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How Happy Do We Have to Be about Trump?
Michael Walsh of PJ Media asks “What, Exactly, Is the #NeverTrumpumpkins’ Problem?“
It’s a serious problem, it seems, because he doesn’t just call people “NeverTrumpumpkins” (is that hashtag a thing?), but “Vichycons — the collaborationist #NeverTrump crew whose views are increasingly indistinguishable from the hard Left.”
I’m not sure who he’s talking about, because I listen to some #NeverTrumpers — mostly National Review columnists and Ricochet podcasters — who remain Trump skeptics, but “Vichycons” and “undistinguishable from the hard Left”? Well, as I said, I don’t know who he’s talking about.
It’s interesting that Walsh is so concerned about the state of #neverTrumpers’ emotions. In the beginning, he asks why they’re so miserable. Then he asks what more do the “dead-enders” want?
Walsh seems to be the one with the unhealthy emotional investment in other people’s outlook.
Exactly how happy are #nevertrumpers supposed to be? Is it enough to smile several times a day, or do we need to grin like drunks on their first evening in Los Vegas?
Can we say we like some of Trump’s appointments or must we be ecstatic over every one of them?
Can we say we are glad Hilary is not president, or must we commit suicide because we chose not to support Trump before the election?
May we disagree with specific policies, or must we cast away every principle we formerly called conservative and wait for the Trump administration to hand down our ideas? I’ve been surprised at how well the Trump administration has done so far, but even Trump booster Sarah Palin knows crony capitalism when she sees it.
For Walsh, it’s not enough for Trump to become our pope (“The misguided flap over Carrier is emblematic of their total lack of political savvy and, frankly, Christian morality”). He also tells us that Trump threatens our lives (“The Tower, the hangman and the axeman tend to concentrate the mind wonderfully. Something for the #NeverTrumpumpkins to ponder”).
For this voter who couldn’t raise the pen to vote for Trump, I’ve been pleasantly surprised by the transition. I’ve decided to wait for him to do something before I evaluate. I apparently think more highly of Trump than Walsh does, because however prickly and thin-skinned Trump has been at times, I don’t believe he threatens the lives of those who chose not to support him.
The late great jazz pianist and lyricist Mose Allison summed up 2016 very well with his song, “I don’t worry about a thing, ’cause nothin’s gonna be all right.”
Donald Trump is the president-elect of the United States. As far as I know, Michael Walsh has not been chosen as his enforcer. Maybe Walsh should relax and let him build his administration and grant the rest of his fellow citizens the right to evaluate it as we see fit.
Published in General
I am a NeverTrumper. My liberal son asked me who I would vote for, ah…I don’t vote for democrats. Either one of them.
I moved on. I have a life, work and family. I suggest Walsh focuses on the same. Less on circular firing squads. If Trump is going to be a success, he is going to need the support of the American People. That excludes the ones that either threatened to move out of the US, the ones who are ashamed of the US, or the diaper pin babies suffering shock. Yep that leaves all of us accepting reality conservatives.
It could be need for affirmation. Even after the Obergefell decision, for instance, there seems to be the need from the LGBTQ activists to seek out and destroy dissenting opinion in buisinesses. This may be a cousin of the same impulse for acceptance.
Did you post this as a comment on PJ Media? It sounds like your issue is there.
If you find posts on Ricochet problematic, there is ample space to confront the author directly.
I intend to post my opinion on the ongoing battle with the progressives which continues unabated. President Elect Trump is now a key part of that. People will have to choose where they fall in that effort.
Ah, well, yessee: there was never any danger that a lady named Hilary would become Prez; Hilary was the guy that actually climbed Everest. That Hillary chick, however, would’ve been a one-woman wreckin’ machine. Just sayin’…
Also from the linked article:
I haven’t thought of Goldman Sachs as the boogie man, but I remember Donald Trump telling people not to vote for Ted Cruz because Cruz’s wife had worked for Goldman Sachs. So which is it? Is having worked for Goldman Sachs like being touched by the Shadows (Babylon 5 fans know what I mean) or is it a resume enhancer?
What’s the problem? Every day there are Member Feed articles that critique articles elsewhere on the internet.
You’re right. I take spelling seriously, despite evidence to the contrary.
As a card carrying B5 fan, always watch for Shadows.
No problem, but the post seemed to take issue with a particular author. I was curious if they had responded to the author in question.
If the problem is with an extrapolation of the beliefs of one person to many, then I wonder who on this site has been demanding such behavior. Maybe I have been blind to it, but I cannot recall anyone here demanding such behavior of the Never folks.
