushing to say this. I didn’t remember it. I agree with Susan Q. that I think it is bad form. In 1993 the Republicans were right in asserting that it would be a costly vote for the Democrats.
Oh, I agree it’s bad form. But what’s good for the goose is good for the gander.
And people can’t get too worked up about bad form when Donald Trump is President. He’s lowered every standard.
Probably. Voters tend to punish parties when they insist on doing wildly unpopular things.
Although at this time one has little reason to respect either Party, do recall the Dems staging a Sit In, then enjoyed a catered luncheon on the floor.
This current display simply reflects a total lack of respect, tact, decorum the chambers deserve.
The adults have left the building along with Elvis and those that act in such fashion deserve no respect or quarter. Disgusting and worth of stern and swift retribution.
This is a different country. We need to compare it to some families squabbling over inheritance, or think of the Julian Claudius family in I Claudius or Petronius, or pre modern royalty almost anywhere, or middle eastern politics. When so much wealth and privilege depends on control of power all political disputes become matters of life and death. Indeed that is why they killed each other so often. One of the most powerful reasons for limited government, maximum reliance on markets is that political decisions are not life and death issues for anyone, let alone a whole class of people. Representative government is simply not compatible with centralized control of the economy. When these decisions are made for one in whole or in part, then every decision is in conflict with everyone else’s because, in spite of progressive assertions, we have different tastes, interests, wants, needs and those at the top always become parasitical because they can. Every government lever is simultaneously a toll booth for someone in or out of government. This is also why we cannot rely on Congress to undo these controls. They are part of the problem and always will be. Only an outsider, a real interloper can undo this stuff. That is why people elected President Trump, but he has yet to learn that only he can lead and leading means he must present blue prints to Congress on every major piece of dismemberment and then sell them to the people. If he is not going to dismember the administrative state then it’s over because the drift, the default position, will always be toward more government. This centralization is why civilizations collapse or get taken over. So yes we must be even more partisan, not less partisan, we must fight the centralizers in both parties, the educators, the regulators the beneficiaries of the regulations and tax code. Simplify, simplify simplify and always decentralized to states and from states to the market.
I don’t think Trump lowered the standards, I think he met the standard already set—by everybody, one way or another. I’m a big fan of decorum normally, but I think I sympathize with Trump voters who saw decorum barely masking disdain, corruption and mendacity. Or, I guess, weakness/”weakness?”
It’s oddly comforting to know that the Republicans sang “Na Na Na Na” in 1993. This may have been a kind of in-joke, then?
I attended Obama’s first inauguration. Our group was seated fairly far forward, with most of the million behind us, and when Bush departed, the crowd began to sing that song. No one in our section sang it. We looked at each other, smiling nervously, scandalized at this lighthearted desecration of a solemn (and extraordinary) peaceful transfer of power.
Context matters. I don’t know what the atmosphere in the Senate during these votes is. In the video, it looks pretty chaotic and informal, with people milling around and talking. Maybe doing something frat-boy-ish in that situation isn’t quite so terrible?
Didn’t someone yell “Liar” at Obama during his State of the Union? That seems like a worse transgression, not because it wasn’t true, but because decorum and respect-for-the-office is part of that event in a way that it may not be part of the conclusion of a tendentious debate and vote?
This is key. Specific governing policy differences are not very meaningful until we get rid of this default trend to centralization and capitulation to the administrative state. We must remind Trump that the people are depending on him for action and leadership to turn this around. I have gotten into a mode where my concerns are less about small issues and specifics in legislation, for instance, as long as the moves are disruptive to the existing administrative state. I think the direction we are going now is more important than each small step. I try to remember how General George Washington led the patriots against the British. Winning the war is much more important than winning any given battle.
Indeed good analogy, it is a revolutionary war. Washington knew he was in a war and he learned along the way and had an end goal. Trump knows he’s in a war with the left but does he know victory isn’t about winning the PR battles, or getting stuff done the media like or politicians like, what you call the small issues? It’s about dismembering the administrative state, and he has to understand or learn what that means because Congress can’t and wont.
I’ve got a theme song for the GOP, IF it ever occurs to them, like :Hey! We won the election, on Trimp’s coat tails :
“Under my thumb! The squirmin’ dog who just had its day!
…It’s down to me! The change has come! They’re under my thumb! ”
Come ON , you pusillanimous pushovers! Crack that big whip your voters handed you! If you don’t, you WILL be bye-bye in 2018–and not because of the Dems.
This doesn’t bother me at all! I don’t think there is decorum in the government, I don’t think the office of the President deserves more respect than any other citizen. Let them brawl, shout, and sing. This is the same chamber where Preston Brooks caned Sumner. I could do with a little more of that and a little less of standing on ceremony. It’s the false prestige that attracts charlatans and crooks. Some men are attracted to wealth, others to power, others to praise. We have way too much of that in that chamber, so let them wear a true face, call the president a liar (especially when it’s true), and shout each other blue in the face.
While we’re at it get rid of the State of the Union address (send a letter), White House Correspondents Dinner, and any other semi-imperial, hero-worshiping, the-state-is-powerful we-love-the-state event.
There’s also the saying, two wrongs don’t make a right. It’s bad form all around. And I’m talking about Congress here.
So many of them have narrow, gerrymandered districts. From Ankara to Beijing to Harlem, decorum, honesty and decency in leadership are inversely proportional to the likelihood of being held accountable for misdeed.
Very thoughtful comment, as always, I. I agree; we need to see more leadership and the plan and direction should be toward simplifying. It will be incredibly difficult to do, turning the battleship. And it is, in fact, a battleship, with everyone actually fighting to keep his or her power. Thanks.