Never folks are free to do and say what they want, including the strange rituals of Nevers , like rolling face first into a bowl of crushed Cheetos. I understand it is a sacred tribal thing. I would not know for sure, I just saw it on TV.
Now, the #ProfessionalNevers, who have a megaphone and are more than happy to play Tokyo Rose for a free drink and a dime, that is a different story.
May their Cheetos bowls contain glass shards.
I recently discovered Michael Walsh (a YouTube video some months ago) and am a fan! However, I agree this article was over the top.
Let’s make a deal. You NeverTrumpers try not to overreact negatively to every move of Trump’s that isn’t 100% conservative-compliant, and I’ll try not to overreact enthusiastically when he nominates guys like Mad Dog Mattis. Can’t we all just enjoy how most lefties show no signs of understanding the Democrats’ disastrous view of Americans and America??
I mean, in the long run, I believe it’s very important to have a loyal opposition party to check the hubris of a unified government. But, for now, I think we can all enjoy warming ourselves over the ash heap that is the Democrat party. Gather ’round the smoldering embers of Clinton’s influence peddling designs for the future. Winter can be so cold.
I sat across from Michael Walsh at dinner on the Hillsdale Cruise, and I found him quite sane. Maybe it’s time for the conservatives who could not force themselves to vote for Trump to acknowledge that he is President-elect, and needs our support. Criticism, maybe, for actions we don’t think are productive, but not active opposition quite yet. We all need to give him a chance to succeed. Consider the alternative-we could be ruled by The Harpy instead. And it might be fun to watch some liberal heads explode.
Why?
Why do any of us owe him fealty of any kind?
I work in a small office. As far as I know, everyone in it voted for Trump. But no one is ecstatic that Trump won. They are ecstatic that Hillary lost.
These are my kind of people! Though, for what it’s worth, Trump has been growing on me a little bit since the election.
Handsome is as handsome does. We’ll see.
I don’t think most NeverTrumpers mind when Pro-Trumpers celebrate pro-conservative choices by Trump (like nominating Mad Dog Mattis or Jeff Sessions; from what I can tell, almost everybody on this site’s happy with those picks). I think what bugs them is when they feel attacked for criticizing what they see a non-conservative choices/behavior by Trump.
I think the only policy that makes sense for anyone is for them to support and praise the President’s actions they agree with and criticize the ones they don’t. I imagine almost everyone, be they Pro-Trump, Reluctant-Trump, Never-Trump, holds to that policy. There’s just differences in how many of his policies/statements they agree with or disagree with.
Giving him a chance is not the same as giving him support. I gave Obama a chance. I rarely gave him my support. When Trump says or does things I can support – like appointing Gen Mattis as SecDef- I will support him. When he does not, I will not. And I don’t see why anyone would take issue with that.
As for not acknowledging that he is president-elect, where is this an issue on the right (Dems and other lefties were not part of NT)?
Tingling in the leg happy.
I think most of the Trump/Never Trump action is moving to the realm of what I call the very small handful of #ProNevers, the pundit class who get media airtime. No one really cares what Joe Schmo #Never thinks these days, or Joe Schmo Trump thinks either.
The action is all in the infowar and some of the vocal #Nevers are acting like collaborators. (Looking at you, McMullin)
We are in for four years of no letup media attacks and some folks in the media are buying and distributing ammunition for the other side.
If the author meant the average , everyday #Never who just did not like Trump, then he is way off base.
This Vichy crap is a brainless slander that is beneath nearly everyone who’s used it here and elsewhere. I was unabashedly NeverTrump and am now unabashed TrumpSkeptical, but thrilled with some of the choices he’s made so far. Carrier and Elaine Chao…not so much. Let’s just wait and see and dance on Hillary Clinton’s political grave together. After eight years of a real-life analog of B5’s President Clarke, Trump is looking pretty good so far.
@tkc1101 Where is the evidence for this assertion? Who has Trump authorized to maintain the list of #ProNevers? Where is the list available?
How about a couple of months of just silent introspection. Emphasis on the silent.
Why?
If we see bad peoples being appointed, if we see grevious errors being made, if we see him laying the ground work for future bad things, why are we supposed to be silent?
in·tro·spec·tion
ˌintrəˈspekSH(ə)n/
noun
the examination or observation of one’s own mental and emotional processes.
“quiet introspection can be extremely valuable”
This is a fight between corporate media and their interests and regular non-elite working people of this country. It’s larger than Republican/Democrat or even conservative/progressive.
That’s where the “Vichy” epithet comes in. Of course Nevertrumpers don’t see this generally. They see media ‘bias’ but not media self-interest and media desire to control as much of the narrative as possible in collusion with Democrats and their unending hostility to anything that threatens their progressive, self-serving agenda.
They didn’t see (and still don’t in many cases) that there was no way a non-progressive could win if he/she operated within the confines of media rules, expectations and gatekeeping.
Too many nevertrumpers are stuck in the abstractions of policy and ideology (the wonks here are legion!) and don’t focus enough on the meta-reality. The evidence is clear. They were generally willing to sacrifice the Supreme Court for decades (meaning forever in reality) because Trump would besmirch their reputation. Quibbling, at this juncture, about appointments Trump makes – in view of what the alternative would have been had Hillary won is breathtakingly arrogant and shameless.
They are still playing small-ball, when the war is vast in scope and extremely complicated. Having disagreements with Trumps picks must be attached to the counterfactuals that these folks would have assented to under a HRC administration, which is quickly and conveniently forgotten. That’s why these folks would do better piping down for a while.
The Vichy aspect is that while these folks are focusing on policy and ideological direction (both worthy pursuits generally) it’s missing the big picture, which is the narrative war between the Democrats with bylines and the rest of us. These vichys are playing into the enemies hands by adding their voices to the media narratives. These people, in their defense, aren’t aware of what is at stake and who the real enemy is and what their goals are.
By all means, have your opinions, but don’t help the enemy. And remember, your opinions are nearly worthless. The election is over and the choices are made. As a “never” you have little influence. That influence was squandered when you doubled down against Trump, did not see the possibilities, and allowed the enemedia to dominate your consciousness.
If you still hold this perspective, that is, that it’s generally a fight between Republican vs. Democrats, and the media is some neutral observer who skew towards Democrats, then you can’t be taken seriously and in fact are working (albeit unwittingly) against the best interests of the USA.
Who are these “NeverTrumps” you speak of? It seems to me that their number is probably so small that they hardly merit all the attention and epithets you are piling on them. Or are you calling anyone who criticizes the man a “NeverTrump” because you just object to any criticism of him at all?
I’m pretty sure that Reluctant Trumps, and not a few people that you are calling “NeverTrump” are the folks who actually secured his margin of victory in several close states by voting for him. I doubt they believed that they were abrogating their right to speak their minds, or that others would find their opinions “worthless” after the fact. I’m not sure alienating them is in anyone’s best interests, least of all the country’s.
Who, in your opinion, is actually entitled to criticize Trump in any way at all? Only those who voted for him? Or nobody?
The various uses of “Vichy” in relationship to conservatives has been ill-intended and rude. It implies nothing less than subservient captivity (to whom exactly anyway? Democrats?).
It is also, sadly, another form of attempting to read people out of the movement, declare them as somehow compromised or impure conservatives, and brand them traitors.
It should have no place here.
Thanks for explaining that. I now understand what the Trump aficionados are afraid of.
Here’s the thing, though, if the principles and ideology are “worthy” but an impediment to progress, then there’s really not much difference between Trump and Obama.
If that’s the case, both men are more about the narrative than the reality. Both are larger-than-life figures with a reputation for standing like the Colossus of Rhodes athwart the petty concerns of the little people who oppose them. Both are welcomed by their supporters to use a “pen and a phone” instead of constitutional processes. (I still have hope that Trump will not live down to the expectations of his supporters, but those expectations still concern me.)
Yes, it’s joyful schadenfreude to see the Left getting back what it’s been giving for the past years. But maybe the people who are Trump-cautious are not the only ones who should be engaged in some quiet introspection.
One cannot reasonably expect to try and spike your own teammates shot on goal, quit the field after punching a few teammates in the face, talk trash from the side of the field, then after the rest of the team wins the game come back like nothing happened.
They did this to themselves, and cannot be shocked by the low regard in which they are now held, nor do they have a legitimate grievance. They have earned every ounce of abuse that could ever be heaped upon them.
It’s governance, not football. I know the football thing is a metaphor, but the metaphor doesn’t work.
In football, there is one goal. One clear direction. Clearly defined roles.
The United States is a nation of 350 million people, who can be right about some things and wrong about others. The Progressives made the mistake of deciding they didn’t need to listen to their opponents. The elites made the mistake of deciding they didn’t need to the folks in flyover country. That’s a mistake everyone needs to learn from (and I do include myself).
Trump does seem to be listening to people who formerly disagreed with him. I give him credit for that. I hope his supporters take the opportunity to do the same.